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Greatest studio designs Keyboard Synthesizers
Old 16th January 2019
  #1
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laperlestudio's Avatar
Greatest studio designs

I am sure that there is already a thread like that, but I can't find it anywhere else.

I was wondering what are the greatest sounding recording room and control room. What is your favourite design and who made them?

I know that Bill Putnam is going to get a lot of love.

I heard that some of the mixing room in East West sound awesome for mixing, I love the sound of those rooms.

I really enjoy Ronnie's Place in Nashville.

What are the best sounding rooms and why?

Thank you!
Attached Thumbnails
Greatest studio designs-maxresdefault.jpg   Greatest studio designs-east-west.jpeg   Greatest studio designs-ronniesplace2.jpg  
Old 18th January 2019
  #2
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laperlestudio's Avatar
Also, is there any pro Acoustic Designer here who have any ultimate reference for studio design?
Old 18th January 2019
  #3
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avare's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by laperlestudio View Post
Also, is there any pro Acoustic Designer here who have any ultimate reference for studio design?
Yes. Several. World projects. For starters our moderator Thomas.

Andre
Old 18th January 2019
  #4
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To the question "What are the best sounding rooms and why?"

A nice read here: Best Mix Room On The Planet!!?

Old 18th January 2019
  #5
nms
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If we're truly talking about "the best", to my knowledge, no one outdoes Thomas / Northward Acoustics. Technically & aesthetically, his rooms are on a whole different level vs the ones you posted.

Northward Acoustics - Home | Facebook
Old 18th January 2019
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nms View Post
If we're truly talking about "the best", to my knowledge, no one outdoes Thomas / Northward Acoustics. Technically & aesthetically, his rooms are on a whole different level vs the ones you posted.

Northward Acoustics - Home | Facebook
Is there one in particular that you really like? How does it sound?
Old 18th January 2019
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JayPee View Post
To the question "What are the best sounding rooms and why?"

A nice read here: Best Mix Room On The Planet!!?

Thank you. Is there one room that you worked in that you really enjoyed the sound?
Old 18th January 2019
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by laperlestudio View Post
Thank you. Is there one room that you worked in that you really enjoyed the sound?
I wish I can answer you. But, for that, I'd need to hear a proper RFZ/Lede room, a NE, a FTB, a Boggy's room etc...
Old 18th January 2019
  #9
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Alright then let me ask the question differently. Because the question is not a technical one, but more based on the experience. Some mixer and recording engineer have really enjoy some room more than other. Like I did when I went to those places. So if people have really enjoy the sound of a particular control room or recording, tell which one and why!

Thanl you!
Old 18th January 2019
  #10
Gear Maniac
 

What are the greatest sounding guitars?
I was wondering what are the greatest sounding guitars and who made them?
I know Gibson or Fender or Gretch or Ibanez did some things.
But Steve Vai likes Ibanez and Jeff Beck likes Fender, and a lot of guys like the brand paying them the most to play om them, like Eddie.

And nobody outdoes the guy who makes guitars by a secret formula because it is secret and he is the guru of the forum.
.
Old 18th January 2019
  #11
Gear Maniac
 

Uncertain people like absolute answers.
That is called religion and it's a bit immature.
Old 18th January 2019
  #12
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Maybe I should have asked the question differently, maybe I’m not in the right category, maybe people here don’t like the that kind of thread. Anyway I wanted mostly to know people who have had great experience in great room getting great sound and having a good time! Anyway.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #13
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Recording or control rooms? Quite differently approach.
Good recording rooms often have the possibilty to tune their behaviour to make it more flexible as room sound is a huge part of the artistic vision. In opposit to a control room where "no sound" is the theoretical goal.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #14
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Northward's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by bert stoltenborg View Post
And nobody outdoes the guy who makes guitars by a secret formula because it is secret and he is the guru of the forum.
.
I'm a guru now? I thought I was more of a dark cult leader.

Send me all your money.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Northward View Post
I'm a guru now? I thought I was more of a dark cult leader.

Send me all your money.
You're also into guitar building?
Old 4 weeks ago
  #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bert stoltenborg View Post
You're also into guitar building?
Only guitar torturing.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #17
It's a good question, but is it the right question? You'd have to start by defining "best sounding"

Is best sounding the most accurate, the vibiest, the loudest? Is the best room the one you remember working in most warmly? If so, I doubt it's because of the sound, more likely because of the interaction or the end result

The thumbnails in your post are interesting: they convey nothing of the sound of the room but of the ambience. That's what you "buy" when you walk into a room. Whether it translates into a great record is another matter

For what it's worth, the best sounding control room I've ever been in was Plus Trente in Paris around 1990. A Hidley Kino****a room. The monitors were just fantastic - so effortless

Nick Froome
Old 4 weeks ago
  #18
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Concerning "Control Rooms" the holy grail is when the room (or listening position) has no sound whatsoever. In other words, it contributes nothing and subtracts nothing from what is emanating from the speakers.

Trying to achieve that in the real world might cost you your first born and a trip to a psychiatric hospital.

Getting "close enough" and moving on to the business of producing records is about the best you can hope for.

And, as always, it is a rich man's game -- the true "secret" of The Masters.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sage691 View Post
Concerning "Control Rooms" the holy grail is when the room (or listening position) has no sound whatsoever. In other words, it contributes nothing and subtracts nothing from what is emanating from the speakers.
Not really, there are differing philosophies with regard to control room criteria. What you have stated here is generally the goal of NE (non-environment) rooms, but LEDE/RFZ on the other hand advocates an anechoic response for the first ~20ms (the Haas window), and then a "Haas Kicker" where there is a diffuse room reflection arriving at the listening position just on the outside edge of the Haas window. Control rooms with diffusers on the rear wall are (generally) more towards the LEDE/RFZ paradigm.

It seems to me that *modern* designs are trending towards less of a Haas Kicker than traditional LEDE/RFZ, but many current designers still seem to advocate for some environmental cues in the loudspeaker-listener response. Maybe Thomas @Northward will chime in here as he is already in the thread.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #20
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We don't advertise or recommend any interaction between room and speakers (except for the floor and to a much lesser extent furniture, which is inevitable) so no environmental cues are triggered by interactions between speakers and room. Path from speakers to engineer is basically hemi-anechoic (due to the floor, otherwise it would be fully Anechoic)

We strictly use "self-noises" cues (so noises we produce such as voice, moving of objects when in the room etc) to trigger an environmental response, using surfaces that are not seen by speakers (i.e. well below detection threshold in their residual interaction with speakers, if there is any).

Among other things, noise floor in the room, level, frequency range and time response of the cues parameters are very important, as it only works if all factors are within a narrow range.

The aim being to create what is called a canonical environmental response using a form of "acoustic environmental dithering", which provides all the necessary cues to the brain so it does not react to the otherwise very controlled environment - and hence keeps the auditory system in a neutral state - which is where half of the translation happens. Good overall audio chain and good speakers being the other half.

Without going into more detail, this is how our specific in-house model works, there are of course other options around and other opinions.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Northward View Post
We don't advertise or recommend any interaction between room and speakers (except for the floor and to a much lesser extent furniture, which is inevitable) so no environmental cues are triggered by interactions between speakers and room. Path from speakers to engineer is basically hemi-anechoic (due to the floor, otherwise it would be fully Anechoic)

We strictly use "self-noises" cues (so noises we produce such as voice, moving of objects when in the room etc) to trigger an environmental response, using surfaces that are not seen by speakers (i.e. well below detection threshold in their residual interaction with speakers, if there is any).

Among other things, noise floor in the room, level, frequency range and time response of the cues parameters are very important, as it only works if all factors are within a narrow range.

The aim being to create what is called a canonical environmental response using a form of "acoustic environmental dithering", which provides all the necessary cues to the brain so it does not react to the otherwise very controlled environment - and hence keeps the auditory system in a neutral state - which is where half of the translation happens. Good overall audio chain and good speakers being the other half.

Without going into more detail, this is how our specific in-house model works, there are of course other options around and other opinions.
To create such things, you have to start from the ground up I guess, you need to work on the structure of the walls and floors. Is it possible to implement elements like these into a existing system?
Old 4 weeks ago
  #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by laperlestudio View Post
To create such things, you have to start from the ground up I guess, you need to work on the structure of the walls and floors. Is it possible to implement elements like these into a existing system?
Ground up build, which have to meet minimum size/volume and structural constraints for example. You can't make it work any other way.

These are very much engineered spaces. No existing space upgrade is possible.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Northward View Post
These are very much engineered spaces. No existing space upgrade is possible.
Anything is possible if you put your mind to it

Greatest studio designs-high-end-acoustic-treatment.jpg
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Greatest studio designs-high-end-acoustic-treatment.jpg  
Old 4 weeks ago
  #24
Gear Nut
 

So that gives rise to an interesting question (to which the final answer is clearly "it depends").

In an existing smaller room, (living room to bedroom size), what's the best/most common/most recommended design philosophy?

LEDE?
RFZ?
Half arsed non environment?

Or just the "no definable philosophy" of
- Treat modes
- Treat first reflections
- Treat low end RT60
- See where you are and hope you have some possibility to tailor "liveness" to what you want?

Really just some mental gymnastics here...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Northward View Post
Ground up build, which have to meet minimum size/volume and structural constraints for example. You can't make it work any other way.

These are very much engineered spaces. No existing space upgrade is possible.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon Best View Post
So that gives rise to an interesting question (to which the final answer is clearly "it depends").

In an existing smaller room, (living room to bedroom size), what's the best/most common/most recommended design philosophy?

LEDE?
RFZ?
Half arsed non environment?

Or just the "no definable philosophy" of
- Treat modes
- Treat first reflections
- Treat low end RT60
- See where you are and hope you have some possibility to tailor "liveness" to what you want?

Really just some mental gymnastics here...
I'd not try to implement a LEDE in a bedroom size studio.

RZF, for sure.

Room modes and SBIR are the #1 priorities.
Actually Room modes are not the hardest part. Specially in small room, since the room modes are not that low (above 40 Hz).

First reflections are easy and do not require any DIY skills. And can work properly, assuming you chose the right product for the given thickness.

RT60 in small room is an oxymoron Some reads about this subject:

Control Room - target decay rates
Favorite Mastering room design
An appropriate replacement for RT60s in SAS - Home Theater Forum and Systems - HomeTheaterShack.com


The two very common mistakes seen in small studio, very often, owned by amateurs are

#1 the over abused of thin porous panel absorbers. Leading to a very dead room.

#2 : the over abused of enormous porous absorbers. Leading to a very dry room (≠dead) and an even smaller room.


Best,

Jean-Pierre B.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon Best View Post

Or just the "no definable philosophy" of
- Treat modes
- Treat first reflections
- Treat low end RT60
- See where you are and hope you have some possibility to tailor "liveness" to what you want?

Really just some mental gymnastics here...
That's what I would recommend.

Be very systematic when you do that:

- List your constraints clearly (room size, location of doors and windows, structural, etc)
- Examine the current state of the room's response (measurements such as ETC, FR etc) and structure a clear report showing the results that can be used as a guideline for the whole project and as a basis with which to compare incremental progress in time,
- List your objectives, the tools you can use to achieve them, and look at what your budget allows you to use realistically.
- Set priorities (ER, Modes etc) and eventually plan the treatment to happen in multiple stages to follow budget constraints, which will help you optimize it and make sure all you do / build now is not getting in the way of future upgrades / progress.

You can look into the various models whose implementation have been made public, but it is unlikely they will work well in a small space - especially if implemented for the first time by a DIYer. If you have more experience, there is less risk in trying it.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #27
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon Best View Post
In an existing smaller room, (living room to bedroom size), what's the best/most common/most recommended design philosophy?

LEDE?
RFZ?
Half arsed non environment?
My new exciting experiences of recordings with diffusion
make me want to add Ambechoic as the most greatest sounding small control room.

For the ones not familiar with abbreviation´s as NE, LEDE etc.
Check this link from Sound on Sound!

Listen here in my links how the two different instruments behave in a NE. vs a Ambechoic room.

Room Acoustics Test 2 - Cymbal


Room Acoustics Test 1 - Bell


And how the vocals sound in this 1,2x1,2meter space.
Dry Vocal Booth vs SMT Vocal Booth


As an example of the bedroom size mix room on gs, we have Boggys My Room Design:
MyRoom Acoustic Design Mark II

And SMT:s S-field concept where Dr Hans mix room is a perfect example of an Ambechoic room.

Old 4 weeks ago
  #28
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I would not trust any room designs (no matter the size) without seeing some propers measurements, presented unsmoothed, and with a proper scale.

Also, ETC is not the hardest to get right. Specially a non filtered ETC.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #29
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Northward's Avatar
Talking about cults... Here we go.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Northward View Post
Talking about cults... Here we go.
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