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Old 8th February 2012
  #31
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🎧 15 years
The Radiohead I've heard lately sounds like meandering ambient grooves to me...

what traditional type songs do they have (lately)?

Katy Perry seems more traditional...
Old 8th February 2012 | Show parent
  #32
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by JP11 ➡️
The Radiohead I've heard lately sounds like meandering ambient grooves to me...

what traditional type songs do they have (lately)?

Katy Perry seems more traditional...
Guess who uses more auto-tune ?

If you are looking among the most popular musical artists today for...

1) Serious musical ART
2) Beautiful, sophisticated, *expansive* melodic themes
3) Poetic lyrics (which are often heavy, well articulated & sophisticated)
4) Extensive harmonic knowledge and chord pattern craftsmanship
5) Exhibition of *natural* (minimally processed), individualistic vocal skill and vocal artistry
6) Exhibition of refined, organic or raw skill on a musical *instrument*
7) Dynamics
8) Originality

...then Radiohead are most likely going to provide you with that more than the rest, including Poptart Perry.
Old 8th February 2012
  #33
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Kaoz's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy Musicfan ➡️
Guess who uses more auto-tune ?

If you are looking among the most popular musical artists today for...

1) Serious musical ART
2) Beautiful, sophisticated, *expansive* melodic themes
3) Poetic lyrics (which are often heavy, well articulated & sophisticated)
4) Extensive harmonic knowledge and chord pattern craftsmanship
5) Exhibition of *natural* (minimally processed), individualistic vocal skill and vocal artistry
6) Exhibition of refined, organic or raw skill on a musical *instrument*
7) Dynamics
8) Originality

...then Radiohead are most likely going to provide you with that more than the rest, including Poptart Perry.
Oh god not the list again.
Old 8th February 2012 | Show parent
  #34
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Uh huh....

but what are their great traditional type songs...like Yesterday or The Long and Winding Road or In My Life or Let It Be...

to me, those are examples of traditional type songs...

are they writing songs like that? I haven't heard them if they have...
Old 8th February 2012 | Show parent
  #35
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaoz ➡️
Oh god not the list again.

Oh God, not your allergic reaction to it again.

I'm not sneaking peanut residue into your snack. You are choosing to snack on the peanut residue.
Old 8th February 2012 | Show parent
  #36
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by JP11 ➡️
Uh huh....

but what are their great traditional type songs...like Yesterday or The Long and Winding Road or In My Life or Let It Be...

to me, those are examples of traditional type songs...

are they writing songs like that? I haven't heard them if they have...

All I'm saying is that they emulate and incorporate the classic songwriting approach you crave more than many of the megapopular ones out there.

On their latest album, which is their least traditional in terms of a classic songwriting approach, this song stands out as a pure, very minimalist salute to the artistry of melodically expressive beauty.


Radiohead - Codex - YouTube
Old 8th February 2012 | Show parent
  #37
DSK
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DSK's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaoz ➡️
Oh god not the list again.
Good list!

Hmm may I borrow it so I can have it as a check list?

Anyway love the turn Radiohead took with Kid A

All amazing albums after that... especially Hail To The Thief!
Old 8th February 2012
  #38
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Kaoz's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by DSK ➡️

Anyway love the turn Radiohead took with Kid A

All amazing albums after that... especially Hail To The Thief!
Agreed.

Which, coincidentally, is when they really turned away from being just another standard rock band who relied on a lot of the oft repeated list and created beautiful music.
Old 8th February 2012 | Show parent
  #39
Gear Guru
 
Sounds Great's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy Musicfan ➡️

Of course, they might be trying to carve out their own sound by neglecting melodic themes, harmonic progressions, natural vocal skills, natural instrumental skills, songwriting skills and dynamics in order to simply provide sonic carnivalshock.
Well then stop listening to Nicki Minaj.
Old 8th February 2012 | Show parent
  #40
Deleted 6ccb844
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by u b k ➡️
No offense taken; for what it's worth, the old men here seem at peace with where things are at, in fact that's the whole point of this thread.

Your post, on the other hand, sounds a bit like an episode of grumpy young men.

"Don't get me wrong I'm not saying people have to like anything or even much."


Actually, it sounded like you were saying exactly that:

"But come on, adapt... Stop being stuck in your ways and look to the future"

It is entirely possible to respect and embrace one's ways without being 'stuck' in them. Being 'stuck' implies that something is wrong and I can't get where I'm going, but the beautiful thing about life is that you can't *not* get where you're going.

You are, in fact, always there.


Gregory Scott - ubk
I really shouldn't post messages when I'm tired :P

You said that you don't have much love for most modern mainstream music, whilst there is a plethora of crap out there in my own opinionated way.. There is also plenty to embrace.

If everything was amazing, there would be nothing that is amazing. You are not always there, neither do you want to be. The Journey can some times count more than the end goal, but people b****** about modern music is ridiculous, you sound like my dad. LOL, especially being an engineer I would of thought you had less chance to ignore and have to embrace even more.

But I have to admit, I care less as I mature.. You never hear a kid saying, Dad I don't want to go to that party because it's a long drive and it's probably going to be crap anyway heh

But if these "old men", were at peace this thread would not exist.. We would be on the good news channel saying new music rocks!!!
Old 8th February 2012 | Show parent
  #41
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShadowAMD ➡️
You said that you don't have much love for most modern mainstream music, whilst there is a plethora of crap out there in my own opinionated way.. There is also plenty to embrace.
If anyone is less positive about mainstream music than you are, it simply means that they have *higher* standards and/or *different* standards/priorities than you.

That's explains *all* of the bitter antagonism towards the *very common* criticisms of modern mainstream music.

And those doing the criticizing of modern music are often in their teens and twenties - they are not all 50 years of age. In any given high school classroom, do you really think there is uniform love and respect for Bieber, or Gaga ? Well, there isn't.
Old 8th February 2012 | Show parent
  #42
Gear Guru
 
joelpatterson's Avatar
 
2 Reviews written
🎧 15 years
Well, I have a spectacularly apropos observation to make in re: vis-a-vis this whole discussion.

And-- maybe at some point I will make it, but this weekend I was recording a concert that included a high school jazz band playing Lady Gaga's "Born This Way."

Now-- it seems by careful planning, I've never heard the original, so I was all atwitter to experience the two primal aspects: (1) when broken down to its instrumental essence, what did the song do? what did it contain? what soaring melody lines and over-arching themes did it employ?; and (2) were the kids especially reverent about it and were they going to project it with a special enthusiasm and delirious joy?

I have to report: it made scant little impression on me. I had to conclude that the value and strength of the tune HAD to lie in its lyrical content, because the "music" was fairly vapid and unmemorable, if I had to characterize what I heard, it was a kind of "bladdle-deedee-dah, bladdle-deedee-dah," that wheezed on for a while, and then it was over. Also, I didn't notice that hint of gleeful abandon that I'd have expected if this was a generation's theme song. To put it mildly.

So... in conclusion, let me say...
Old 8th February 2012 | Show parent
  #43
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy Musicfan ➡️
All I'm saying is that they emulate and incorporate the classic songwriting approach you crave more than many of the megapopular ones out there.

On their latest album, which is their least traditional in terms of a classic songwriting approach, this song stands out as a pure, very minimalist salute to the artistry of melodically expressive beauty.


Radiohead - Codex - YouTube
The images were great...

if this is the sort of music you crave, I don't know what you're complaining about, there's lots of stuff like that out there...
Old 8th February 2012 | Show parent
  #44
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by JP11 ➡️
The images were great...

if this is the sort of music you crave, I don't know what you're complaining about, there's lots of stuff like that out there...
Not at that popularity level, providing such a pure, uncompromising and classic melody. And the album it's from changes gear radically from the aesthetic of that song.
Old 8th February 2012 | Show parent
  #45
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy Musicfan ➡️
Not at that popularity level, providing such a pure, uncompromising and classic melody.
Really? How does it go?
Old 8th February 2012 | Show parent
  #46
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by JP11 ➡️
Really? How does it go?
It goes *better* than most of the other modern mainstream musical artists out there.

That's what you are oblivious to. I'm *not* saying it's at the level of your ideal standards and preferences.
Old 8th February 2012 | Show parent
  #47
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy Musicfan ➡️
I'm *not* saying it's at the level of your ideal standards and preferences.
Okay, just checking...
Old 9th February 2012 | Show parent
  #48
Lives for gear
 
jeremy.c.'s Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by joelpatterson ➡️
I have to report: it made scant little impression on me. I had to conclude that the value and strength of the tune HAD to lie in its lyrical content, because the "music" was fairly vapid and unmemorable, if I had to characterize what I heard, it was a kind of "bladdle-deedee-dah, bladdle-deedee-dah," that wheezed on for a while, and then it was over. Also, I didn't notice that hint of gleeful abandon that I'd have expected if this was a generation's theme song. To put it mildly.

So... in conclusion, let me say...
I have to admit I was (metaphorically) biting my nails, truly scared you were going to say the youngsters unearthed a gem that would stand the test of time. Unfortunately now it just makes me participate in confirmation bias, because I knew that.
I'm pretty sure the lyrics convey value and strength much in the same way that most car advertisement text conveys poetry on a billboard.
Old 9th February 2012 | Show parent
  #49
Gear Guru
 
u b k's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deleted 6ccb844 ➡️
You said that you don't have much love for most modern mainstream music, whilst there is a plethora of crap out there in my own opinionated way.. There is also plenty to embrace.

Well, to be clear, I never called anything crap, in fact I expressed no judgments about anything. I simply expressed the fact I don't seem to have much love for new music... but that's not a statement about the music, that's a statement about me, and it's made without a trace of bitterness, resentment, or cynicism.

That distinction between expressing a preference and judging the thing itself is either tripping you up, or lost on you completely, I'm not sure which.

The thing is --- and maybe this is different for you --- I don't have any control over what I like and don't like. I also don't much care to control my tastes, because there is SO MUCH about music, life, food, women, art, and people that I love that I have neither the time, bandwidth, nor need to push my tastebuds in any direction they don't naturally want to go.

You seem to think folks like myself should or ought to be feeling differently than we do, and on that point I can't agree with you because I'm enjoying the hell out of my experience of this existence. I gather you're having the same quality of experience as well, the only apparent difference is the sounds and grooves that get us off. I don't need you to like Percy Faith, why do you think I ought to like <insert new artist>?

The answer, quite possibly, is because you think you know what's best for others. Heads up on that one, it's a soul trap of epic proportions.


Gregory Scott - ubk
Old 9th February 2012 | Show parent
  #50
Deleted 6ccb844
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy Musicfan ➡️
If anyone is less positive about mainstream music than you are, it simply means that they have *higher* standards and/or *different* standards/priorities than you.

That's explains *all* of the bitter antagonism towards the *very common* criticisms of modern mainstream music.

And those doing the criticizing of modern music are often in their teens and twenties - they are not all 50 years of age. In any given high school classroom, do you really think there is uniform love and respect for Bieber, or Gaga ? Well, there isn't.
That's simple, it's because if something is deemed "uncool" then it will be slated by teens.. You should see the amount of Bieber insults in metal, I don't get why they do it, if they don't like it then they should listen to what the enjoy and forget Bieber exists..
Old 9th February 2012 | Show parent
  #51
Deleted 6ccb844
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by u b k ➡️
Well, to be clear, I never called anything crap, in fact I expressed no judgments about anything. I simply expressed the fact I don't seem to have much love for new music... but that's not a statement about the music, that's a statement about me, and it's made without a trace of bitterness, resentment, or cynicism.
Call a potato a tree, but saying that "You don't have much love for" equates a more diplomatic way of saying you think it is sub par to other things.. plus it doesn't matter it's opinion, everyone is obviously entitled.

Quote:

That distinction between expressing a preference and judging the thing itself is either tripping you up, or lost on you completely, I'm not sure which.
I wouldn't of even thought about it, you obviously thought even momentary to come to conclusion.. It seems you have summed up this book without opening the contents..

To me a preference can be pertained as a judging, on X Factor / American Idol they judge, but it's only really a preference.

Quote:

The thing is --- and maybe this is different for you --- I don't have any control over what I like and don't like. I also don't much care to control my tastes, because there is SO MUCH about music, life, food, women, art, and people that I love that I have neither the time, bandwidth, nor need to push my tastebuds in any direction they don't naturally want to go.
That's great and I never said you had to.

Quote:

You seem to think folks like myself should or ought to be feeling differently than we do, and on that point I can't agree with you because I'm enjoying the hell out of my experience of this existence. I gather you're having the same quality of experience as well, the only apparent difference is the sounds and grooves that get us off. I don't need you to like Percy Faith, why do you think I ought to like <insert new artist>?
I'm not fussed who you like, I also don't believe you could enjoy a specific product like I do and vice versa we are two different people. If you had an issue, then I would care.. I would try and help as much as I could.. That's just me, but when it comes to someone's preference in music.. Then it's your ball, in your court.

Quote:

The answer, quite possibly, is because you think you know what's best for others. Heads up on that one, it's a soul trap of epic proportions.

Gregory Scott - ubk
It's statement's like these I don't much care for, it sounds like you are insinuating I'm ramming some form of lifestyle down your throat.. It's not really necessary and is poor treatment of others. You don't know me at all, so you can't comment on what I think.

There is a lot of moaning that goes on with different generations, it seems there is a grouping that of elder generations that want to throw everything modern in a dustbin.. I know it's a generalisation and not pointed specifically at you or anyone else..

The only thing I would presume someone should do is keep an open mind, not just in music but in life.. If you choose not to, then it doesn't matter to me.
Old 9th February 2012 | Show parent
  #52
Here for the gear
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy Musicfan ➡️
It goes *better* than most of the other modern mainstream musical artists out there.

That's what you are oblivious to. I'm *not* saying it's at the level of your ideal standards and preferences.
I think the song has a wonderful melody that shows restraint and patience (i.e., maturity).
Old 9th February 2012 | Show parent
  #53
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deleted 6ccb844 ➡️
That's simple, it's because if something is deemed "uncool" then it will be slated by teens.. You should see the amount of Bieber insults in metal, I don't get why they do it, if they don't like it then they should listen to what the enjoy and forget Bieber exists..
Many teens (and non-teens) prefer something heavier, less frivolous and predictable and less packaged/processed/hyped than Bieber and Gaga. How can they forget something which is in their face via various very powerful mass media outlets ?

OTOH, many teens (and non-teens) prefer something packaged/processed/hyped, frivolous and predictable so they opt for things like Bieber and Gaga.
Old 9th February 2012 | Show parent
  #54
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sleepingbag's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deleted 6ccb844 ➡️
Call a potato a tree, but saying that "You don't have much love for" equates a more diplomatic way of saying you think it is sub par to other things..
No, those aren't the same thing at all. UBK is making the point that something can both be a) not for him, and b) still good to somebody. He's been very explicit about that.

It would be really nice if people understood that this is the way opinions work. You can dislike something -- strongly, even -- and still acknowledge that other people see something to like about it. And the equally important corollary: just because they do doesn't necessarily make them stupider or less perceptive people than yourself in any way. They might just.... gasp.... like different things than you!
Old 9th February 2012 | Show parent
  #55
Gear Guru
 
chrisso's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by sleepingbag ➡️
No, those aren't the same thing at all. UBK is making the point that something can both be a) not for him, and b) still good to somebody. He's been very explicit about that.
Bingo.

I like some jazz, I can't be bothered with a lot of it. Of course it is highly crafted music performed with great skill. I very much value it's existence and admire the people who compose and perform it.
Do I want to listen to it? Not very often.
Old 9th February 2012 | Show parent
  #56
Deleted 6ccb844
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by sleepingbag ➡️
No, those aren't the same thing at all. UBK is making the point that something can both be a) not for him, and b) still good to somebody. He's been very explicit about that.

It would be really nice if people understood that this is the way opinions work. You can dislike something -- strongly, even -- and still acknowledge that other people see something to like about it. And the equally important corollary: just because they do doesn't necessarily make them stupider or less perceptive people than yourself in any way. They might just.... gasp.... like different things than you!
They are the same thing, but the other part of your statement is obvious.. One man's gold is another man's junk..

Doesn't mean I disrespect anyone for liking what they like, I have friends into extreme LO-FI black metal.. I don't have an issue with it, other's aren't so slow just to spout out whatever they think.. Especially when it comes to extreme metal.
Old 9th February 2012 | Show parent
  #57
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by sleepingbag ➡️
It would be really nice if people understood that this is the way opinions work.
Actually, it's you who do not tolerate a variety of opinions. Did I say you have to like AC/DC or Neil Diamond ? No.

What I'd say is that they manifest the old school skills and standards which are less prevalent in today's pop music than in the pop music of their heyday.


You constantly come in to say that old school preferences music are inappropriate, and people must respect Skrillex, LMFAO and Minaj for what they are.

In reality, it is you who don't tolerate anything more critical than your unconditional 'all modern pop is great' abyss of anything goes and must be respected.
Old 9th February 2012
  #58
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sleepingbag's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
LOL I never said any of that? And I don't think I believe any of it, except for the idea that "old school skills" are less prevalent in today's pop music, I agree with that. But "even older school skills" were less prevalent in yesterday's pop music and it turned out fine. So I'm not concerned.

I know you think it means the death of music and art and the world, but slowly phasing out old rules is called 'progress', and it's nothing to worry about, unless you really like worrying. And people sure do seem to like worrying about things. So who am I to take that away from you? Also Nicki Minaj is better than "Selling England By the Pound".
Old 9th February 2012 | Show parent
  #59
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by sleepingbag ➡️
I know you think it means the death of music and art and the world, but slowly phasing out old rules is called 'progress', and it's nothing to worry about, unless you really like worrying.
There will be no death of musical standards in pop music songcrafting born out of rock and roll. Adele, Van Halen, Radiohead, Janelle Monae, Bruno Mars, Coldplay and many many others are 'raising the bar' above the non-existent, non-standard of the abyss you command everyone to respect.
Old 9th February 2012 | Show parent
  #60
Gear Guru
 
joelpatterson's Avatar
 
2 Reviews written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeremy.c. ➡️
... Most car advertisement text conveys poetry on a billboard. Ablian
like ...THIS SONG IS GAGA TOUGH!
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