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Is this a RADIO READY mix?? Dynamics Plugins
Old 30th December 2010
  #1
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bryan k's Avatar
Is this a RADIO READY mix??

Ive spent some time on this mix....messing with it...leaving it alone...coming back, messing with it again...etc etc...

Even though the music genre isnt a radio "air play" type (its a guitar shred instrumental), i wanted to mix it hard hitting, heavy, aggressive, attitude style......you know, that "radio ready" rock sound. Kinda like most modern rock songs are today.....

What do you all think, is it ballpark close?

I would like some real critical feedback....really tear this thing apart and let me know if the "mix style" is a hard hitting radio ready mix.

thanks in advance, looking forward to hearing all your thoughts....
Attached Files

10-20mas2.mp3 (7.48 MB, 721 views)

Old 30th December 2010
  #2
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djanthonyw's Avatar
 

Definitely radio ready. Nothing wrong really standing out here, great job! thumbsup

I added some extra mojo for you.
Attached Files

10-20mas2_mojo.mp3 (7.15 MB, 341 views)

Old 30th December 2010
  #3
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bryan k's Avatar
what did you add to it?

It sounds like the left/right channels are a bit smoother....and you added some more low end overall.....

Sounds LUSH now.......Woot!
Old 30th December 2010
  #4
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It's "almost there" your mix. It lacks a bit of typical mastering polish. The drums and whole track benefit quite a bit from some overall masterbus compression of some kind, glueing the whole thing together into a coherent, living, breathing thing. Now all elements are a tiny bit too separated. You also have a small amount of harshness in the guitar tone, at least according to my headphones. I can not confirm if this is an issue of the mix or my headphones though.

Anyhow, here is my tiny example of how I'd make it sound through some subtle "home mastering" (done on headphones and my ****ty laptop.. I've probably overdone the compression but you'll get my point).

Cheers!
bManic
Attached Files

10-20mas2_bM_quickmaster.mp3 (1.34 MB, 227 views)

Old 31st December 2010
  #5
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bryan k's Avatar
Heres a new version.

The last one i was getting alot of flack that it was too LOUD and crushed. Plus there was some digital inter-sample overs....

This time around, when faux-mastering i monitored and made sure inter-sample overs didn't happen this time. Plus i re-EQ'd the rhythm guitars so it didn't sound so "edgy", which some people thought it sounding like over distortion (clipping).

Its not as LOUD as the first sample i posted.....but still kinda loud. Its not BRICKWALLED chopped.
Attached Files

10-20master3.mp3 (7.48 MB, 438 views)

Old 31st December 2010
  #6
Slate Pro Audio / Slate Digital
 
Steven Slate's Avatar
 

I think it sounds great. My personal preference would be to send the cymbals (I'm talking most specifically about that main crash) to a group and thin them out a bit by filtering out more lows, and then turn them down a tiny bit as in some parts they are a bit heavy.. this is all subject and is just my taste, and there is nothing wrong with how it is..

Good stuff.
Old 31st December 2010
  #7
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Bryan, now it sounds much better! Great work!

I agree with Steven about the crash cymbal. Thinner and slightly lower in the mix. Perhaps even the hihat a tiny bit lower.. but that might kill too much of the good drive/groove you have going.

As a compressor freak I'd still push the mixbus compressor a tiny bit harder. The compressor in FG-X is superb. Don't be afraid of abusing it a bit. It might be overkill but try inserting two instances of FG-X, the first using ONLY the compressor. Set it to wide open attack and fast release. Deep threshold and minimal ratio. This way you force each drum hit to smack a bit more.

The second instance of FG-X is your main mastering thing. There you'd set the compressor to do the glueing bit (deep or low threshold, two ways of doing this). Fast attack, release so that it rides with the tempo of the music.

Anyhow, it already sounds superb. Great work and a very enjoyable instrumental as well! Thanks for posting it!

Cheers!
bManic
Old 31st December 2010
  #8
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memphisindie's Avatar
 

Sounds great now, I wanna play it and listen to it more.
I typically listen to stuff before it's mastered, so, I like stuff that sounds like it stands oout, I like Guitar rock, and I like aggressive mixes, I don't like overcompressing and jamming up the dynamics when not necessary. Great work. I like some breathing room. Then I can turn the knob to the stereo up and pollute the air with loud guitar rock and here what my amp will do.
Old 31st December 2010
  #9
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by djanthonyw View Post
Definitely radio ready. Nothing wrong really standing out here, great job! thumbsup

I added some extra mojo for you.
Nice job!
Great sounding track,. you took it from 10 to 11 (smoother sound quiality)
Old 31st December 2010
  #10
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by bryan k View Post
Heres a new version.

The last one i was getting alot of flack that it was too LOUD and crushed. Plus there was some digital inter-sample overs....

This time around, when faux-mastering i monitored and made sure inter-sample overs didn't happen this time. Plus i re-EQ'd the rhythm guitars so it didn't sound so "edgy", which some people thought it sounding like over distortion (clipping).

Its not as LOUD as the first sample i posted.....but still kinda loud. Its not BRICKWALLED chopped.
Great job!
Old 1st January 2011
  #11
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bryan k's Avatar
Thanks for all the tips guys!

Just tried your suggestions.....The rolling off the lows on the cymbals (and taking it down a hair) really helped this song out. It defiantly sounds balanced now....

You all rock!
Old 4th January 2011
  #12
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Gary Ladd's Avatar
Nice tips!

Personally I think the drum track has "I need transient designer" all over it...

Old 4th January 2011
  #13
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bryan k's Avatar
in what way? You think it has too much transient, or not enough?
Old 4th January 2011
  #14
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bryan k's Avatar
Heres something different.

Less in your face snare, more mellow vibe. Took the last tips and applied it to this new song/mix....

I guess this is my version of a mainstream radio "power pop/rock" love song......but instrumental style. Just finished recording this today, and heres a rough mix with a faux mastering jobby......

Attached Files

Why did you leave.mp3 (9.49 MB, 242 views)

Old 4th January 2011
  #15
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memphisindie's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by bryan k View Post
in what way? You think it has too much transient, or not enough?
When you listened to it, was the first thing that struck you about it that the transients were off?
What about after the tenth time?
If it still didn't, it's a waste of precious time.
Old 4th January 2011
  #16
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bryan k's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by memphisindie View Post
When you listened to it, was the first thing that struck you about it that the transients were off?
What about after the tenth time?
If it still didn't, it's a waste of precious time.
I didn't think the transients were off. The poster above mine suggested that " it sounds like it needs a transient designer, but didn't specify if he thought it had too much..... Or not enough transients
Old 4th January 2011
  #17
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memphisindie's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by bryan k View Post
I didn't think the transients were off. The poster above mine suggested that " it sounds like it needs a transient designer, but didn't specify if he thought it had too much..... Or not enough transients
I understand. And you were right, your transients aren't off, it's fine.
Sometimes I think that the people that sell "software" post crap like that on here so they can make people uneasy enough to use their product when it isn't necessary. It's not helping OUR end of the business one bit.

I think like this; when records were selling rather than being stolen, no one even had transient designer, and the even today listeners don't care one bit if you use it or not. I use my kids, all 13/14 yr. olds, as depth gauge and they listen and love old music, it makes them move and sing, newer music that they say they also love, newer tuned designed stuff, they never sing that stuff and I find it conspicuous that they don't, and telling about where the industry has chosen to focus the quality control (production value over content).
What is transient designer about anyway? Saving a recording that needs it and you would know if it needed it, to use it just because it's there, un-creatively when it isn't necessary, is a bad safety conscious move, to use it as a safety conscious move instead of a needed safety net is bad biz.
Your song is FINE, it isn't screaming anything other than ROCK.
Move to the next tune man. (which you did, thanks)
There's only so much mixing that is required.
Another thought, radio stations CRUSH music anyway, once you get within a certain ballpark of acceptability as far as your mix goes, it's pretty much a waste of time to go much further. The only mixes that take me too long are the ones where I have to do a LOT of tricky verbs and timed delay effects that must be eq'd and have a ton of automation and have a ton of major changes and shifts along the timeline, but, even then, once you reach a certain point, it's been over. Not that I'm shaking the earth with anything I've done in the last bunch of years, because clearly I'm not.

Dennis Kucinek (sp?) said "who's running this country, the insurance companies or the US Congress?".
I'm saying (which no authority at all) "who's running this industry, the artists engineers and writers and producers, or the software developers".
One listen to radio or TV tells you who. It has been BAD for the business the whole way, it started as a very dishonest process, and no business can survive that for long, especially one that relies on talent and listeners. Once you take the focus off talent ad listeners, you're talking about a completely different industry and this industry can't be that industry.
/rant
Your song sound fine. I like it.

That second tune isn't ready yet. The drums are distracting more than serving.
Old 4th January 2011
  #18
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bryan k's Avatar
Quote:
That second tune isn't ready yet. The drums are distracting more than serving.
So your saying the mix on the 2nd new tune is ok, its just that the drums are a bit too "different" (playing style)?
Old 4th January 2011
  #19
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Gary Ladd's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by bryan k View Post
in what way? You think it has too much transient, or not enough?
I think tweaking the sustain/transient attack might help the BD be a lil' less muddy and bring out the snap/presence of the SD, both of which to me aren't quite sitting properly in the track with std. compression approach.

I'd give the overhead a shot in TD, just to see, though sometimes it sounds artificial depending on the source...

With TD a lil' goes a long ways, and it's possible depending on the source tracks you'll end up with more dynamics than smashing them through a typical compressor - Then again, if you're going for Satch type vibe this is pretty close already.

And no, I'm not talking about the plugin, which for me wasn't even 70% of the way to matching my TD4...

YMMV
Old 4th January 2011
  #20
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memphisindie's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by bryan k View Post
So your saying the mix on the 2nd new tune is ok, its just that the drums are a bit too "different" (playing style)?
I'm saying that the drums on the 2nd tune are so distracting that I can't "hear" the mix.
They may be fine with a counter-rhythm, or, you may want to have a more transcendent groove, maybe not, but, as is, I'm not getting it, I'm getting kicked out of the tune every few beats.
Old 4th January 2011
  #21
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bryan k's Avatar
OMG....im so ********. I too heard there was something a bit off about the drums. I went back into the project, and all my buses (for parallel comp and distressor) had it routed to the wrong output! Silly F*&#in' me.....

Heres that mix again........(with buses engaged, LOL)
Attached Files

Why did you leave - Bryan K.mp3 (9.49 MB, 140 views)

Old 5th January 2011
  #22
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memphisindie's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by bryan k View Post
OMG....im so ********. I too heard there was something a bit off about the drums. I went back into the project, and all my buses (for parallel comp and distressor) had it routed to the wrong output! Silly F*&#in' me.....

Heres that mix again........(with buses engaged, LOL)
Better? Still has a lot of timing issues. Sounds like the wrong kit for the tune too. Snare is too pop rock, too much splash in it in the top.
Old 5th January 2011
  #23
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bryan k's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by memphisindie View Post
Better? Still has a lot of timing issues. Sounds like the wrong kit for the tune too. Snare is too pop rock, too much splash in it in the top.
Perfect! I was going for a pop-rock snare! Sounds like I nailed it then.

As far as timing of the drums, it's spot on.... But it's not your typical normal 4/4 kick/snare, kick/snare with the high hats pounding away at 8th notes. This beat is a little more "different". The bass/ rhythm guitars don't follow the drums so "syncopated" and mimicked like most rock tunes.

I like this one because it doesnt follow the rules.
Old 5th January 2011
  #24
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memphisindie's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by bryan k View Post
Perfect! I was going for a pop-rock snare! Sounds like I nailed it then.

As far as timing of the drums, it's spot on.... But it's not your typical normal 4/4 kick/snare, kick/snare with the high hats pounding away at 8th notes. This beat is a little more "different". The bass/ rhythm guitars don't follow the drums so "syncopated" and mimicked like most rock tunes.

I like this one because it doesnt follow the rules.
Well, if that's what you're going for, you nailed it.
Prepare for people to need an explanation, because, it sounds like extra hits out of time instead of purposeful hits in time, whether it's 4/4 or not.
It's cool to break the rules, but, people rarely get that.
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