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C7.5 - Combining Lanes and Track Versions when comping!
Old 10th December 2013
  #1
Deleted #265368
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C7.5 - Combining Lanes and Track Versions when comping!

This is a compilation of my first 3, and most important, posts in a thread I started over at the Cubase Forum (link to original thread at the bottom).

C7.5 - Combining Lanes and Track Versions when comping!

POST 1
Here is one way to combine the use of Lanes and Track Versions when comping takes (I'm sure there are more).

1. Do your recording/cycle recording as you normally would for comping with Lanes.

2. Before starting comping, open the TrackVersion tab in the inspector, click Duplicate Version, not New Version.
* IMPORTANT! See under.

3. You now have two Versions, both with the last full take. Rename the two something logical (Comp1, Comp2)

4. Select one of them, do your wanted comp. Select the next, do a second comp. You can now select between two different comps.

5. For more comps, select the one closest to your next idea, Then duplicate again, rename, change bits and pieces. You have three comps to choose/flip between. Great.

* IMPORTANT!
If we choose New Version we will get an empty track ready for new recording/takes. Not what we want when combining with Lanes.

New Version (empty) is of course great when we want to record a complete different idea. But for combining with comping we should stick with the above mentioned.
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A sidenote on how to use the "traditional" PT playlist recording/editing.

1. We can of course use the Track Versions "exactly" as in PT (Playlists) and Studio One (Layers), adding New Track Version (before next take), renaming, duplicate (for a different edit).

2. We can select one Track Version, and copy a range. Then change Track Version, and paste it in there (the range selection is preserved).
This is more like the "traditional" PT way of doing Playlist editing. Great addition, but different in use than when combining it with Cubase's Lane comping.

Best of both worlds right now in IMO.

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For other ideas and workflows, please chime in. This thread can be a valuable resource for learning the new Track Version feature in Cubase 7.5.

PS. No trolling allowed. Be polite, mature and helpful in a respectful manner. Some have been working with Playlists/Layers in Pro Tools/Studio One, some have not.
We are here to learn and teach, to and from each other.

POST 2
I did a quick test on how to incorporate this into my workflow today.

The Track Versions is absolutely GREAT when tracking multiple takes of a Drum Kit (I kind of knew from PT).
The ability to Range select and copy between Track Versions makes more sense than Lanes (cluttered and harder to have control of) in the above scenario.
PS. Remember to put all drum tracks into a folder, and engage the Group Edit button.

If you have a great take except for one vers, fill etc, you can:
1. Pick out the best overall take.

2. Flip through the different Track Versions (with Ctrl + Shift + G or H) to find a "replacement" part.

3. Range select that part/bar/fill and Copy.

4. Flip back to the best overall take and paste your "replacement" part into here.

The selected Range stays the same when changing Track Version. Dead easy.

I will definitively use Track Versions for recording drums. And for "Live in the Studio" kind of recording (full band in the same room type tracking).
It "kills" for Drum recording IMO.
And it's a reason many Cubase/Nuendo users (that know Pro Tools) have asked for a "Playlists" function.

For recording one on one, with Vocalists, Bassists, Guitarists etc, I will probably still use Lanes for recording/cycle recording and comping.

POST 3
First. I haven't used the Audio Part Editor since the "new" Lanes feature showed up in Cubase 6.5.
Before that the Audio Part Editor was one of my favorite Cubase/Nuendo features.

For single track recording, or maybe double tracked guitars/bass, I most certainly will continue to use Lanes (after rec/cycle rec) to do my comping.
In this scenario Lanes shine, and IMO Cubase has the best Lanes system compared to Pro Tools and Studio One *.

*Sidenote: In PT and S1 you have to make a new Playlist/Layer before recording the next take or rounds of takes, or you will overwright your last take.
In Cubase it adds a new Lane automatically.
When doing recording sessions in PT or S1 I have forgot to add a new Playlist/Layer too many times to mentioned (frustrating to say the least).

But if you have tried to do multitrack recording of a full drum kit or full band even, you know how fast that Lanes system can get messy.
Did my cut go across all tracks, check - did my selection get across all tracks, check - etc.
You must at least have to open one of the tracks Lanes to have som sort of control. Not so....

.... Not so with the Track Version way (as long as all your drum tracks are in the same folder, with the Group Edit button engaged).
Here you can only have the normal track view (Lanes closed).

1. Make one Track Version for every take.

2. Flip/Listen through all versions (Ctrl + Shift + G/H = up and down through the Track Version List).

3. Select the best overall drum take/version.

4. Find the parts that needs "replacement", if any.

5. Listen through the remaining Track Versions for the best "replacement" part (where to copy from).

6. Select the "replacement" part with the Range Tool (this Range will be preserved when changing Track Version).

7. Copy the Range selection (Ctrl + C)

8. Change back to the best overall take/version.

9. Paste the copied "replacement" part onto the selected Track Version.

Voila.... You have made a comp using the Track Version feature.
Once you have found the parts to be replaced and the "replacement" parts (step 3 and 4), the rest will only take a few seconds.

For drum tracking, full bands (Live in the Studio), and other tracking that have many tracks that belong together, the Track Version method is way better than Lanes IMO.
Less cluttered screen, less "guesswork" (you always have to check twice when doing multitrack recording with Lanes), and much faster).
So in this scenario, I will choose Track Versions before Lanes and/or the Audio Part Editor.

Take a look at this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7rxCmxk ... aKzb5wKDdQ

PS. I will not force my way of working on someone.
This thread is all about coming up with ideas for different uses of Track Versions in addition to comping in Lanes (and/or the Audio Part Editor).

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PS. The original thread in the Cubase Forum:
www.steinberg.net • View topic - C7.5 - Combining Lanes and Track Versions when comping!

I have a couple of more ideas, but I'd like to start up with the same given in the original thread.

If you have any other ways of incorporating Track Versions to our workflow, please chime in.
The same goes for any questions you might have. Ask away.

BUT.........KEEP IT CIVIL
Old 10th December 2013
  #2
Lives for gear
 

This is great. Thanks for the tips and suggestions!
Old 10th December 2013
  #3
Gear Maniac
 

Good stuff! Thanks Bredo!
Old 10th December 2013
  #4
Deleted #265368
Guest
You can also convert between Track Versions and Lanes (both ways).

Let's say that you have recorded X nr of different Track Versions for, let's say a bass, and later want to comp between them.

Then you can of course Range Select and Copy between the different Track Versions.
You can even add an empty Track Version, then copy from the other Track Versions to put together a perfect Comp Version (with the perfect name).

But you can also convert from Track Versions to Lanes (right click the track, see menu) for comping with Lanes.

If you start out by recording and open inn Lanes, and find out that you just want to listen through the different takes (without cluttering up your screen), then you can convert the other way.
From Lanes to Track Versions (right click the track, see menu).

Please join in with ideas and/or questions.

But, keep on topic (this can be valuable) .
Old 11th December 2013
  #5
Lives for gear
 
Benmrx's Avatar
 

Yep, as a Pro Tools user (since '99) doing more and more in Cubase (do to the amazing MIDI features), the new 'track versions' is HUGE! It's actually MORE powerful than PT Playlists now IMO, because you ALSO have Lanes!

For instance, here's a common scenario I've come across doing vocals (or anything really).

In Pro Tools, doing take after take, each on it's own playlist, you finally get one that's nearly perfect...., let's say it's take 5. Now you just want to punch in a single word or two, or maybe a full bar. In Pro Tools, I would copy this 'almost perfect' take to a new Playlist, so now I have two identical takes. If take 5 was named 'Vox5', I would rename this new copy (Vox5_punch).

Now for my OCD brain it's already screwed up, because I have Playlist 1=Take 1, Playlist 2=Take 2, (actually in PT it's different, but bare with me here) etc..., except now.., playlist 6 = Take5_punch. If I had named playlist 6 = Vox6_punch for example, I might forget that it was a copy from take 5 down the road. It's definitely not a huge problem, but annoying. Especially if you get into more takes and copies afterward. OK, so that's problem 1 solved with having a lanes system..., I get to always have the 'track version' = the 'take number'. This is because with Track Versions + Lanes, I can now just punch in the bar I want on a new Lane..., we're still on Take 5.

Now, back to Pro Tools land..., and problem two. We're back on our 'Vox5_punch' track. You go to the bar where you want to punch in. You punch in..., and again.. it's 'almost perfect'. Don't want to trash it. So what do you do... you guessed it, copy this again to a new playlist.., maybe named 'Vox5_punch_punch'... or maybe a keyword from the phrase we're punching... what ever it is, it's starting to get convoluted. Again, with Lanes, I can just punch in a few versions of the same bar... all the while still working on 'Vox5'. This will hold true for anything really. Ever had a drummer punching in different versions of the same fill, but wanting the same overal track?

One thing I can say though, is that in Pro Tools, there's a key command 'copy selected area to main playlist', which is a VERY nice way to work IMO. So, if you're deep into take 42, and you've got a section you want to put in your 'comp', you don't have to scroll all the way back to the top. However, from the posts above, it DOES seem that you can use key commands in Cubase to scroll through Track Versions, which isn't possible with Pro Tools Playlists. It's a good time to be invested in Cubase IMO.
Old 11th December 2013
  #6
Deleted #265368
Guest
Yes this is HUGE. Track Versions (PT's Playlists) and Lanes combined is unique to Cubase. And more powerful.
Absolutely great.

Thanks for a great PT working style explaination.
Keep it coming, as this is all about gathering ideas on how to incorporate Track Versions into our arsenal of working methods.
In this instance, former and everyday Pro Tools users is of great value in throwing up some great (and different) styles of working.
Thanks again.

You can indeed scroll through Track Versions by using Ctrl + Shift + G/H (up/down).

Happy comping.
Old 12th December 2013
  #7
Lives for gear
 
Benmrx's Avatar
 

Here's two more handy tips for using Track Versions when comping.

I don't have 7.5 yet, but I'm 99.9% sure this will work:

Before you do ANY editing, make all your takes (the actual regions in the arrange window) a unique color. So, Take 1=Green, Take 2=Orange, etc. Now, when you do your comp, you'll get instant visual feedback as to which take each section of your comp came from. When you zoom out to the entire project it might look like a rainbow, or more often than not, it's mostly one color with a few spots here and there. This info might prove useful when working with particular clients. I've done this before and it's shocking how consistant people are.

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Here's another one, again... taken from Pro Tools, and this one comes from our lovely Kenny Gioia:

When building your comp from track versions, instead of 'copying' from the various versions and 'pasting' into your comp, do a 'cut' instead. So now..., 2 weeks later down the road when you want to build some doubles, you can go into all your takes, and you'll immediately know which sections you've already used for the main comp, and now you can just go through the sections you haven't used to build your double.

Again, this is a HUUUUGE feature addition for 7.5 IMO. Can't wait to upgrade.
Old 12th December 2013
  #8
Deleted #265368
Guest
Thanks Benrmx. Great

This is becoming the post I hoped it should be. Seems to work better here than in the Cubase forum heh

Others?
Old 27th December 2013
  #9
Deleted #265368
Guest
Consider this a bump :-).

Are there more ideas on how to incorporate out there?
Please chime in with what you got.
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