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Why Is Modern Pop Music So Terrible
Old 8th October 2020 | Show parent
  #481
Deleted 5f4684d
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mattiasnyc View Post
But the thread wasn't the question "Are we forced to listen to new music?", was it?
Terrible is so subjective. Personally I really like Travis Scott, Post Malone, Migos and all the highly autotuned artists , but I'm not into Shawn Mendes, Alessia Cara, Ariana Grande, I'm not into Billie Eilish either. There's something for everyone.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary Ladd View Post
Seems a lot of folks these days are too busy virtue signaling to even bother with comprehending the breadth and depth of the question at hand...

Although, it would be nice to once again experience the virgin joy of listening to a masterpiece ala DSOTM the first 10 times through
The virgin joy of listening to music died after your 20s man. Maybe check out some album reviews on Pitchfork, that’s how i learnt about Fiona Apple New album, and so many other good albums from artists I didn't know. I find anytime I listen to an album and then kind of gauge a rating out of 10, Pitchfork rating is pretty bang on everytime.
Old 11th October 2020
  #482
Gear Maniac
 
Metasfera's Avatar
I think this is due to overall drop in education and learning process quality.
Life is too fast now to invest time into song writing and composing. Also easy access to music making killed possible profit per track.
Old 11th October 2020 | Show parent
  #483
Deleted 5f4684d
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by Metasfera View Post
I think this is due to overall drop in education and learning process quality.
Life is too fast now to invest time into song writing and composing. Also easy access to music making killed possible profit per track.
If you're starting from zero right now, I agree, good luck, it's tough out there. I do think if you're really good you'll find your way. But you have to be better than whats already out there, and a bit different. It's hard to do but it's possible. Everything is possible really (especially in 1st world countries)
Old 12th October 2020 | Show parent
  #484
Gear Guru
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Deleted 5f4684d View Post
Terrible is so subjective.
Possibly. To reiterate:

..reiteration here..
Old 12th October 2020 | Show parent
  #485
Gear Guru
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Metasfera View Post
I think this is due to overall drop in education and learning process quality.
mmm... not sure I agree..

Quote:
Originally Posted by Metasfera View Post
Also easy access to music making killed possible profit per track.
mmm.... While I agree that a really inflated supply generally lowers prices when demand remains the same and all else being equal, I'd say that what 'killed' the industry was piracy/not paying for content.

But I agree that inflating the supply of music too has had an effect. In the future I think it'll be much worse as AI will allow more machines to create far more "music" for us.
Old 12th October 2020 | Show parent
  #486
Deleted 9d8db46
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by mattiasnyc View Post
. . . all else being equal, I'd say that what 'killed' the industry was piracy/not paying for content.
Here's where I think the digital revolution can be blamed for some of the current mess that music is in . . . the infinite copyability with no deterioration of quality. Piracy in the days of LPs and cassettes meant that you had to laboriously make copies on tape, and lose fidelity. You could copy CDs, but it was still a physical item. Now it's just a file that can be sent for nothing a million times.
Old 12th October 2020 | Show parent
  #487
Gear Guru
 
Brent Hahn's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deleted 9d8db46 View Post
Here's where I think the digital revolution can be blamed for some of the current mess that music is in . . . the infinite copyability with no deterioration of quality.
There's a documentary in which Jimmy Iovine recalls the moment when he figured that out. As it turns out, He and Dr. Dre plotted their revenge in the form of a product that's not only an absurdly expensive physical thing, it can only be used by one person at a time.
Old 12th October 2020
  #488
Deleted 9d8db46
Guest
Two things, if you include an iPhone.
Old 12th October 2020
  #489
The "business" end of the music business gained nearly complete control.

There used to be a condition in the Music Business, where those two diametrically opposed segments fought bitterly to the benefit of both, and created a system of checks and balances where the Business people made a ton of money, and the Music people were much more free to pursue pure aesthetics.

The Business people, at some point, got sick and tired of fighting with the Springsteens and the Tom Pettys, and decided that they would no longer seek musical artists to market, but they would create the artists, in much the same manner that Unilever creates and markets a new hair soap. Hair soap does not sue Unilever because they introduced artificial ingredients, and threaten to remove itself from store shelves.

The vast majority of current pop stars are products, manufactured by the business side, in much the same way that the Monkees were created in the 60's. Still, many of them forget to be grateful for being plucked from obscurity and crowned as the latest pop sensation, and they create problems for the business people. But the situation is usually quickly resolved by throwing money at them, because that's what the disputes are all about these days. Selena Gomez won't be suing her record company because they are trying to block her from releasing a double concept album. Damn, she might own the record company now. And nobody will try to stop Dylan from releasing whatever he damn well pleases, because it's well established that public will support it.

This is not a great environment for the production of highly aesthetic music, created by highly dedicated musical artists. But it is a great environment for making lots of money for a very small group of people. Damn the music, bring on the cash.

Fortunately, the record companies don't own the entire distribution system like they did pre-internet. You can still find great stuff out there, and some older established artists still have the power to release quality music through more legitimate distribution channels. Not all doom and gloom, but the top 100 pretty much sucks in the recent past... IMHO anyway. You won't be hearing any Witch’s Promise or Bohemian Rhapsody being released into the top charts these days. We still get stuff like Beck's Uneventful Days, but that stuff is relegated to esoteric, eclectic channels of communication like WXRT in Chicago. Uneventful Days... how fitting. Still a lot of good stuff and dedicated artists. You just have to look harder today, and be your own A&R person.
Old 12th October 2020
  #490
Gear Addict
 

Has because it does been used already? Sorry, didn't read any of the preceding posts.

g
Old 12th October 2020 | Show parent
  #491
Deleted 5f4684d
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by kennybro View Post
The "business" end of the music business gained nearly complete control.

There used to be a condition in the Music Business, where those two diametrically opposed segments fought bitterly to the benefit of both, and created a system of checks and balances where the Business people made a ton of money, and the Music people were much more free to pursue pure aesthetics.

The Business people, at some point, got sick and tired of fighting with the Springsteens and the Tom Pettys, and decided that they would no longer seek musical artists to market, but they would create the artists, in much the same manner that Unilever creates and markets a new hair soap. Hair soap does not sue Unilever because they introduced artificial ingredients, and threaten to remove itself from store shelves.

The vast majority of current pop stars are products, manufactured by the business side, in much the same way that the Monkees were created in the 60's. Still, many of them forget to be grateful for being plucked from obscurity and crowned as the latest pop sensation, and they create problems for the business people. But the situation is usually quickly resolved by throwing money at them, because that's what the disputes are all about these days. Selena Gomez won't be suing her record company because they are trying to block her from releasing a double concept album. Damn, she might own the record company now. And nobody will try to stop Dylan from releasing whatever he damn well pleases, because it's well established that public will support it.

This is not a great environment for the production of highly aesthetic music, created by highly dedicated musical artists. But it is a great environment for making lots of money for a very small group of people. Damn the music, bring on the cash.

Fortunately, the record companies don't own the entire distribution system like they did pre-internet. You can still find great stuff out there, and some older established artists still have the power to release quality music through more legitimate distribution channels. Not all doom and gloom, but the top 100 pretty much sucks in the recent past... IMHO anyway. You won't be hearing any Witch’s Promise or Bohemian Rhapsody being released into the top charts these days. We still get stuff like Beck's Uneventful Days, but that stuff is relegated to esoteric, eclectic channels of communication like WXRT in Chicago. Uneventful Days... how fitting. Still a lot of good stuff and dedicated artists. You just have to look harder today, and be your own A&R person.
I actually disagree with you on some points and here's why. I will also tell you why Rap and Hip hop is dominating.

Billie Eilish, her brother, and their mixing engineer make all the songs, there's no random songwriter from what I can tell.

Same with Roddy Ricch with Mustard and his engineer, they do it very tight knit, same with Travis Scott (who's had Tame Impala produce with him (Skeletons if I remember), Frank Ocean (Carousel), Bon Iver, Washed Out Sample etc). You do have Bohemian Rhapsody these days, especially in Rap, just listen to Sicko Mode; its the modern version of the same progressive concept. Same with Post Malone, he has a very tight knit group with Frank Dukes and Louis Bell, same with the newer big dance artists such as Imanbek and Topic and Surf Mesa, they do everything on their own.

Labels don't make artists anymore, the artists usually do it all themselves (except Korean acts). Again, Old Town road, dude buys a 15 dollar beat from a Swedish producer with a NIN sample (highly illegal btw, but Trent Reznor/Atticus Ross are good guys), he writes it and makes it himself and bam! Hit. He didn't need Columbia Records, but I guess he decided to sign with them anyway.

The trick is to do it on your own, get the traction and then maybe partner up with a label, to make it even bigger.

Last edited by Deleted 5f4684d; 13th October 2020 at 12:20 AM..
Old 13th October 2020 | Show parent
  #492
Quote:
Originally Posted by hellohead View Post
I actually disagree with you on some points and here's why. I will also tell you why Rap and Hip hop is dominating.

Billie Eilish, her brother, and their mixing engineer make all the songs, there's no random songwriter from what I can tell.

Same with Roddy Ricch with Mustard and his engineer, they do it very tight knit, same with Travis Scott (who's had Tame Impala produce with him (Skeletons if I remember), Frank Ocean (Carousel), Bon Iver, Washed Out Sample etc). You do have Bohemian Rhapsody these days, especially in Rap, just listen to Sicko Mode; its the modern version of the same progressive concept. Same with Post Malone, he has a very tight knit group with Frank Dukes and Louis Bell, same with the newer big dance artists such as Imanbek and Topic and Surf Mesa, they do everything on their own.

Labels don't make artists anymore, the artists usually do it all themselves (except Korean acts). Again, Old Town road, dude buys a 15 dollar beat from a Swedish producer with a NIN sample (highly illegal btw, but Trent Reznor/Atticus Ross are good guys), he writes it and makes it himself and bam! Hit. He didn't need Columbia Records, but I guess he decided to sign with them anyway.

The trick is to do it on your own, get the traction and then maybe partner up with a label, to make it even bigger.
Cool. We see the music biz through different eyes. There will always be upstart artists who are creative, and I do not disagree with your picked and chosen examples. The business side will never completely do away with individual talent.

The Eilishes are good. Original and talented. There will always be a number of examples you can point to, but a handful of examples don't make how the business works today. It is dominated by three companies (Sony, Universal, Warner), and very little that is truly "Mass Scale" happens without the blessing of one of those three. They select, package and groom artists, market them to be successful in the story term, and move on to the next. A short list few, like Justin Bieber, stick to the wall for a while.

The established acts like Stones, Billy Joel, Metallica, Pink Ariana Grande, Elton, Timberlake, Fleetwood Mac, Dylan, etc... are the hugest touring acts, but that isn't current releases. Those acts have been pounding the pavement for decades, some approaching 60 years. But the current, young releases come and go like ice in the Sahara.

Rap is an old music form, and it has always represented independence and revolt. It started in the 70's, and I was listening to DJ Kool Herc mixtapes by the early 80's. GM Flash, Fatback, Sugar Hill, DMC, Ice T, Too Short, Toddy Tee, etc... were all well established by the 80's. Man, that's nearly a half a century ago.
Old 13th October 2020 | Show parent
  #493
Deleted 5f4684d
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by kennybro View Post
Cool. We see the music biz through different eyes. There will always be upstart artists who are creative, and I do not disagree with your picked and chosen examples. The business side will never completely do away with individual talent.

The Eilishes are good. Original and talented. There will always be a number of examples you can point to, but a handful of examples don't make how the business works today. It is dominated by three companies (Sony, Universal, Warner), and very little that is truly "Mass Scale" happens without the blessing of one of those three. They select, package and groom artists, market them to be successful in the story term, and move on to the next. A short list few, like Justin Bieber, stick to the wall for a while.

The established acts like Stones, Billy Joel, Metallica, Pink Ariana Grande, Elton, Timberlake, Fleetwood Mac, Dylan, etc... are the hugest touring acts, but that isn't current releases. Those acts have been pounding the pavement for decades, some approaching 60 years. But the current, young releases come and go like ice in the Sahara.

Rap is an old music form, and it has always represented independence and revolt. It started in the 70's, and I was listening to DJ Kool Herc mixtapes by the early 80's. GM Flash, Fatback, Sugar Hill, DMC, Ice T, Too Short, Toddy Tee, etc... were all well established by the 80's. Man, that's nearly a half a century ago.
It's like a jungle sometimes, it makes me wonder how I keep from going under!

Yeah for sure, I totally agree with your idea of how music is being pushed to the top, usually 1 person hits it big with 1 song, and sometimes that's the only hit they ever get. I think Old Town Road is going to be his only hit, I don't consider the song "Panini" a hit, same with Lizzo, I don't think she'll last more than a few years.

That's why when someone's hot, they try to push for more hits. Sometimes I'm amazed at how long i think someone's been really hot, and then I think, wait, the album came out in 2018! (pretty good year for solid releases btw, don't know why).

I see Lizzo spending 30k rental in LA, and I keep thinking, wow, people really want to waste money like that, they think they'll stay hot? Buy a house at this point, you'll make a profit after 5 years (usually) and probably own the house.

When it comes to the industry, I'm a stats guy; I try to study the trends and follow what's going on (and learn how to produce new genres, and sing new genres) Next year I'll be a chameleon (but on overdrive), always been that way, thats how I built the small artist career I have (and I've been lucky to have support from big artists and celebrities). I know I'm an anomaly though, probably why I have a feeling that I'll crack the top 40 billboard next year. I understand the game a bit more than the middle level artist (or A&R) looking in, and other artists (and label and my publisher Sony) can sense that so they want to join in and are super supportive about it. Now sure, if within 3 years I don't produce anything that has traction, I'll get canned, I'm disposable just like anyone; but knowing what I know, and executing how I execute, I'm not too worried. I know what people want and I dish it.

Funny how my whole family made fun of me all these years, they all thought it was a stupid hobby and called me deluded (they destroyed me emotionally, I needed a lot of therapy unfortunately), they're eating their words big time these days (and they also pretend that they always supported my career). I quickly tell them what they were saying to me 5 years ago, to get a real job lol. I get a kick out of torturing them with my success haha. I've released songs from 6 years ago on my label, and they still get lots of streams and new discoveries from New fans. I own the masters 100% baby.
Old 13th October 2020
  #494
I can hear a deliberate lack of melody in a lot of modern music, not just pop music, the worst one for it is film music where is basically a motif repeated again and again, but without the intelligence of good well written minimal music which has a lot of complexity underneath its seemingly simplistic nature.
Old 13th October 2020
  #495
Deleted 9d8db46
Guest
Melody be damned. "It's got a good beat and I can dance to it" remains the DNA of pop music. It's to the point where pop music could end up being just a beat with somebody talking over it.
Old 13th October 2020 | Show parent
  #496
Deleted 5f4684d
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deleted 9d8db46 View Post
Melody be damned. "It's got a good beat and I can dance to it" remains the DNA of pop music. It's to the point where pop music could end up being just a beat with somebody talking over it.
Yeah, pretty much a lot of Drake records man. He can command a song with nothing much but his voice.
Old 19th October 2020
  #497
Gear Head
 
Lost_Cause's Avatar
Reviving this thread. If you want to know why mainstream music has been dumbed down and degenerated to the point of being borderline Idiocracy - look into Tavistock Social Engineering.
Old 19th October 2020 | Show parent
  #498
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lost_Cause View Post
Reviving this thread. If you want to know why mainstream music has been dumbed down and degenerated to the point of being borderline Idiocracy - look into Tavistock Social Engineering.
Hush, child.
Old 19th October 2020 | Show parent
  #499
Deleted 9d8db46
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lost_Cause View Post
Reviving this thread. If you want to know why mainstream music has been dumbed down and degenerated to the point of being borderline Idiocracy - look into Tavistock Social Engineering.
You are right on the money. And here's proof, from Wikipedia:

Quote:
The Rough Guide to Conspiracy Theories notes that the Tavistock Institute has been named by some conspiracy theorists as having a part in "The most extravagant anti-Illuminati conspiracy theory" of John Coleman "known as [the] 'Aquarian Conspiracy'. This totalitarian agenda culminates in the Illuminati 'taking control of education in America with the intent and purpose of utterly and completely destroying it.'" By "'means of rock music and drugs to rebel against the status quo, thus undermining and eventually destroying the family unit'.
We may never know how many Gearslutz have been secretly duped into mixing records that contribute to the destruction of our way of life!!!
Old 23rd October 2020 | Show parent
  #500
Gear Head
 
Lost_Cause's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by robert82 View Post
You are right on the money. And here's proof, from Wikipedia:



We may never know how many Gearslutz have been secretly duped into mixing records that contribute to the destruction of our way of life!!!
Ah yes wikipedia is definitely the authority on facts and truth. Its not like there's paid armies to edit it in favor of an agenda.

https://www.bitchute.com/video/362FzLr4ogfu/

And as far as Tavistock, all you have to do is research it. It's well documented, but that has to be your choice, I can't make you think critically or be open to looking into something further.

All I see are people attacking the messenger which shows how controlled our thinking has been from birth - and the music industry is part of that.
Old 23rd October 2020 | Show parent
  #501
Gear Guru
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lost_Cause View Post
All I see are people attacking the messenger
I've heard that. From anti-vaccers and flat-earthers... and "truthers" and "birthers"...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lost_Cause View Post
which shows how controlled our thinking has been from birth - and the music industry is part of that.
I once got paid handsomely to mind-control people using my music. It was fun. I got them to believe the moon-landing never happened and that playing 6 instruments per minute live is talent.
Old 23rd October 2020 | Show parent
  #502
Deleted 9d8db46
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lost_Cause View Post

. . . which shows how controlled our thinking has been from birth . . . .
Must. Turn. On. Radio.
Must. Find. Pop. Station.
Awaiting. Further. Instructions.
Old 1 week ago | Show parent
  #503
Lives for gear
 
norfolk martin's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by robert82 View Post

We may never know how many Gearslutz have been secretly duped into mixing records that contribute to the destruction of our way of life!!!
No . I was deliberately mixing to contribute to the destruction of our way of life. I failed miserably.

Also, anyone notice that every generation seems to believe that the quantity of contemporary music fell of just about the time they they turned 25 -30 years old, and was really bad by the time they turned 40?
Old 1 week ago | Show parent
  #504
Deleted 9d8db46
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by norfolk martin View Post

Also, anyone notice that every generation seems to believe that the quantity of contemporary music fell of just about the time they they turned 25 -30 years old, and was really bad by the time they turned 40?
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