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i've been showcasing these kids, looking for a manager.. Effects Pedals, Units & Accessories
Old 2nd February 2003
  #1
i've been showcasing these kids, looking for a manager..

And it has been going very well so far!

it's been fun, the showcases are for everyone BUT record co A&R.

It has been enjoyable refusing them entry!

I have a publishing stake in them.

They need a good manager to move forward.

Emo Core is the genre..

The name is a secret for now...

It has been fun decorating the rehersal room we booked, we moved in the following:

TV & video games
Pool table
Table football
Espresso machine (for me)
Fairy lights (like for a Xmas tree)
And my laptop showing a slide show of the best photos they have..
Rented backline (Ampeg SVT / Messa Boogie / Marshall / cymbals
Beer & sodas
Snacks

So no 'grim rehersal room vibe for us'!

Performances were of 5 songs at; 1pm, 3pm, 5pm 7pm 9pm

over 2 x days some companies that sent a junior manager, brought back 'the boss' the 2nd day.

We will do one more day next week for folks that couldn't make it..

This recording - then showcasing thing might be a good formula for me in future...

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Old 2nd February 2003
  #2
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Old 2nd February 2003
  #3
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Old 3rd February 2003
  #4
Jax
Lives for gear
 

Only trouble is...

they don't look corrupted or even jaded yet!

Gotta do something about that.

Er, wait... you already are!

heh
Old 3rd February 2003
  #5
yes!

I am carrying the whole "bitter & twisted" workload on this project!

Heck, although I have never been in 'rehab' I can sort of busk it if I need too!

heh
Old 6th February 2003
  #6
Motown legend
 
Bob Olhsson's Avatar
 

I'd try to find a successful publicist or a journalist who wants to move into management. There's nothing like being the only artist on a manager's plate and those qualifications would enable a new manager to raise money.
Old 9th February 2003
  #7
Ashley they have now got several experienced managers to choose from. They have been meeting them all last week. Tomorow is a final showcase for about 3 big managers that missed the first batch..

I am really digging this method for bands without a manager.

Send out CDRs to managers of my production (have publishing slice of tunes)
Showcase for interested managers

If all goes well and they fine one then....
Managers - organise shows and climb towards record deal, (and using my recording for a 'first single' perhaps)
Managers build band up
Band get record deal (I earn if songs are re-recorded or re-mixed)
Band get publishing deal
Publisher contacts me re my 'share' and does side deal with me (this pays back studio time investment hopefully)

If the band go on to be a hit, well then it could be a nice little earner for me.

Thats my plan these days. I am working on the next band right now. Wheel em in wheel em out. I see myself in the numbers game. I frankly dont care if I do 'the album' if I 'click' the band, then I 'click' if not...well. Finding the acts, doing my new band thing with em in the studio, then moving them forward in the biz retaining a piece of the action - is my bag. The showcase for managers only is a great solution for me... I am rather suspicious of A&R, so this way I don't have to even be in the same room with em!

Old 18th April 2003
  #8
UPDATE

Well.....

They picked up pro management from the showcases, so that was a worthwhile experience!

In fact the managemment co have a Number 3 hit in the UK national charts this week with another of their acts, so they are serious. The senior partner managed a BIG international act for Europe for many years...

Anyhoo, the management took the head of ******** Records (a Major) to an out of town show, and he immeadiatly offered a no strings development deal worth $30,000 (+) for 6 months..



I am already counting on the management co to try to screw me & make insulting low offers for my services during this development phase..

But with paper signed on thier publishing....

WHO GIVES A SH!T?



Looking good so far.....
Old 18th April 2003
  #9
Lives for gear
 
cajonezzz's Avatar
 

Jules, sounds great, congrats!

How large a document, and how much did you have to invest in lawyers to draw up the necessary docs to cover this type of endevour?

This sounds really similar to the route we would like to explore in our neck of the woods.

Do the bands secure representation before "signing" with you for your services?

Is this buisiness model unique as far as your experience goes, or a more finely tweaked , more than a hand shake take on the "spec deal".

could you elaborate on the way things work? How'd you "discover them"
We're they walk-in, or word of mouth kids that just wanted a demo?
I think this approach is going to be important to weather the storm of uncertainty in the biz.....
Old 18th April 2003
  #10
Gear Nut
 

Didn't it say on the box that pool table was for 3-5 year olds?
Old 20th April 2003
  #11
"How large a document, and how much did you have to invest in lawyers to draw up the necessary docs to cover this type of endevour?"

3 page Publishing - giving me 25%

3 page production. - giving me 3 points, 1 point if re-recorded in future

(I seem to spend about $2,000 per quarter on legal fees)

This sounds really similar to the route we would like to explore in our neck of the woods.

"Do the bands secure representation before "signing" with you for your services? "

No, if they dont have a manager, I halp em find one after the recordings, but ALL of them, manager or not, have to use a lawyer.

"Is this buisiness model unique as far as your experience goes"

No, but I did manage to get a peice written on me in Music Week a year or so back when I started up with it....

"or a more finely tweaked , more than a hand shake take on the "spec deal".

Handshake aint worth ****, (unless you are dealing with blood relatives I suppose...)

"could you elaborate on the way things work?"

Ask me more questions!

"How'd you "discover them""

In a crappy dive, while going to see another band..

"I think this approach is going to be important to weather the storm of uncertainty in the biz....."

I belive so too. we have the power, lets use it.

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Old 30th April 2003
  #12
Gear Maniac
 
HiString's Avatar
 

Jules,

Very interesting, and is close to one of the options we were (still are) looking at with my son's band. A meeting in January with one of "Down Unders" top industry legal eagles, resulted in the offer to shop the demo around the majors.

Unfortunately, 2 of the guys didn't see the need to put additional rehearsal time in, nor did they want, or see the need to travel to play gigs where they would have been more accesable to industry types. The frustrating thing is that both these guys are damned fine musicians in every sense of the word, but they are now being replaced..........so off we go again.

Your approach is something that will be kept in mind.

Old 30th April 2003
  #13
Presently I am in dispute with the management I introduced em to about some more recordings!

tutt

Still, the publishing paperwork I hold on 3 tunes is etched in stone..

Old 1st May 2003
  #14
Lives for gear
 
Henchman's Avatar
Don't you just love the way the industry likes to screw the people who actually work on FINDING the talent, and deliver it to their doorsteps.

God, sometimes I hate this business. Which is why I too took your lead , and now ONLY work on stuff if there is a re-recording clause as well as a percentage of publishing involved.
Old 1st May 2003
  #15
Lives for gear
 
cajonezzz's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally posted by Henchman
ONLY work on stuff if there is a re-recording clause as well as a percentage of publishing involved.
could someone go into more detail as to what a re-recording clause would cover.....in as non legalese as possible?


this is a very cool thread.
Old 2nd May 2003
  #16
Here for the gear
 

I am reading this book called 'Hit Men' which talks about some of the ways the Music Industry evolves.

Jules good luck hope the people on your team are there to stay
Old 3rd May 2003
  #17
quote:
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Henchman
ONLY work on stuff if there is a re-recording clause as well as a percentage of publishing involved.
------------------------------------------------------------------------


could someone go into more detail as to what a re-recording clause would cover.....in as non legalese as possible?

--------------

Sure an example

% payed on each record released = 3%
Reduced to 2% if a remix by someone else is done
1% payment if song TOTALY re recorded by another producer

This is because as producer you might create, encorage, or cause new parts or arangement that might make it into the RE RECORDED VERSION.

Re recording clauses give a producer an atachment to a project ~CO~ME WHAT MAY.

It's like, "if you want me to get involved and do my thing on your material, its a serious step and I need reward for it, even if the tune is re recorded"

Most senior artist managers HATE these type of clauses, as they want a free ride in a demo / potential master situation, to sound great, them have the scope to move the act over to a big hitter producer and never have to look back or give the original producer a single penny.

Friends of mine recorded Brit band ****** who has a hit album. EMI said, "we dont like you having a percentage, do a lower deal or we will just go and re record the whole record"... the band were "uh, er um" about it (probably scared) and the studio / producers had to accept the bully tacktics and agree to it (or get nothing) DIRECTLY after they put re recording clauses in their future contracts...

re the band.... so far 2 x mentions in national music press 'stars of tomorrow' type collumns.

Old 16th May 2003
  #18
Motown legend
 
Bob Olhsson's Avatar
 

I think it's important that sweeping terms such as "the music industry" get left behind because this kind of "business as usual" characterization only perpetuates the problems.

Individuals are the ones who screw over other individuals and THEY are who OUGHT to be taking the heat for sleazy business practices instead of being lumped together as "the industry" or being allowed to get away with fiction suggesting "it's the label's fault."

Every manager and label wants to get as many known-quantities into the credits as they can in order to arouse interest in and lend credibility to the unknown-quantity which is their artist. Everybody developing talent needs to find ways of protecting their investment from changes made precisely for this purpose. One very effective method I've seen is a full-rate rerecording royalty but one that has a cap of a certain figure that everybody feels is fair. Yes this costs the artist but it also allows maximum flexibility without anybody getting screwed.
Old 17th May 2003
  #19
Lives for gear
 

Glad to hear some people are doing the kind of thing you're doing, Jules. That's really great. If only it worked like that here in the states somewhere ;-)
Old 17th May 2003
  #20
Next week they will be banking $30,000 development money from a major lable.

There is a seperate 'recording fund' - hopefully I will be able to divert some of it my way.

I feel vindicated in my talent search "pick". The head of the A&R dept is VERY keen on them.

I feel my publishing share is now more like it will be worth something in future, but we shall see how things turns out. I will be reporting any progress here...

I am also doing a 4th track with them, and (did I mention above) one of the previous tracks I produced has been invited on a very hip US lables next compilatiojn series..

Old 20th May 2003
  #21
I am nearing the end of ANOTHER (4th) track with these guys.. Mixing today

The head of A&R at ****** records (an international major) just visited. Liked what he heard and wants to discuss more recording....

hehehe,

Old 20th May 2003
  #22
Lives for gear
 

Great job, Jules!
Old 31st May 2003
  #23
Hey I just got my first cheque for publishing royalties for a spec job! (back from when I started doing them 2 years ago)

OK so its only for $200!

But its a start!

Old 31st May 2003
  #24
Lives for gear
 

congrats, Jules :-)
Old 1st June 2003
  #25
Gear Head
 
archtop's Avatar
 

Very inspiring.
why would it not work in the States?
Old 2nd June 2003
  #26
I see no reason for it not to..

The whole point of the post is to share good news to inspire others to do the same with dead studio time...

Develop new acts..

I must have spent over $300 and a week and a half of studio to earn that $200, l hope I get a bit more during the next royalty period...

Old 2nd June 2003
  #27
Here's the next bunch!
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Old 2nd June 2003
  #28
Gear Maniac
 
palebluedot's Avatar
 

Whilst were on the topic of points,

Most of my work is programming and mixing stuff, I wouldn't call myself a recording engineer as I really only seem to record vocals these days!

Anyhow, I have always worked upon hourly rates; and with people I am comfortable with will get a fixed price for a job (only when I know that my word is final!)

However, I am being asked to program more and more music now and feel I am often putting more artistic effort in than the songwriters.

If it is a clear co write then I obviously ask for appropriate figures but do any of you guys work to a points scale for programming.

When I call it programming I mean been given songs and building tracks around them?

This seems like a grey area and I'm sure I'm going to get shafted if not careful.

Any advice

Regards

Nathan
Old 2nd June 2003
  #29
Gear Maniac
 
palebluedot's Avatar
 

P.S Jules

Looks like the way to go studio wise!

Hope it works out good!

Regards
n
Old 5th June 2003
  #30
Lives for gear
 
drundall's Avatar
 

Congrats Jules.

The Emo-core thing is hitting big over here. I've done a couple records in that style. You need to get those guys rolling ASAP, IMO. People are already looking for the next thing post-emo...crazy business...
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