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Roland SH-101 prices insane or justified? Keyboard Synthesizers
Old 9th March 2014
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by empirix View Post
most overrated synth ever! 200 is a fair price
Yep. Just re-amp your Tal-101 bassline through a guitar combo and you're there.
Old 9th March 2014
  #62
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I had two of these in the late 80's early 90's. A blue one without a grip and a gray one with a grip. The gray one had no battery cover and had not been taken care of. There was a light silt on it like someone left it uncovered in a garage for a few years. The gray one worked fine, but with no battery cover and no hope to get one (could not get one from Roland), I threw it way in the garbage. The blue one I traded with some other gear. But that's been years ago.

Sold all of my gear around "93". After returning to music back in 2012, I was dumbfounded that people had deified these old boards as "Godly" and were paying astronomical prices for this stuff. It's not junk, but come on people, the SH101 is what it is:

1) A Monophonic Synth
2) Single Oscillator
3) No Patch or Bank Memory
4) No MIDI

All of the above.. A HUGE DEAL BREAKER!

If you want a mono synth with a great sound get a new Moog LP or SP.
Old 9th March 2014
  #63
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SPAM :
Or an anushri which also has the sh101 sequencer and the same specs as a 101 - im selling mine to pay for bills but I'll be building another as soon as funds allow.
Old 9th March 2014
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jaxman12 View Post

1) A Monophonic Synth
2) Single Oscillator
3) No Patch or Bank Memory
4) No MIDI

All of the above.. A HUGE DEAL BREAKER!

If you want a mono synth with a great sound get a new Moog LP or SP.
Actually, if you have an Expert Sleepers rig that lets you sequence synths with CV from your computer dead tight, much better than MIDI, and you consider a patchless synth a creative greatness it all turns on its head.......
Old 10th March 2014
  #65
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Quote:
Actually, if you have an Expert Sleepers rig that lets you sequence synths with CV from your computer dead tight, much better than MIDI, and you consider a patchless synth a creative greatness it all turns on its head....
I guess if you have that kind of time to devote to that technology, more power to ya'. If it is your hobby or profession of coming up with creating your own sounds with this synth, I guess that is great, if that is what you want. My Access Virus B was almost 1/3 of the cost of a SH101 and it blows the SH101 in the dirt as far as sound and what it will do.
Old 10th March 2014
  #66
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Your paying for one of the foundational sounds of early techno with a 101 , much like the 909 and 303 but $2000 isn't anywhere near accurate?
Try $1000 - $1200 for the blue and red and even then you'll get a grey one for much less.

It'll be interesting to see how much this one goes for: Roland SH-101 prices insane or justified?WHITE ROLAND SH-101 | eBay
Old 10th March 2014
  #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rachel View Post
In Australia, loads of SH-101's were unloaded at Brashes in the 80's
for something like $899 with mod grip and strap plus a soft bag.
I remember looking through the Trading Post in the late 80's, and there was always a tonne of 101's, way more than any other synth.
There must still be a heap of them in Oz, so asking 2K for one is a bit ambitious.
To quote a great Australian film, "Tell him he's dreaming"
Old 10th March 2014
  #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jaxman12 View Post
I guess if you have that kind of time to devote to that technology, more power to ya'. If it is your hobby or profession of coming up with creating your own sounds with this synth, I guess that is great, if that is what you want. My Access Virus B was almost 1/3 of the cost of a SH101 and it blows the SH101 in the dirt as far as sound and what it will do.
You say that, but my ears struggle to love most sounds emanating from a Virus. Horses for courses.
Old 10th March 2014
  #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stevee0303 View Post
It'll be interesting to see how much this one goes for: Roland SH-101 prices insane or justified?WHITE ROLAND SH-101 | eBay
I think that was originally with fixed price of 999£ (or $?).

If ppl are willing to pay for that, I'm so gonna paint my SH's green and violet!
edit: Or black, with mint green borders.
Old 10th March 2014
  #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheBrightSide View Post
"Tell him he's dreaming"


love it!
Old 10th March 2014
  #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stevee0303 View Post
Your paying for one of the foundational sounds of early techno with a 101 , much like the 909 and 303 but $2000 isn't anywhere near accurate?
Try $1000 - $1200 for the blue and red and even then you'll get a grey one for much less.

It'll be interesting to see how much this one goes for: Roland SH-101 prices insane or justified?WHITE ROLAND SH-101 | eBay
because the red ones go faster? (red cars are supposed to go faster)

I think the colour fetching higher prices is a joke - they sound the same, most people wont gig with them, as they're 30 years old and probably dangerously close to falling apart.
Old 10th March 2014
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ranzee View Post
I think the colour fetching higher prices is a joke - they sound the same, most people wont gig with them, as they're 30 years old and probably dangerously close to falling apart.
The 'rarity' makes them tempting. And the colors are actually sweet!

Also, the colored ones seems to be from the later batch of SH's, with revised
components. I'm not 100% sure about this, though, but at least all blue ones
I've opened are the 'new' ones. (less wires, more integrated components)

In addition, they don't really 'fall apart' that easily, the build quality is surprisingly solid!
(And people won't gig with them because keytars are not cool in 2014. But they will be cool again in 2015)
Old 10th March 2014
  #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seccione View Post
Also, the colored ones seems to be from the later batch of SH's, with revised components. I'm not 100% sure about this, though, but at least all blue ones I've opened are the 'new' ones. (less wires, more integrated components)
I think they are all pretty much the same. Roland did make some changes throughout production, but nothing major. I had a red one and it was identical to all the grey ones I have seen.

Tony
Old 10th March 2014
  #74
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Seccione's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Synthbuilder View Post
I think they are all pretty much the same.
I got a gray one from the older batch, and it has these annoying grounding wires which are connected to bottom plate screws.
My other SH's does not have them, and the board layout looks more 'clean'.
Old 10th March 2014
  #75
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Aziak's Avatar
Last week i opened my 101 to fix the power switch issue and did a calibration to it as well. There is no grounding wires to the bottom plate, the cabling is very nice placed around the circuit board and everything inside it looks clean and in place. Mine is #308414, a grey one.

p.s. I did the filter overdrive Mod and it's amazing how you can change the character from smooth to brute with just a knob twist. Love it!!

Cheers!
Old 10th March 2014
  #76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seccione View Post
I got a gray one from the older batch, and it has these annoying grounding wires which are connected to bottom plate screws.
I can't remember ever seeing one with such. But then I haven't seen them all. It may be that someone back in the day just didn't re-assemble it correctly. Now that I have seen plenty of times.

One does need to remove the ground wires from the keyboard and the pitch bender to get at some bits. Maybe they just put them back to the wrong place. The bottom plate should get grounded via the keyboard assembly.

I had one of the first runs of the PS3300 through the workshop a few years ago. The wire dressing on that one was terrible compared to others I have seen. Possibly assembled by the engineering team rather than the production line.

Actually, if you do have a really early one, you could have a look to see if they ever did fit the trimmer for the VCA offset. The PCB is designed to carry one, but I've never seen an SH-101 with one fitted. Funny thing to miss off since it actually does work very well at reducing the VCA thumping.

Tony
Old 10th March 2014
  #77
bry
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Karloff70 View Post
Actually, if you have an Expert Sleepers rig that lets you sequence synths with CV from your computer dead tight, much better than MIDI, and you consider a patchless synth a creative greatness it all turns on its head.......
It still doesn't explain why not just get a brand new Minibrute with 3 year warranty instead...

I wonder how long this craze will go on for, I mean those synths are getting older and older, their maintenance is getting more expensive every day if you can't service them yourself, at some point they will just be a plain bad deal, which will suck pretty bad if you paid this much for them.

If you've been playing one all your life and love it, I understand the relationship, but when getting a new synth, with all the modern mono synth offers, I just don't get it.
Old 10th March 2014
  #78
Quote:
Originally Posted by bry View Post
It still doesn't explain why not just get a brand new Minibrute with 3 year warranty instead...

I wonder how long this craze will go on for, I mean those synths are getting older and older, their maintenance is getting more expensive every day if you can't service them yourself, at some point they will just be a plain bad deal, which will suck pretty bad if you paid this much for them.

If you've been playing one all your life and love it, I understand the relationship, but when getting a new synth, with all the modern mono synth offers, I just don't get it.
It's pretty simple. People read about their idols are using "insert gear here". They want to make as good music as their idols so in their mind they MUST have the same peice of gear to be able to achive that.

Because it's all about the gear and not the skillset right?

We have all been there.
Old 10th March 2014
  #79
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Quote:
It still doesn't explain why not just get a brand new Minibrute with 3 year warranty instead...

I wonder how long this craze will go on for, I mean those synths are getting older and older, their maintenance is getting more expensive every day if you can't service them yourself, at some point they will just be a plain bad deal, which will suck pretty bad if you paid this much for them.

If you've been playing one all your life and love it, I understand the relationship, but when getting a new synth, with all the modern mono synth offers, I just don't get it.
This !

Quote:
Your paying for one of the foundational sounds of early techno with a 101
That no other board in history can compare?

BUT..... I will have to say, this board had a great sound for what it is. It has a interface that is so easy to operate, nothing gets in the way. It takes no time at all to come up with a sound. Even though I had two in the past, and it is not a board I would consider in the future, there are a lot of people, who are posting here, that give their accounts of how well this fits into their mix and how it inspires them to create music. And for others, it is just a lot of fun. For them, it is worth the price. If you have the money and it inspires you to write music, buy it. If you don't like it sell it. Buying gear is not always a logical process. Sometimes it is about wanting a certain board for as long as you can remember and finally being able to get one. Kind of like the fulfillment of a dream you've had for a long time. Finally getting "THE PRECIOUS" !!!
Old 10th March 2014
  #80
Gear Guru
 
Karloff70's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by bry View Post
It still doesn't explain why not just get a brand new Minibrute with 3 year warranty instead...

I wonder how long this craze will go on for, I mean those synths are getting older and older, their maintenance is getting more expensive every day if you can't service them yourself, at some point they will just be a plain bad deal, which will suck pretty bad if you paid this much for them.

If you've been playing one all your life and love it, I understand the relationship, but when getting a new synth, with all the modern mono synth offers, I just don't get it.
It's sort of like a Gibson SG. Simple, but does a very specific thing with a set of specific connotations attached. Only, unlike a Gibson SG they don't make these anymore, and the new offerings, however great in their own right, don't do the same thing....so if you want to do an Angus you will want one, as other guitars may sound great too, but not like that.
Old 10th March 2014
  #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Synthbuilder View Post
I can't remember ever seeing one with such. But then I haven't seen them all. It may be that someone back in the day just didn't re-assemble it correctly.
Nope, that's not it. In the 'old model' there's three wires coming from the jack connector board,
small mod grip board and some third place that can't remember right now. They are placed on top
of three plastic screw-hole-thingies that used to attach the bottom plate. (You know, the ones
that are always broken because of over tightening the screws.) Wires been originally 'glued' in place
with some sort of two-sided tape, but the adhesive's been long dried.

In 'newer' versions these wires have been replaces with small metal pieces sticking 'up' when the SH is upside down.

Also, the layout and details in this 101's circuit board is quite different to others I got.

Have to take some pictures next time I open it. (It's #267814)

(Off topic, but rather interesting)
Old 10th March 2014
  #82
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R3Member's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Karloff70 View Post
It's sort of like a Gibson SG. Simple, but does a very specific thing with a set of specific connotations attached. Only, unlike a Gibson SG they don't make these anymore, and the new offerings, however great in their own right, don't do the same thing....so if you want to do an Angus you will want one, as other guitars may sound great too, but not like that.
There's also the fact that the SH-101 uses a single envelope for both the filter and amp. This is a huge factor in why a lot of vintage synths (particularly the Rolands) sound as good as they do. When two envelopes are implemented, such as on the MiniBrute, it's easier for the sound to just fall apart completely, whereas on a single envelope synth, that sweet spot is always locked in.
Old 10th March 2014
  #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seccione View Post
In 'newer' versions these wires have been replaces with small metal pieces sticking 'up' when the SH is upside down.
Fascinating. I have never seen one that isn't like that. And I've seen loads of the beggars over the years.

Please do take some pictures the next time you're inside the old 101.

And now back to the regular programming.

Tony
Old 10th March 2014
  #84
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I think it doesn't sound spectacular but the sequencer is really nice in combination with triggers while you transpose it at the same time you send CV out that transposes your other gear. It's the main piece for people like Martial Cantarel:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=28u7kWCuF24

The price is completely absurd if you want to just use it like a keys synth or sound module. I think Arturia seems to be aiming for the 101 spot in many ways with their Brutes range, but the sound doesn't come near. So if you want triggered transposable sequencing and the Roland sounds....it will be the 101 and nothing else....
Old 10th March 2014
  #85
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Karloff70's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by R3Member View Post
There's also the fact that the SH-101 uses a single envelope for both the filter and amp. This is a huge factor in why a lot of vintage synths (particularly the Rolands) sound as good as they do. When two envelopes are implemented, such as on the MiniBrute, it's easier for the sound to just fall apart completely, whereas on a single envelope synth, that sweet spot is always locked in.
Interesting point.
Old 10th March 2014
  #86
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by R3Member View Post
There's also the fact that the SH-101 uses a single envelope for both the filter and amp. This is a huge factor in why a lot of vintage synths (particularly the Rolands) sound as good as they do. When two envelopes are implemented, such as on the MiniBrute, it's easier for the sound to just fall apart completely, whereas on a single envelope synth, that sweet spot is always locked in.
The microbrute has a single envelope for both VCA and VCF.
Old 10th March 2014
  #87
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R3Member's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by D_M_R View Post
The microbrute has a single envelope for both VCA and VCF.
It indeed does, but we were discussing the MiniBrute, which has two separate envelopes. The MicroBrute is something I'm actually a bit interested in myself since it is smaller and has that step sequencer, but I'm personally waiting to see how the Korg Arp Odyssey reissue turns out first.
Old 10th March 2014
  #88
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by R3Member View Post
There's also the fact that the SH-101 uses a single envelope for both the filter and amp. This is a huge factor in why a lot of vintage synths (particularly the Rolands) sound as good as they do. When two envelopes are implemented, such as on the MiniBrute, it's easier for the sound to just fall apart completely, whereas on a single envelope synth, that sweet spot is always locked in.
I've always felt a single Env to be a real drawback. E.G. you can't make a sound with a brassy attack (instant VCA attack, slightly slower VCF attack) and still have a little release time because you have to set the VCA to gate control to achieve the desired attack characteristic. Lots of other cool, more subtle sounds are unachievable also due to the single Env limitation so I wouldn't say the sweet spot is locked in, often it's unavailable. Yes you can **** up a sound with 2 Envs but that's down to your limitations, not the synths.
Old 10th March 2014
  #89
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[QUOTE] When two envelopes are implemented, such as on the MiniBrute, it's easier for the sound to just fall apart completely/QUOTE]

That is probably one of the most unprofound statements I have ever heard on this forum. Add a second OSC or LFO and I guess you really have a mess.
Old 10th March 2014
  #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jaxman12 View Post
That is probably one of the most unprofound statements I have ever heard on this forum. Add a second OSC or LFO and I guess you really have a mess.
Well, I meant that in the context of trying to use a double envelope synth to replicate sounds from a single envelope synth. The way two envelopes react in real time is significantly different than a single one controlling both filter and amp at the same time. The only way to have it behave the same would be using something like CC control to shape them both at once, but otherwise, you're forced to move them individually which then creates a significantly different movement in sound.

And I can admit to the fact that more envelopes typically means more sonic possibilities, all I'm saying is that once more than one envelope is involved, it operates differently. Replicating brass sounds are the last thing on my mind when I power up my SH-101, though you can pretty much get a similar effect as someone mentioned above using the mod stick to control the filter separately from the envelope. I wouldn't doubt it if a brass patch is actually listed in the manual. Either way, the SH-101's limitations play into how it sounds the way it does and why people are paying top dollar for it now. It's similar to what has happened with the Juno-60. Not that I agree with some of the more expensive auction prices, but it is what it is.
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