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OC 703 / Rockwool (USA / EU) Effects Pedals, Units & Accessories
Old 6th September 2006
  #1
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dubrichie's Avatar
OC 703 / Rockwool (USA / EU)

alrighty,

i am intending to build a bunch of bass traps / acoustic panels.

i live in ireland and can get Rockwool easily enough.

i am just wondering how well it performs in this application compared to the much-vaunted OC 703, ie is it worth my while to try to get some 703 instead? OC have a distributor in Belgium i could try.

so, comparable performance or not?

thanks,

regards,

richie.
Old 6th September 2006
  #2
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orange's Avatar
 

I think that rockwool RW3 is the same as OC 703. RW5 = OC705

si
Old 6th September 2006
  #3
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cramseur's Avatar
Go here and check out the specs:

http://www.bobgolds.com/AbsorptionCoefficients.htm


similar specs...similar results.
Old 6th September 2006
  #4
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Mineral Wool/Rockwool can work very well both for bass absorbers and reflection point absorbers. For bass control in 4" thick, go with something approx 6-8 lb/cu ft density. If you can go thicker, you can drop down to 3-4lb.

For reflection point duties, 2.5lb /cu ft density works very well.

The wool has a different gas flow characteristic than fiberglass but still works well.

Bryan
Old 6th September 2006
  #5
Quote:
Originally Posted by bpape View Post
Mineral Wool/Rockwool can work very well both for bass absorbers and reflection point absorbers. For bass control in 4" thick, go with something approx 6-8 lb/cu ft density. If you can go thicker, you can drop down to 3-4lb.

For reflection point duties, 2.5lb /cu ft density works very well.

The wool has a different gas flow characteristic than fiberglass but still works well.

Bryan

I am thinking about building membrane traps like these: http://www.ethanwiner.com/basstrap.html

But Ethan is using 1 inch 703, do you know if Rockwool has comparable products?
(Since I also live in Europe). Couldn't find RW3 on www.rockwool.com.
Could I use thicker Rockwool like suggested above? (I suppose bpape wrote it with another absorber design in mind).

Thanks,
Henning
Old 7th September 2006
  #6
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recky's Avatar
 

I've spent months trying to source a product similar to OC 703 in Germany. But because of national regulations and standards this has proved impossible. Both Rockwool and Isover do not publish density or absorption figures (with a couple of exceptions, albeit irrelevant for what we need), therefore i have been at a loss.

HOWEVER, there is a new kid on the block, called Basotect (by BASF). It's an open-cell melamine foam originally invented for the automotive industry and it is now finding its way into studios. Apparently, its absorption properties are very good indeed (I have no figures), similar to 703. I have ordered a few Basotect boards and will try them out.

Cheers,

Recky
Old 7th September 2006
  #7
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tamasdragon's Avatar
 

Rocksil RS45/Rockwool RWA45 - 45kg/m3 and..

Rocksil RS60/Rockwool RW3 - 60 kg/m3 are...

The rough equivelents or 703 and 705.

OC703/705 is glasswool ( glassfibre ), while rocksil and rockwool are mineral wool.

Either works great. If you specifically fancy glass fibre then a company called Isover sels in EU/UK
These are from the sos acoustic forum.
I kept this as a reference, I think in this way you can easily find the right material
Hope this helps
regards Tamas Dragon
Old 7th September 2006
  #8
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dubrichie's Avatar
great stuff!

thanks very much to everyone!

rockin the wool!

regards,

richie.
Old 7th September 2006
  #9
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shangoe's Avatar
 

take a look at this stuff: FlexCL

http://www.homatherm.com


its a cellulose slap. i used it in my new vocal booth and building absorbers right now.

i think its the best stuff to get in the moment. plus its not toxic and not outgasing formaldehyd like fiberglas and rockwool is.

it has very good specs, 70kilo mass m3.

look at "kontakt" vor irland or GB distribution....
Old 9th September 2006
  #10
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mr jkn's Avatar
I´m into buildings some traps, but find i t very difficult to find the equivalents to 703/705 in Sweden. So, I wonder if there´s any swedish (swänska) slutz who can tip me on rigid materials you dig, and compares to 703/705. Please help out - I´m in a weekend DIY mood!

..tips on other materials you dig is also appreciated.
Old 9th September 2006
  #11
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NetworkAudio's Avatar
I am having the same problem. Owens Corning does not sell here.
If you find a good place to buy dense Rockwool please let me know.

vennlig hilsen
kjetil
Old 9th September 2006
  #12
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reid's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by recky View Post
HOWEVER, there is a new kid on the block, called Basotect (by BASF). It's an open-cell melamine foam originally invented for the automotive industry and it is now finding its way into studios. Apparently, its absorption properties are very good indeed (I have no figures), similar to 703. I have ordered a few Basotect boards and will try them out.
Recky, can you pass on any details about Basotect's stats / density, etc? Also, where did you order from in Germany?

Many thanks,

reid
Old 9th September 2006
  #13
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As was posted, the 45kg material would work best to emulate the 703 for the sealed wooden membrane absorbers on Ethan's site.

Bryan
Old 10th September 2006
  #14
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dubrichie's Avatar
just wondering, how do you guys actually secure the sheet of rockwool / OC to the timber frame once you have wrapped it in fabric?

long screws through the wood and into the insulation?

and has anyone come up with a way, ingenious or otherwise, to mount these kinds of DIY panels to stands of some sort for use as gobos?

thanks,

regards,

richie.
Old 10th September 2006
  #15
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AlexLakis's Avatar
 

I just used screws. Larger threaded screws seem to work well. Also, get the biggest washers you can find.

If you built the frame the right size, you could almost get away with no screws at all. Just cram it in the frame, wrap it all up in burlap, and you're done!
Old 10th September 2006
  #16
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r0ck1r0ck2's Avatar
 

would wrapping it in AstroTurf work?

i'm thinking of a grass theme..

anybody?
Old 10th September 2006
  #17
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AlexLakis's Avatar
 

Actually, I wrapped my corner traps in that black papery stuff you put down over your garden bed. You can find it in the gardening section in True Value. Works great, and unlike the burlap, it doesn't smell!
Old 10th September 2006
  #18
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cramseur's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by recky View Post
I've spent months trying to source a product similar to OC 703 in Germany. But because of national regulations and standards this has proved impossible. Both Rockwool and Isover do not publish density or absorption figures (with a couple of exceptions, albeit irrelevant for what we need), therefore i have been at a loss.

HOWEVER, there is a new kid on the block, called Basotect (by BASF). It's an open-cell melamine foam originally invented for the automotive industry and it is now finding its way into studios. Apparently, its absorption properties are very good indeed (I have no figures), similar to 703. I have ordered a few Basotect boards and will try them out.

Cheers,

Recky

Go to this site (as I posted above) above for specs on Isover and Rockwool.

http://www.bobgolds.com/AbsorptionCoefficients.htm
Old 10th September 2006
  #19
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recky's Avatar
 

Thanks a lot, Cramseur!!!
Old 13th September 2006
  #20
Gear Guru
Rockwool EU vs OC703

I live in Ireland also. Can't get OC703. The Rockwool products work well for sound, but are very floppy and hard to work with. OC703 and 705 are I believe Semi Rigid Fibre panels. They are intended for strapping around ducts, machines etc. They hold themselves together and can be used very easily. Check out GIK bags for instance.
RW is not like that. It is floppy and even in frames needs to be contained by netting or chicken wire. Hard to do and make look good. If any one can find a proper rigid material in the EU with a source of supply, it would be a great help to many of us.
RealtTraps are worth considering.
DD
www.soundsound..ie
Old 13th September 2006
  #21
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orange's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by DanDan View Post
I live in Ireland also. Can't get OC703. The Rockwool products work well for sound, but are very floppy and hard to work with. OC703 and 705 are I believe Semi Rigid Fibre panels. They are intended for strapping around ducts, machines etc. They hold themselves together and can be used very easily. Check out GIK bags for instance.
RW is not like that. It is floppy and even in frames needs to be contained by netting or chicken wire. Hard to do and make look good. If any one can find a proper rigid material in the EU with a source of supply, it would be a great help to many of us.
you've got the wrong stuff - you can get RIGID blocks of RW3 rockwool. If you do a SEARCH for rockwool on this forum you will find links for places to buy it in the UK.
Old 13th September 2006
  #22
Gear Guru
Semi Rigid

RW3 is a Semi Rigid panel on their site. I have seen and felt them in local Hardware yards. They are floppy. I reckon you could not wrap them in fabric and hang them. They would sag and deform. OC703 and 705 are more rigid panels, almost like light boards.
Many many people have been looking for an available EU alternative. On many searches, and in phone calls to RW and other insulation makers, I have never found such a product.
DD
Old 14th September 2006
  #23
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The mineral wool I have is 8lb density. In 4" thick, it stands up and is relatively rigid. When you get down to 2", it's a little 'floppier'.

That said, if you frame it and frame it tight so it's a friction fit and have a couple cleats on the back (bottom, middle, top), it'll work fine and won't sag. When you get down to 2.5 or 4lb (more similar to OC 703 3lb density) , it's a bit tougher to work with.

Bryan
Old 15th September 2006
  #24
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dubrichie's Avatar
alrighty,

i have been sent these specs by rockwool.co.uk

Standard sizes: See table below

Thicknesses: 25*, 30, 40, 50, 60, 75 and 100mm

Types and densities
kg/m3 Size (mm)
RWA45 45 1000 × 600
RW3 60 1000 × 600
RW5 100 1000 × 600
RW6 140 1000 × 600

Other sizes and thicknesses are available to special order
*25mm is a non-standard thickness for RW6

i am trying to decide on density.

i will be treating a very small, almost square room with a 7' ceiling, all reflective surfaces everywhere.

we are hiring out this basement as our band rehearsal room and intend to record there too.

so, i hope to deaden the room severely as with a room this tight i figure the only good sound to aim for is tight, dry and dead.

to this end i was planning on going for the heavy RW6 140kg/m3 stuff for the traps i want to catch the most bass which will be mounted across corners at the ceiling/walls.

for the reflection-point traps, to be mounted flat on the walls and ceiling i had intended to use the RW3 60Kg/m3.

all traps/rockwool to be 4" / 100mm thick.

is the RW6 overkill in density or a good idea for LF control if i can afford it?

thanks all,

regards,

richie.
Old 15th September 2006
  #25
Gear Guru
RW3

Richie,
You will need framing to hold RW. RW3 is generally regarded as acoustically similar to OC703. As before, RW it is not stiff, self supporting. The is some debate as to whether 705 etc. are any better at LF. The is no real choice in treating your room, because of the size. I would take a look at the SuperChunks at www.studiotips.com (Corrected thanks Isle)

DD

Last edited by DanDan; 15th September 2006 at 07:56 PM.. Reason: Correction
Old 15th September 2006
  #26
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Isle of Weight's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by DanDan View Post
Richie,
You will need framing to hold RW. RW3 is generally regarded as acoustically similar to OC703. As before, RW it is not stiff, self supporting. The is some debate as to whether 705 etc. are any better at LF. The is no real choice in treating your room, because of the size. I would take a look at the SuperChunks at www.studotips.com

DD

DD, I think you left out an "I"

www.studiotips.com

AA
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