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Why so much hate on mainstream? Virtual Instrument Plugins
Old 9th March 2014
  #31
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sleepingbag's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by djugel View Post
I love being the dumbest person in the room.. it's part of growing mentally. It usually happens ironically when you think you have it all figured out.
i feel this


at the same time.... it's PRETTY DAMNED HARD to be the dumbest person in the room on this message board
Old 9th March 2014
  #32
Gear Guru
Quote:
Originally Posted by sleepingbag View Post
hell no, i want in! i want to be making the **** on the radio that some of you guys detest so much! i admire those making all sorts of music, because all sorts of music has enriched my life in all sorts of ways, and that definitely includes 'simple' mainstream music.
I could see that.. but since the mid 90's .. mainstream music is so far behind the times.. that no matter what.. to make "new mainstream" music.. you have to be pretty patient because it's such dated music.

I don't have the drive to do that.. because I'd rather create what I like.. than make an investment.
Old 9th March 2014
  #33
I think that Skrillex said it best in his AMA on reddit a few days ago, at least about dance music.

Skrillex - "At the end of the day it's DANCE music.. dancing is supposed to be fun. Dance music should be fun to... I don't think it's meant to be taken so seriously... it's not politics. More so than a genre, I think success has to come with being open about your personality, doing YOU and not giving a **** what people have to say. Those are the people who catch my attention at least. I come form hardcore and punkrock.. I came from the uncool lunch tables. I feel like there's this jock elitist mentality when it comes to dubstep in particular which is so against everything I stand for. BEING yourself, and not giving a **** what others think. Not judging others.. For **** sakes it's just MUSIC. stop taking it so seriously and have fun.. And if you dont like something, then just fkn forget about it! "
Old 9th March 2014
  #34
Gear Guru
Quote:
Originally Posted by sleepingbag View Post
i feel this


at the same time.... it's PRETTY DAMNED HARD to be the dumbest person in the room on this message board
True.. I meant more in person. Like when you're 19 and you're hanging out with 30 year olds.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sleepingbag View Post
i dunno. in either example of yours, people are being physically affected by the music they're listening to. i like that.
Haha.. even tho I'm a jaded cynic.. maybe I am still an optimist
Old 9th March 2014
  #35
"And if you dont like something, then just fkn forget about it!"
He especially nailed it with this part
Old 9th March 2014
  #36
Gear Guru
I think the jock mentality was the key part actually..
Old 9th March 2014
  #37
Quote:
Originally Posted by M1da View Post
I'm being completely honest right now, why does almost everybody on this forum absolutely HATE mainstream music? It seems like every time someone mentions a producer like deadmau5, Zedd, or Skrillex(especially) everybody just goes crazy. I can see why some of the top 40 gets hate but seriously, there are only one or two singers who honestly don't deserve to be that popular, the rest are just fine. So can someone explain why mainstream is hated so much?
I like what I like.

Sometimes what I like is popular. Sometimes it's not.

That doesn't change whether I like it.

I'll admit when I first heard Skrillex I was horrified -- but it was the grotesque lack of any sort of dynamic interest or finesse that was putting me off.

I sort of like some of the ideas and moves -- though a quick survey showed me how often he went to the same kit bag -- what's worse, of course, were the Skrillex wannabes.

And now that obvious tuning is finally out of vogue, I'm actually hearing some mainstream pop I can stand to listen to. So, all in all, things seem to be kind of looking up from my perspective.

That said, there is still a lot of cliche-ridden drivel at the top of the charts. Using singers who can sing (or at least cheat undetected) helps -- but it can't make up for 'songs' that are often little more than a string of buzz phrases and hoary, wildly overused cliches strung together over what is hoped to be a couple of catchy hooks.
Old 9th March 2014
  #38
I can understand the resentment. Mainstream artists making big money and being recognized as "champions" of the music, for the lack of a better term, while the pioneers and innovators are forgotten, unknown and broke. In my opinion, much mainstream music isn't even popular because of the music, rather than how it is presented. Lyrics have something to do it with it as well. These days essentially all you need is a drum machine (for the music), several lyrical phrases about partying (no voice training required), a "rock star" image and the advertising support of a big label to make a hit record.
Old 9th March 2014
  #39
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horseface's Avatar
I like it when music is both danceable AND political.

Maybe I just don't like American music? Maybe I find it insanely predictable and conservative even after all this time?

People bring up Skrillex quite a lot. Skrillex jumped onto the Dubstep bandwagon, which like a lot of other genres began life sounding quite varied and interesting, but like Drum 'n' Bass before it, it eventually turned into a lot of the same as more and more people jumped onboard without bringing any new ideas to the party.

Skrillex wasn't even the guy who turned Dubstep into the cesspool of mediocrity it is today. He simply jumped onboard. It started slipping that way with Rusko, then the whole Brostep Boredgore thing. It started its decline when it became popularized by Frat boys in America. I thought that the music college kids listened to was supposed to be good...?

But anyway. Where's my time machine?
Old 9th March 2014
  #40
Quote:
Originally Posted by BM0 View Post
In my opinion, much mainstream music isn't even popular because of the music, rather than how it is presented. Lyrics have something to do it with it as well. These days essentially all you need is a drum machine (for the music), several lyrical phrases about partying (no voice training required), a "rock star" image and the advertising support of a big label to make a hit record.
I don't really agree with you, because I just listened to the top 20 for pop and only 2 people(Jason Derulo and Kesha) couldn't sing/used autotune. And none of the lyrics were about partying(I'm actually kind of surprised by that lol)
Old 9th March 2014
  #41
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horseface's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by M1da View Post
Well now we're getting into unnecessary hate. Listen to Lorde's album that came out a couple months ago which is very, very popular right now. How can you call that empty?
I just listened to a bunch of Lordes to try and figure out what all the fuss is about and I honestly can't fathom how she's different to the other billion acts out there making similar kinds of music. By the time I'd listened to the 7th track, I couldn't remember any of the ones which came before it. Now I've even forgotten the 7th track as I write this.

Lyrically, well, it's a bit teeny bopper bubble gummy and asinine. I don't get much out of it, but perhaps a 14 year old girl out in suburbia loves listening to this stuff as she shops for stuff in the mall? Maybe office girls love this stuff when they 'cut loose' and go drink white zinfandel at a chain restaurant in a strip mall on a Friday evening after work?

If this is the cream of the current crop, we're culturally in massive bloody trouble.

Old 9th March 2014
  #42
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7Wave's Avatar
 

I don't think the resentment comes directly from the fact that they're successful. I think more of it comes from the fact that their music doesn't seem to warrant such hype. The interesting paradox is that you can't remain "cool" and enjoy mainstream success at the same time, at least not for very long.

As Douglas Rushkoff and others have pointed out, once you've made it these days, you're on the way out.
Old 9th March 2014
  #43
Gear Guru
Quote:
Originally Posted by 7Wave View Post
The interesting paradox is that you can't remain "cool" and enjoy mainstream success at the same time, at least not for very long.
I do love that..
Old 10th March 2014
  #44
Quote:
Originally Posted by horseface View Post
I like it when music is both danceable AND political.

Maybe I just don't like American music? Maybe I find it insanely predictable and conservative even after all this time?

People bring up Skrillex quite a lot. Skrillex jumped onto the Dubstep bandwagon, which like a lot of other genres began life sounding quite varied and interesting, but like Drum 'n' Bass before it, it eventually turned into a lot of the same as more and more people jumped onboard without bringing any new ideas to the party.

Skrillex wasn't even the guy who turned Dubstep into the cesspool of mediocrity it is today. He simply jumped onboard. It started slipping that way with Rusko, then the whole Brostep Boredgore thing. It started its decline when it became popularized by Frat boys in America. I thought that the music college kids listened to was supposed to be good...?

But anyway. Where's my time machine?
Wecome to the old guys. heh
Old 10th March 2014
  #45
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The reality is the old schooler's with their old school tastes are literally sonically, intellectually, spiritually and emotionally addicted to the old school elements they continually crave and demand.

But how the heck are young, innovative, up and coming musicians gonna do anything new if they feel locked into old approaches ? Often, it means simply dropping some of the old school "requirements" (dynamics, traditional organic instruments, raw natural singing, composing primarily via large chord vocabulary like Brian Wilson did) to sound unique. It really is about sounding new and unique against the historical musical backdrop. A march towards the future. It's fully understandable and inevitable.

Personally, I listen to modern mainstream music at work (radio going constantly in the office) 3-4 hours per day and like 10% of it, dislike 60% of it and have a neutral reaction to 30% of it.

When I first heard Pharell Williams' & Daft Punk's "Get Lucky", I was totally into it and still am. I love that song. I couldn't believe the criticisms of it in the electronic music forum (but eventually learned to see why many were unimpressed with it). I love "Royals" by Lorde and "Locked Out Of Heaven" by Bruno Mars. I like some of John Legend's stuff as well. I purchased Arcade Fire's last album, "Reflektor", it took me back to the 1980's, pure bliss.

I'm addicted to that old school sound and approach, and no, I don't want to be cured of it.
Old 10th March 2014
  #46
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horseface's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by theblue1 View Post
Wecome to the old guys. heh
Probably, yeah…

But it's not like new music is offensive and frightening to old Granddad here. It's more that it's like its been severely castrated and its listeners lobotomized.

It's not exactly offensive or new and challenging. Any of it. Last time I heard something vaguely 'challenging' was some of the early Juke/Footwork stuff, but even that appears to have mellowed out into blah safe mediocre territory now.

I still search.
Old 10th March 2014
  #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by horseface View Post
blah safe mediocre territory
I'm with you on that point. Too much predictability out there.

I'd like to hear a new release which is bold and trailblazing. You know, extremely weird, maybe noisy, improper and obnoxious, just unconventional.

Disturbing. That's the word,

I'd like to be shocked and disturbed (in a good way) by a new release which really stands out from the crowd.
Old 10th March 2014
  #48
Quote:
Originally Posted by Purpureus View Post
Mainstream = success. Such success can potentially create resentment in people who don't believe they can also succeed or don't know how/can't be bothered.
This is solid info here.

No one truly wants to be obscure. Even people that do not want mainstream fame want some recognition and friendship from their hard work.

Old 10th March 2014
  #49
Quote:
Originally Posted by horseface View Post
Probably, yeah…

But it's not like new music is offensive and frightening to old Granddad here. It's more that it's like its been severely castrated and its listeners lobotomized.

It's not exactly offensive or new and challenging. Any of it. Last time I heard something vaguely 'challenging' was some of the early Juke/Footwork stuff, but even that appears to have mellowed out into blah safe mediocre territory now.

I still search.
Like I said... heh
Old 10th March 2014
  #50
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7Wave's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Desire Inspires View Post
This is solid info here.

No one truly wants to be obscure. Even people that do not want mainstream fame want some recognition and friendship from their hard work.

I think the issue is in the ways some people sell out to make it big.

If mainstream = success, as someone pointed out, then we have to ask ourselves how an artist managed to appeal to so many people in the first place. What does it take? What happens as you do this?

Well, usually to capture the market you have to aim for the common denominator, and if you take this route, artistic standards will suffer. At that point you're not producing art that came from some bold and original artistic motivation. No, to make it that big, you took a demand driven approach. What you usually end up with is music that is derivative and contingent.

And it's not a crime. But it is what is.

I think it's funny when I mention things like artistic standards to someone desperate to be a star, and he looks back at me like a dog that has been shown a card trick. It just doesn't register. To this guy, if it gets him money and pussy, then consider it done. F#@k art.

Some people are just very utilitarian in how they see music. To them, it's just something you do that gets you what you want. It doesn't exist for itself, it needn't make a statement. It's just another way to equivocate for attention and money.
Old 10th March 2014
  #51
How much music that is current is still going to be listened to 20 or 40 years from now? The reason that people are still buying the Beatles is because it is good music and has been enjoyed ever since it was produced. Much of the "music" that is being done today is over the top. It is squashed, it is shrill, it is over compressed and over limited and there is no pleasure in listening to it over and over again. Music has, in many cases, become the wallpaper of our lives. No one today, or very few, sit down and really listen to music. It is on in their car or on their IPOD or cellphone but they only have it on as a noise source. I see students at the local college walking down the street with an ear bud in one ear their cell phone on the other ear and walking and talking to their friends. The mind is a wonderful thing but constantly multitasking divides the attention the brain can put on one sense. Music being done today is competing for attention and they do that by being louder than anyone else or by making their music so over the top that people will listen to it. Unfortunately it all sounds the same because everyone else is trying to do the same thing.

MTCW and YMMV
Old 10th March 2014
  #52
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frans's Avatar
Some music is designed as an instrument of social control, just like the news or any other 'mainstream' outlet that pours desinfotainment so we forget to connect to what we are. Think Brave New World and 1984. Some people get this, either by intuition or by connecting the dots on their own. Others are too hypnotized to see anything that's not shoved down their throats by big corporations/mass media/the control system. To each their own.
Old 10th March 2014
  #53
maybe cause of inane **** like this?

Old 10th March 2014
  #54
Quote:
Originally Posted by msl View Post
maybe cause of inane **** like this?

A Lady GAGA knockoff???

They just re released Achy Breaky Heart as a hip hop song

Buck 22 - Achy Breaky 2 ft. Billy Ray Cyrus - YouTube

I guess people will watch or listen to anything today!!

CAUTION a whole lot of shaking going on from the young ladies..Can you say "PG-12" video?????
Old 10th March 2014
  #55
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Benprogfuse's Avatar
I usually find that mainstream songs are exctremely simple and basic and bore the crap out of me.

Even with bands that I like, I will purchase and listen to their entire ablum multiple times. Then the songs that I like least from that album will surprisingly become the radio singles from that album.
Old 10th March 2014
  #56
Gear Addict
 
7Wave's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas W. Bethe View Post
How much music that is current is still going to be listened to 20 or 40 years from now? The reason that people are still buying the Beatles is because it is good music and has been enjoyed ever since it was produced. Much of the "music" that is being done today is over the top. It is squashed, it is shrill, it is over compressed and over limited and there is no pleasure in listening to it over and over again. Music has, in many cases, become the wallpaper of our lives. No one today, or very few, sit down and really listen to music. It is on in their car or on their IPOD or cellphone but they only have it on as a noise source. I see students at the local college walking down the street with an ear bud in one ear their cell phone on the other ear and walking and talking to their friends. The mind is a wonderful thing but constantly multitasking divides the attention the brain can put on one sense. Music being done today is competing for attention and they do that by being louder than anyone else or by making their music so over the top that people will listen to it. Unfortunately it all sounds the same because everyone else is trying to do the same thing.

MTCW and YMMV
It's true. I think one of the big changes we've seen with smartphones and iPods is that when most people have unlimited random access to whatever they want to hear, the very experience of listening to music is devalued. The wallpaper analogy is a good one.

I'd like to think that what is happening to music will parallel what has been happening in film. The affordability of technology has democratized film making to a large degree. While there will always be big Hollywood studios turning out mindless action films and stupid romantic comedies -- which is about catering to the demands of target demographic groups -- independent film makers are making more meaningful "small" movies that actually make a statement or tell an interesting story.
Old 10th March 2014
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M1da View Post
I'm being completely honest right now, why does almost everybody on this forum absolutely HATE mainstream music? It seems like every time someone mentions a producer like deadmau5, Zedd, or Skrillex(especially) everybody just goes crazy. I can see why some of the top 40 gets hate but seriously, there are only one or two singers who honestly don't deserve to be that popular, the rest are just fine. So can someone explain why mainstream is hated so much?
well vocal house died in the nineties. and since the "Rave" scene was downplayed so they can make it their own (EDM is the mainstream name now) the ones that were exposed to it have moved on....

... sorry but "pop" is not popular anymore.......
Old 10th March 2014
  #58
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Benprogfuse's Avatar
Songs in a major key usually make me feel uncomfortable
Old 10th March 2014
  #59
Well it makes sense why people hate mainstream music. Mainstream music appeals to a broad and common audience. Appealing to a broad and common audience is a sign of respect and tolerance.

A nice portion of society does not have respect and tolerance for different people and ideas. That is why culture is always at war with itself. Caring about others is extremely difficult for people, so applying negative labels and differentiating oneself from the masses is what people do.

Having a problem with mainstream music is a direct reflection of having problems with different cultures, ideas, people, and traditions. Going against the grain becomes a necessity for many people because it stops them from learning and progressing. Learning and progressing would disrupt their world views.
Old 10th March 2014
  #60
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"You must love and respect the great musical artistry of Lady Gaga and Nicki Minaj or I will call you names like 'snob', 'bigot', 'elitist', 'racist', 'homophobe', 'conservative', 'xenophobe', 'intolerant jerk', and I will insult you in many many other ways. Now get wise, acquire my perfect taste, and bow to them IMMEDIATELY you evil person you. Repent !!!"
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