The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
 Search This Thread  Search This Forum  Search Reviews  Search Gear Database  Search Gear for sale  Search Gearslutz Go Advanced
Clouds or Diffusion? Small Studio Control Room Dynamics Plugins
Old 19th March 2010
  #1
Gear Nut
 
jetpackstudios's Avatar
 

Clouds or Diffusion? Small Studio Control Room

My control room is roughly 10x11. I have bass traps, plenty of broadband absorbers and a few clouds at the front and back of the room. I have some room directly above my chair for another large panel. I've built the raw frame but need some advice before filling it out.

Should I go with another cloud or a skyline-type diffuser?

Here's a few shots of the room and the overhead panel in question (Shots 1 and 7)

https://www.gearslutz.com/board/5204740-post117.html
Old 19th March 2010
  #2
Lives for gear
 
jhbrandt's Avatar
If the options are cloud vs. diffusor, I would recommend a cloud.
Old 19th March 2010
  #3

I would not put a cloud there unless it is a first reflection point. There is already a lot of absorption in there.



-tINY

Old 19th March 2010
  #4
Lives for gear
 
jhbrandt's Avatar
Then try an angled panel to eliminate flutter between ceiling and floor.

It's a small room so I didn't recommend the skyline (too close)

What is the surface area of the wall compared to the surface area of the absorption that you now have?
Old 19th March 2010
  #5
Gear Guru
 
Glenn Kuras's Avatar
You have gotten some great advise but just to add/clarify.

When the panel is absorbing there is no reason to angle it as it is not reflecting any sound. You can do it but it would be more for looks then anything else.
For the early reflection points on the ceiling, when that low, I always recommend absorption, but right above your head is not a reflection point so you can try diffusion. Actually Massive Mastering (How Diffusion Really Works. Spotlight on MASSIVE Mastering.) put a cloud in the early reflection point and then added some of our d1s right above his head. He really liked the way it seemed to open up the sound a bit. YMMV.
Old 19th March 2010
  #6
Gear Addict
 

I agree with Glenn that you will want to stay with absorption first. Your room (although nicely tailored!) is small and you will want to "knock down" the floor to ceiling axial mode as much as possible; 4" of 8# Mineral fiber is how I would attack this.

Nice work.
Old 19th March 2010
  #7
Gear Nut
 
jetpackstudios's Avatar
 

Thanks Guys!

I'm assuming the first reflection on the ceiling would be roughly at a 45 degree from the speakers? If so, I'm covered; both on the ceiling itself and on an angle part of the back ceiling.

If I go with diffusion, should I go with a skyline or channel diffusion?

The room is already very tight and the close placement of all the panels is creating some diffusion already.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Glenn Kuras View Post
You have gotten some great advise but just to add/clarify.

When the panel is absorbing there is no reason to angle it as it is not reflecting any sound. You can do it but it would be more for looks then anything else.
For the early reflection points on the ceiling, when that low, I always recommend absorption, but right above your head is not a reflection point so you can try diffusion. Actually Massive Mastering (How Diffusion Really Works. Spotlight on MASSIVE Mastering.) put a cloud in the early reflection point and then added some of our d1s right above his head. He really liked the way it seemed to open up the sound a bit. YMMV.
Old 19th March 2010
  #8
Gear Nut
 
jetpackstudios's Avatar
 

I'll have the chance to try a flat or angled panel since I can adjust the clasps that hold the ceiling hooks in place.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jhbrandt View Post
Then try an angled panel to eliminate flutter between ceiling and floor.

It's a small room so I didn't recommend the skyline (too close)

What is the surface area of the wall compared to the surface area of the absorption that you now have?
Old 19th March 2010
  #9
Lives for gear
 
jhbrandt's Avatar
Angling an absorption panel is not going to do anything sonically.. but angling a reflective panel with absorption behind it might do the trick.. you could try the absorption as is - then angle it with a plywood face and see which sounds the best.. (yeah, i know.. real scientific.. haha)
If you angle plywood, be sure to angle towards the rear of the room.

Cheers,
John
Old 19th March 2010
  #10
Gear Nut
 
jetpackstudios's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by jhbrandt View Post
Then try an angled panel to eliminate flutter between ceiling and floor.

It's a small room so I didn't recommend the skyline (too close)

What is the surface area of the wall compared to the surface area of the absorption that you now have?
60% absorption 40% wall
Old 19th March 2010
  #11
Gear Guru
 
Glenn Kuras's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by jhbrandt View Post
Angling an absorption panel is not going to do anything sonically.. but angling a reflective panel with absorption behind it might do the trick.. you could try the absorption as is - then angle it with a plywood face and see which sounds the best.. (yeah, i know.. real scientific.. haha)
If you angle plywood, be sure to angle towards the rear of the room.

Cheers,
John
Actually for the early reflection all of the high end will reflected if angled board is up there so any absorption behind it will not help, IME.
The problem I see with using a reflector in that area is not a 100% it will reflect past your head. Not to say it won't work, but has its pitfalls in a room with a low ceiling.
Old 19th March 2010
  #12
Lives for gear
 
PaulP's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by jhbrandt View Post
Angling an absorption panel is not going to do anything sonically..
I believe the absorption properties of an absorber change with angle of incidence.
The shallower the angle the more it reflects. So wouldn't an absorber be more effective
if it was angled to be perpendicular to the source ? The difference might not be great
(and it would probably look weird).

Paul P
Old 19th March 2010
  #13
Quote:
Originally Posted by jhbrandt View Post
then angle it with a plywood face and see which sounds the best.. (yeah, i know.. real scientific.. haha)

Actually, that is pretty scientific - Try the experiment!



-tINY

Old 19th March 2010
  #14
SAC
Registered User
 

Lots of good suggestions...

If you have the means, why not measure?

Either absorption and diffusion, or even a combination of both, could be optimal.

The balance of reflections within the space could easily indicate both a problem:

high gain sparse specular reflections that would benefit from either absorption - in the case of early arriving reflections - or spatial and temporal diffusion and the correlative reduction in gain for later arriving reflections.

and a solution:

as you have the means to verify the resultant behavior for any option tried.

It is so easy for all to make pronouncements predicated on both our assumptions and expected results when the means to determine the actual 'before' behavior, and thus the ability to better ascertain and verify the desired results is readily available.
Old 19th March 2010
  #15
Gear Guru
 
Glenn Kuras's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by SAC View Post
Lots of good suggestions...

If you have the means, why not measure?

Either absorption and diffusion, or even a combination of both, could be optimal.

The balance of reflections within the space could easily indicate both a problem:

high gain sparse specular reflections that would benefit from either absorption - in the case of early arriving reflections - or spatial and temporal diffusion and the correlative reduction in gain for later arriving reflections.

and a solution:

as you have the means to verify the resultant behavior for any option tried.

It is so easy for all to make pronouncements predicated on both our assumptions and expected results when the means to determine the actual 'before' behavior, and thus the ability to better ascertain and verify the desired results is readily available.
Use the following program to test the room.
Room EQ Wizard Home Page

The problem is you may not be able to test the room and it tell you which way to go, so if you don't know then stick with absorption.
Old 21st March 2010
  #16
Gear Nut
 
jetpackstudios's Avatar
 

Thanks for all the advice guys. I'll post a build diary soon...
Top Mentioned Products
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearslutz Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…
Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Similar Threads
Thread
Thread Starter / Forum
Replies
tonyton / Bass traps, acoustic panels, foam etc
16
Ziko / Bass traps, acoustic panels, foam etc
7
nafspark / Studio building / acoustics
2
Grumblefoot / Studio building / acoustics
5
666666 / So much gear, so little time
30

Forum Jump
Forum Jump