The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
 Search This Thread  Search This Forum  Search Reviews  Search Gear Database  Search Gear for sale  Search Gearslutz Go Advanced
Single speaker stand for 2 monitors Utility Software
Old 12th August 2018
  #1
Gear Nut
 
rokko101's Avatar
 

Single speaker stand for 2 monitors

Hello guys.

I'd like to hear an opinion from you about mounting 2 speakers on a single stand.

I used to have only the bigger ones (7"-8") on proper stands while the smaller ones (4"-5") sitting on the desk.

The problem is I than even using Isoacoustics any small monitor on the desk sounds boxy.

I don't have too much space available so I was thinking about mounting both on a single stand.

Do you think it's ok or should I built separate stands for each monitor?

Thanks!
Attached Thumbnails
Single speaker stand for 2 monitors-3d.jpg  
Old 12th August 2018
  #2
Lives for gear
 
Jason Foi's Avatar
 

As long as the stand is really massive and the monitors are decoupled independently, it should be ok. You might experience artifacts from edge diffraction, but i dont know what to expect.
Old 12th August 2018
  #3
Gear Nut
 
rokko101's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason Foi View Post
As long as the stand is really massive and the monitors are decoupled independently, it should be ok. You might experience artifacts from edge diffraction, but i dont know what to expect.
Thanks Jason. Both monitors will be decoupled with isoacoustics stands and the stands themselves should be pretty heavy.

I'm going to read more about edge refraction, it's a term i'm only familiar from speakers literature. I guess careful placement should minimize undesired interaction between speakers in close proximity.
Old 12th August 2018
  #4
Lives for gear
 
Jason Foi's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by rokko101 View Post
Thanks Jason. Both monitors will be decoupled with isoacoustics stands and the stands themselves should be pretty heavy.

I'm going to read more about edge refraction, it's a term i'm only familiar from speakers literature. I guess careful placement should minimize undesired interaction between speakers in close proximity.
I wouldnt worry too much about it, but if funky stuff shows up in rew it may be something to consider
Old 12th August 2018
  #5
Gear Nut
 
rokko101's Avatar
 

Edge "diffraction" ... I wrote refraction! Not enough caffeine in my brain I guess.

Thanks. I'll measure to check any anomalies.
Old 12th August 2018
  #6
Gear Guru
Multiples

Over time I have tried many Monitors in my CR. From tiny to huge I have noticed more similarities than differences. So there was really no point referencing a slight variation the room response. Eventually I reviewed the room treatment and started using Dirac Live to impose a listening curve which simulates the average room/system. Now, I reference in different rooms on different systems.
But the combination of knowing the room/speakers and working on a 'real world' target curve....... I rarely hear anything different in any of the different spaces.


It is probably not possible to have both sets of speakers in the optimum position, but if you must, I would try one on top of the other. If you intend driving both together put the tweeters together, one upside down.
Also apart from flutter echo, which would mean an untreated Back Wall, we often find no benefit from Front Wall treatment. Even at the highest levels of studio design, they are often bare and reflective.


DD
Old 13th August 2018
  #7
Gear Nut
 
rokko101's Avatar
 

Quote:
Also apart from flutter echo, which would mean an untreated Back Wall, we often find no benefit from Front Wall treatment. Even at the highest levels of studio design, they are often bare and reflective.
Thanks for your suggestions.

I've already found the best listening spot (front to back)in the room and also allowed some distance (speakers to desk) to avoid early reflections from the mixing desk.

In this context the computer screen is about 20cm in front of the speakers. If I move the speakers closer to me then I get very noticeable comb filtering from the desk/console.

I could mount the screen on a stand and move it backwards.. but then it'll be hard to read (it's 27").

The front wall consists of 2 corner bass traps and 2 - 4.5 " panels.

My guess is that reflections coming from the back of the screen should be tamed by the 4" front wall panels ... Am I right?

I'd appreciate any further suggestions.
Attached Thumbnails
Single speaker stand for 2 monitors-3d2.jpg   Single speaker stand for 2 monitors-3d.jpg  
Old 13th August 2018
  #8
Lives for gear
 
Jason Foi's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by rokko101 View Post
Thanks for your suggestions.

I've already found the best listening spot (front to back)in the room and also allowed some distance (speakers to desk) to avoid early reflections from the mixing desk.

In this context the computer screen is about 20cm in front of the speakers. If I move the speakers closer to me then I get very noticeable comb filtering from the desk/console.

I could mount the screen on a stand and move it backwards.. but then it'll be hard to read (it's 27").

The front wall consists of 2 corner bass traps and 2 - 4.5 " panels.

My guess is that reflections coming from the back of the screen should be tamed by the 4" front wall panels ... Am I right?

I'd appreciate any further suggestions.
Only way to really know about the computer screen is to check in REW. If your screen is currently perpendicular to your desk you could try angling in back greater than 20 degrees. That would redirect and frequencies offended by the screen size.
Old 13th August 2018
  #9
Gear Guru
Aaaaa

Unfortunately there is another issue. An object in the direct path will experience a Diffraction 'Echo'. Best to have the screen flush with or behind the speaker baffles.

DD
Old 13th August 2018
  #10
Lives for gear
 
Jason Foi's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by DanDan View Post
Unfortunately there is another issue. An object in the direct path will experience a Diffraction 'Echo'. Best to have the screen flush with or behind the speaker baffles.

DD
Tilting wouldnt help?
Old 13th August 2018
  #11
Gear Addict
 
ReDRuMx's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by DanDan View Post
Unfortunately there is another issue. An object in the direct path will experience a Diffraction 'Echo'. Best to have the screen flush with or behind the speaker baffles.

DD
Sometimes this is impractical. I would suggest measuring to confirm there really are issues. I have my monitor in front, on the desk, and tilted. No issues.
Old 13th August 2018
  #12
Gear Guru
Dunno

Same here, but I never checked if there were issues, as there was no choice. Until I moved from two Lacie 19" to a 49" Samsung TV. I don't know about tilting, presuming the screen is pointed at the eyes, wouldn't the reflection and surface combo be also directed at the ears. Same height. Never took that much notice of Diffraction, tend to just avoid the knowns. Also I am just giving another reason to buy a big screen!
I also wonder is the mixing desk or the screen the main work area. If the desk is just preamps and such, I would try it behind or to the side.
All in all though, REW actually answers any or all of these questions. Lately I am wondering why we spend energy in theory? +1 Red.

e.g. Somebody showed numbers as to how sound travels at 111 m/s at 100Hz through 10K fibre. Really?

DD
Old 13th August 2018
  #13
Lives for gear
 
Jason Foi's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by DanDan View Post
Same here, but I never checked if there were issues, as there was no choice. Until I moved from two Lacie 19" to a 49" Samsung TV. I don't know about tilting, presuming the screen is pointed at the eyes, wouldn't the reflection and surface combo be also directed at the ears. Same height. Never took that much notice of Diffraction, tend to just avoid the knowns. Also I am just giving another reason to buy a big screen!
I also wonder is the mixing desk or the screen the main work area. If the desk is just preamps and such, I would try it behind or to the side.
All in all though, REW actually answers any or all of these questions. Lately I am wondering why we spend energy in theory? +1 Red.

e.g. Somebody showed numbers as to how sound travels at 111 m/s at 100Hz through 10K fibre. Really?

DD
I really dunno either. I guess a lot would have to do with the height of the tv in relation to the listener. Ray tracing would decide i suppose. I also would opt for a tv mounted on the front wall as well.

+500 for REW
Old 13th August 2018
  #14
Gear Addict
 
ReDRuMx's Avatar
The Library of Babel

Some things are easy to test. Some are not. Sometimes knowledge of theory is very useful. Sometimes it's the opposite. So, what's new?
Old 13th August 2018
  #15
Gear Guru
Doubting Thomas

Doubts are new Red. I am beginning to suspect a lot of our regularly trotted out facts. e.g. Does a 1:1 fibre to air gap actually work when the traps are distributed, as they often are? Afaik the basis for this free lunch air gap thing is either a 10 Sq Metre test or the fully sealed Kundt's Tube. Then there is the speed of sound in fibre...... some say 88m/s 50Hz 10K fibre.

DD

Last edited by DanDan; 13th August 2018 at 07:43 PM..
Old 13th August 2018
  #16
Gear Nut
 
rokko101's Avatar
 

Quote:
All in all though, REW actually answers any or all of these questions. Lately I am wondering why we spend energy in theory? +1 Red.
Acoustics lay in-between dreams and nightmares. In the beginning I thought a few 2" panels were all I needed to be happy. Then came wider panels, bass traps diffusors, zeleous soundproofing (walls, doors, windows), etc. But alas! there was a whole compendium of mathematical theory behind it all I wasn't completely aware.

So after reading a few pages I found out I knew almost nothing about acoustics and I needed to re-build the studio according to this new acquired knowledge.

Finally I realized that learning everything about acoustics could take a life time and so would left no time available for actual recording. What? Let's take a break!

I've just grasped the concept behind Diffraction. I was only thinking about reflections bouncing from the back of the screen and not the screen becoming a secondary sound source conflicting with the direct signal. Interesting for sure.

The best thing i can do is lower and angle the screen as much as possible.... or buy a bigger monitor and moving it backwards on a separate stand (but I don't really like huge screens... at least not in a recording studio... then again a 32" FHD could be nice!).
Moving the speakers closer will bring a whole lot of other issues: SBIR, Comb filtering from desk surface andnon-equilateral speakers-listener triangle. The same happens if I move the desk closer + a 100-120Hz cancelation due to a tenacious standing wave in that position (this I'm going to try to fix a few tuned membrane bass traps).
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearslutz Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…
Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Forum Jump
Forum Jump