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Control Room for creative input Dynamics Plugins
Old 9th September 2011
  #1
Gear Addict
 

Control Room for creative input

Hello GS Friends - I am building a personal studio in my basement and thought I would throw the basic design and layout up for for group comment.

There are some interesting challenges and I'm hoping to get some experienced and knowledgeable perspective from anyone willing to chime in.

Some important details:

What is this space for? I am a composer and producer with a personal studio where I will occasionally track overdubs and small groups, but I do not charge by the hour and do not need a commercial grade recording space that is sound proofed. My main concern is getting an accurate mix environment and having a room I can track in to get nice recordings, even if I need to plan the time carefully to minimize risk of noise creeping in.

What are the details? I will attach a detailed diagram below with all dimensions, etc. . .

What is the budget? Low. But I have access to any and all tools you could imagine and am willing to buy materials. So I will not be buying pre-fabricated treatments, but I plan on building some myself.

What do you already have? I have an Auralex Roominator kit that includes tons of absorptive foam, some T-fusers and 8 bass traps.

What are the stipulations? Consider the placement of the desk and its orientation set in stone.

What are the specific questions for the community?
a) the ceiling . Notice the ceiling configuration. This is a basement, and the ceiling is just the subfloor of the upstairs. The beams in the picture are the joists. the width of each joist seems cut off in the picture, and is 2.5 inches.

If I were to finish the ceiling in a traditional way I would have 7.5 foot ceilings, roughly. But without a traditional ceiling I have 8 foot 9 inch ceilings with a room above me that is almost never used, and the joists seem to be a kind of diffusor. My current plan is to leave it open, paint it completely black as you might see in a restaurant with a modern design aesthetic. What do you think about the idea of trading isolation for taller ceilings?

I have also had some cool design ideas about running wire between the joists and threading it with various materials to create a rippling ceiling that lets sound through in key places, but traps some of it up there as well.

What do you think the joist configuration as it exists would do, if anything to the sound? Any ideas about how to play in between them to create a room-wide ceiling diffusor based around them?

b) monitor placement. My current thought is to place the L and R nearfields on F-H wall (the diagram labels each wall corner for easy reference), and I could place Rear surrounds against the B-C wall. I am running cable through the walls with faceplates so the rear surrounds can just plug into wall plates. So although I would be facing the A-B wall while staring at my monitors, the sound would come from my right side, and if you look at the diagram carefully you will se a 19 inch rack is being built directly into the F-H wall, so I coud adjust settings from within a good monitoring sweet spot.

c) subwoofer placement . Any opinions about where to place the sub?

d) any concerns about the dimensions of the room, problem frequencies with these dimensions, advice about what kind of diffusors to build, what frequencies to target, etc etc etc?

e) anything and everything else that you want to talk about based on the diagram

here it is:



Many many thanks in advance for anybody kind enough to share their knowledge with me!

SA
Old 9th September 2011
  #2
Gear Guru
 
Glenn Kuras's Avatar
Since you own Auralex products why not contact them to help you? Let us know what they say about your questions and we can go from there.
Old 9th September 2011
  #3
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Glenn Kuras View Post
Since you own Auralex products why not contact them to help you? Let us know what they say about your questions and we can go from there.
OK, i've reached out to Auralex for guidance. Out of fairness to them I won't post their response here (they will not give it with the expectation it will be posted on a public forum. I likewise don't publicly post suggestions and ideas sent to me by PM.)

But it may well trigger different, or more focused questions.

Does anyone have an opinion about the ceiling? I have a gut feeling that something super cool could be done with it, and it would be of great use to other readers since it is so common to work with an unfinished basement of this kind.
Old 9th September 2011
  #4
Lives for gear
 
boggy's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by SonicAlchemist View Post
OK, i've reached out to Auralex for guidance. Out of fairness to them I won't post their response here (they will not give it with the expectation it will be posted on a public forum. I likewise don't publicly post suggestions and ideas sent to me by PM.)
.......
No one can forbid you to ask more specific questions on the public forum. It's much easier than start from beginning...
Old 9th September 2011
  #5
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by boggy View Post
No one can forbid you to ask more specific questions on the public forum. It's much easier than start from beginning...
I'm not following. But if you have help you are willing to give, but require more specific questions I'm sure I could come up with some, and would be very appreciative.

For example, This room is not exactly as long as it is wide, but it is very close except for the little alcove that exists at C, D, and I ( in the diagram.)

Will this asymmetry and variation in width prevent problems arising from square rooms?

Would putting a book case in that space (functioning as a type of imperfect diffusor help or hurt? Would it possibly hurt things because it would bring the room closer to being a square?
Old 9th September 2011
  #6
Lives for gear
 
boggy's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by SonicAlchemist View Post
I'm not following. But if you have help you are willing to give, but require more specific questions I'm sure I could come up with some, and would be very appreciative.
I mean that you may read Auralex guide and ask here specific questions (if you have it) without publishing this particular guide. Most people do this.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SonicAlchemist View Post
For example, This room is not exactly as long as it is wide, but it is very close except for the little alcove that exists at C, D, and I ( in the diagram.)
Yes, I see, but you don't have a different room...
Quote:
Originally Posted by SonicAlchemist View Post
Will this asymmetry and variation in width prevent problems arising from square rooms?
No.
- Symmetrical placement is needed because we have two symmetrical ears, so, placement need to be symmetrical, even in square rooms.
- Weak asymmetry can't help much in square rooms.
- In square rooms you have double room mode in one single frequency, or at frequencies that are too near to each other, and only way to cure this is strong LF absorption treatment in your room.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SonicAlchemist View Post
Would putting a book case in that space (functioning as a type of imperfect diffusor help or hurt? Would it possibly hurt things because it would bring the room closer to being a square?
You can't hear clear differences because this particular asymmetry in your room if your low frequency room modes aren't dampened enough.
I'will rather put an absorber in this cavity.
Also, before all, I'will try to find a best position for speakers and listener with acoustical measurements.
Old 10th September 2011
  #7
Gear Addict
 

boggy, thank you for your willingness to help. Where would you suggest I put the monitors, and do you have any suggestions about how to best use this room for mixing? The construction is not yet complete, so I cannot take measurements yet. I am at the stage where I am about to run audio cable through the walls and into wall plates.
Old 10th September 2011
  #8
Lives for gear
 
boggy's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by SonicAlchemist View Post
boggy, thank you for your willingness to help. Where would you suggest I put the monitors, and do you have any suggestions about how to best use this room for mixing?
I can't suggest you anything without measurements in your room, at least, I do measurements every time.
Here is a guide how to do acoustical measurements:
https://www.gearslutz.com/board/studi...er-v2-1-a.html
And try to place listener and loudspeakers symmetrically in the room.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SonicAlchemist View Post
The construction is not yet complete, so I cannot take measurements yet. I am at the stage where I am about to run audio cable through the walls and into wall plates.
Ok.
Old 10th September 2011
  #9
Gear Addict
 

So unless anybody stops me now, I am going to wire the studio so my L, C, and R monitors are positioned on the F-H wall. The idea is that this is the only configuration that makes sense to me as allowing a good surround sound set-up. If I were to place monitors along the A-B wall I would a) find it a bit awkward (but not impossible to place the Ls and Rs, b) would not have anything close to an ideal listening position unless I positioned the monitors on my desk, but then the length of the room would be greatly reduced, and I would be using the shortest part of the room which seems like a mistake to me.

On the other hand, placing the monitors on the F-H wall easily puts the listening spot around 38% in to the room, and that listening area is right in front of the racked gear. I also like the simplicity of the wiring, since it will be a short cable run through the wall, since that F-H wall is shared with the machine room.

But there is one problem with this (at least one that I can see. . maybe more?) - that is, that if I center the monitors symmetrically in the room, it puts the listening area on top of my prime listening area. It also puts my racked gear outside the prime listening area, which I cannot have.

But If I shift the monitors over, I have my R monitor much closer to its wall than the Left one is to its wall

What can be done? Is there a way to widen the prime listening spot by widening the distance between the speakers? Is the only alternative I have push the desk forward so the speakers can be centered in the room, preserving symmetry?

The reason the desk is where it is, is that I need a pathway through the room to the tracking room.
Old 10th September 2011
  #10
Gear Addict
 

A key bit of info I haven't shared yet is that the Machine room is not built yet. The G-F and F-H walls are not up. All other walls are built, wired for electricity, but not wired with audio or other cables (such as data.) But now would be the time for me to run audio cable to one of the other walls if I am going to do it.
Old 10th September 2011
  #11
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AllBread's Avatar
 

Control Room for creative input

Quote:
Originally Posted by Glenn Kuras
Since you own Auralex products why not contact them to help you? Let us know what they say about your questions and we can go from there.
Wow, bit bitter, eh?

If I bought a ford instead of the Chevy that you had for sale should I contact ford for a good design for my garage? Not like he asked you specifically.
Old 13th September 2011
  #12
Gear Addict
 

As suggested, I went to Auralex for the help I sought here, and I wanted to post a note publicly recognizing how helpful they have been. Without any requirement for me to buy any of their products they worked off my sketch, created a to-scale mock-up in a CAD program and mapped out a detailed plan for me to consider. As it turns out, I will likely purchase a few things from them as well.

I'm going to disconnect the link to my studio floor-plan now that the thread seems dead. I am disappointed there was less help available here, but I was able to find it elsewhere and that is all that matters I guess.

I wanted to add that my seeking of help does not mean I have not read other posts or used the search feature. This sub forum is different from the others in the sense if someone has unique dimensions in their room, they will need custom advice from people with expertise. In this case all I needed was a sounding board and some friendly discussion.

I recommend Auralex for this for those people who find this article using the search feature.
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