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Correct settings on Genelecs after Sonarworks readings.
Old 12th September 2020
  #1
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Correct settings on Genelecs after Sonarworks readings.

Hi people,

I am just finishing off my project studio (not professional, so very low budget)

I purchased the Sonarworks measurement mic and wanted some help on how I could remedy my room and work out what settings I should use for my Genelec 8020 monitors please?

Firstly the Genelecs come with different dip switches and there's a roll of at 85hz so you can use a sub. When I use the measurement mic I can still pickup down to the low-subs even with different variations of the roll off dip switches engaged, any ideas?

For the test attached I left treble tilt off and engaged all three bass cuts which you can read in the file here
https://www.manualslib.com/manual/27...?page=4#manual

I cut the bass off as I plan to use my little cheap Yamaha sub and I will calibrate so it cuts off at 85hz so there's little crossover(again this is probably wrong but I'm not professional, yet!)

I'd like someone to help interpret the readings and suggest what I should do to improve my room.

Info on the room.

It is 2.4m tall, 3.4m wide and 4.1m long.

I have treate the early refelction points on wall and ceiling with acoustic tiles. Have a diffuser on the back wall and the back wall have floor to ceiling bass traps made from rockwool.

I also have some cheap foam bass traps on the front wall corners, floor to ceiling where I can.

Based on the measurements what is going wrong and what should/could I do to fix it please?
Attached Thumbnails
Correct settings on Genelecs after Sonarworks readings.-gen-only-ds-234.jpg   Correct settings on Genelecs after Sonarworks readings.-img_1101.jpg   Correct settings on Genelecs after Sonarworks readings.-img_1104.jpg   Correct settings on Genelecs after Sonarworks readings.-img_1105.jpg   Correct settings on Genelecs after Sonarworks readings.-img_1106.jpg  


Last edited by Northward; 11th October 2020 at 08:30 AM..
Old 12th September 2020
  #2
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Jason Foi's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Muskman View Post
Hi people,

I am just finishing off my project studio (not professional, so very low budget)

I purchased the Sonarworks measurement mic and wanted some help on how I could remedy my room and work out what settings I should use for my Genelec 8020 monitors please?

Firstly the Genelecs come with different dip switches and there's a roll of at 85hz so you can use a sub. When I use the measurement mic I can still pickup down to the low-subs even with different variations of the roll off dip switches engaged, any ideas?

For the test attached I left treble tilt off and engaged all three bass cuts which you can read in the file here
https://www.manualslib.com/manual/27...?page=4#manual

I cut the bass off as I plan to use my little cheap Yamaha sub and I will calibrate so it cuts off at 85hz so there's little crossover(again this is probably wrong but I'm not professional, yet!)

I'd like someone to help interpret the readings and suggest what I should do to improve my room.

Info on the room.

It is 2.4m tall, 3.4m wide and 4.1m long.

I have treate the early refelction points on wall and ceiling with acoustic tiles. Have a diffuser on the back wall and the back wall have floor to ceiling bass traps made from rockwool.

I also have some cheap foam bass traps on the front wall corners, floor to ceiling where I can.

Based on the measurements what is going wrong and what should/could I do to fix it please?
Well, youre not going to like this, but thin foam on the walls really only sucks out HF energy, leaving everthing else to run a muck.

Set all your dip switches to flat and use the sticky at the top of the forum to download REW and a do a proper measurement and then upload your file.
Old 12th September 2020 | Show parent
  #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason Foi View Post
Well, youre not going to like this, but thin foam on the walls really only sucks out HF energy, leaving everthing else to run a muck.

Set all your dip switches to flat and use the sticky at the top of the forum to download REW and a do a proper measurement and then upload your file.
Hi does the readings from Sonarworks cut it?

I’m trying to interpret generally if this Sonarworks reading I uploaded the screen shot of is horrendous?

I’m applying the suggested EQ from Sonarworks and doing a comparison and it doesn’t sound a million miles away.

I’ll get REW and do that now. Should I do it with sub on or off?
Old 12th September 2020 | Show parent
  #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason Foi View Post
Well, youre not going to like this, but thin foam on the walls really only sucks out HF energy, leaving everthing else to run a muck.

Set all your dip switches to flat and use the sticky at the top of the forum to download REW and a do a proper measurement and then upload your file.
Hi and when you say thin foam, the stuff I’ve got in the first reflection points(side walls and ceilings) is 100mm thick. Are you suggesting I need broadband ones, I’ve seen people do rockwool inside wooden frames on the side walls and ceilings before.

Cheersb
Old 12th September 2020
  #5
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I have uploaded the files.

I dont know if you need to know the frequency curve of the Sonarworks Mic?

Orange is with bass rolled off

Green is with it flat
Attached Thumbnails
Correct settings on Genelecs after Sonarworks readings.-screenshot-2020-09-12-16.35.40.jpg   Correct settings on Genelecs after Sonarworks readings.-screenshot-2020-09-12-16.36.09.jpg  
Attached Files
File Type: mdat Bass not rolled off.mdat (7.52 MB, 3 views) File Type: mdat BASS ROLLOFF.mdat (5.09 MB, 3 views)
Old 12th September 2020 | Show parent
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason Foi View Post
Well, youre not going to like this, but thin foam on the walls really only sucks out HF energy, leaving everthing else to run a muck.

Set all your dip switches to flat and use the sticky at the top of the forum to download REW and a do a proper measurement and then upload your file.
It would be amazing to learn about what is causing the big dip at like 600-1800. I did some reading and some people said it might be reflections from the desk/synths in front of me.

Would be amazing to work out what causes that massive dip!

Cheers
Old 12th September 2020 | Show parent
  #7
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Jason Foi's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Muskman View Post
Hi does the readings from Sonarworks cut it?

I’m trying to interpret generally if this Sonarworks reading I uploaded the screen shot of is horrendous?

I’m applying the suggested EQ from Sonarworks and doing a comparison and it doesn’t sound a million miles away.

I’ll get REW and do that now. Should I do it with sub on or off?
Frequency response is only one piece of the puzzle. Measure left, left + sub, right, right + sub, left + right, left + right + sub
Old 12th September 2020 | Show parent
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason Foi View Post
Frequency response is only one piece of the puzzle. Measure left, left + sub, right, right + sub, left + right, left + right + sub
OK so you the ones above aren't adequate with REW. You need all the individual ones as your saying yeah?

Generally speaking what would cause a big dip between 600-1800hz?

Thankyou
Old 12th September 2020 | Show parent
  #9
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Jason Foi's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Muskman View Post
Hi and when you say thin foam, the stuff I’ve got in the first reflection points(side walls and ceilings) is 100mm thick. Are you suggesting I need broadband ones, I’ve seen people do rockwool inside wooden frames on the side walls and ceilings before.

Cheersb
Possibly, REW will tell us, but most likely at the very least youll need to space the foam off the wall or repurpose it in a new location.
Old 12th September 2020 | Show parent
  #10
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Jason Foi's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Muskman View Post
OK so you the ones above aren't adequate with REW. You need all the individual ones as your saying yeah?

Generally speaking what would cause a big dip between 600-1800hz?

Thankyou
Phase cancellations from early reflections
Old 12th September 2020 | Show parent
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason Foi View Post
Phase cancellations from early reflections
What do I do about that then?

Did you see the files above, were they no use?
Thanks
Old 12th September 2020 | Show parent
  #12
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you cannot cure issues by applying eq...

if you ask jason nicely (and pay him a fee), he might guide you through the process of optimizing your room acoustics; be prepared to get your hands dirty though and spend some additional money on material and make a considerable effort...
Old 12th September 2020 | Show parent
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deedeeyeah View Post
you cannot cure issues by applying eq...

if you ask jason nicely (and pay him a fee), he might guide you through the process of optimizing your room acoustics; be prepared to get your hands dirty though and spend some additional money on material and make a considerable effort...
Hi thanks for taking time to reply.
I hadn’t released he was after a fee for his time-/advice.
I’m trying my best to research each of the separate issues within my readings so I can learn how they occurring and how with very limited budget I can try to fix them.
I do agree a reversed EQ of the issues isn’t a way to fix it but I’m kinda stuck now because I don’t understand how to move forward because I can’t interpret the readings!

Thanks again.
Old 12th September 2020 | Show parent
  #14
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Jason Foi's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Muskman View Post
What do I do about that then?

Did you see the files above, were they no use?
Thanks
Lol, i am not after a fee, nor an expert, but i know 1 or 2 things...

You stop phase cancellations by adding absorbtion to the offending surface or by using geometry to redirect the reflection elsewhere.

I havent looked at your files yet, but if they arent seperated how i suggested they are of little help
Old 12th September 2020 | Show parent
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muskman View Post
Hi thanks for taking time to reply.
I hadn’t released he was after a fee for his time-/advice.
I’m trying my best to research each of the separate issues within my readings so I can learn how they occurring and how with very limited budget I can try to fix them.
I do agree a reversed EQ of the issues isn’t a way to fix it but I’m kinda stuck now because I don’t understand how to move forward because I can’t interpret the readings!

Thanks again.
ask him about a fee - it's just been my assumption that he cannot spend time endlessly for free... *

i'm no acoustician, just an experienced tech (working mostly in nicely designed studios if not live/broadcasting) so i can't help you much.
to me it looks though that - amongst other things - you need to treat the areas of reflections with more absorbtive material: good news is that this won't necessarily cost you an arm and a leg!


* guess that question got answered by his previous post - but maybe get him a bottle of corona beer during these strange pandemic times? :-)

Last edited by deedeeyeah; 12th September 2020 at 08:19 PM.. Reason: * edited
Old 12th September 2020 | Show parent
  #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason Foi View Post
Lol, i am not after a fee, nor an expert, but i know 1 or 2 things...

You stop phase cancellations by adding absorbtion to the offending surface or by using geometry to redirect the reflection elsewhere.

I havent looked at your files yet, but if they arent seperated how i suggested they are of little help
Hi, thanks again.

I just worked out what ‘sticky’ meant and found a post talking about measurements so now I understand what you were asking of me!

Tomorrow I will run all the tests as you suggest. Slowly catching up on the terminology.
I’ve been googling all the things you’ve said to try work them out!

In my room with the FLAT settings the monitors sound super muddy and bright so I’ll do readings with the bass roll off and treble tilt also.

Thankyou mate.
Old 12th September 2020 | Show parent
  #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deedeeyeah View Post
ask him about a fee - it's just been my assumption that he cannot spend time endlessly for free...

i'm no acoustician, just an experienced tech (working mostly in nicely designed studios if not live/broadcasting) so i can't help you much.
to me it looks though that - amongst other things - you need to treat the areas of reflections with more absorbtive material: good news is that this won't necessarily cost you an arm and a leg!
Agreed and I don’t expect him to, I will happily compensate however I can.

You see I’m trying to learn how your experience helps you to arrive with me needing more absorption as you’re saying?

The freq response shows a sort of linear line at the highs but it’s a few DB above 0db. So I don’t know if that means it’s doing a good job of keeping it coherent or it’s balanced but balanced in a bad way?!

Then the low mids-mids has a huge dip and I’ve no idea what I need to do with that either!!

It’s such a minefield.

I researched as much as I possibly could before building this space on a very low budget (£1000).

I’ve learned a lot about rooms, where to setup, bass traps, diffusion, early reflection points and now I’ve exhausted my new knowledge!

Thanks for your time.
Old 12th September 2020 | Show parent
  #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muskman View Post
Agreed and I don’t expect him to, I will happily compensate however I can.

You see I’m trying to learn how your experience helps you to arrive with me needing more absorption as you’re saying?

The freq response shows a sort of linear line at the highs but it’s a few DB above 0db. So I don’t know if that means it’s doing a good job of keeping it coherent or it’s balanced but balanced in a bad way?!

Then the low mids-mids has a huge dip and I’ve no idea what I need to do with that either!!

It’s such a minefield.

I researched as much as I possibly could before building this space on a very low budget (£1000).

I’ve learned a lot about rooms, where to setup, bass traps, diffusion, early reflection points and now I’ve exhausted my new knowledge!

Thanks for your time.
with some experience, one 'knows' that your measurement results cannot stem from issues with the signal chain or the measurement device/tools but from reflected sound interfering with direct sound, leading to rather typical dips in the frequency plot and a weired phase trace - hence my conclusion that you need to minimize reflections which you can do by both absorbing (and to some extent diffusing) them but also by avoiding them: do not throw any sound/as little as possible onto a surface which causes reflections.

you already put your speakers as close as possible to the front wall which is good; do the same for a sub but make it fire sideways (with the woofer then almost touching the wall) or possibly even better, put it in one of the front corners for maximum 'loading', meaning you get the most output due to the boundaries plus you can minimize some of the negative effects of 'sbir'/interference/phase cancellation.

judging from your pics, the 'table' of the speaker stands is a bit too big (causing already a first reflection) - way more critical are the large tables with the keyboards though.

if you'd throw the tables and keyboards out just for measurement purposes, you could already see a clear improvement in the response - try cutting down on reflective surface as much as you can, starting with the furniture. maybe use typical keyboard stands and a table just as large as really needed. cover additional areas with absorbtive materials; for this, foam might do.

jason might fill you in with how to treat the side walls/ceiling/rear wall...
Old 12th September 2020 | Show parent
  #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deedeeyeah View Post
with some experience, one 'knows' to that your measurement results cannot stem from issues with the signal chain or the measurement device/tools but from reflected sound interfering with direct sound, leading to rather typical dips in the frequency plot and a weired phase trace - hence my conclusion that you need to minimize reflections which you can do by both absorbing (and to some extent diffusing) them but also by avoiding them: do not throw any sound/as little as possible onto a surface which causes reflection.

you already put your speakers as close as possible to the front wall which is good; do the same for a sub but make it fire sideways (with the woofer then almost touching the wall) or possibly even better, put it in one of the front corners for maximum 'loading', meaning you get the most output due to the boundaries plus you can minimize some of the negative effects of 'sbir'/interference/phase cancellation.

judging from your pics, the position of the tops seems to be okay but the 'table' of the speaker stands is a bit too big (causing already a first reflection) - way more critical are the large tables with the keyboards though.

if you'd throw the tables and keyboards out just for measurement purposes, you could already see a clear improvement in the response - try cutting down on reflective surface, as much as you can, starting with the furniture. maybe use typical keyboard stands and a table just as large as really needed. cover additional areas with absorbtive materials; for this, foam might do.

jason might fill you in with how to treat the side walls/ceiling/rear wall...
Hi, thank you so much for this!

I hadn't considered the speaker stands, I can position them so they are at the front edge, good point!

I will move the sub also, I was worried in the readings it would make the phase weird if it wasn't centred.

I can try measurements with no desk as an experiment. I was hoping the 10cm thick foam-absorbers on the ceiling & side walls would be adequate but it seems we're arriving at those being the culprits!
I'm guessing if I made my own broadband rockwool ones they will cover a better frequency range.

I do have diffusers on the rear wall. And floor to ceiling bass traps made from rockwool too.

Thanks again.
Old 12th September 2020 | Show parent
  #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muskman View Post
I will move the sub also, I was worried in the readings it would make the phase weird if it wasn't centred.
low frequencies behave in much different ways than one might guess and 'phase' on absolute terms cannot get perceived: for a free standing sub (or a sub array), it's recommended/mostly good enough if it's positioned within a quarter of a wavelength (of the frequency in question which is mostly the crossover frequency) to the top speakers for optimum coupling (without alignment).

there are a couple of other factors which might take priority in a studio/indoors though which only measurments can reveal...

anyway, you wanna make sure that the position of the measuring mic doesn't even move by a millimeter or (almost) all comparisons between measurements (one after each step to change furniture, absorbers, diffusors, positions of gear) will become impossible/mostly useless and you cannot document which step went into the right or wrong direction!

imo you can skip the sub for the time being/as long as you haven't sorted out the reflections... - make sure you run the top speakers full range though/no filters engaged.
Old 13th September 2020 | Show parent
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muskman View Post
Generally speaking what would cause a big dip between 600-1800hz?
Question about dip at 1KHz
Old 13th September 2020 | Show parent
  #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jens Eklund View Post
Wow! Thankyou!! Ok, the issue is a like to workwith my synths in front of me and use a desk for the keyboard and mouse etc..

I will run a test with a heavy blanket on the table and no synths etc to hopefully prove that part of the issues I’m having is this. However I couldn’t work without that setup so I’ve no idea of a solution?!
Old 13th September 2020 | Show parent
  #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deedeeyeah View Post
low frequencies behave in much different ways than one might guess and 'phase' on absolute terms cannot get perceived: for a free standing sub (or a sub array), it's recommended/mostly good enough if it's positioned within a quarter of a wavelength (of the frequency in question which is mostly the crossover frequency) to the top speakers for optimum coupling (without alignment).

there are a couple of other factors which might take priority in a studio/indoors though which only measurments can reveal...

anyway, you wanna make sure that the position of the measuring mic doesn't even move by a millimeter or (almost) all comparisons between measurements (one after each step to change furniture, absorbers, diffusors, positions of gear) will become impossible/mostly useless and you cannot document which step went into the right or wrong direction!

imo you can skip the sub for the time being/as long as you haven't sorted out the reflections... - make sure you run the top speakers full range though/no filters engaged.
I hear you.
When you say run the speakers full range though. Is this just so we can use the measurements to identify the rooms issues? I won’t ever setup my speakers with the bass at full range as my sub will cover 85hz and below. Just trying to work put the reason behind carrying out a test on a system which I won’t be using. Thankyou again!
Old 13th September 2020 | Show parent
  #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muskman View Post
I hear you.
When you say run the speakers full range though. Is this just so we can use the measurements to identify the rooms issues? I won’t ever setup my speakers with the bass at full range as my sub will cover 85hz and below. Just trying to work put the reason behind carrying out a test on a system which I won’t be using. Thankyou again!
i do whatever gets me the 'best' results...

...which, in a well-designed and acoustically optimized room, is often running the tops full-range and then use the sub(s) 'just' to hear the lowest octave.

running tops full-range is also helpful for mixing without a sub (which i did for about 20 years and which was more or less the norm in most other studio i got to work; of course i had to check the low end on headphones then). also worth noting that the crossover doesn't need to be symmetrical in any case and there can be quite a considerable amount of overlap between the sub and the tops - or no overlap at all!

each setting has some benefits but also some disadvantages and mostly, there is more than one way how to approach a situation.

anyway, the idea to leave the sub off for the time being is that imo its way easier to see flaws in the measurement as the sub can mask some of them; i'll guarantee that adding the sub later on will (mostly) improve your situation and you then have to deal just with alignment.

there are a couple of threads on using subs and how to integrate them - and here's a link to an article i think is worth reading (even if one doesn't necessarily has to agree on everything):

https://www.soundonsound.com/techniq...t-control-room



[personally, i still prefer mixing in either one of my 35-years old lede-rooms with huge in-wall augspurger/tad/kino§hita speakers which go down very low (and yet i added a single external sub later on) - and i love mixing at stage levels in there! - or then in my barely treated home mixing room which features a relatively massive 7.1.4 setup consisting of tannoy mains, genelec overheads and three k+h (neumann) subs and where my preferred listening level is below 75dBA leq/1h.

i drive all of my speakers though external dsp, from the large kino§hitas to the tiny single fostex 6301nd, and i do correct minor room anomalies, issues from positioning of speakers, dial in my preferred curves which apply gradual hf attenuation, compensate for different levels and some hearing loss... - dsp rules!]
Old 13th September 2020 | Show parent
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason Foi View Post
Frequency response is only one piece of the puzzle. Measure left, left + sub, right, right + sub, left + right, left + right + sub
Hey mate.

So this morning I have taken new measurements as you suggested. I also removed everything from my desk and laid down some heavy old curtains. I used the calibration file from my XREF20 Mic to balance the readings out.

I tested as you said and also with the bass roll off engaged with sub as you'll see in the file.

Any help here would be amazing please! Corona beers are ready!

The file is too big so I uploaded it to Mediafire.


https://www.dropbox.com/s/aszr19vdqm...ents.mdat?dl=0
Attached Thumbnails
Correct settings on Genelecs after Sonarworks readings.-img_1110.jpg   Correct settings on Genelecs after Sonarworks readings.-img_1108.jpg  
Old 13th September 2020 | Show parent
  #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deedeeyeah View Post
i do whatever gets me the 'best' results...

...which, in a well-designed and acoustically optimized room, is often running the tops full-range and then use the sub(s) 'just' to hear the lowest octave.

running tops full-range is also helpful for mixing without a sub (which i did for about 20 years and which was more or less the norm in most other studio i got to work; of course i had to check the low end on headphones then). also worth noting that the crossover doesn't need to be symmetrical in any case and there can be quite a considerable amount of overlap between the sub and the tops - or no overlap at all!

each setting has some benefits but also some disadvantages and mostly, there is more than one way how to approach a situation.

anyway, the idea to leave the sub off for the time being is that imo its way easier to see flaws in the measurement as the sub can mask some of them; i'll guarantee that adding the sub later on will (mostly) improve your situation and you then have to deal just with alignment.

there are a couple of threads on using subs and how to integrate them - and here's a link to an article i think is worth reading (even if one doesn't necessarily has to agree on everything):

https://www.soundonsound.com/techniq...t-control-room



[personally, i still prefer mixing in either one of my 35-years old lede-rooms with huge in-wall augspurger/tad/kino§hita speakers which go down very low (and yet i added a single external sub later on) - and i love mixing at stage levels in there! - or then in my barely treated home mixing room which features a relatively massive 7.1.4 setup consisting of tannoy mains, genelec overheads and three k+h (neumann) subs and where my preferred listening level is below 75dBA leq/1h.

i drive all of my speakers though external dsp, from the large kino§hitas to the tiny single fostex 6301nd, and i do correct minor room anomalies, issues from positioning of speakers, dial in my preferred curves which apply gradual hf attenuation, compensate for different levels and some hearing loss... - dsp rules!]
Wow! Sounds like some amazing setups!! I didn't realise you can have a fair overlap on the sub, thats good then!

I find my Genelec 8020 to be a little weak on the bottom end having now heard them in 4 different studio spaces.

I just did another Sonarworks reading to compare with yesterday and I can see how the blanket on desk vs synths etc have affected the top end considerably!

I guess I need to read into what people do in a creative studio space that's not dedicated to mixing. I love having an array of synths/keys around me to be able to jam quickly BUT if that's gonna cause mixing issues I am torn on what I should do?!
Attached Thumbnails
Correct settings on Genelecs after Sonarworks readings.-screenshot-2020-09-13-10.09.17.jpg   Correct settings on Genelecs after Sonarworks readings.-screenshot-2020-09-13-10.08.44.jpg  
Old 13th September 2020 | Show parent
  #27
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take the large monitor (screen) off the front wall, cover the window and the door with a blanket, move away the table but use the cross-leg keyboard stand (which currently holds the juno and put it) in front of you - turn down the light, take a lamp with a wide beam (which ideally matches the dispersion of your speakers) and put it in one of the speaker's position: everything which lands in your face (at the listening position) is good, everything else not so much but this should tell you which surfaces to avoid/dampen - plenty of room for improvements...


btw: i hope you did turn off sonarworks for the measurement?! - keep optimizing your room by physical measures; only at the very end use dsp to correct minor flaws (say within 1,5 to max. 3dB)...
Old 13th September 2020 | Show parent
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deedeeyeah View Post
take the large monitor (screen) off the front wall, cover the window and the door with a blanket, move away the table but use the cross-leg keyboard stand (which currently holds the juno and put it) in front of you - turn down the light, take a lamp with a wide beam (which ideally matches the dispersion of your speakers) and put it in one of the speaker's position: everything which lands in your face (at the listening position) is good, everything else not so much but this should tell you which surfaces to avoid/dampen - plenty of room for improvements...


btw: i hope you did turn off sonarworks for the measurement?! - keep optimizing your room by physical measures; only at the very end use dsp to correct minor flaws (say within 1,5 to max. 3dB)...
Ha ha yeah Sonarworks is off! I'm silly but not that bad!

I just moved my listening position to 38% (a change of 20cm) which means I have had to move the Genelecs forward 20cm (so now 40cm away from the front wall). I again laid down the blanket and did new readings with flat speaker response and no sub.

The screen monitor is potentially in an early reflection I guess. The window has been built a few inches above the monitors and the door I can treat but I was reading that the front wall rarely gets treated? I only did the wall for aesthetics instead of plasterboard/drywall!
+ corner bass traps.

You reckon I need to cover those surfaces then?

Thanks again!
Attached Files
File Type: mdat New Sweet Spot @ 38%.mdat (8.02 MB, 4 views)
Old 13th September 2020 | Show parent
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deedeeyeah View Post
take the large monitor (screen) off the front wall, cover the window and the door with a blanket, move away the table but use the cross-leg keyboard stand (which currently holds the juno and put it) in front of you - turn down the light, take a lamp with a wide beam (which ideally matches the dispersion of your speakers) and put it in one of the speaker's position: everything which lands in your face (at the listening position) is good, everything else not so much but this should tell you which surfaces to avoid/dampen - plenty of room for improvements...


btw: i hope you did turn off sonarworks for the measurement?! - keep optimizing your room by physical measures; only at the very end use dsp to correct minor flaws (say within 1,5 to max. 3dB)...
Orange 38% position with blanket

Red original position with blanket.

Firstly, do you think it has improved things by moving it to the 38% position?

Sorry about all of this.
Attached Thumbnails
Correct settings on Genelecs after Sonarworks readings.-screenshot-2020-09-13-11.31.15.jpg  
Old 13th September 2020 | Show parent
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muskman View Post
... this morning I have taken new measurements as you suggested. I also removed everything from my desk and laid down some heavy old curtains. I used the calibration file from my XREF20 Mic to balance the readings out....
Hi,
looks like you have loaded a measurement file as "Soundcard Calibration"

Correct settings on Genelecs after Sonarworks readings.-left-sondcard-.jpg

A decent soundcard would look like pic 2
Which means... its actually not needed at all!
(Unless you are constructing loudspeakers etc.)


(The main advantage with Loopback measurements/ Soundcard calibration is to reveal measuring misstakes.

Also: 8020 type is one of the smaller Genelecs so measuring loud (?) will give you a lot of distortion and possibly another kind of corrupt measurement...

Try again, no SC Cal and not too loud

Best


BTW. Agree with deedee. Make sure you don't have Sonarworks or other EQ engaged when you investigate your room.
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Correct settings on Genelecs after Sonarworks readings.-left-sondcard-.jpg   Correct settings on Genelecs after Sonarworks readings.-soundcard-cal-scarlet.jpg  
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