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It had to be said... re: the state of hip hop Audio Interfaces
Old 8th August 2008
  #1
It had to be said... re: the state of hip hop

This is a bulletin I just sent out on Myspace but I thought it would also be appropriate here.



SUBJECT: So you want to be a Hip hop artist, producer, label owner...



BODY: Let me start by saying that although I love hip hop, the current image, scene, industry and trend is pathetic. I get literally dozens or messages a week on here from unknown people claiming to be record labels, artists, studios, promoters and managers. They are all the same... "Buy my beats for $10", "big money bitches and guns records" and pictures of bedrooms labeled as "studios".

The problem is that everyone is so caught up in this image and the lifestyle that few people are putting in the real work to make music! It is a joke. I give this advice truly because I want to see more people get on track to becoming the things they so desperately seem to want to emulate. So here goes.....


ARTISTS / RAPPERS:
- Your only job is to make sure your lyrics and delivery are on point. You are not required to play an instrument or even know a thing about music. There is no excuse for not being prepared.

- Don't come into the studio with a beat you got on some online site and write your lyrics in the studio. Come prepared. This means ad libs and all your parts TIGHT and practiced.

- Memorize your lyrics! We can hear in 10 seconds if you are reading off of a piece of paper.

- Bring the BPM of the tracks you want to use! You are making unnecessary work for the engineer if you don't know this information.

- Do NOT bring in 8 extra people and your kids to a session! It is NOT ok and you are wasting everyones time. It may seem cool to have your friends seeing you in the studio and taking pictures for your eventual "behind the music" episode but I promise that if you dont get serious and do some work, there will never be one.

- IF YOU ARE GOING TO PLASTER PICTURES ALL OVER YOUR MYSPACE OF YOU WITH PILES OF $ AND WRITE ABOUT HOW RICH YOU ARE, DONT ARGUE WITH THE STUDIO OR ENGINEER ABOUT A FEW DOLLARS AND HIS HOURLY RATE!!!




"LABELS":
- If you have not secured distribution then you are NOT a label. You are just some guy in his bedroom. Anyone can go form a "label" during their lunch break. It means nothing to simply call yourself that. I can call myself the dictator of an imaginary country but it doesnt do anything but make me look like I am playing pretend.

- If you are not incorporated with a specific structure then you are NOT a CEO. As much as you might think this looks cool to write, it doesnt. It looks dumb. The term "CEO" has very real and very specific attributes and implications in a corporate structure. Simply writing it makes you look like you have no idea what you are doing and are just another wannabe in your bedroom.

- if you are serious about it, read a book. Find out what a label really does and how it functions. Go find distribution and backing. I encourage small labels and grass roots artists but take it seriously.





"STUDIOS":
- A computer, a mic and speakers in a bedroom does NOT make a studio. It makes a bedroom with a computer, mic and speakers in it. There is nothing wrong with a modest setup and working from home but there IS something wrong with marketing yourself as "professional quality" and charging $10 an hour.

- Whether you realize it or not, flooding the market with these pretend studios that claim to be "professional quality" simply tells artists and the public that a studio is only worth $10 an hour. After all, your place is "professional" so why should they pay any more?

- This sort of thing also makes studio owners and engineers look bad. I am almost embarrassed to tell people what I do sometimes because I know they will just assume I mean that I am just another guy in his bedroom when in reality it is something I have invested many years and hundreds of thousands of dollars into.



BEATMAKERS:
- Again, I get messages and spam from people every day selling beats for a $10 to $25. STOP IT! If you think thats all your beats are worth, why would anyone else ever take you seriously and think they are worth more? It is a race to the bottom of the barrel.

- Aside from no one taking you seriously, you are again saying that beats are only worth that much. In reality, artists are getting tens of thousands of dollars for beats PLUS 50% of the publishing.

- No one is going to discover you and give you a big record deal from myspace. If you are good and take your craft seriously, get hooked up with an agent who specifically represents beatmakers and pushes your beats to real artists.






Ok, lets talk about presentation and selling yourself......

In 90% of the messages I get, it is someone writing in ebonics. Not only that, it is usually ALL CAPITALS with NO PUNCTUATION! You might think that gives you street cred but it doesnt. It means anyone who is in a position to help you is going to lump you in with the rest of the throw away wannabe artists who think they are the next Tupac because they can spit over a beat and have a myspace page and delete your message.

It is a sad fact that ignorance seems to be a commodity in hip hop. In fact, the dumber and more ignorant you come off, the more you sell these days. HOWEVER, IT IS AN ACT! I promise you that these same people speak perfectly intelligible English when conducting business, networking or negotiating.

HIP HOP IS A BUSINESS! If you want to go anywhere you need to start treating it as one and play for real. Pretending to be a CEO, talking in slang and acting the part will get you nowhere. If you want to actually succeed you had better step out of fantasy land and into the real world because I assure you that the A&Rs, REAL CEOs and execs are playing for real. It is business!!! Take very measured and methodical steps towards your goals. Read, study and learn all you can about the business.

As harsh as this all might seem, I say it because the state of things saddens me. I truly hope that at least a few people take this to heart and are encouraged to really take their music seriously. I look forward to helping and working with any artist who is serious and dedicated! Feel free to send me a message and I will be happy to try and help in any way I can in terms of studio time or even just basic advice from someone who spends every day in this crazy business.


Eric
Full Clip Audio


I feel better now.
Old 8th August 2008
  #2
Lives for gear
 
Mylithra's Avatar
 

+1 for Truth.

But I wouldnt limit this to just HipHop artist. This is kind of rampant all around. Who hasnt had some bad rock band come in with no music and no practice and expect to make a hit but hey, You want to spend 5x the time in the studio at 5x the cost, more power to you (and $$$ to me). Come prepared, we can tell within 5 minutes of you walking through the door.
Old 8th August 2008
  #3
Smile

.

i think the new state of hip hop is alaska.

.
Old 8th August 2008
  #4
Lives for gear
 
azwun25's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Full Clip Audio View Post
This is a bulletin I just sent out on Myspace but I thought it would also be appropriate here.



SUBJECT: So you want to be a Hip hop artist, producer, label owner...



BODY: Let me start by saying that although I love hip hop, the current image, scene, industry and trend is pathetic. I get literally dozens or messages a week on here from unknown people claiming to be record labels, artists, studios, promoters and managers. They are all the same... "Buy my beats for $10", "big money bitches and guns records" and pictures of bedrooms labeled as "studios".

The problem is that everyone is so caught up in this image and the lifestyle that few people are putting in the real work to make music! It is a joke. I give this advice truly because I want to see more people get on track to becoming the things they so desperately seem to want to emulate. So here goes.....


ARTISTS / RAPPERS:
- Your only job is to make sure your lyrics and delivery are on point. You are not required to play an instrument or even know a thing about music. There is no excuse for not being prepared.

- Don't come into the studio with a beat you got on some online site and write your lyrics in the studio. Come prepared. This means ad libs and all your parts TIGHT and practiced.

- Memorize your lyrics! We can hear in 10 seconds if you are reading off of a piece of paper.

- Bring the BPM of the tracks you want to use! You are making unnecessary work for the engineer if you don't know this information.

- Do NOT bring in 8 extra people and your kids to a session! It is NOT ok and you are wasting everyones time. It may seem cool to have your friends seeing you in the studio and taking pictures for your eventual "behind the music" episode but I promise that if you dont get serious and do some work, there will never be one.

- IF YOU ARE GOING TO PLASTER PICTURES ALL OVER YOUR MYSPACE OF YOU WITH PILES OF $ AND WRITE ABOUT HOW RICH YOU ARE, DONT ARGUE WITH THE STUDIO OR ENGINEER ABOUT A FEW DOLLARS AND HIS HOURLY RATE!!!




"LABELS":
- If you have not secured distribution then you are NOT a label. You are just some guy in his bedroom. Anyone can go form a "label" during their lunch break. It means nothing to simply call yourself that. I can call myself the dictator of an imaginary country but it doesnt do anything but make me look like I am playing pretend.

- If you are not incorporated with a specific structure then you are NOT a CEO. As much as you might think this looks cool to write, it doesnt. It looks dumb. The term "CEO" has very real and very specific attributes and implications in a corporate structure. Simply writing it makes you look like you have no idea what you are doing and are just another wannabe in your bedroom.

- if you are serious about it, read a book. Find out what a label really does and how it functions. Go find distribution and backing. I encourage small labels and grass roots artists but take it seriously.





"STUDIOS":
- A computer, a mic and speakers in a bedroom does NOT make a studio. It makes a bedroom with a computer, mic and speakers in it. There is nothing wrong with a modest setup and working from home but there IS something wrong with marketing yourself as "professional quality" and charging $10 an hour.

- Whether you realize it or not, flooding the market with these pretend studios that claim to be "professional quality" simply tells artists and the public that a studio is only worth $10 an hour. After all, your place is "professional" so why should they pay any more?

- This sort of thing also makes studio owners and engineers look bad. I am almost embarrassed to tell people what I do sometimes because I know they will just assume I mean that I am just another guy in his bedroom when in reality it is something I have invested many years and hundreds of thousands of dollars into.



BEATMAKERS:
- Again, I get messages and spam from people every day selling beats for a $10 to $25. STOP IT! If you think thats all your beats are worth, why would anyone else ever take you seriously and think they are worth more? It is a race to the bottom of the barrel.

- Aside from no one taking you seriously, you are again saying that beats are only worth that much. In reality, artists are getting tens of thousands of dollars for beats PLUS 50% of the publishing.

- No one is going to discover you and give you a big record deal from myspace. If you are good and take your craft seriously, get hooked up with an agent who specifically represents beatmakers and pushes your beats to real artists.






Ok, lets talk about presentation and selling yourself......

In 90% of the messages I get, it is someone writing in ebonics. Not only that, it is usually ALL CAPITALS with NO PUNCTUATION! You might think that gives you street cred but it doesnt. It means anyone who is in a position to help you is going to lump you in with the rest of the throw away wannabe artists who think they are the next Tupac because they can spit over a beat and have a myspace page and delete your message.

It is a sad fact that ignorance seems to be a commodity in hip hop. In fact, the dumber and more ignorant you come off, the more you sell these days. HOWEVER, IT IS AN ACT! I promise you that these same people speak perfectly intelligible English when conducting business, networking or negotiating.

HIP HOP IS A BUSINESS! If you want to go anywhere you need to start treating it as one and play for real. Pretending to be a CEO, talking in slang and acting the part will get you nowhere. If you want to actually succeed you had better step out of fantasy land and into the real world because I assure you that the A&Rs, REAL CEOs and execs are playing for real. It is business!!! Take very measured and methodical steps towards your goals. Read, study and learn all you can about the business.

As harsh as this all might seem, I say it because the state of things saddens me. I truly hope that at least a few people take this to heart and are encouraged to really take their music seriously. I look forward to helping and working with any artist who is serious and dedicated! Feel free to send me a message and I will be happy to try and help in any way I can in terms of studio time or even just basic advice from someone who spends every day in this crazy business.


Eric
Full Clip Audio


I feel better now.
Thanks for the advice. I'll try to step it up!

Azwun
CEO of My Moms House Ent.
"Fully professional studio featuring Mbox 2 Mini and M Audio Nova Professional Condenser mic" Only $9.95/hr!! Home of the $5 exclusive license beat.


LOL.

Really though...I hear you bro.
Old 8th August 2008
  #5
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sqye View Post
.

i think the new state of hip hop is alaska.

.
LOL! Yes it had to be said. And while we're at it, African American music, it must be said, is no longer the world's greatest music. Where's the new Louis Armstrong, Charlie Parker, Miles Davis etc etc? Being white I can understand why white culture is de-volving, but why does a whole generation of African Americans refuse to stand proudly behind the greatest, most intelligent and most hip music this planet ever heard?
C'mon, compared to Bebop, hip hop just ain't hip.

I'll trade you 500 Fiddy Cents for one Coltrane....
Old 8th August 2008
  #6
Gear Addict
 
Mudnoc's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Full Clip Audio View Post
ARTISTS / RAPPERS:
- Your only job is to make sure your lyrics and delivery are on point. You are not required to play an instrument or even know a thing about music. There is no excuse for not being prepared.

- Don't come into the studio with a beat you got on some online site and write your lyrics in the studio. Come prepared. This means ad libs and all your parts TIGHT and practiced.

- Memorize your lyrics! We can hear in 10 seconds if you are reading off of a piece of paper.

- Bring the BPM of the tracks you want to use! You are making unnecessary work for the engineer if you don't know this information.

- Do NOT bring in 8 extra people and your kids to a session! It is NOT ok and you are wasting everyones time. It may seem cool to have your friends seeing you in the studio and taking pictures for your eventual "behind the music" episode but I promise that if you dont get serious and do some work, there will never be one.

- IF YOU ARE GOING TO PLASTER PICTURES ALL OVER YOUR MYSPACE OF YOU WITH PILES OF $ AND WRITE ABOUT HOW RICH YOU ARE, DONT ARGUE WITH THE STUDIO OR ENGINEER ABOUT A FEW DOLLARS AND HIS HOURLY RATE!!!

I really just want this portion blown up and hung in my studio
Old 8th August 2008
  #7
Lives for gear
 

i thought this was going to be another corny "i hate hip hop" rant but all this was on point
Old 8th August 2008
  #8
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noiseflaw's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by princeplanet View Post
I'll trade you 500 Fiddy Cents for one Coltrane....
But that's only $250


x that $250 by 4000 and we have $1Million - Still nowhere near enough to buy Coltrane's socks.



Coltrane my man, is Priceless.



No no my friend, not for all the vitamin water in the world.....Yuck!


However the OP makes a very good point about the state of hip hop.
Old 9th August 2008
  #9
Smile

Quote:
Originally Posted by noiseflaw View Post
However the OP makes a very good point about the state of hip hop.
lol...i never liked original hip hop - it was too:

rickky-dickky-doo
dicky-dickky-dick - HAH
(dicky)
dicky-dicky-do
dinky-rinky-dink-HO


for my taste.


now, BUSTA, on the other hand, takes that sh&t around the corner and BACK...

YouTube - busta rhymes break ya neck

people with HIS kinda synchopation and straight-up tongue skilz are RARE INDEED...

i'll take busta, nas and em over any of the old **** anyday.

.
Old 9th August 2008
  #10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sqye View Post
lol...i never liked original hip hop - it was too:

rickky-dickky-doo
dicky-dickky-dick - HAH
(dicky)
dicky-dicky-do
dinky-rinky-dink-HO


for my taste.


now, BUSTA, on the other hand, takes that sh&t around the corner and BACK...

YouTube - busta rhymes break ya neck

people with HIS kinda synchopation and straight-up tongue skilz are RARE INDEED...

i'll take busta, nas and em over any of the old **** anyday.

.
For me its Nas and Wu Tang above all else but thats not really what I meant. I dont mean that new school hip hop isnt as good as say Kool Mo Dee. What I mean is that the current generation of wannabe rappers have completely lost the plot.
Old 9th August 2008
  #11
Smile

Quote:
Originally Posted by Full Clip Audio View Post
For me its Nas and Wu Tang above all else but thats not really what I meant. I dont mean that new school hip hop isnt as good as say Kool Mo Dee. What I mean is that the current generation of wannabe rappers have completely lost the plot.
i gotcha - i was merely saying i haven't heard anyone out-rip busta, yet -
on a speed, and creative synchopation level or rap.
and i dig those pompous dre beats - just because they're so cheesy and hooky..
his keyboard parts are always tasty, and his rhythm tracks are funky like a monkey...

but i hear yah - i don't listen to modern hip hop - i haven't heard an artist or track
that made me go WHATTTTTTT in a while.

i like some of the southern swagger, but i'm still waiting for that next crazy track...

right now, all the radio tracks sound the same to me...i'm not hearing anything new...
that goes for pop, rock and rnb, too...i'm i getting old, or is it true? or both heh

and yeah, and i worked with cap from wu tang for a minute on a track in my studio in nyc...
years ago...in a galaxy far away...he was tres cool...the young rapper he was guesting on
never showed for the session - he was out partying - and never went anywhere
but cap was cool...all about business and being a pro...no bs.

.
Old 9th August 2008
  #12
Lives for gear
 
sleeper1400's Avatar
 

great post.
maybe we could try to get it on digg.
Old 9th August 2008
  #13
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paultools's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Full Clip Audio View Post
Feel free to send me a message and I will be happy to try and help in any way I can in terms of studio time or even just basic advice from someone who spends every day in this crazy business.


Eric
Full Clip Audio


I feel better now.
How many successful Hip Hop records have you been involved in?
The industry is doing fine without your standards or advice.
If you hate these people and the way they talk, type, and think, then turn down their business, and work on something else!
Old 9th August 2008
  #14
Quote:
Originally Posted by paultools View Post
How many successful Hip Hop records have you been involved in?
The industry is doing fine without your standards or advice.
If you hate these people and the way they talk, type, and think, then turn down their business, and work on something else!
Actually it isnt. The people I am talking about are NOT getting anywhere. I have been involved with successful hip hop artists and I can tell you that there is a very big difference in the attitudes, work ethic and approach between the people I am talking about in that post and those who succeed. Maybe you should re-read what I wrote. In fact you probably didnt even read it and are just assuming you know what I wrote from peoples responses. I dont see how anyone with any experience in the studio or hip hop world could find much to disagree with in that post. Then again, if you are offended, maybe you are one of the people it is directed towards.

BTW... if I "hated" these people I wouldnt bother to write such a long bulletin giving suggestions on how they can be more effective in working towards their goals. I would simply write a rant about how stupid they are and tell them to f$%^K off. I didnt do that for a reason.
Old 9th August 2008
  #15
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paultools's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Full Clip Audio View Post
Actually it isnt. The people I am talking about are NOT getting anywhere. I have been involved with successful hip hop artists and I can tell you that there is a very big difference in the attitudes, work ethic and approach between the people I am talking about in that post and those who succeed. Maybe you should re-read what I wrote. In fact you probably didnt even read it and are just assuming you know what I wrote from peoples responses. I dont see how anyone with any experience in the studio or hip hop world could find much to disagree with in that post. Then again, if you are offended, maybe you are one of the people it is directed towards.
Probably not.

I didn't see any successful (major label) artists listed on your website.
What qualifies you to know what it takes to be a successful Hip Hop artist?
Can you point to anyone in the industry (whether you've worked with them or not) who conforms to your high standards? Will Smith maybe?

Why do you feel such a need to "rescue" the genre?

The hottest act in Hip Hop is not getting over by using the Queen's english. He probably has a pretty big posse who follows him everywhere including the studio. His records certainly sound like they required no more than a computer and a bedroom. Plenty of bling, money and girls in his videos... he's generating lots of cash for himself and a lot of others in spite of it.

Again I ask, if you detest these people and their way of life, why take their business?
Your manifesto is a veiled way of putting people down that don't conform to life/music/business as you see it.
MOVE ON! DON'T TAKE THEY MONEY! (caps for emphasis)
Old 9th August 2008
  #16
Quote:
Originally Posted by paultools View Post
Probably not.

I didn't see any successful (major label) artists listed on your website.
What qualifies you to know what it takes to be a successful Hip Hop artist?
Can you point to anyone in the industry (whether you've worked with them or not) who conforms to your high standards? Will Smith maybe?

Why do you feel such a need to "rescue" the genre?

The hottest act in Hip Hop is not getting over by using the Queen's english. He probably has a pretty big posse who follows him everywhere including the studio. His records certainly sound like they required no more than a computer and a bedroom. Plenty of bling, money and girls in his videos... he's generating lots of cash for himself and a lot of others in spite of it.

Again I ask, if you detest these people and their way of life, why take their business?
Your manifesto is a veiled way of putting people down that don't conform to life/music/business as you see it.
MOVE ON! DON'T TAKE THEY MONEY! (caps for emphasis)
Wow. I dont know why you feel the need to attack what Im saying. What part do you specifically disagree with?

1: .... AGAIN, I have been involved in several projects with major label artists. However that has nothing to do with it.

2: Successful artists are business savvy. They understand the business, business in general and understand how to communicate. Even the "wildest" artists get down to business and are methodical and prepared when it comes to making a record.

3: There is a whole generation of people who are literally playing pretend. These are not the people who are succeeding. They are emulating what they see on videos and they should be emulating what these big artists did to get into the videos!!!

4: There is nothing veiled about my post. It is as honest and direct as I can possibly be. I do not dislike or detest hip hop artists in any way.

5: I DO turn away people who are not serious about what they are doing. We do it all the time and in all genres. It just happens to be an epidemic in hip hop because it requires so little investment in every way.

6: Anyone who takes the time to practice their lyrics, be prepared for a session, takes the time to learn the business and how to work towards their goals in a realistic way, understands that it takes real work and puts their heart into it conforms to "my" (read "reasonable") standards. Those who think that all they have to do is call themselves a CEO, smoke blunts and play the role doesnt.

Simple.
Old 9th August 2008
  #17
Lives for gear
 
paultools's Avatar
 

I'm attacking it because it's a bunch of hot air!!!

If it makes you personally feel better to put these people down because you don't like the way they behave, then you have accomplished that and nothing else. Nothing is gonna change as a result of what you posted. Hopefully, YOU are the living epitome of Hip Hop success...
AGAIN I ASK: specifically which hit records have you been a part of? What successful artists are on your label? Whose career has blossomed under your tutelage?

You are just like those you criticize... you talk about things you haven't done!

QUOTE:

1: .... AGAIN, I have been involved in several projects with major label artists. However that has nothing to do with it.

Name two, otherwise you don't know anything about success in this business. You only have theories about what works, not real-life experience.


2: Successful artists are business savvy. They understand the business, business in general and understand how to communicate. Even the "wildest" artists get down to business and are methodical and prepared when it comes to making a record.

Either that or successful artists hire business managers, accountants and attorneys to do all that for them so they can do what they love. From experience, which artists did you watch who were methodical and prepared?


3: There is a whole generation of people who are literally playing pretend. These are not the people who are succeeding. They are emulating what they see on videos and they should be emulating what these big artists did to get into the videos!!!

So are you. Who are these ones who are succeeding? What makes you believe thay are doing things "your way"?

4: There is nothing veiled about my post. It is as honest and direct as I can possibly be. I do not dislike or detest hip hop artists in any way.

You just don't like the way they talk, type, conduct their sessions, market their work, handle their business, or choose their friends. Other than that, great guys!


5: I DO turn away people who are not serious about what they are doing. We do it all the time and in all genres. It just happens to be an epidemic in hip hop because it requires so little investment in every way.

Well, now you have set us straight and we will try to do better. Could you clarify that 'so little investment" remark? Another sign of your blatent disrespect for the game!


6: Anyone who takes the time to practice their lyrics, be prepared for a session, takes the time to learn the business and how to work towards their goals in a realistic way, understands that it takes real work and puts their heart into it conforms to "my" (read "reasonable") standards. Those who think that all they have to do is call themselves a CEO, smoke blunts and play the role doesnt.

Simple.

Why don't you watch some behind the scenes videos so you can see how it really goes down.
Old 9th August 2008
  #18
Ok, you are clearly an idiot and trolling. Every word of what you wrote is complete nonsense and nothing more than being difficult and arguing for arguments sake. If you had any clue whatsoever you wouldnt have reason to argue a single point. I have no reason to prove a single thing to you (especially someone who doesnt seem to want to offer any information on themselves). The fact that I have worked with major label artists (like many people on here have) isnt even a point to bring up because it isnt needed to prove my argument. Simple logic as well as experience in the music industry at any professional level is plenty sufficient. Good luck. dfegad
Old 10th August 2008
  #19
Lives for gear
 
paultools's Avatar
 

I'm a trolling idiot with plaques on my wall from the albums I have mixed.

You are a cowboy with a big hat, big boots and no cattle.

How about some answers instead of insults?

Don't make me go thru your entire first post and tear that down point by point.

Who can you point to as an example of someone who has come into your studio and become a success as a result of following your rules?

Stop editing your replies so fast or else I'm gonna quote them all!

Last edited by paultools; 10th August 2008 at 12:02 AM.. Reason: You edited your post again
Old 10th August 2008
  #20
Quote:
Originally Posted by paultools View Post
I'm attacking it because it's a bunch of hot air!!!

If it makes you personally feel better to put these people down because you don't like the way they behave, then you have accomplished that and nothing else. Nothing is gonna change as a result of what you posted. [/I]
Actually I hope very much that it will help some artists be better prepared to go into the studio and think about their approach to what they are doing. Maybe nothing will change but it is worth a shot.

Quote:
Hopefully, YOU are the living epitome of Hip Hop success...
AGAIN I ASK: specifically which hit records have you been a part of? What successful artists are on your label? Whose career has blossomed under your tutelage?

You are just like those you criticize... you talk about things you haven't done!
What kind of moron makes assumptions like that about someone they know little to nothing about? Again, I have been part of multiple records and albums with big label artists (some who have been nominated for Grammies) in multiple genres. Have you (not that I give a **** tbh)? Also, no one ever said I had a label or wanted to have a label. Where do you come up with this ****?

Quote:

Either that or successful artists hire business managers, accountants and attorneys to do all that for them so they can do what they love. From experience, which artists did you watch who were methodical and prepared?[/I]
Hiring others is fine. It is terribly obvious that the people I am addressing are NOT doing that. It is obvious from what they send and obvious in the studio. In my experience, every artist that I have worked with or been around in every genre that has had any success has been that way.

Quote:

[I]So are you. Who are these ones who are succeeding? What makes you believe thay are doing things "your way"?
So am I? Really? How so? Oh wait, you have nothing more than silly attacks like "so are you" with not a single thing to back it up. The ones succeeding are the ones landing deals, touring, getting liscensing deals and moving up in the game. If you cant tell the difference between someone succeeding and someone going nowhere then you are beyond help. Furthermore, they are not doing it MY way. Learing the industry, learning what it takes to be where they want to be and understanding that it is hard work is common sense and practical. It has nothing to do with "my" way. Sort it out.

Quote:
Well, now you have set us straight and we will try to do better. Could you clarify that 'so little investment" remark? Another sign of your blatent disrespect for the game
Really? You REALLY cant figure out what I could possibly mean by that? You are THAT thick? Here, let me try and explain it simply for you. Hip hop requires little investment in the sense that you dont need to have any musical training whatsoever, you dont need to learn an instrument, you dont have to buy an instrument etc. All you have to do is "spit" and you can call yourself a "rapper". Now talented rappers are amazing. It is an art and it takes an incredible about of skill but even if you are terrible you can still call yourself a rapper. To even be terrible at an instrument takes a great deal more investment.

Is that easy enough for you to understand?

Quote:

Why don't you watch some behind the scenes videos so you can see how it really goes down.


I dont need to watch videos to see how its done. I make records every day. If that is how you need to get your information then go right ahead.
Old 10th August 2008
  #21
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paultools's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Full Clip Audio View Post
Actually I hope very much that it will help some artists be better prepared to go into the studio and think about their approach to what they are doing. Maybe nothing will change but it is worth a shot.



What kind of moron makes assumptions like that about someone they know little to nothing about? Again, I have been part of multiple records and albums with big label artists (some who have been nominated for Grammies) in multiple genres. Have you (not that I give a **** tbh)? Also, no one ever said I had a label or wanted to have a label. Where do you come up with this ****?

Hiring others is fine. It is terribly obvious that the people I am addressing are NOT doing that. It is obvious from what they send and obvious in the studio. In my experience, every artist that I have worked with or been around in every genre that has had any success has been that way.

So am I? Really? How so? Oh wait, you have nothing more than silly attacks like "so are you" with not a single thing to back it up. The ones succeeding are the ones landing deals, touring, getting liscensing deals and moving up in the game. If you cant tell the difference between someone succeeding and someone going nowhere then you are beyond help. Furthermore, they are not doing it MY way. Learing the industry, learning what it takes to be where they want to be and understanding that it is hard work is common sense and practical. It has nothing to do with "my" way. Sort it out.

Really? You REALLY cant figure out what I could possibly mean by that? You are THAT thick? Here, let me try and explain it simply for you. Hip hop requires little investment in the sense that you dont need to have any musical training whatsoever, you dont need to learn an instrument, you dont have to buy an instrument etc. All you have to do is "spit" and you can call yourself a "rapper". Now talented rappers are amazing. It is an art and it takes an incredible about of skill but even if you are terrible you can still call yourself a rapper. To even be terrible at an instrument takes a great deal more investment.

Is that easy enough for you to understand?





I dont need to watch videos to see how its done. I make records every day. If that is how you need to get your information then go right ahead.
I couldn't have said it any better than you just did!
Foot, meet mouth.

Good luck!

Old 10th August 2008
  #22
Quote:
Originally Posted by paultools View Post

Who can you point to as an example of someone who has come into your studio and become a success as a result of following your rules?
Look, I will try to make it even simpler for you. Its not about MY rules. It is about how artists go about becoming successful. Actually it is true in anything. You have to gain as much knowledge about the task at hand as possible and then take logical steps to get there. What artist have you seen become successful in any other manner? Of course there is just luck and circumstance but you may as well play the lottery.


If you REALLY want to know what kinds of people have been involved in projects I have been a part of here are a few.....

Miko Wady (Next), Mario Winnans, Royce Da 5'9, Mook B, Ministry, Vayden, Pokafase etc.

Why dont you tell us a little bit more about yourself? You may for all I know be a multiple platinum winning producer. What I dont get is, if you are so experienced, how you could possibly argue with any of it? It is all simple, logical stuff.
Old 10th August 2008
  #23
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paultools's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Full Clip Audio View Post
Look, I will try to make it even simpler for you. Its not about MY rules. It is about how artists go about becoming successful. Actually it is true in anything. You have to gain as much knowledge about the task at hand as possible and then take logical steps to get there. What artist have you seen become successful in any other manner? Of course there is just luck and circumstance but you may as well play the lottery.


If you REALLY want to know what kinds of people have been involved in projects I have been a part of here are a few.....

Miko Wady (Next), Mario Winnans, Royce Da 5'9, Mook B, Ministry, Vayden, Pokafase etc.

Why dont you tell us a little bit more about yourself?
I worked with Tupac.
He didn't come to the studio with a tattered copy of "This Business of Music" tucked under his arm.

I doubt that Soulja Boy is sitting on the toilet reading his copy either.
Old 10th August 2008
  #24
Quote:
Originally Posted by paultools View Post
Good luck!
Luck has nothing to do with it. Its about putting in work in a way that makes sense. that was a great deal of my point.


Since you seem to think that is "hot air" I will wish you good luck. Maybe you will re-read my original post on a day when someone hasn't pissed in your cheerios and you will realize how unfounded and illogical your attacks were.
Old 10th August 2008
  #25
Quote:
Originally Posted by paultools View Post
I worked with Tupac.
He didn't come to the studio with a tattered copy of "This Business of Music" tucked under his arm.

I doubt that Soulja Boy is sitting on the toilet reading his copy either.
Ah, now we are getting somewhere. I wish you had started the conversation with examples and reasonable discussion instead of silly attacks based on nothing.

Tupac was not successful on his own. He had VERY business savvy people behind him.

Solja Boy is first of all not even music as far as I'm concerned (and working with someone of Tupacs caliber Im sure you agree) but aside from that he got lucky. He had something that went viral on youtube and he blew up. It happens. Can you plan for it? Not really. You may as well play the lottery if you are hoping for that sort of luck.
Old 10th August 2008
  #26
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paultools's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Full Clip Audio View Post
Look, I will try to make it even simpler for you. Its not about MY rules. It is about how artists go about becoming successful. Actually it is true in anything. You have to gain as much knowledge about the task at hand as possible and then take logical steps to get there. What artist have you seen become successful in any other manner? Of course there is just luck and circumstance but you may as well play the lottery.

Look, to be fair, what you are saying would make sense (taking away the insults about your clients) if this were a logical business . It isn't.
Your posts read like the ROTC grad who thinks he knows all about war talking down to the 25 year career soldier.

Russel Simmons, Diddy, Rick Rubin... none of these guys got to where they are by reading books or learning how to type. Have you ever had a conversation with Russell Simmons? Ebonics galore... OOPS... he made it anyway!
Old 10th August 2008
  #27
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Here is my .02

Quote:
Originally Posted by paultools View Post
Probably not.

I didn't see any successful (major label) artists listed on your website.
What qualifies you to know what it takes to be a successful Hip Hop artist?
Can you point to anyone in the industry (whether you've worked with them or not) who conforms to your high standards? Will Smith maybe?

Why do you feel such a need to "rescue" the genre?

The hottest act in Hip Hop is not getting over by using the Queen's english. He probably has a pretty big posse who follows him everywhere including the studio. His records certainly sound like they required no more than a computer and a bedroom. Plenty of bling, money and girls in his videos... he's generating lots of cash for himself and a lot of others in spite of it.

Again I ask, if you detest these people and their way of life, why take their business?
Your manifesto is a veiled way of putting people down that don't conform to life/music/business as you see it.
MOVE ON! DON'T TAKE THEY MONEY! (caps for emphasis)
Eric is a big boy and can easily handle the likes of you but I'll throw myself into the ring just the same.

First, we do quite a bit of hip hop. With a name like Full Clip Audio you can rest your sweet little head on your pillow tonight knowing that someone will get out of prision Monday morning and be on the phone with us by Monday afternoon ready to do their album - sigh.

Anyway, a lot of it comes our way. Since we see so much of it, we've had an opportunity to guage what works and what doesn't.

Reading off of a sheet of paper doesn't work - it sounds like someone reading.

Bringing me a third generation mp3 and calling it a beat is just plain wrong. These artists expect to make tons of money but they do not want to spend any of it on their music.

Bringing a crowd to the studio never makes the situation better. Maybe it did for the Beatles when they recorded Yellow Submarine but it doesn't work here.

Calling yourself "CEO" and "Executive Producer" when you don't know what those words actually mean warrants a correction. I, for one, was fortunate to sit in on a meeting with Russel Simmons, MTV, EMI and some other powerful media moguls and you better believe that EVERYTHING was in Queen's English. This was a three day event and I didn't hear any street slang - not once.

I think you are attacking Eric out of ignorance or spite - maybe his description fits you?
Old 10th August 2008
  #28
Quote:
Originally Posted by paultools View Post
Look, to be fair, what you are saying would make sense (taking away the insults about your clients) if this were a logical business . It isn't.
Your posts read like the ROTC grad who thinks he knows all about war talking down to the 25 year career soldier.

Russel Simmons, Diddy, Rick Rubin... none of these guys got to where they are by reading books or learning how to type. Have you ever had a conversation with Russell Simmons? Ebonics galore... OOPS... he made it anyway!
That is fine, but I promise it is an act to some degree and he sure as hell doesnt use ebonics when he sends out press releases or contracts.

Every one of the people you mentioned are where they are because of hard work, great business sense, understanding of the industry and the ability to present themselves in a manner that made people take them seriously.
Old 10th August 2008
  #29
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paultools's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Full Clip Audio View Post
Ah, now we are getting somewhere. I wish you had started the conversation with examples and reasonable discussion instead of silly attacks based on nothing.

Tupac was not successful on his own. He had VERY business savvy people behind him.

Solja Boy is first of all not even music as far as I'm concerned (and working with someone of Tupacs caliber Im sure you agree) but aside from that he got lucky. He had something that went viral on youtube and he blew up. It happens. Can you plan for it? Not really. You may as well play the lottery if you are hoping for that sort of luck.
My posts are based upon EXPERIENCE.

Re: Tupac, he didn't do ANY of the things you suggested in your original post. He didn't always have savvy business people behind him. He rolled with a pretty deep crew, smoked plenty of blunts, spoke broken english, wrote his rhymes on the spot and read them off the paper in the booth.

You may not like Soulja Boy, but if this thread is truly about BUSINESS, then I'm on his dlck!
Old 10th August 2008
  #30
Quote:
Originally Posted by paultools View Post
My posts are based upon EXPERIENCE.

Re: Tupac, he didn't do ANY of the things you suggested in your original post. He didn't always have savvy business people behind him. He rolled with a pretty deep crew, smoked plenty of blunts, spoke broken english, wrote his rhymes on the spot and read them off the paper in the booth.

You may not like Soulja Boy, but if this thread is truly about BUSINESS, then I'm on his dlck!
Well I'll leave it at this... If a rapper comes in anywhere CLOSE to as talented as Tupac, he is welcome to do whatever he pleases and I will keep my mouth shut. For the rest of the world, maybe they should try and stack the odds in their favor as much as possible.

Anyway, hopefully if we continue this conversation we can do it in a civil way rather than turning it into a flame war.
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