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Full Sail Graduates Virtual Instrument Plugins
Old 10th November 2009
  #211
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianT View Post
Alright then. My bad and my apologies.

Thanks for clearing that up and welcome to GS.

Wow! I can't believe you just got away with that!

The guy had to reveal some of his personal history and private reasons in a puplic forum – to cleanse himself of your accusations... ^^

Welcome to GS... thumbsup
Old 10th November 2009
  #212
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.Cheese View Post
Full Sail is such a scam.... it is seriously ridiculous.

I went there, so don't give me the "you don't know" crap.

Honestly, I wish I could tell you some positive things about Full Sail, but I have a ****load of bad stories...

First of all, the way they run the business... is, well, run like a business .
- They don't care about the individual.
- Most of the instructors don't even want to help you in the labs.

Everyone gets all excited about working in the labs on the "million dollar" Amek and SSL consoles, but forget that you have 6 other students there with you, with 1 or 2 hogging the console cause they did "audio stuff" before Full Sail.

And full fail allows any student with a high school diploma to sign up. Yup. They just want your money.

All these schools should be shut down or be forced to charge no more than 10,000 dollars for a full degree, cause they really are a joke.

If you have a problem with the system, you got nobody to complain to. They treat you like **** cause they know they are getting new students in every month.


All in all, [email protected] full sail. I couldn't wait to get out of there, and get a REAL education.


I hope their building burns down and the president wrecks his aston martin.
I feel you're holding back. Come on. Open up a little. Tell us how you're really feeling.
Old 10th November 2009
  #213
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Old 12th November 2009
  #214
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Quote:
Wow! I can't believe you just got away with that!
Well, really he didn't just get away with it...he got away with it almost two years ago...
Old 14th November 2009
  #215
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the good: there are a lot of students who have won grammys, directed movies (such as SAW). many students have done very very well in the industry. amazing. but when i say many its a lot of people but compared to how many graduate from there its nothing
maybe 1 out of 50
some of the teachers there are GREAT. so knowledgable

the bad: a student from full sail apparently did something really bad to Prince? (just heard, dont hold me to it)
full sail has a terrible system in some classes, their online classes are all jokes
some of the teachers should be janitors.
many full sail students work at guitar center or sam ash after graduating. they do the bare minimum to pass and learn nothing
full sails curriculum is great, the tuition is WAY too high though
too bad almost all the student dont pay attention
Old 14th November 2009
  #216
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.Cheese View Post
I hope their building burns down and the president wrecks his aston martin.
i believe he drives a vintage shelby lol
perfect condition (i'm serious)
Old 16th November 2009
  #217
And a sailboat, I'm guessing...
Old 16th November 2009
  #218
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toneguru's Avatar
$40k for FullSail ... hmmm

$5k Used Protools HD rig
$5k Monitors and cables etc
$2.8k Purple Audio 1176 comp x 2
$2.2k api 3124 4 ch mic pre
$10k Pultec EQP1A x 2
$5k RCA 44BX ribbon mic x 2
$5k Bock Audio tube mic x 2
$5k Neumann KM54 tube mic x 2

$40k for the gear or the school...

Cheers
Old 16th November 2009
  #219
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toneguru View Post
$5k Used Protools HD rig
$5k Monitors and cables etc
$2.8k Purple Audio 1176 comp x 2
$2.2k api 3124 4 ch mic pre
$10k Pultec EQP1A x 2
$5k RCA 44BX ribbon mic x 2
$5k Bock Audio tube mic x 2
$5k Neumann KM54 tube mic x 2

$40k for the gear or the school...

Cheers
This is what I was going to say. And that is NICE gear. 40k could be stretched much more efficiently than that if someone wanted bang for the buck. As a self-taught 'slut' myself, I wouldn't change a thing.
Old 22nd November 2009
  #220
Here for the gear
Life After F.S.

I've had a few Interns from FS and trained many of 'em when I worked at Westlake Audio. Graduates after 1994 seemed to be pretty ****ty and just keep getting worse. The Berkley Students were well motivated. You definitely learn(ed) more by being apprenticed in Studio(s) that had Techs and Engineers that could build whatever they needed. I was part of the Mid-90's generation that signaled the beginning of the end and it gets worse each year.Prior knowledge of the Fundamentals is very important. But then again, a friend of mine who went to FS is now the Assistant Manager of the Local Guitar Center. If you just want to work in Hollywood - do yourself a favor and go into Film School... that is if you only care about making money.
Old 22nd November 2009
  #221
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Quote:
Originally Posted by studiomonkey View Post
I've had a few Interns from FS and trained many of 'em when I worked at Westlake Audio. Graduates after 1994 seemed to be pretty ****ty and just keep getting worse.
I did a session at Westlake in 1988 or 1989 (in Studio B with the VR) and the assistant was from Full Sail. The session lasted from 8 AM to 1 AM the first day, and from 8 AM to 5:30 AM the second day. I don't remember his name, but he was great. We were all exhausted but he kept going to the end.

That said, I've had the opportunity to visit Full Sail, Expressions and three SAE schools. They were all very impressive looking with great gear. At each school, I asked them how many students actually got jobs. And at each school they answered "Very few."

Mike McRoberts
Old 23rd November 2009
  #222
Here for the gear
Westlake Guys (back then) were always good. The longest I ever went was for 72 hours. We didn't take mercy on training our runners. I guess the theory being: "If you can't do the easy sh.# right, how are you going to handle being an Assistant who has to know more than the guy pretending to drive the ship. I don't miss Total Recalls on thee SSL 4000 in Studio B at 4AM! But those were the days...
Old 23rd November 2009
  #223
Here for the gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcmike View Post
I did a session at Westlake in 1988 or 1989 (in Studio B with the VR) and the assistant was from Full Sail. The session lasted from 8 AM to 1 AM the first day, and from 8 AM to 5:30 AM the second day. I don't remember his name, but he was great. We were all exhausted but he kept going to the end.

That said, I've had the opportunity to visit Full Sail, Expressions and three SAE schools. They were all very impressive looking with great gear. At each school, I asked them how many students actually got jobs. And at each school they answered "Very few."

Mike McRoberts
Hanson Hsu Re-worked the Room / installing the SSL a few years after you were there. I believe that VR went across the Hall into Studio A (The Room where Thriller was mixed w/ the Harrison Desk). Do you remember the name of the Assistant?
Old 23rd November 2009
  #224
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Quote:
Originally Posted by studiomonkey View Post
Hanson Hsu Re-worked the Room / installing the SSL a few years after you were there. I believe that VR went across the Hall into Studio A (The Room where Thriller was mixed w/ the Harrison Desk). Do you remember the name of the Assistant?
I don't remember his name, but I do have a picture of him. I'll try to post that tomorrow.

It might have been Studio A, because somebody mentioned that Thriller had been mixed in the Room. But there was a studio across the hall with the Harrison then. We used it for some product demos in the 80s.

Mike McRoberts
Old 23rd November 2009
  #225
Here for the gear
Club Bev is we what called The Beverly Building. It was a lot more lax than working the Santa Monica BLDG w/ the Sales Group. They would Memo loan employees/clients just about any piece of gear to try out. FS would drive out there once a year and do their little BullSh$# Honors for previous Grads. There use to be a High Caliber of person that went along w/ the title engineer - like buying a car from an old Air-force guy. You could count on it. All that BS of what trends/music you listen to being a common denominator for friendship were void. We had each others back and in LA that's hard to find. Real Engineers are a dying breed.
Old 23rd November 2009
  #226
Gear Maniac
 

Here's the only picture I have with the assistant in it. He's at the far left. I'm on the right. The session was to produce the first recording demo of the Akai ADAM digital 12-track. We did one 12-track instrumental jazz tune and one 24-track vocal tune. We pulled it off in 48 hours thanks to the team at Westlake and a good group of musicians: Jeff Baxter, Ricky Lawson, Jeff Lorber, Jimmy Johnson, the Perri sisters (who were with Anita Baker) and Sam Zambito on Akai EVI.

Mike McRoberts
Attached Thumbnails
Full Sail Graduates-westlake.jpg  
Old 24th November 2009
  #227
Here for the gear
Don't recognize him, but thanks for posting it. The most fun I've had in that room was tracking to a Studer A800 @ 15IPS/Dolby NR through an old 8 Ch. Neve Broadcast board. Sickest drum sounds ever...
Old 24th November 2009
  #228
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Most think a degree in this or that is going to get you a job in this or that.

There's plenty of people cimplaining about it, if you really care that much go into one of these schools as an industry pro and state to them the hard facts about what is going on.
Old 25th November 2009
  #229
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by joelpatterson View Post
I think the true crime is that they prey on people with romantic delusions about "the industry" and cater to pathetic types who think they can buy their way into "cool."

Other than that, I'm sure they're a fine bunch of folks.
This is exactly the way SAE works too. I worked there as a studio supervisor 10 years ago. During open days they told us when people ask the question " so, what are the chances of getting work once the course is over?" to tell them " if you are good, you will get work." as we all know this is not always the case.

Back then you were paying 9K for the course. Now you pay double that. The worst part about it is that almost all the lecturers have zero industry experience. ie: just finished the course themselves and been hired to regurgitate what they just learned from another "unqualified" person.

It is sad to see people who have no idea about a cut throat industry being reeled in to the course but at the end of the day SAE is a business and it exists to make money and does that very well.
Old 25th November 2009
  #230
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BorkTheGearDork View Post
Howdy yall,
i realized that i was balls deep in debt and couldn't mix to save my life. Obviously, i only got the oppertunity to "mix" 1 song while in school. I don't think that anyone leaves FS w/ ears, but i could smoke people on PT. That's how i got my in on recording.
that's the impression that I get - like thousands of "Protools certified" keystroke jockeys pouring out of the gates with earmuffs on. "Smoking people in PT" doesn't get you too far.
Old 25th November 2009
  #231
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Four months ago I went to SAE here in San Fran for an interview.

The position was to teach a course in live sound.

I told the interviewer that most of my expertise is in the 100 to 500 capacity venues. I always figured that most grads would be better off going for the $150 a night gigs then going for the $400 a day concert gigs. For obvious reasons like the 1,000's of small venues that need a soundman and the fact that concert gigs are not flush with FOH engineers straight out of school.

Anyway, he had it scheduled for about 50 hours of lecturing on live sound. I had mentioned that I felt the most important part of keeping a sound gig is the ability to communicate with the concert mgr and the artists and to keep your ego in check. I told him I want to impart that to the class and go over syntax and other communication skills because it truly is the part that many classes do not teach. He seemed more interested in line arrays.

I am happy to discuss dispersion and setting delays and the new amp systems but I still could not get away from the importance of knowing how to deal with the artists. Over a thousand FOH gigs and I am still refining my communications skill-set.

Anyway, I think it is a great place to go if money is no object. As much for the chance to develop relationships with like minded students as for the studying and hands on part.
Old 12th January 2011
  #232
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Negative FS videos

YouTube - Full Sail University - Short SCAM Documentary

YouTube - (Full Sail Is A Scam!!!!) Meeting With Fullsail University Admissions Representative

YouTube - Key Grip vs. Full Sail student

I've got my own horror stories to tell about my time in the film program at FS. Makes me sad and angry that a business can have so little integrity.
Old 12th January 2011
  #233
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lettenmusic's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by toneguru View Post
$5k Used Protools HD rig
$5k Monitors and cables etc
$2.8k Purple Audio 1176 comp x 2
$2.2k api 3124 4 ch mic pre
$10k Pultec EQP1A x 2
$5k RCA 44BX ribbon mic x 2
$5k Bock Audio tube mic x 2
$5k Neumann KM54 tube mic x 2

$40k for the gear or the school...

Cheers
You don't need to have much of a credit score/rating to get student loans. I would guess it would be pretty difficult for most of us to get approved for a 40K "gear loan".
Old 12th January 2011
  #234
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Quote:
End credit "This movie was made by Full Sail graduates"

Yeah it sure was - the dialogue was unintelligible at times. Sad evidence of their mixing abilities, can't believe no one taught them the concept of "ducking".
Old 12th January 2011
  #235
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Real MC View Post
End credit "This movie was made by Full Sail graduates"

Yeah it sure was - the dialogue was unintelligible at times. Sad evidence of their mixing abilities, can't believe no one taught them the concept of "ducking".
Ha I was thinking the same thing pretty much. Didn't take it as a reflection onto Full Sail as much as the student. Some people just don't have the skills. I found the documentary hilarious and pretty much a summary of why you see so much hate about Full Sail.

I went to a well respected University before Full Sail and got a degree not related to audio. I know very few people from the large university working in the field that their degree was in. This is normal. At the same time I am the only person I know of working full time in audio that I graduated with from Full Sail. For some reason with Full Sail everyone thinks they get the degree and then immediately the job flood gates open and they get a job. It is not this way with any degree.

I mean whining about the parking, really! The quote from the student whining about having to retake a class because of attendance due to parking is priceless. Ha the university I went to had NO parking. You couldn't even drive through campus. You know what if you run late, the next time you plan for that. Don't think my boss would accept me constantly being late because there was no parking in Los Angeles. That attitude right there is an example of what will keep you from moving up in the industry and why that person shouldn't of went to Full Sail.

Basically trying to point out that probably at most 2-5% of the students at Full Sail should be there. But you need the other 95% to pay for the gear and building. Also don't know why people get so upset about this with Full Sail when it goes on at every university. One thing about cost. The 4 year state university I went to was a lot more expensive then Full Sail. So is my wife's bachelors and masters that we are still paying off. She is always jealous that my Full Sail loans are already payed off! heh
Old 12th January 2011
  #236
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by fsisbs View Post
YouTube - Full Sail University - Short SCAM Documentary

YouTube - (Full Sail Is A Scam!!!!) Meeting With Fullsail University Admissions Representative

YouTube - Key Grip vs. Full Sail student

I've got my own horror stories to tell about my time in the film program at FS. Makes me sad and angry that a business can have so little integrity.
This is also the fault of the current 40-60 generation, and will probably not stop with them, they pushed kids with education education education all their lives and they think it matters a lot. They think high school is the be all end all and if you fail there you fail in life, and if you succeed there, you'll be a millionaire one day.

The guy who owns full sail is a really smart guy, he saw where all these losers were going (or were being pushed to, as I said, education) then offered them the chance to work on professional tools. If they just sign *here*, *here* and urm, *here*....big sparkly consoles and what not.

Full Sail is like a med school with a machine that cures cancer.....only in a world where no-one is sick. Think about it.

If their gear is so expensive and they have the sluttiest setups ever (which they do) then why don't they just run a commerical studio?

Oh yea, there are no jobs and there is no money in the music industry, there is more money from the loans given to people with no potential that see full sail as a last ditch effort to get something worthy in life.

They're wrong. If you were a smart audio engineer, you'd start work in Full Sail and work your way up to the director's/president's job, not working in a bad studio for 10 years listening to crap music all day for measly bucks an hour.
Old 13th January 2011
  #237
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lettenmusic View Post
You don't need to have much of a credit score/rating to get student loans. I would guess it would be pretty difficult for most of us to get approved for a 40K "gear loan".
Nagh, I actually just got one myself not 6 months ago to build my small studio.

I just used as collateral all my existing guitars, amps, drums, etc and "gamed" it up to the high end of what they were all worth.

Loan went through easily enough for me, with a decent credit score.
Old 13th January 2011
  #238
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by fsisbs View Post
YouTube - Full Sail University - Short SCAM Documentary

YouTube - (Full Sail Is A Scam!!!!) Meeting With Fullsail University Admissions Representative

YouTube - Key Grip vs. Full Sail student

I've got my own horror stories to tell about my time in the film program at FS. Makes me sad and angry that a business can have so little integrity.
Those animated ones on youtube are hilarious.
Old 14th January 2011
  #239
Gear Maniac
 

In the UK I think the fees are likely to be £9000 at the highest fees paid. Maybe to compete some might be lower at say £7-8,000. All in all it's a heck of a lot of money, it's shocking that it's nothing to what it's like in university.

So £25k for a degree in music technology in the UK. Scary, I'm applying to lecture there now heh
Old 14th January 2011
  #240
Gear Head
 

Rather than go to FS, go to your state U and get an EE degree. Take a music minor. Hang around whatever local studios there are. This course of action is probably cheaper and, having the EE degree, you won't be starving as you pursue your avocation (which recording will end up being for most of you).

And, oddly enough, being able to read and understand a schematic can come in useful.
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