The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
 Search This Thread  Search This Forum  Search Reviews  Search Gear Database  Search Gear for sale  Search Gearslutz Go Advanced
Studio build time lapse
Old 17th October 2017
  #1
Here for the gear
 
Leisure's Avatar
Studio build time lapse

Hi forum community and audio lovers!

Sorry to barge in here like this, but I have to share something! We're currently building a small recording studio in my new house, in order to produce the desired high quality content I requery for my media jobs. When finished, the studio will have a control / creative room of about 17m2, along with a vocalbooth of about 2m2. Both spaces are completely seperated from another, and both have 18cm rockwool in the walls.

Right now we're about half way the building process, and I have captured the entire process as a time lapse video, with one frame every five seconds, on my gopro. At 30fps, this means that every minute in the video is about two and a half hours of work.

I have added all the timelapse videos to our Youtube channel's timelapse playlist, so the entire process can be watched up untill its current state. Since I feel things are coming along pretty nice, I wanted to share this video here in order to get feedback and any remarks you guys might have, as well as to make your heart pump just a little faster for a moment Enjoy!



PS: Since I don't seem able to embed playlists, here's the link:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ASu...L_fgZMk95nreOU
Old 19th October 2017
  #2
Lives for gear
 
JWL.GIK's Avatar
 

nice work! I look forward to seeing how the build progresses and the treatment/setup strategies you employ.
Old 19th October 2017
  #3
Here for the gear
 
Leisure's Avatar
Regarding the treatment I was thinking rockwool basstraps in all four corners, of about 40x40x69cm triangles. Also I'm going to put up panels made of 10cm rockwool in wooden frames on the ceiling and on the walls a bit in front of the listening position.

Since I have windows on both sides (which is a bit numb, but I had to have some light and a direct view on the person I'm recording), this might be a bit of a tricky thing to manage. I have attached a schematic drawing and a sketch to clarify that last part. Any suggestions are more than welcome!
Attached Thumbnails
Studio build time lapse-bauzeichnung_0_0_71.jpg   Studio build time lapse-skitze_studio0_5.jpg  
Old 20th October 2017
  #4
Lives for gear
 
JWL.GIK's Avatar
 

Excellent, I think you have the right idea. For the window, I'd probably make some sort of removable panel or a freestanding panel that can be moved when eye contact is more important than sound quality.

Also be careful of not making the room too dead, you want a well-balanced room.
Old 20th October 2017
  #5
nms
Lives for gear
 
nms's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leisure View Post
Regarding the treatment I was thinking rockwool basstraps in all four corners, of about 40x40x69cm triangles. Also I'm going to put up panels made of 10cm rockwool in wooden frames on the ceiling and on the walls a bit in front of the listening position.
This is really on the conservative side, particularly in a room of concrete boundaries. Anything less than 60x60cm corner traps would be a waste.
Old 20th October 2017
  #6
Here for the gear
 
Leisure's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by nms View Post
Anything less than 60x60cm corner traps would be a waste.
Noted and will be included. Thanks!

And yes, too bad about the removable panels, that's what I was afraid of. I guess there's really no way around them. But since I'm still well inside my budget, all options are on the table!
Old 31st October 2017
  #7
Here for the gear
 
Leisure's Avatar
Ok, we're wll underway now. This weekend I put the first door in, quite exciting actually

Regarding the triangles in the corners: I was watching this german video about room acoustics, and this guy is trying to tell the viewers that the triangles in the corners need to be facing outward (so the 90° angle is pointing towards the center of the room instead of the corners) and that it is a common mistake to think they need to be pointing towards the corners (as I have seen in almost any studio I've ever been in).

Just to make sure I'm not a complete moron: This is wrong, right?

Here's a link to the german vid:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wqTTUL1IrA
Old 31st October 2017
  #8
Lives for gear
 
akebrake's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leisure View Post
...Regarding the triangles in the corners...
What do you think:
Which one is "the best" bass trap?
(If you use soft absorption and have the space/ money...)

Cheers
Attached Thumbnails
Studio build time lapse-chunk-b-invert-.jpg   Studio build time lapse-chunk-c-d.jpg  
Old 31st October 2017
  #9
Here for the gear
 
Leisure's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by akebrake View Post
Which one is "the best" bass trap?
I would guess A, because this enables you to place the speakers "between" the bass traps, hence also taking care of the bass frequencies that are moving towards the sides and the back of the speakers...

But maybe this is just because I've grown used to seeing it set up in this manner. Is there any consensus on this?
Old 3rd November 2017
  #10
Lives for gear
 
akebrake's Avatar
 

New tricks

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leisure View Post
I would guess A, because this enables you to place the speakers "between" the bass traps, hence also taking care of the bass frequencies that are moving towards the sides and the back of the speakers...
Sorry...My sketch was meant as a principle only.
Let's concentrate on the corner absorbers.

I am convinced that C is a better basstrap compared to A. (Double amount of abs material)
But...
It’s quite possible that the Inverted Chunk (B) will outperform the traditional one! (A). (Absorbing material spaced away from corner).

Best
Attached Thumbnails
Studio build time lapse-corners-only-jpg.jpg  

Last edited by akebrake; 3rd November 2017 at 11:45 PM..
Old 5th November 2017
  #11
Here for the gear
 
Leisure's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by akebrake View Post
It’s quite possible that the Inverted Chunk (B) will outperform the traditional one!
Thanks for that! I'm now seriously considering taking squares instead of triangles. Would this mean I could make the squares smaller than the 60x60cm? Or would this still be considered minimum?

Sorry for all the dumb questions, but at this point my head is seriously saturated with the whole project, so professional advice is very much appriciated Here's another one:

Regarding the vocalbooth: My current plan is to cover all the walls with rockwool panels, with 2 walls @ 5cm and the other twho and the ceiling with 10cm, covered in cloth. Would there be any reason to NOT cover the entire vocalbooth?
Old 7th November 2017
  #12
Lives for gear
 
JWL.GIK's Avatar
 

Most likely D would be best, followed by C, followed by B, followed by A. Bass trapping results are all about surface area (total of all traps in the room) and thickness. D wins on both counts.
Old 7th November 2017
  #13
Here for the gear
 
Leisure's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by JWL.GIK View Post
Most likely D would be best, followed by C, followed by B, followed by A. Bass trapping results are all about surface area (total of all traps in the room) and thickness. D wins on both counts.
No ****! Wow, eventhough I thought I grasped the concept, I wasn't really applying it...

Ok, so about D:
I currently have a 18cm rockwool wall directly behind the speakers. Eventhough it is covered with a 2.5cm pressed wood layer, as well as an 1.5cm dry wall layer, my presumption is that, due to the great length of the bass frequencies, it should still perform (atleast) in part as a basstrap. So let's say I create another 18cm rockwool layer, covered in cloth, on top of this dry wall (maybe leaving a little space between), would this have the same effect as D?

Or in other words, if applicable, how thick would you personally prefer the second layer to be?

Also, any thoughts you might have on the vocalbooth are also very welcome!
Attached Thumbnails
Studio build time lapse-variation_on_d.jpg  
Old 8th November 2017
  #14
Gear Addict
 
whippoorwill's Avatar
one thing you don't seem to have noticed in your replies is that they are talking about back wall absorbers and you seem to be talking about front wall.
Old 8th November 2017
  #15
Lives for gear
 
akebrake's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leisure View Post
...
I currently have a 18cm rockwool wall directly behind the speakers. Eventhough it is covered with a 2.5cm pressed wood layer, as well as an 1.5cm dry wall layer, my presumption is that, due to the great length of the bass frequencies, it should still perform (atleast) in part as a basstrap. ...
Your time laps video shows concrete bock walls and soft ceiling?
Are you saying there is an inner shell with wood/ drywall on studs? Hard dry wall ceiling? An inner shell (panel trap) will affect the low frequencies a bit, yes.
EDIT: may be not the lowest which still "feels" the concrete shell.

1. Would you mind describing your walls and ceiling of the inner room.

2. What is your plan re control room design? RFZ, Frequency response: +/- dB
Decay time? Ambience?

3. If you have access to a monitor speaker and an omni mic now is the time to check the empty rooms modal reponse.
Spkr on the floor in a rigid corner. Mic at the ceiling in the diagonally opposite corner.

It might look a bit like this REW Room Sim (without absorption) original dimensions
Attached Thumbnails
Studio build time lapse-concrete-room-sim.jpg  

Last edited by akebrake; 9th November 2017 at 03:32 PM.. Reason: Correction
Old 9th November 2017
  #16
Here for the gear
 
Leisure's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by whippoorwill View Post
one thing you don't seem to have noticed in your replies is that they are talking about back wall absorbers and you seem to be talking about front wall.
Whoops. Ok, then I would like to focus the current discussion first on the front of the room. Since I need to get the gear up as fast as possible in order to be able to work normally again, without headphones that is, I would like to get the front traps done asap. As soon the desk is set up, I will start with the vocalbooth and finish off with the back of the room. Or so is my current plan, which of course I'm willing to change, if she doesn't make sence.

@Abrake:

1: You can see the innerworks of the room in the attachment (screenshot taken from timelapse 6 at about 00:49). Both the back wall and the ceiling are 18cm rockwool. The ceiling is covered with 1.5cm press wood and 1.5 cm dry wall, the back wall is covered with 2.5cm press wood and 1.5cm dry wall. Then there is about 10cm space between teh frame and the outer 2 stone (old and crummy) brick wall.

2: Not quite sure. The room should be suitable for mixing and mastering though in the end. My current plan was to get measurements with REW in the empty room, and work my way from there up to a "as linear as possible" frequency responce and acceptable decay times.

3: I though I'd start with the measurements as soon as the laminate is in there and the walls have been papered and painted.

Here's the current state of the project:
Attached Thumbnails
Studio build time lapse-timelapse_6__00_49.jpg  
Old 10th November 2017
  #17
Lives for gear
 
akebrake's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leisure View Post
...1: You can see the innerworks of the room in the attachment (screenshot taken from timelapse 6 at about 00:49).
OK got it

Quote:
2: My current plan was to get measurements with REW in the empty room, and work my way from there up to a "as linear as possible" frequency responce and acceptable decay times.
Fine!
It's valuable to have an empty room (diagonal) REW meas. for reference.
Also a rough estimated spkr / listener set up.

Looks like the room have changed dimensions. Which are the new ones?
How do you deal with heating/ ventilation?

Best
Old 10th November 2017
  #18
Lives for gear
 
akebrake's Avatar
 

This thread might give you some ideas re treatment

Interpreting REW results of a small controlroom
Old 11th November 2017
  #19
Here for the gear
 
Leisure's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by akebrake View Post
Looks like the room have changed dimensions. Which are the new ones?
How do you deal with heating/ ventilation?
Thanks for the reply! The dimensions are still as pictured in the schematic. The GoPro tends to make objects it records appear larger than they actally are

Regarding ventilation I got 2 big parallel windows in the left wall wich can be opened if the smoke gets too dense. I hope this will suffice.

I checked out the post you posted, the treatment looks good, but unfortunetally due to previously mentioned window, and also the windows in the vocalbooth, such treatment won't be possible in my situation.

I have about 40cm from the front (listening position) wall untill I hit the vocalbooth window. I can kind of work around this (as mentioned above) by working around the window in order to achive corners of about 60x60 cm in case of triangles.

So, basically my options for the control room are:
1: triangles of 60x60cm maximum
2: squares of 40x40-80cm maximum
3: an extra wall of 40x300cm covering the entire front (listening postition) wall

Does any of these sound convincing?
Old 12th November 2017
  #20
Lives for gear
 
akebrake's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leisure View Post
Thanks for the reply! The dimensions are still as pictured in the schematic.
You're welcome! If that's the inside drywall dimensions?

Quote:
Regarding ventilation I got 2 big parallel windows in the left wall wich can be opened if the smoke gets too dense. I hope this will suffice.
Suggestion: Make provision for supply and return ventilation. (Cut holes. Silencers. Add ducts.) Or at least prepare some space... Your booth is quite small...


Quote:
I checked out the post you posted, the treatment looks good, but...
Take it only as an hint of how much treatment is really needed to get a ”decent” Waterfall response.

Quote:
2: squares of 40x40-80cm maximum
Test that for a start and may be...

Quote:
3: an extra wall of 40x300cm covering the entire front (listening postition) wall
Does any of these sound convincing?
The difficulty lies in convincing oneself that fairly small chunks of soft absorption will not be enough below 100 Hz ...

But don’t take my word for it. You’ll find out when you start measuring...

Design Modular treatment:
If you make your traps modular you can add ”real basstraps” (like VPR's )
behind the soft absorbers at a later date if needed.

EDIT: Added link about VPR (Verbund Platten Resonatoren)
https://www.gearslutz.com/board/12889354-post15.html
Best

Last edited by akebrake; 14th November 2017 at 06:46 PM..
Old 13th November 2017
  #21
Here for the gear
 
Leisure's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by akebrake View Post
You're welcome! If that's the inside drywall dimensions?
Ah sorry, no, the dimensions in the wire frame are the outer dimensions. So basically it's these measurements minus 37cm.

Quote:
Originally Posted by akebrake View Post
Suggestion: Make provision for supply and return ventilation. (Cut holes. Silencers. Add ducts.) Or at least prepare some space... Your booth is quite small...
Duly noted, I will get on that first thing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by akebrake View Post
If you make your traps modular you can add ”real basstraps” (like VPR's ) behind the soft absorbers at a later date if needed.
Ok, cool. Thanks!
Old 14th January 2018
  #22
Here for the gear
 
Leisure's Avatar
Hi Guys!

Ok, so we've made some progress with the studio, and I thought it would be cool to post an update video, since I've implemented atleast one of the changes suggested above Thanks again for that, akebrake!

After a lot of frustrating computer problems, which in the end turned out to be easily solveable by cleaning out my RAM slots, I've made some measurements with REW. I'll post them here, along with a detailed description, in the next couple of days.

In the mean time, big thanks to all of you helping me out with my questions!

Old 16th January 2018
  #23
Lives for gear
 
akebrake's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leisure View Post
Hi Guys!

Ok, so we've made some progress with the studio, and I thought it would be cool to post an update video, since I've implemented atleast one of the changes suggested above Thanks again for that, akebrake!
Nice video! Hope you'll get some air and not too much outside noise

Best
Old 17th January 2018
  #24
Here for the gear
 
Leisure's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by akebrake View Post
Nice video! Hope you'll get some air and not too much outside noise

Best
Thanks! No, it's pretty damn quiet and well ventilated in the booth now!
Old 10th February 2018
  #25
Here for the gear
 
Leisure's Avatar
So, we finally started witht the acoustic treatment of the studio! I decided to follow nms' advice, and go for the 60x60 triangles in the back. Also we installed a couple of absorber panels on the front and back wall, as well as the ceiling.

Still no REW files, but some cool measurements and results of which I'll post soon. Also, I thought another time-lapse update might be in place in order to illustrate my tale.

Topic:
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearslutz Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…
Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Forum Jump
Forum Jump