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Small room = small monitors? Studio Monitors
Old 8th September 2011
  #1
Gear Maniac
 

Small room = small monitors?

Hey, all


I recently moved to a smaller place and had to shoe horn my project studio into a "dining area" about 6 feet wide and 7 feet front to back. I brought my event studio precison 8s with me and I'm starting to wonder if they are too big for the space. I have no treatment at this time and would like to explore it but I can even fit anything on the side wall next to the monitors.

I'm sure there is something wierd going on with my bass and even worse, I don't get a lot of detail in my quieter instruments/ reverb tails. I think this is due to a lack of treatment but I wanted advice on wether it might be smart to down size to a 5-6 inch monitor as well.

Any thoughts would be great... I can post a picture later if that would help.



Brian
Old 8th September 2011
  #2
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ritelec's Avatar
 

8"
Old 8th September 2011
  #3
Gear Maniac
 

That should say 6' (feet)wide above by the way... Not inches.
Old 8th September 2011
  #4
Gear Maniac
 

Here's a quick snapshot I found on my phone if that helps anyone help me.



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Old 8th September 2011
  #5
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ritelec's Avatar
 

I thought thats what you meant. And I meant keep the 8" speakers.


There's nothing wrong with that picture.

Put some absorption where you can, Yes you don't have much room but hang a rug or movers blanket to cut some of that reflection from the sheetrock. Rugs aren't the way to go if you have the room for traps and absorbers to stop reflections and trapping, but you have no room. Don't sweat. Kill the highs so your ears don't bleed and ring. (by the way, my "whole" room is carpet, I installed it for live playing years ago. Recently, I've been tuning the room with corner traps, clouds, early reflection points. The carpets still up. I can see in measuring the room how the carpet may effect whats going on here, but it's all good. I plan in the future to remove it and add wood, but it's not a big deal) SO...hang some rug. And make some music (and reference in headphones too)
Old 8th September 2011
  #6
Gear Maniac
 

Ok, so your opinion is to do some reflection control on the walls, some bass control if possible, and get back to work. That's a fair point of view. Anyone else want to second that provide a different point of view?

Thanks

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Old 8th September 2011
  #7
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boggy's Avatar
Keep your speakers, try to find a best possible position for it and for you, with measurements, and do a heaviest bass treatment as your space allows. Treat all walls and ceiling...
Old 8th September 2011
  #8
Gear Guru
 
Glenn Kuras's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by BJosephs View Post
Ok, so your opinion is to do some reflection control on the walls, some bass control if possible, and get back to work. That's a fair point of view. Anyone else want to second that provide a different point of view?

Thanks

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I can second about treatment.
Kind of hard to tell but it looks like you may want to bring your monitors in closer. See the following about set up.
Monitor Positioning. Acoustic Panels and Bass Traps.
Old 8th September 2011
  #9
Old 8th September 2011
  #10
Here for the gear
 

Condemed to Relive History

Not You, But Me. In December 1948 we rebuilt WHKC Columbus Ohio for FM broadcasting. Our control room was much your size and we really enjoyed the four Western Electric, AIR SUSPENSION, 8" monitor speakers. Each was driven by six tube stages of Langevin amplification. (The low distorion raised the threshold of pain so high that no one could talk against them.)

The speakers were in a Flying Coffin positioned against a wall and the ceiling which was perforated Celotex. (The studios were treated to the Walt Disney Studio's bullet-proof concept of Poly-Cylindrical Diffusers -- which was also a big hit in Columbia's Liederkrantz Hall in NYC.)

That experience leads to the suggestion that you have, or had, a Standing Wave Problem. IF TWO of the dimensions of your room are the same you have Voltage Addition of Standing-Wave Distortions. In that small a room, the frequencies would be high and the difusers small??
Old 14th July 2012
  #11
Gear Maniac
 

Reviving my own thread to get some more insight on how to make the best of my space. I'm still in the same place with the same gear. Below is my first attempt at sweeping the room response with the free version of fuzzmeasure. It's far from optimal as 1) I used a preamp that I don't believe is totally flat and 2) I only swept with one speaker as my other monitor is down waiting for a new amplifier. The microphone was a Line Audio CM3. That said, does this appear to contain any usefully information? I see a big dip above 100hz followed by a big peak.



Here are some dimensions of my apartment. The studio is in the area with the blue arrows (6X8'), the ceiling is 8' high. Ignore the big word "STUDIO" as this is describing the unit (There bedroom was added by the last owner), not where my equipment is.



And some update pictures:





Uploaded with ImageShack.us

My main questions are:
  1. Should I have some controlled distance between my monitors and the walls/corners? If I put bass traps in the corners should I have some additional distance from them?
  2. Should I cover the passthrough on my left that leads into the kitchen? There must be an impact on balance due to the reduced reflection/ increased diffusion on my left vs the standard wall on my right. Or does to make more sense to just put absorption on the right?
  3. What would be a good bass trapping scheme? I was thinking a big trap on the back wall behind the monitor alone with corner treatment. Should I try something on the walls beside my head... 1 wall only due to the window?


Thanks, folks, for any advice you can give.

Brian
Old 15th July 2012
  #13
Gear Addict
 

I have precision 8's and i have them about 8' apart and they has taken on a hole new life. I still need to run test to make sure their in the right spot but i can hear every slight nob movement and the stereo image is great. Here is a pic of how i got mine.


denlig

https://www.gearslutz.com/board/attac...1&d=1342307602
Attached Thumbnails
Small room = small monitors?-studio-3-7-11-2012-004.jpg  

Last edited by denlig; 15th July 2012 at 01:50 AM.. Reason: EDIT
Old 15th July 2012
  #14
Gear Maniac
 

denlig,

I wish I had space like that in my place. Unless I decided to move the studio into the bedroom I won't even be able to approach spacing like that. I have strongly considered doing that however as when I bought this place I did lots of renovations and the bedroom wasn't more than a garage for about a year - I got used to having my bed in the small space you see my studio is now in. I doubt my girlfriend would be as excited...

I decided to give a shot at making some bass traps. Here is a picture of my fist 2 prototypes:



They are pine frame with 1 layer of 3" Roxul "safe n sound" insulation layer in them. The black backing is some cheap fabric I bummed off my mom, the green fronts are made from 250 thread count bed sheets acquired at the local bargain bin store.

I doubt these will make a significant difference but I wanted to see if I'd have any success building them. I feel confident now and I'd like to spend my day banging out a few more (bigger and thicker) but I'm still a bit unsure what the best placement scheme would be. I'm thinking of making one hug one for the wall behind my desk, maybe 4X4' with 2 layers of insulation; one maybe 30"x4' to hang at an angle over my desk (can't get directly over the listening position due to lighting); and maybe some convention corner wedge traps for the wall/wall corners (I know corners are most important but I think also the most difficult at this point).

Does this hold promise as an effective approach?

Brian
Old 15th July 2012
  #15
Gear Addict
 

BJosephs,



I started in a small section of my basement yours ago and knew nothing about acoustic/bass traps. I have always use big monitors and then i found gearslutz and started reading about room acoustics.

My first room was 10 x 16 x 8 and it was a pain to mix in so i put up some foam on the walls not knowing what i was doing and the room was still a pain. I remodel my studio 5 time making it bigger each time and building more bass traps and i went.

The rooms never turned out the way i wanted it. I never could tame the corner bass and i had a lot of trapping in my last room. I hired JH.Brandt to design me a new room and hold my hand until completion. Best money i ever spent and i can tell you from first hand experience i wasted thousands and thousands of dollars on trying to fix my room myself.

Do yourself a favor and contact some one on this forum cause guess work = wasted money. Even if your budget is small make sure what you send goes to the right place. Trust me i use to build some traps and look at someone studio online and put the traps like what i seen.


denlig
Old 16th July 2012
  #16
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by denlig View Post
BJosephs,

Do yourself a favor and contact some one on this forum cause guess work = wasted money. Even if your budget is small make sure what you send goes to the right place. Trust me i use to build some traps and look at someone studio online and put the traps like what i seen.

denlig
Probably good advice but sadly you seem to be working on a much higher plane than me regarding your needs, this is my hobby space. Ideally I'd like to get a incremental (read: minimal if anything at all) improvement for a few hundred dollars in materials and learn something in the process. No one seems to have any comments on the specific questions I posted above so I guess I may be on my own, but if I get any where I'll post something.

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Old 16th July 2012
  #17
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by BJosephs View Post
Probably good advice but sadly you seem to be working on a much higher plane than me regarding your needs, this is my hobby space. Ideally I'd like to get a incremental (read: minimal if anything at all) improvement for a few hundred dollars in materials and learn something in the process. No one seems to have any comments on the specific questions I posted above so I guess I may be on my own, but if I get any where I'll post something.

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Sorry about the advise but my studio is a hobby studio too. Thousand of dollars wasted doing it myself was over a 18 yr period. I take on clients but it's my hobby studio. I'm poor like the average joe.

Sorry if i can't answer your question but my 1st reply was about the speakers.


denlig
Old 16th July 2012
  #18
Gear Maniac
 

I do really apreciate it. I'm trying to hold back some of my grandest ambitions for when I have a decent single family house. I hope my place comes out as gorgeous as yours someday.

PS - its nice to see that after all that time and effort you're still using the Events! You must like them as much as I like mine.

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Old 16th July 2012
  #19
Gear Addict
 

yes i do and i started with mackie hr824's then i got the events precision 8's. I then got the focal twin's and had them and the events for over a 1yr and the events kick the twins butt big time (in my room). when i found the sweet spot for the events they was like new speakers. I sold the twins and the got the adam a8x and i had them for alittle while and the event kick their butt too. I will keep the events for a long time until i can afford the event opals.


If you can just move your precision 8's into a larger room (to listen to them) and spread them out wide and then tell me what you think.

denlig
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