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All these Neve knock-offs as "the real thing" Dual-Channel Preamps
Old 17th September 2011
  #1
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All these Neve knock-offs as "the real thing"

I see all these posts, time and time again how great all these Neve knock-offs are and people recommending them (some never even used a real or knock-off!)..GTFOH !

Then all the "better then a real 1073" crap that follows

Get your money up and buy a real racked 1073 and stop being a cheap ass !!!



That is all...and yes I have my flame suit on heh
Old 17th September 2011
  #2
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I feel that real and clone 1073's are overrated. I'm not saying that they don't sound amazing. They most certainly do. I'm just saying that there are MANY other pres out there that are just as useful. As long as the talent is there it's incredibly easy to make ANY high end mic Pre sound good. That is of course just my opinion. I do feel that we as engineers are guilty of building these mystical pieces of gear up in front of our clients (even though it's very rare that they could tell the difference between any of these pres).

Those vintage neve pres certainly have their own sound, but so does APA, Buzz, API, Milennia, Manley . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Old 17th September 2011
  #3
I'll go a step further and add that the importance of the preamp has been overblown to death, back to life and death again. I've never heard an original 1073 but have yet to hear a pre magically do anything but amplify the mic plugged into it. Subtle stuff that's over hyped. It's important, just not as important as some people would have you believe. There's not a whole lot of bad gear around anymore. Even the cheapest of prosumer gear these days is quite good.
Old 17th September 2011
  #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 302efi View Post
Get your money up and buy a real racked 1073 and stop being a cheap ass !!!
Not everyone can afford £1000+ per channel on pre's. That's just reality man. So as far as that goes the cheap Neve clones do fulfill a need in the market.

I agree that the difference between and importance of pre's has been way overhyped around here. But I have heard direct comparisons of reamped guitars (so no difference in performance like some of the "comparisons" I've seen) and compared to the Profire and Motu the GAP definitely sounded better to me.
Old 17th September 2011
  #5
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That's just it, if you want the Neve sound, don't waste $1500 on a Vintech knock-off, say another $1500 and get the real thing.

Are you really getting close to a Neve with a $350 GAP knock-off ? IMO, nowhere near.

The music business is big money and this stuff is what sets the pros from the hobbyists...
Old 17th September 2011
  #6
So if I have an AMS Neve 1073 DPD, is that considered the real thing? I personally don't know.
Old 17th September 2011
  #7
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studio825's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by 302efi View Post

The music business is big money and this stuff is what sets the pros from the hobbyists...
Old 17th September 2011
  #8
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dannyofmarge's Avatar
 

First off, I admit it's annoying when people talk about things they dont really know much about, especially 1073's!
But... I owned a well maintained pair of original neve 1073's for a a number of years. Then I bought an aurora audio gtq. Later that week I called my tech to see of I could get some info on why my 1073's didn't sound as good as the aurora pre's... Turns out i just like them better. i soon sold my neves, bought a second gtq, and never looked back! But then again, the gtq's will never that cool neve logo...



Sent from my SGH-T959 using Gearslutz.com App
Old 18th September 2011
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Lago View Post
So if I have an AMS Neve 1073 DPD, is that considered the real thing? I personally don't know.

I would says your is the real thing considering who makes it heh
Old 18th September 2011
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by studio825 View Post

Smack your head all you want but no "pro" is going to use a GAP over a real 1073...Sorry to inform you of this.

You can now show me all these paid video testimonials of big studios using now
Old 18th September 2011
  #11
Quote:
Originally Posted by 302efi View Post
I would says your is the real thing considering who makes it heh
But AMS Neve Makes it haha, it doesn't have the same stuff as the old neves, I've A/Bed and they sound different.

I think the BAE is closer to the Older Neve sound.
Old 18th September 2011
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Lago View Post
But AMS Neve Makes it haha, it doesn't have the same stuff as the old neves, I've A/Bed and they sound different.

I think the BAE is closer to the Older Neve sound.

...but AMS Neve is "Neve", not a knock off...Like the actually company.

On a side note, I love the descriptions of some of these bootlegs:
"Neve inspired sound"
"Similar sound to a 1073"


They clearly have to change my then a few things to get by copyright laws, wonder where those "changes" are at ?...So in conclusion it is not a actual 1073 circuit, no matter what they did as by law they can't copy it exactly.
Old 18th September 2011
  #13
Quote:
Originally Posted by 302efi View Post
Smack your head all you want but no "pro" is going to use a GAP over a real 1073...Sorry to inform you of this.

You can now show me all these paid video testimonials of big studios using now
Hate to be an arse and prove you wrong, but we have a rack of 10 Neves (1081s and 1066s, so ok not a 1073 though I'll be using a desk full tomorrow) at one of our studios.

They sound great. However, I did an A/B with the Neves against a GAP that was also there, and ended up going with the GAP - it worked better. This was at a multi-Grammy winner's studio (not that I think he had anything to do with the GAP, just that the Neves are in top notch condition).

My studio partner had the same experience independently, without me mentioning it.

On the strength of that, I bought a GAP73 and have used it on several "pro" records, plus on a multitude of independent and unsigned projects.

I'm no grammy winner (but I am a professional engineer working on records for signed and unsigned artists) and for sure I'd get a 1073 as well if I could afford it. But the GAP does what it does very well, it's kind of a total no-brainer when you consider what else is available at that price point, and it's not identical to a 1073. But it does provide a good quality sound, and holds it's own with preamps many times the price.

Sorry to inform you of this
Old 18th September 2011
  #14
Talking

Quote:
Originally Posted by 302efi View Post
I see all these posts, time and time again how great all these Neve knock-offs are and people recommending them (some never even used a real or knock-off!)..GTFOH !

Then all the "better then a real 1073" crap that follows

Get your money up and buy a real racked 1073 and stop being a cheap ass !!!



That is all...and yes I have my flame suit on heh
.



.
Old 18th September 2011
  #15
Thumbs up

Quote:
Originally Posted by bexarametric View Post
I feel that real and clone 1073's are overrated. I'm not saying that they don't sound amazing. They most certainly do. I'm just saying that there are MANY other pres out there that are just as useful. As long as the talent is there it's incredibly easy to make ANY high end mic Pre sound good. That is of course just my opinion. I do feel that we as engineers are guilty of building these mystical pieces of gear up in front of our clients (even though it's very rare that they could tell the difference between any of these pres).

Those vintage neve pres certainly have their own sound, but so does APA, Buzz, API, Milennia, Manley . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
.

Well said.

My Buzz Audio ARC will kick the ****e out of pretty much anything on the market.

Guaranteed.

And the compression.......oy....

.
Old 18th September 2011
  #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_monkey View Post
Hate to be an arse and prove you wrong, but we have a rack of 10 Neves (1081s and 1066s, so ok not a 1073 though I'll be using a desk full tomorrow) at one of our studios.

They sound great. However, I did an A/B with the Neves against a GAP that was also there, and ended up going with the GAP - it worked better. This was at a multi-Grammy winner's studio (not that I think he had anything to do with the GAP, just that the Neves are in top notch condition).

My studio partner had the same experience independently, without me mentioning it.

On the strength of that, I bought a GAP73 and have used it on several "pro" records, plus on a multitude of independent and unsigned projects.

I'm no grammy winner (but I am a professional engineer working on records for signed and unsigned artists) and for sure I'd get a 1073 as well if I could afford it. But the GAP does what it does very well, it's kind of a total no-brainer when you consider what else is available at that price point, and it's not identical to a 1073. But it does provide a good quality sound, and holds it's own with preamps many times the price.

Sorry to inform you of this

Exactly as I said in my first post, save money and get the real thing !

The GAP is a cheap, low cost Chinese knock of the 1073. In this field, nothing cheap is worth its weight sand.

Please don't renationalize your way outta this and say " well it's just another flavor" of a pre... It's a cheap knock off
Old 19th September 2011
  #17
Quote:
Originally Posted by 302efi View Post
Exactly as I said in my first post, save money and get the real thing !

The GAP is a cheap, low cost Chinese knock of the 1073. In this field, nothing cheap is worth its weight sand.

Please don't renationalize your way outta this and say " well it's just another flavor" of a pre... It's a cheap knock off
It's a cheap, low-cost knock off that can be a better fit than the original...for my tastes at least. what's your point? What's your problem? I can't afford a real 1073 at the moment...I have other gear that is more pressing, especially when considering that the GAP does a good job, at it's price point or any other. If I bought a "real" 1073, and it didn't work as well (as in my example, a genuine well maintained 1066 didn't) have I still saved money?

I think you're misinterpreting my post you quoted above, or maybe I didn't explain myself that well. I wouldn't buy a 1073 to replace the GAP - I'd buy it AS WELL. Just as I might buy an API AND a Neve compressor, or maybe I'd keep a VP dynamite around as well for when that is the thing that's needed.

Just don't understand what your problem is. If something sounds right, it is right. The GAP73 does a good job, and a more expensive pre is not necessarily better. That's the mistake you're making - equating cost to value.

FWIW I don't intend to "re-nationalize" myself anytime soon - I'm happy being British!
Old 19th September 2011
  #18
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Quote:
Smack your head all you want but no "pro" is going to use a GAP over a real 1073...Sorry to inform you of this.
A real "pro" will use the tools at hand, whatever they may be...

Quote:
...but AMS Neve is "Neve", not a knock off...Like the actually company.
It could be argued that AMS Neve is not the actual company, having changed hands several times since it was actually owned by anyone with Neve in their name.
Old 19th September 2011
  #19
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duardo View Post
It could be argued that AMS Neve is not the actual company, having changed hands several times since it was actually owned by anyone with Neve in their name.
I agree with you entirely.
Old 19th September 2011
  #20
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I have an awesome idea guys!! Lets bicker like drunken penguins about mic pres - the single most important factor in how many albums you sell. Only by whining about knockoffs will we raise our profession to the level of art.

Oh wait...
Old 19th September 2011
  #21
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302efi's Avatar
 

Quote:
A real "pro" will use the tools at hand, whatever they may be...
We here these kinda statements all the time, but you never see any "pro" studios with a 10 racks full of GAP's ???..Up against the real thing, they will 100% of the time never be the right tool in a million dollar record.


Quote:
It could be argued that AMS Neve is not the actual company, having changed hands several times since it was actually owned by anyone with Neve in their name.
...but it can't be argued they hold the patents and copywrites to all the Neve gear including the 1073. How many other audio companies are allowed by law to have "Neve" in their name ?
Old 19th September 2011
  #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cdog View Post
I have an awesome idea guys!! Lets bicker like drunken penguins about mic pres - the single most important factor in how many albums you sell. Only by whining about knockoffs will we raise our profession to the level of art.

Oh wait...

This is the MoaN ZonE !

They do this all the time in the "High End" section about mic pres, but I don't see your rebuttal in there ?
Old 20th September 2011
  #23
Pretty sure Deadmau5 uses the GAP pre and to me (contrary to many people on here), he sounds pretty pro.
Old 20th September 2011
  #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 302efi View Post
This is the MoaN ZonE !

They do this all the time in the "High End" section about mic pres, but I don't see your rebuttal in there ?
You and youe silly mpc electro avatar....what do you care about esoteric preamps? Nothing is gonna fix the sound coming out of your strage little white box.
heh
Old 20th September 2011
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DSpec1 View Post
You and youe silly mpc electro avatar....what do you care about esoteric preamps? Nothing is gonna fix the sound coming out of your strage little white box.
heh
It's actually grey...get the color right and try again
Old 20th September 2011
  #26
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I have a good handle on whats in a neve and whats in many of the clones and most of them share the same circuit and parts. The difference is really splitting hairs.

I have used a number of real 1073 and they all sound different. Some are in great shape and some are in bad shape. I would gladly use any of the good clones over or next to a real one. I do! Its not worth missing a house payment over or losing any sleep.

The things about the clones are they are new. So for the most part they sound very very similar to each other. Just get a good clone, with good high quality parts in them and you will be very happy.
Old 20th September 2011
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 302efi View Post
the music business is big money and this stuff is what sets the pros from the hobbyists...

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaaaa~!
Old 20th September 2011
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 302efi View Post
It's actually grey...get the color right and try again
Nope. It's white, cuz I say so.
Old 20th September 2011
  #29
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Quote:
We here these kinda statements all the time, but you never see any "pro" studios with a 10 racks full of GAP's ???..Up against the real thing, they will 100% of the time never be the right tool in a million dollar record.
I don't think you'll ever see a "pro" studio with ten racks full of any one type of preamp. And what is a million-dollar record? If it's a record that has made a million dollars then there certainly are million-doller records that have been made with knockoffs. If it's a record that costs a million dollars to make...I don't believe those exist any more.

Professional engineers work in all sorts of studios, from huge rooms to small project studios. If you are a professional engineer who is hired to work on a record you will not refuse to work on that record because the studio doesn't have the preamps you want. Sure, you may ask to have them brought in, but if that comes out of your cut are you going to insist? And if you are buying the preamp for your own studio and money is tight, are you going to buy the Neve every time? It's clear that the answer is not always going to be "yes".

Quote:
...but it can't be argued they hold the patents and copywrites to all the Neve gear including the 1073.
No, because those patents expired years ago (which is why there are so many clones out there). All they own is the name.

Quote:
How many other audio companies are allowed by law to have "Neve" in their name ?
I'm not sure how many are allowed to, but I'm only aware of one (Rupert Neve Designs) that does. Perhaps if Neve Campbell decides to get into audio equipment manufacturing there will be another. Although if she wants to milk her name there's probably more money in soup.

Besides, what do you think is important? The sound as you said earlier in the thread, or the name?
Old 20th September 2011
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jordanvoth View Post
I'll go a step further and add that the importance of the preamp has been overblown to death, back to life and death again. I've never heard an original 1073...
If you've never heard an original 1073, how are you qualified to make that statement?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jordanvoth View Post
... but have yet to hear a pre magically do anything but amplify the mic plugged into it.
You obviously haven't heard the right pres.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jordanvoth View Post
Even the cheapest of prosumer gear these days is quite good.
Some of it is good - some. Most isn't very good. But the small amount that is, is not on par with the pro stuff.

Cheers.
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