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*** Timbaland address demoscene controversy ***
Old 8th February 2007
  #1
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mintyfreshbeats's Avatar
 

*** Timbaland address demoscene controversy ***

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ATkHbfbQAc4&eurl=
Old 8th February 2007
  #2
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mintyfreshbeats's Avatar
 

my apologies - the thread title wasn't very specific...
Old 9th February 2007
  #3
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atma's Avatar
man, what a ****ing dick!
Old 9th February 2007
  #4
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That kinda sounded like he was saying that if it's on the internet and doesn't have credits etc...it's public domain. What an a-hole. Like it's okay to use somebodys beats or sample something just because everyone else does it. Well at least we now know, why he is "so good". Anyone can have an endless pitt to pull ideas from if you just take other peoples stuff and use them.
Old 9th February 2007
  #5
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Agreed. **** this guy. "It's from a video game, idiot." You know what? I can name a handful of video game composers who leave more talent in the toilet each morning than Timbaland could ever hope to have in his lifetime.. I hope this sinks his career. He clearly doesn't care that he's ripped someone off. This guy deserves to be hit by a bus.
Old 9th February 2007
  #6
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XHipHop's Avatar
I wouldn't say this is his "response"...this is just him on an entertainment-based radio show.
Old 9th February 2007
  #7
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does he even consider for a second what the finnish guy felt like hearing HIS beat on the Nelly record?? call it a sample, fine, but how you gonna CALL THE GUY AN IDIOT!!???

I sincerely hope people can realize this dude doesn't need his nuts licked ANYMORE then they already are....

wow
Old 9th February 2007
  #8
Gear Maniac
 

its messed up but now the guy will have some credits for a nelly f record.

this isn't the first time and it won't be the last
Old 9th February 2007
  #9
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PhonoquO's Avatar
 

HAHAHAHA. His differentiation between sampling and stealing was pretty funny, but str8 bull****.

People should start to realize that there really isn't much point (financial/legal reasons) in sampling other people's joints, when you could just sample yourself. If you're doing it for a hobby fine, it's an art itself. Not everyone has musical ability to play instruments outside of mp's and such, but that doesn't mean to say you can't learn! **** man, grab a shaker, jangle some keys around whatever. With little training you can throw down keyboard parts 1 by 1, even guitar and bass and come up with some arrangements that aren't necessarily hip hop....BUT....when you mix that down and dirty it up, and chop it up, suddenly new ideas are born when you replay it.
Old 9th February 2007
  #10
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as much as i love timbaland, he did come off as an ass in that although i suspect that much of his reaction came from idiots knowing nothing about sampling calling him a thief.
Old 9th February 2007
  #11
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SoundEng1's Avatar
SAMPLECLEARENCE! has he ever heard of that?
Old 9th February 2007
  #12
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Its a big shame that Timbaland, who changed the face of r&b / hip hop forever is risking such a amazing reputation for that. Also i'll never understand why someone with perhaps the most impressive creditlist right now, cant give credit to someone to a small name and call up for a collab instead. He must be able to remember how it felt and ment when he himself had the first big break.


As a producer who submits to the majors i have to say that unfortunately it isn't an isolated case. Its common that celebs artist/producers steals big time. Im not allowed to send mp3s to ANYONE that my management are not doing business with. Nomatter how big the name is....I guess once a gangsta always an gangsta.....
Old 9th February 2007
  #13
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7 Hz's Avatar
Yup, what an ignorant dickhead. Mr ****in I got a big ego. It's clear from this he thinks the ground he walks on is holy. Hey Timbaland, you are just a theif who jacks other peoples **** and then makes megs bucks out of it. I hope you get sued into the fukin ground.

Whack and lame as fuk.
Old 9th February 2007
  #14
Gear Maniac
 

Thats what happends when everybody around you say you're god. After a while you start believing it.

What he did pre 2003 was amazing. I believe he did music that was never heard before. And that NODBODY can take away from him. But when he said that the new Justin T record was music from another planet he lost me. Everybody yells about how awesome his saw theme in "My Love" is. Well, its just a ripoff of mid 90s euro techno dance themes style nothing else.

However i still have a big respect for him cause he clashes genres in new ways. But be a little selfcritical Tim and it'll make your music much better in the end. Cause you know as well as me that music is the key.
Old 9th February 2007
  #15
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AlexLakis's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by introvert View Post
I can name a handful of video game composers who leave more talent in the toilet each morning than Timbaland could ever hope to have in his lifetime..
Nobuo Uematsu = God

And, yeah, Timbaland is a dick (not that I enjoy anything he does anyways, or am affected by his existance other than commenting about him in this thread.)
Old 9th February 2007
  #16
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Traxx's Avatar
 

Personally i agree with timbaland... I don't see that he did ne thing wrong, he sampled the sample just as the other ppl sampled that sample....Ppl sample the same record all the time, period. Whats the big deal? And a lot of ppl on this board that are all of sudden "holy honest ppl" probably done the same thing. Its just that this guy has made a huge career and some of u guys including myself are still tryin to make it. There's no need for hate...plus it has nothing to do wit ne of u, so why make these long post about the guy....I'm not about to get into a post going back and forth b/c of my beliefs either, so u can save the bashing...I'm just stating my opinion.. Have a nice day
Old 9th February 2007
  #17
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wow


just... wow

I'm am totally stunned not only by how stupid timbaland is, but also by how extra stupid his defenders are

depressing, it is
Old 9th February 2007
  #18
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Traxx's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seifer View Post
wow


just... wow

I'm am totally stunned not only by how stupid timbaland is, but also by how extra stupid his defenders are

depressing, it is
Yup i'm stupid lol wit extra on the top... depressing? If this depresses u...get a life...simple as that, its not that serious...
Old 9th February 2007
  #19
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yes, dumbest person I have ever met
Old 9th February 2007
  #20
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kingofswing's Avatar
Why so much hate on Timbo? tutt

What about all the suckers in this world who happen clone his style, from his drum sounds to his production style.
Old 9th February 2007
  #21
mmm I think I'm going to change my name to Timbaland.
I heard it somewhere and it sounds good.

Old 9th February 2007
  #22
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Traxx's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seifer View Post
yes, dumbest person I have ever met
First off, we never met....Secondly why all the harsh words?....I simply stated my opinion in a respectful way without using harsh words. Thats ok.... Hope your day gets better tho, b/c u seem a bit upset....And like i said, after reading both sides of the argument, i feel Timbaland has done nothing wrong period. Do I agree with ppl stealing other ppl music, "no" do i agree if someone "samples" something and then pay's for it, is it right, "yes." There's artist that deliberately steal ppl music all the time, what you going to do, make a post 20 pages long each time someone does it? Its just that timbaland is the biggest producer "at this point of time." But hey, as one says, "i'm the dumbest person ever.." lol To the guy that said that, have a good day man...I can't possibly even begin to call you a name b/c i don't know u...but for some reason u seem to think u know me and that we have met..
Old 9th February 2007
  #23
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Traxx's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by kingofswing View Post
Why so much hate on Timbo? tutt

What about all the suckers in this world who happen clone his style, from his drum sounds to his production style.
Thank You....
Old 9th February 2007
  #24
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*loud fart noise*

thats all this thread deserves
Old 9th February 2007
  #25
Gear Addict
 

Traxx and kingofswing:

He DID do something wrong. No matter what you hip hop people may think, taking a piece of a recording and using it without the permission of the copyright holder is ILLEGAL. It's a CRIME. Not only that, it's IMMORAL. It doesn't matter whether "Do It" is a #1 single and sells a million copies or it's a flop, either way Timbaland should have paid the copyright owner. By not doing so, he has commited a criminal act. And yes, I realize other people do this, and they're ****ing criminals as well. This is just the latest case.

Why is there so much hate? Because those of us who create our own original material are sick of this ****. We're sick of hip hop producers ripping off other artists in lieu of creating anything of their own. We're especially sick of those who don't clear their samples and take the "I've got more money, you can't sue me" approach. In a way it's very similar to organized crime, and it makes my stomach turn. You may say that we're overreacting, but we're not. We're concerned for the rights of others because we know we may be the next ones to get ripped off by a guy like Timbaland.

Finally, I'm sick of the bastardization of the terms "sample" and "sampling." "Sampling" is not ripping the chord progression and most of the identifying characteristics of a song, looping it in Pro Tools and letting some thug grunt and yell meaningless crap over it. "Sampling" is taking a small piece of audio and using it in a completely different context. Processing it, tweaking it, bit crushing it, distorting it and so on, then putting it into a new, original work. "Sampling" is also recording individual notes of an instrument and creating a playable facsimile of that instrument using a sampler.

Call it "beatjacking." Call it "ripping loops." Call it "song stealing," that's the phrase I use. But don't call it "sampling" because that's not the proper term for it.

Hip hop has abused and bastardized this technology by stealing from everyone that has come before them so that they don't have to be arsed with writing something new. And the worst offenders are people like Timbaland, who think they can do it without even paying for the song in the first place. I really don't understand why intelligent, original hip hop music has failed to flourish. You'd think the fans would get sick of hearing old stuff rehashed with "bitch," "money," "bling" and "uh uh yeah" every ten seconds.

**** Timbaland. **** 95% of the hip hop "artists" out there. **** the record industry that lets them get away with this ****. And **** anyone who defends these criminals. As I said before, Timbaland deserves to be hit by a bus. I hope I'm on said bus if it happens.
Old 9th February 2007
  #26
To the ppl. here defending this action:

Hello, what planet are you from?
The guy didn't just sample, he RIPPED a song. COPIED it.
Is it so hard to understand, that that copy has to be cleared?
On top of that he calls the original creator an idiot in public?
Man, that is insulting, and says a lot about Timbaland.
What a pity, I respected the guy's early work.

Maybe planet "I got my nose buried so far up a celebrity's ass that I can't smell anything but **** anymore, and think it's normal"?
You tell me.
Old 9th February 2007
  #27
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Traxx's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by introvert View Post
Traxx and kingofswing:

He DID do something wrong. No matter what you hip hop people may think, taking a piece of a recording and using it without the permission of the copyright holder is ILLEGAL. It's a CRIME. Not only that, it's IMMORAL. It doesn't matter whether "Do It" is a #1 single and sells a million copies or it's a flop, either way Timbaland should have paid the copyright owner. By not doing so, he has commited a criminal act. And yes, I realize other people do this, and they're ****ing criminals as well. This is just the latest case.

Why is there so much hate? Because those of us who create our own original material are sick of this ****. We're sick of hip hop producers ripping off other artists in lieu of creating anything of their own. We're especially sick of those who don't clear their samples and take the "I've got more money, you can't sue me" approach. In a way it's very similar to organized crime, and it makes my stomach turn. You may say that we're overreacting, but we're not. We're concerned for the rights of others because we know we may be the next ones to get ripped off by a guy like Timbaland.

Finally, I'm sick of the bastardization of the terms "sample" and "sampling." "Sampling" is not ripping the chord progression and most of the identifying characteristics of a song, looping it in Pro Tools and letting some thug grunt and yell meaningless crap over it. "Sampling" is taking a small piece of audio and using it in a completely different context. Processing it, tweaking it, bit crushing it, distorting it and so on, then putting it into a new, original work. "Sampling" is also recording individual notes of an instrument and creating a playable facsimile of that instrument using a sampler.

Call it "beatjacking." Call it "ripping loops." Call it "song stealing," that's the phrase I use. But don't call it "sampling" because that's not the proper term for it.

Hip hop has abused and bastardized this technology by stealing from everyone that has come before them so that they don't have to be arsed with writing something new. And the worst offenders are people like Timbaland, who think they can do it without even paying for the song in the first place. I really don't understand why intelligent, original hip hop music has failed to flourish. You'd think the fans would get sick of hearing old stuff rehashed with "bitch," "money," "bling" and "uh uh yeah" every ten seconds.

**** Timbaland. **** 95% of the hip hop "artists" out there. **** the record industry that lets them get away with this ****. And **** anyone who defends these criminals. As I said before, Timbaland deserves to be hit by a bus. I hope I'm on said bus if it happens.
Wow....hoping someone gets hit by a bus...then saying hip hop is stealing from everyone...this can be easily turn into a hip hop vs everybody else or even deeper a racial kind of post...so ima stop right here....Introvert..i respect your opinion, don't agree with it but respect it... Also, making a generalization about the entire hip hop culture was completely uncalled for, but everybody has the right to voice they opinion....You seem like a person wit some sense, so i hope you really don't feel or believe in half what you said.. Hope you have a nice day as well....
Old 9th February 2007
  #28
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Traxx View Post
Wow....hoping someone gets hit by a bus...then saying hip hop is stealing from everyone...this can be easily turn into a hip hop vs everybody else or even deeper a racial kind of post...so ima stop right here....Introvert..i respect your opinion, don't agree with it but respect it... Also, making a generalization about the entire hip hop culture was completely uncalled for, but everybody has the right to voice they opinion....You seem like a person wit some sense, so i hope you really don't feel or believe in half what you said.. Hope you have a nice day as well....
I'm not saying hip hop is stealing from everyone. I'm just saying that the majority of hip hop "artists" are anything but, and try to get by with stealing the songs of others. There ARE original hip hop artists out there doing cool, original things, but they are sadly in the minority. If you want to hear an example, a recent record in heavy rotation here is Styrofoam and Fat Jon's "The Same Channel." Also check out a few tracks from the Funkstorung record "Disconnected" (specifically "Fat Camp Feva" and "Chopping Heads").

As far as a generalization about the entire hip hop culture, this behavior (stealing songs) is prevalent in the genre and is rewarded by its fans. Even if the "artists" pay for the sample, it's still unoriginal and derivative, and therefore pretty boring. I've heard quite a few "joints" with cleared samples that bored me to tears. That, to me, doesn't qualify as culture. That is a bunch of morons giving money to thieves and (in some cases legal) copycats. I realize there are some original hip hop artists out there (I mentioned a few previously), but they're in the minority, and so I feel comfortable making a generalization about hip hop culture. I want it to change. I would love to hear interesting, socially relevant music come out of hip hop. But, aside from a few blips on the radar, that hasn't been happening for at least ten years.

As for the bus comment, I'm just really agitated by this, and that's a personal favorite way of expressing it. "I hope (insert name here) gets hit by a bus." I have very little tolerance for people stealing the creative works of others. People who do this sort of thing have no place in the public discourse. And don't cry "freedom of speech" at me, because that doesn't apply when the speech is stolen in the first place.

I would be happy if I could go through the rest of my life and never hear the name Timbaland or any of his music again.

Oh, and if you want to check out the Funkstorung tunes I mentioned...

Fat Camp Feva
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DgoKR4N_XjE

Chopping Heads
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HnLxQPCVnj0

I would be shocked if Timbaland, without stealing and without hiring someone to do it for him, could create beats like these. I would be absolutely ****ing floored.

As for the Styrofoam with Fat Jon record, it's on iTunes. Go check it out.
Old 9th February 2007
  #29
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I usually try and stay away from the non gear or technique gossip but this is sad. "Artists" have been ripping each other off since they were banging on rocks with thighbone drumsticks. Many of our musical heros come down a notch when you finally find out where they get their ideas. Even the big rock dinosaurs like the Rolling Stones and Led Zeppelin lifted whole passages from others. At least they had to have the talent to ape someone else's talent, sometimes with the result of something different than intended but equally compelling. Copyright laws are supposed to ensure that at least the majority of a work originates with the author. Sampling where the source material is unidentifiable equates that the sample is sound material for an original work. Sampling where the the source sample is a clearly identifiable part of the composition would make the author of the sample a contributor to the composition and should be proportionally compensated. To boil it all down. If it were your music that found it's way onto someone else's release I'm sure you would be crying "He jacked me. He jacked ME!!!" to anyone who would listen. I"m sure in this situation this guy is going to get serious compensation for this. I wouldn't take a discreet payoff either. Dude was lazy or sleazy enough to try and slip it out and see if anyone noticed. Shame on him. He's a talented dude. If he hasn't the time to do it himself maybe he should reduce his workload.

Oh yeah the stuff he was doing pre 2003. No, not totally original. He was heavily borrowing production and arrangement ideas from the UK and Euro dance scene. The brilliant thing was nobody else was thinking that way at the time. Nowdays Hip Hop sounds like Rinky Dink Euro tech house with rap beats.
Old 9th February 2007
  #30
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Someone else dug the sample up for Timbaland and then he used it in the track. Timbaland is not notified whether it's a sample, whether it's free license, whatever the ****. Maybe the person who dug it up for him told him that he played it himself? None of you know how this popped up and are just basing this off him being defensive in an audio clip when it seems like most it of is just coming from millions of idiots calling him a thief without knowing what they're talking about. Simple fact of the matter is, a label is not going to push back an album they actually want to put out just to track down someone for sample clearance and if a sample goes unknown by everyone who hears it, they will just throw it on the album.

The mere fact that they're in legal talks with dude right now can only be good for him. Can you imagine how much money he would be able to get if they tried to get at him before the album came out? Promiscuous would not have blown up if it didn't have that cell phone commercial and if it didn't, dude would be happy to see a G or something. Now that the album is out and sales figures are also out, it gives dude a lot more bargaining power as far as how much he should be compensated for use of the sample.

A good example of this was the last Black Eyed Peas album which had a track sampling the Stark Reality. Will.I.Am purposely did not clear the sample so that Monty Stark of the Stark Reality would be able to collect more money since he was such a big fan. Monty posts on another message board I read and he was completely bugging out about it and was not able to find out what happened until much later but now everything is okay. I'm not saying it's the same situation but good things can come from artists not clearing samples beyond saving the sampler some cash.
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