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New Steinberg Controller - Autumn 2011
Old 22nd September 2011
  #91
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shakermaker3's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay M View Post
What would you expect from Steinberg that Euphonix doesn't do?
something cheaper lol ... but this is just a massive fail. Maybe they have a target market in mind that they are going for but as mr.dylan once said, it aint me babe lol ... im just glad i didnt have to wait 2 months to be let down. time to save for the euphonix !! and i echo the guy that said i would take a IPAD and the 3rd party controllers apps over this any day!!
Old 22nd September 2011
  #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dxavier View Post
To add, this on their website sums it up........

".....Small in size but big in value, the CMC series are your perfect partner on the road. The units are small enough to fit in your pocket......"

STEINBERG, WE WERE NOT ASKING FOR ON THE ROAD CONTROLLERS. FADERPORT DOES MOST OF THIS ALREADY
[email protected] the double facepalm!

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Old 22nd September 2011
  #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kdp View Post
I truly believe Cubase is the best DAW known to to man. But this latest hardware offering is just kid stuff. More bedroom studio crap for 12 year olds. We are adults here! We have our own money! We are not on an allowance. I'd be willing to spend $5000. on a kick ass dedicated Cubase controller. Steinberg will never get in the Pro market. I give up!
Yes I love cubase!

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Old 22nd September 2011
  #94
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Would any of you spend more than $200 on a Steinberg hardware product knowing their track record of dropping support after only a short time?
Old 22nd September 2011
  #95
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Jorg's Avatar
Their old Houston controller is better than this nonsense. Who would have use for that rubbish?

I like Cubase but never liked or owned any Steinberg hardware.
Old 22nd September 2011
  #96
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Wow, you guys are harsh...i like it!
It seems that the conjecture over the last couple of months is the real culprit for the reactions in this thread - everyone was expecting Yamaha to make a serious-azzed kind of product with PM level quality at a grand price point...

I asked a guy at GC Pro a while back about the sales of the Artist series and other controllers you guys are talking about and he said sales 'were in the toilet'. Maybe going the way of the middle class in our country

Anyway, for what I do (music recording and mixing in a small studio), these little b-tards look awesome and as they're supposedly Yamaha made, they are not going to be like that garbage from Korg et al. I am thinking seriously about getting the pad and the channel and maybe a fader. I don't think I need the cost and single-mindedness of trad faders anymore after years of using mouse and keyboard. If these capacitance ones on the CMCs are as accurate as they state, it'll likely be a way better experience than a real one (or an iPad for that matter with the latencies there).

My 2 cents.
Old 22nd September 2011
  #97
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yikesboy View Post
Wow, you guys are harsh...
harsh?

dude! Its like they've just been completely us for years on end !!

What is the god dammned secret to building a half-decent 8 or 16 channel controller in this day an age, before going all sci-fi about it?!

Who the heck prefers this to the touch reality of a physical fader?
Old 23rd September 2011
  #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Big_Bang View Post
harsh?

dude! Its like they've just been completely us for years on end !!

What is the god dammned secret to building a half-decent 8 or 16 channel controller in this day an age, before going all sci-fi about it?!

Who the heck prefers this to the touch reality of a physical fader?
Dude, I haven't felt a nice and accurate fader since the last time I was in a real studio with an SSL console. Those foul Euphonix ones are worse than using a mouse in my opinion (and I'm old school baby!). Maybe these CMCs will suck or maybe they'll be awesome, but I'm at least interested in something that's not simply a low res motorized fader-equipped cash stealer with a bunch of other features of dubious merit to me. Until I can check 'em out, I reserve the FAIL on these "toys".
Old 23rd September 2011
  #99
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Being a user of the CC121, I was disappointed as well. I expected a control surface of 8 faders in the CC121 quality.

However, the only way I will excuse them is if they price these new controllers reasonably. And by reasonably I mean CHEAP. They are obviously made only of plastic. I wouldn't mind at all if these are an equivalent to the Korg nano series. So if they price each unit at about 30-35 euros then this will be a thumbs up by me. I wouln't mind having 8 touch sensitive faders for that price.

But if they are going to price it 100£ each then this will be a disaster.
Old 24th September 2011
  #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yikesboy View Post
Dude, I haven't felt a nice and accurate fader since the last time I was in a real studio with an SSL console. Those foul Euphonix ones are worse than using a mouse in my opinion (and I'm old school baby!). Maybe these CMCs will suck or maybe they'll be awesome, but I'm at least interested in something that's not simply a low res motorized fader-equipped cash stealer with a bunch of other features of dubious merit to me. Until I can check 'em out, I reserve the FAIL on these "toys".
I'd like to hear more about that... I've used several high end boards for rec/mixing and FOH, from SSL AWS, Soundcraft Vi4 and DC2000, ICON, Venue, C24 etc, but I have never owned myself a lower end controller. I have played on ocasions with a couple, but never sat down to work on one.

I've been looking into getting one for automation moves, rides, mixing and even tracking for tranport and punch-ins etc.

What dont understand is what exactly makes them worse than a mouse !? I mean, its just so much more natural isnt it?! I can understand that there are quircks here and there, like fader lag, but I've never seen anything that drastic that it wouldn't make it better than a mouse...?
Old 24th September 2011
  #101
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivorydom View Post
Being a user of the CC121, I was disappointed as well. I expected a control surface of 8 faders in the CC121 quality.

However, the only way I will excuse them is if they price these new controllers reasonably. And by reasonably I mean CHEAP. They are obviously made only of plastic. I wouldn't mind at all if these are an equivalent to the Korg nano series. So if they price each unit at about 30-35 euros then this will be a thumbs up by me. I wouln't mind having 8 touch sensitive faders for that price.

But if they are going to price it 100£ each then this will be a disaster.
I agree. The only way I could see investing in something like this is if the modules were cheap enough. $100 for each wouldn't seem too bad but I have the feeling they are going to be more than that.
My MCU isn't going to last forever.
Old 24th September 2011
  #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by edwonbass View Post
I agree. The only way I could see investing in something like this is if the modules were cheap enough. $100 for each wouldn't seem too bad but I have the feeling they are going to be more than that.
Whoa, you seriously expect Steinberg to be cheaper than Behringer?

$100 get you three USB keys and a Nuendo sticker. heh
Old 24th September 2011
  #103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Big_Bang View Post
I'd like to hear more about that... I've used several high end boards for rec/mixing and FOH, from SSL AWS, Soundcraft Vi4 and DC2000, ICON, Venue, C24 etc, but I have never owned myself a lower end controller. I have played on ocasions with a couple, but never sat down to work on one.

I've been looking into getting one for automation moves, rides, mixing and even tracking for tranport and punch-ins etc.

What dont understand is what exactly makes them worse than a mouse !? I mean, its just so much more natural isnt it?! I can understand that there are quircks here and there, like fader lag, but I've never seen anything that drastic that it wouldn't make it better than a mouse...?
Hi Big Bang,
I find that a mouse's scroll wheel allows me to do some pretty fine movements (like riding a channel volume in Cubase) and I tried the Artist Series and a Tascam piece that I can't remember the model number for. Both had less than fine performance...jerky and with a touch of latency. It made me realize that faders are really a link to my past analog self and not much more. Really they have been made less and less important by virtue of automation (I do a lot of drawing and scrolling) and hell, now even plug-ins that ride the vocal fur ya'll. Anyway, if the Steiny capacitance fader is really sensitive AND able to do other things as advertised, that might just convince me to move away from my mouse and back to a kind of fader.
Old 25th September 2011
  #104
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Well,here you go. 200$ for the 4 fader option...

Steinberg CMC Controllers

Not a good start if you ask me. Hope the street prices drop because asking for 200$ for a plastic 4 fader controller is over the top imo.



Edit: Oh, and the list price is apparently 249$! Am I the only one thinking that the pricing is insane?
Old 25th September 2011
  #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivorydom View Post
Well,here you go. 200$ for the 4 fader option...
So, 16 cheap plastic faders will cost you $800. Insane. Heck you can get two BCF2000's for about $300, and they have actual motors...
Old 25th September 2011
  #106
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Beyersound's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivorydom View Post
Well,here you go. 200$ for the 4 fader option...

Steinberg CMC Controllers

Not a good start if you ask me. Hope the street prices drop because asking for 200$ for a plastic 4 fader controller is over the top imo.



Edit: Oh, and the list price is apparently 249$! Am I the only one thinking that the pricing is insane?
No the pricing is not insane. The Euphonix/Avid Artist Mix is a bank of 8 faders for a street price of about $1300us. That would be noisy, non-adjustable/scalable, faders that are mechanical. The equivalent in Steinberg
with totally configurable, touch screen faders that are not mechanical are about $400us. They are also incredibly integrated with Cubase/Nuendo if that is your DAW of choice. Seriously, give new stuff a chance people! Think outside the box just a little, this stuff could be really great. I certainly like the idea of being able to assemble a controller with exactly what I need, and not have to pay for stuff I won't use. I also like the idea of not being stuck with pain in the ass moving physical faders that cost a fortune to replace, and never seem to behave the way I want them to. No matter what, it is a novel idea. I choose to be excited about this stuff at this juncture.hehheh
Old 25th September 2011
  #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beyersound View Post
No the pricing is not insane. The Euphonix/Avid Artist Mix is a bank of 8 faders for a street price of about $1300us. That would be noisy, non-adjustable/scalable, faders that are mechanical. The equivalent in Steinberg
with totally configurable, touch screen faders that are not mechanical are about $400us. They are also incredibly integrated with Cubase/Nuendo if that is your DAW of choice. Seriously, give new stuff a chance people! Think outside the box just a little, this stuff could be really great. I certainly like the idea of being able to assemble a controller with exactly what I need, and not have to pay for stuff I won't use. I also like the idea of not being stuck with pain in the ass moving physical faders that cost a fortune to replace, and never seem to behave the way I want them to. No matter what, it is a novel idea. I choose to be excited about this stuff at this juncture.hehheh
If you prefer a touch sensitive surface more than a fader, then I beg to differ. Euphonix stuff is pricey, but they have REAL components like motorized faders . Like them or not they are more expensive to produce than a ribbon-like channel fader. I want to give Steinberg a chance as Cubase is my DAW of choice but my objection is about pricing an obviously cheap-material plastic little unit in a price that if you would want 8 faders you would have to spend 400$! If it was metal like the CC121 then great! But when you make something that seems so cheap you have to price it accordingly.

So, yes , they may be great but still cannot justify the price according to the materials used and the lack of any motorized fader.
Old 25th September 2011
  #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PaPi61 View Post
So, 16 cheap plastic faders will cost you $800. Insane. Heck you can get two BCF2000's for about $300, and they have actual motors...
My used MCU + Extender cost me lass than that. I think I will hang on to it.
Old 25th September 2011
  #109
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edwonbass's Avatar
 

Oh yeah, and still no scribble strips.
Old 26th September 2011
  #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PaPi61 View Post
So, 16 cheap plastic faders will cost you $800. Insane. Heck you can get two BCF2000's for about $300, and they have actual motors...
But they are noisy and aren't touch sensitive. Neither do they have meters.
Old 26th September 2011
  #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mattiasnyc View Post
But they are noisy and aren't touch sensitive. Neither do they have meters.
And they will block out all AM radio reception within a mile radius of you heh
Old 26th September 2011
  #112
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That module on the right in the video reminded me that I have to buy new lights for the Xmas tree this year.
Old 26th September 2011
  #113
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay M View Post
What would you expect from Steinberg that Euphonix doesn't do?
More flexibility, more integration....
Old 29th September 2011
  #114
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Animus's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by yikesboy View Post
Wow, you guys are harsh...i like it!
It seems that the conjecture over the last couple of months is the real culprit for the reactions in this thread - everyone was expecting Yamaha to make a serious-azzed kind of product with PM level quality at a grand price point...

I asked a guy at GC Pro a while back about the sales of the Artist series and other controllers you guys are talking about and he said sales 'were in the toilet'. Maybe going the way of the middle class in our country

Anyway, for what I do (music recording and mixing in a small studio), these little b-tards look awesome and as they're supposedly Yamaha made, they are not going to be like that garbage from Korg et al. I am thinking seriously about getting the pad and the channel and maybe a fader. I don't think I need the cost and single-mindedness of trad faders anymore after years of using mouse and keyboard. If these capacitance ones on the CMCs are as accurate as they state, it'll likely be a way better experience than a real one (or an iPad for that matter with the latencies there).

My 2 cents.
Sales are in the toilet on the Artist series because they raised prices $400 last year I imagine, especially a bad idea in a major recession. It was already a little too expensive before the price hike imo.
Old 29th September 2011
  #115
Gear Guru
 
Animus's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by yikesboy View Post
Dude, I haven't felt a nice and accurate fader since the last time I was in a real studio with an SSL console. Those foul Euphonix ones are worse than using a mouse in my opinion (and I'm old school baby!). Maybe these CMCs will suck or maybe they'll be awesome, but I'm at least interested in something that's not simply a low res motorized fader-equipped cash stealer with a bunch of other features of dubious merit to me. Until I can check 'em out, I reserve the FAIL on these "toys".
The faders on the Artist series are pretty nice if you ask me. Overall build quality and QA of the units could have been better though.
Old 30th September 2011
  #116
kdm
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Ah you deleted your post yikesboy. I was just about to go searching for one of those popcorn eating smilies, lol.
Old 30th September 2011
  #117
LEX
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kdm View Post
Ah you deleted your post yikesboy. I was just about to go searching for one of those popcorn eating smilies, lol.
Smart move yikesboy. That would have been a train wreck for you.

Golf Clap. I'll give you credit for that.
Old 30th September 2011
  #118
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Animus View Post
Sales are in the toilet on the Artist series because they raised prices $400 last year I imagine, especially a bad idea in a major recession. It was already a little too expensive before the price hike imo.
The prices have come back down , not sure if its back to pre AVID, but they did drop substantially a while back.

Can't comment about sales in the US , but since the resolution of the documented fader issues , sales are ticking over nicely here.., plus the new Black livery is a bonus IMO... :-)

BTW: I really wouldn't be taking anything being posted by our new cyber cloaked defender seriously , pity he deleted his last contribution, I was about to join Dedric in some popcorn and beer... LOL
Old 30th September 2011
  #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LEX View Post
Smart move yikesboy. That would have been a train wreck for you.

Golf Clap. I'll give you credit for that.
LEX, it's akin to poking a stick at a rabid animal- just a not wise thing to do. I get the feeling that no matter what the argument might be, there's little hope of rational discussion here.

I will say this though as I can't resist to round out this general discussion: the future of sweat shop audio for the myriad of cheap production happening out there does not favor "expensive" fader solutions. The fader is a throwback to the old days when signal actually passed through that part of the console - approximations by innacurate mechanisms such as Euphonix Artist series will eventually wear out their welcome. This is because older guys like you and I (my assumption that you grew up with real faders) WILL move on and the new breed who are used to working with a keyboard and mouse will take over. Client eye candy will become too expensive for all but the largest houses. Mixing film and huge track count, yes, I would agree that there's still a compelling argument for System 5 and the Digi consoles but again, those will be large houses.

By the way, I go all the way back to running Optifile with various consoles and have been engineering/producing music since the early 1990s. Your assumptions about 'fan boys' (as you so charmingly tried to paint me) are dead wrong and offensive.tutt
Old 30th September 2011
  #120
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yikesboy View Post
This is because older guys like you and I (my assumption that you grew up with real faders) WILL move on and the new breed who are used to working with a keyboard and mouse will take over.
I think that's nonsense.

ALL "new guys" that I've seen that work exclusively without faders either spend more time getting a "musical" ride done, or just don't get the same "musicality" out of it.

Heck, just to give one simple example: Try fading one music track out while fading the other one in - controlling two faders - with a mouse! With a bunch of faders you simply hit play and fade. Simple. Musical. Fast. Accurate.

Quote:
Originally Posted by yikesboy View Post
Client eye candy will become too expensive for all but the largest houses.
Once again I disagree. I think there is a market for the mid-range. The WK-Audio stuff is almost in that range, but I'm thinking about half that price maybe. Definitely a market for that in my opinion.
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