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Why do microphones today sound rubbish - z5600a mk2 & WA87 sounds awful thin & WA-47?
Old 23rd November 2017
  #1
Why do microphones today sound rubbish - z5600a mk2 & WA87 sounds awful thin & WA-47?

Just been listening to the Youtube demonstrations comparisons of the warm audio WA87 versus the NewmanU87

I have to say I have never heard such rubbish coming from the WA87.

The WA-87 sounds ugly lacking of any proper tone, sounds harsh,aggressive lacking of any weight or bass and low mid sound horrible

And the Neumann U78 microphone sounding as it should do a great sounding Mic to record with for an album.

This is seriously disappointing in regards to the new warm audio WA-47 this makes me wonder how bad and cheap this new warm audio WA-47 is going to sound. Was looking forward to this mic but not now.

The WA-87 just sounds cheap so the WA-47 will sound the same I'm assuming.

This is the same problem with quite a lot of the SE microphones the Z5600amk11 , Gemini mk 11, they just all sound thin lacking in any depth bass and real Tone.

What's wrong with all these microphone manufactures are they def?

You try recording with these mics then try to eq it in the mix it's impossible all you have is the most aggressive sibilance aggressive high-end no depth no bass no tone no warmth.

It's just so sad after all these years with such advanced technology cheap high-quality components costing very cheap that all these manufacturers just can't get it right.

Listen to the Newman you U47 and you U67 this is the sound we want the tone we want we all know the components cost peanuts

Having said that Open up any Neumann TL M103 TL M149 TL M193 you will have a heart attack seriously no joke, then listen to these microphones basically as far as Im concerned there all completely unusable again sounds thin lacking any real tone no magic something just sounds wrong.

you spend hours months testing these microphones and you just cannot make music with them after using them for a few months they just don't sound right

And then your final mix takes your hours and hours because you spend hours and hours trying to filter out this disgusting sound from these microphones then you realise you can't all you've done is cancelled out all the beautiful high-end, try to put any low mid and bass back into the sound all you get is low end boom or low end stuff you don't want basically you cannot mix
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Old 23rd November 2017
  #2
TSM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by terrysound View Post
SE microphones the Z5600amk11 , Gemini mk 11, they just all sound thin lacking in any depth bass and real Tone.
Interesting observation re Mk2. i have used both these on Mk1, and they sound good on stock and even better with good quality valves. Not used the warm stuff.
Old 23rd November 2017
  #3
Quote:
Originally Posted by TSM View Post
Interesting observation re Mk2. i have used both these on Mk1, and they sound good on stock and even better with good quality valves. Not used the warm stuff.
Yes but your recordings could have sounded more real better more organic
You might have even sold over 5 million.

If the people the audience can't feel it they won't buy the music. Microphone manufacturers don't care about this they just want their money but you have to care about your sound it lives on for the rest of your life and it's played for the rest of your life.

I think these companies think how can we make something as cheap as possible put a name on it and make as much money in return as possible they can't be doing any real musical listening tests or they wouldn't make such ugly sounding microphones. Makes me sick
Old 23rd November 2017
  #4
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GnZotNPAxEg I thought the WA-47 didn’t sound that bad, though I’m not buying their 87. And you need to consider they are budget and way cheaper than originals or boutique recreations. Cheap often sound cheap.
Old 23rd November 2017
  #5
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I have an uber expensive Wunder CM7 which I sound great on.

I was sketching out an idea on a cheap £120 AKG C3000B today - and I sounded great on it.

Maybe I'm just great :-)

OK so I'm joking (although it did sound really good)

But seriously, I bet I could make a fantastic sounding album on a WA87.

Sure it's nice to have boutique hand made kit - but talent will out and if you can sing great and play great a WA87 will get you where you need to go
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Old 23rd November 2017
  #6
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deckdaddy View Post
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GnZotNPAxEg I thought the WA-47 didn’t sound that bad, though I’m not buying their 87. And you need to consider they are budget and way cheaper than originals or boutique recreations. Cheap often sound cheap.
Hi man
Please can you send the links to where you've heard the WA-47 vs other mics?

I would love to hear this

Thanks man
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Old 23rd November 2017
  #7
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Originally Posted by thehightenor View Post
I have an uber expensive Wunder CM7 which I sound great on.

I was sketching out an idea on a cheap £120 AKG C3000B today - and I sounded great on it.

Maybe I'm just great :-)

OK so I'm joking (although it did sound really good)

But seriously, I bet I could make a fantastic sounding album on a WA87.

Sure it's nice to have boutique hand made kit - but talent will out and if you can sing great and play great a WA87 will get you where you need to go
you are Great !!! love it .. says it all .. great talent will sound great no matter what .. joni mitchell through a Lav Mic into a Mackie 1604 with dirty Pots .. Great !!!!
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Old 23rd November 2017
  #8
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deckdaddy View Post
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GnZotNPAxEg I thought the WA-47 didn’t sound that bad, though I’m not buying their 87. And you need to consider they are budget and way cheaper than originals or boutique recreations. Cheap often sound cheap.
The Neumann TLM103, TLM49, TLM193 cost a lot of money and they still sound so bad I mean so bad they are just usable back in the days I felt like getting the hammer and smash them into pieces from my personal experience many years ago they should never have been made.

Now as for Neumann U87 that costs a fortune but its usable not brilliant still lacks Weight and body and real low-end Bass but has great tone not quite like the U67 or U47but somehow similar Tone.

You can record with the U87 makes a great record and mix it without much problems

You see the point is when you try to mix with all these other clone mics your in trouble. fair enough you can record with them but you try mixing your final mixes forget it.
You spent hours and weeks trying to get rid of the exaggerated sibilance exaggerated high-end ugly Tone then you tried to add more low-end more weight more bass, just is not happen

My point is it should've been captured in the first place and with the amount of technology we have today everything manufactured in China costing incredibly cheap high-quality components of the high standard costing peanuts really cheap why can't this be done.

All these manufacturers must be deaf

Take something like the IZ radar that machine is just out of this world every album should be recorded on this machine do you see IZcorp asking $30,000 for it? NO
Now open that machine up have a look inside all the components are of the highest quality in the world, Record an album on it and mix you just want to cry it sounds so out of this world is fantastic

I'm no expert but I'm sure many microphone manufactures are stamping out there motherboards in seconds assembling these microphones in seconds putting a brand or name on it and asking ridiculous prices for them then you tried to use them make an album this quite simply isn't going to happen.

The microphone manufacturers need to listen to their product listen in much much greater detail and give us something we can use and cheap they can do it

I nearly collapsed laughing when I saw the YouTube video of Audio-Technica’s AT5040
In the recording studio demonstration of this Mic with all these top professional recording industry people not one of them had a smile on their face actually a few of them looked quite disgusted confused puzzled basically that microphone sounds thin like hell nothing no nobody no wait not bad tone I suppose but no magic

And everyone is using the term larger-than-life sounding microphone this is just a joke
Old 23rd November 2017
  #9
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What an absurd straw man argument.
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Old 23rd November 2017
  #10
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Ummm, you're listening to **** on youtube dude.

Perusing through threads around here should quickly lead you to the revelation that it's possible to have horrible results with the gear you mention that you mention as lustworthy as well.

And I am absolutely certain that you have probably enjoyed music that has used some of the gear you're ragging on (maybe not some of the newest pieces you're referring to).

Anyway.... maybe spend some time making music, less worrying about why you don't understand why certain gear is the way it is.
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Old 23rd November 2017
  #11
Quote:
Originally Posted by toledo3 View Post
What an absurd straw man argument.
The truth hurts

The amazing thing about the Internet is you can inform people of your experiences having wasted years of your time and energy going through all this rubbish testing this testing that.

All we try to do is make music but we don't want the cheap sound it can be done
I know people will not like what I say but go ahead and do it open up the equipment have a look inside look at what has been stamped out within seconds by the machines in China assembled within seconds and sold to you the thousands and you're trying to figure out why you can't get the sound tracking and mixing
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Old 23rd November 2017
  #12
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I would stay away from k67/k87 based stuff, or things that are trying to get in that territory.

I'm not big on some of the stuff you mention, but IMO you are really just showing how little experience you have to be that negative about many things that people have used to fantastic ends. IF YOU CAN'T ACHIEVE A GOOD RESULT OR YOU ARE GAUGING ENTIRELY ON YOUTUBE VIDEOS.... what does that really say about the gear itself? Not much. Says a lot more about you.
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Old 23rd November 2017
  #13
Quote:
Originally Posted by toledo3 View Post
Ummm, you're listening to **** on youtube dude.

Perusing through threads around here should quickly lead you to the revelation that it's possible to have horrible results with the gear you mention that you mention as lustworthy as well.

And I am absolutely certain that you have probably enjoyed music that has used some of the gear you're ragging on (maybe not some of the newest pieces you're referring to).

Anyway.... maybe spend some time making music, less worrying about why you don't understand why certain gear is the way it is.
Been there done it mate

Sound is 50% of the music that's why Michael Jackson sold the most that's why the world loves Miles Davis kind blue Norah Jones first hit album including Kate Bush directors cut, Joni Mitchell both sides now

Sound is 50% of the music
If the sound is wrong the music is wrong you can't catch and record the vibration you can't capture the emotion. microphone companies need to know this get it right and stop asking for all that money.

Make a good microphone with the best components available on the planet make it for cheap doesn't take you that long to make the microphone and doesn't cost that much for the components stop taking the PPPPPPPPPP SSSSSSSSS
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Old 23rd November 2017
  #14
Don't want to fall out with anyone here I'm just making a point all these microphone companies can do it it doesn't cost that much we need it so why can't they do it they just need to get it right it's been too long why is everyone still talking about Neuman U67 U47, how many years old is this now thiss is ridiculous.

Every microphone manufacture is putting the stamp on the microphone 87,47,67, but the clone microphones all sound SH...TTTT
Old 23rd November 2017
  #15
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Originally Posted by terrysound View Post
Don't want to fall out with anyone here I'm just making a point all these microphone companies can do it it doesn't cost that much we need it so why can't they do it they just need to get it right it's been too long why is everyone still talking about Neuman U67 U47, how many years old is this now thiss is ridiculous.

Every microphone manufacture is putting the stamp on the microphone 87,47,67, but the clone microphones all sound SH...TTTT
sincerely, what microphones are you using or have in your mic closet ?? i am curious .. i ahve some fun mic's and find some of the new one much less exciting !!!
Old 23rd November 2017
  #16
Tried opening up your equipment get the screwdriver open up look inside look at the cheap motherboard stamped out by the machine within seconds assembled by the machine in seconds using mobile phone technology then listen to your final mix and compare that to Miles Davis kind of blue Norah Jones Michael Jackson, there is no depth no Magic no music something just sounds weird you can't put your finger on it it just doesn't jell together tons and tons of high frequency rubbish lots and lots of sibilance everything sounds thin on the vocals on the backing vocals there is no weight no bass in the voice no realism

The microphone didn't Capture it what ever you do you cannot put it back in it track it wasn't there in the first place because the microphone manufacturing companies got their money and sold you stamp out microphone technology PCB boards
Old 23rd November 2017
  #17


What the hell am I reading here...
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Old 23rd November 2017
  #18
The best microphones I've ever heard and used I've not heard anything better since so these amazing and incredible microphones our an original Neumann U47 Neumann U67 and original Nemann 87 and an original AKG C414 and more nothing touches nothing comes close not even after all these years is just one big joke.

Microphone companies today They're all trying but they just can't do it.
However I think they can but they keep cutting corners.
I'll leave with one this that sums up what the microphones companies need today in microphones Tone depth balls musicality Magic.

And to all the microphone manufacturers of today stop using the word larger-than-life your microphones do not sound larger-than-life they sound ugly harsh sibilance edgy lacking musicality lacking magic lacking tone they sound awful in comparison to the masters I've mentioned above

Just for a joke open up a modern today AKG C414 compare that to original 1970s or 80s AKG C414 you won't stop laughing is an absolute joke then you look at how much they're asking for it it's one big pi ---sssss take
Then listen to it like I have you'll probably give up music making music

Try this go to google microphone saturn-sound images and Then to his website check out this man he is a genius I learn a lot from him check out his images there is the evidence then listen to the sound of the mis you paid all at money for it's one big joke
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Old 23rd November 2017
  #19
The new AKG c414 sounds great....you're smoking some funny stuff mate.
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Old 23rd November 2017
  #20
Lives for gear
Didn’t Michael Jackson on occasion use a sm7 ?
That’s not an expensive mic ?
But I get your point , a lot of people have bought into the I can get an 47 ,67, 251, etc for little money .(not saying you can’t use them)
You spread enough bull**** flowers will grow , but still will smell like bull****. Lmao

Last edited by kmade; 23rd November 2017 at 10:27 PM.. Reason: Spellcheck
Old 23rd November 2017
  #21
Quote:
Originally Posted by jwh1192 View Post
you are Great !!! love it .. says it all .. great talent will sound great no matter what .. joni mitchell through a Lav Mic into a Mackie 1604 with dirty Pots .. Great !!!!
why should you

The point I'm trying to make is we need to go forward we need to push the boundaries we need to achieve greater doesn't matter if someone used something cheap why should you

This is art we are painting the painting is for life for all to hear and see.

They said to Bruce Swedien yes you you can Google this they said to him you had the best equipment available to you at the time when you made thriller Bruce Swedien reply was why not we deserved it.

So I say If you're painting the best picture in the world you need the best tools available. Microphone companies can do it but I don't Wanna do it they just want millions of pounds in return for little out lay. Makes me sick
Old 23rd November 2017
  #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by terrysound View Post
The best microphones I've ever heard and used I've not heard anything better since so these amazing and incredible microphones our an original Neumann U47 Neumann U67 and original Nemann 87 and an original AKG C414 and more nothing touches nothing comes close not even after all these years is just one big joke.

Microphone companies today They're all trying but they just can't do it.
However I think they can but they keep cutting corners.
I'll leave with one this that sums up what the microphones companies need today in microphones Tone depth balls musicality Magic.

And to all the microphone manufacturers of today stop using the word larger-than-life your microphones do not sound larger-than-life they sound ugly harsh sibilance edgy lacking musicality lacking magic lacking tone they sound awful in comparison to the masters I've mentioned above

Just for a joke open up a modern today AKG C414 compare that to original 1970s or 80s AKG C414 you won't stop laughing is an absolute joke then you look at how much they're asking for it it's one big pi ---sssss take
Then listen to it like I have you'll probably give up music making music

Try this go to google microphone saturn-sound images and Then to his website check out this man he is a genius I learn a lot from him check out his images there is the evidence then listen to the sound of the mis you paid all at money for it's one big joke
i am a big favorite of 2 things .. Ribbon Mics and Mic MOds by some of the current great Doc Frankensteins !!!

i would like to hear the Current ADK mics in person ..
Old 23rd November 2017
  #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by terrysound View Post
why should you

The point I'm trying to make is we need to go forward we need to push the boundaries we need to achieve greater doesn't matter if someone used something cheap why should you

This is art we are painting the painting is for life for all to hear and see.

They said to Bruce Swedien yes you you can Google this they said to him you had the best equipment available to you at the time when you made thriller Bruce Swedien reply was why not we deserved it.

So I say If you're painting the best picture in the world you need the best tools available. Microphone companies can do it but I don't Wanna do it they just want millions of pounds in return for little out lay. Makes me sick
you are on a Tear today Mate !!! LOL .. go for it .. let it out !!
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Old 23rd November 2017
  #24
Quote:
Originally Posted by kmade View Post
Didn’t Michael Jackson on occasion use a sm7 ?
That’s not an expensive mic ?
But I get your point , a lot of people have bought into the I can get an 47 ,67, 251, etc for little money .(not saying you can’t use them)
You spread enough bull**** flowers will grow , but still will smell like bull****. Lmao
Come on man

Bruce Swedien even talked about that he said Bruce Swedien said the one he used is not the one you buy today it's the original the one today is not the same the one made today is not the same as the one he used then
Old 23rd November 2017
  #25
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the fxs's Avatar
 

there goes terrysound again complaining about affordable products.
why my man?
i've seen you on various "clone" threads complaining about "cheap" power supplies, capsules and SMD tech.
why?
if you already know the low or mid priced stuff doesn't deliver for your needs, why even waste the time and bother?
go buy yourself a 10000$ Neumann, Telefunken, Chandler, Brauner, Wagner or whatever mic and move on.

i didn't like the SE z5600a MKII either when i had it,... but i learned my lesson and moved on.
there's a lot of people who can't afford a U87 or U47, and they're just fine using Warm Audio / SE Electronics products.

Michael Jackson this and that... why do you even care?
do you have his skills? Do your clients have them?
if so, a Warm Audio Mic will do just fine, trust me.

We all know that a good high end mic will kill any low or mid priced microphones, but please just stop complaining about that very obvious fact.
makes you look dumb.

(sorry if that came off too harsh, i used an SE Electronics for my reply,... PS: without a pop filter)

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Old 23rd November 2017
  #26
Good bye
I hope you've all learnt something
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Old 23rd November 2017
  #27
Lives for gear
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Originally Posted by terrysound View Post
Come on man

Bruce Swedien even talked about that he said Bruce Swedien said the one he used is not the one you buy today it's the original the one today is not the same the one made today is not the same as the one he used then
Well if you read all my post you just helped make my point . All these cheap mic’s we’ve been told sound like the originals. And a lot people are buying into that.
I’m basically agreeing with you.
Old 23rd November 2017
  #28
Okay I'll say this much and my last I can take any microphone and make it sound like a Neumann U47 or U67 its been years of research and knowing what to do what to alter what to change take any microphone costing $300 turn into something costing $10,000

Good luck to you all didn't want to offend anyone here just wanted to give personal experience and knowledge back

The sound is 50% of the music you don't have sound don't have music take the screwdriver opened equipment have a look listen listen carefully

See you later
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Old 23rd November 2017
  #29
Gear Guru
 
jwh1192's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by terrysound View Post
Okay I'll say this much and my last I can take any microphone and make it sound like a Neumann U47 or U67 its been years of research and knowing what to do what to alter what to change take any microphone costing $300 turn into something costing $10,000

Good luck to you all didn't want to offend anyone here just wanted to give personal experience and knowledge back

The sound is 50% of the music you don't have sound don't have music take the screwdriver opened equipment have a look listen listen carefully

See you later
hold on, you can't just run off and drink more beer than i am right now ..

how: "I can take any microphone and make it sound like a Neumann U47 or U67 its been years of research and knowing what to do what to alter what to change take any microphone costing $300 turn into something costing $10,000"

sincerely would like to know this ... are you a tech or some different approach .. this is serioously Baiting us to ask the Q ....
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Old 23rd November 2017
  #30
Quote:
Originally Posted by kmade View Post
Well if you read all my post you just helped make my point . All these cheap mic’s we’ve been told sound like the originals. And a lot people are buying into that.
I’m basically agreeing with you.
Okay cool man

I'll give you two places to checkout vovox cables there within volvox is a company that alters microphones within in vovox I love them they taught me a lot the other company is called microphone parts there absolutely amazing you learn a lot from them as well and they're fantastically cheap but you need to spend time and put the researching in listen listen listen alter alter alter you'll get there they use the best components in the world and they're ridiculously cheap check it out
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