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Spiral Groove Studio One vs PSI A21-M
Old 12th March 2013
  #1
Spiral Groove Studio One vs PSI A21-M

I've seen people acting like both of these monitors are gifts from God. Has anyone listened to both?
Old 13th March 2013
  #2
Gear Maniac
 
Yagya's Avatar
 

I own a pair of PSI A21-M and am also really interested in this comparison!!

and I probably don't have to tell you that I really love the A21-M. but I'm so curious to know how it compares to Studio One. I actually have been daydreaming about ordering a pair from Spiral Groove just to hear it...
Old 13th March 2013
  #3
Lives for gear
Well I can only talk about the spirals....but they are the most important thing I have in the studio hands down. Desert Island...spiral grooves and a nice amp.
Old 13th March 2013
  #4
See what I mean?? lol :P
Old 13th March 2013
  #5
Gear Addict
 
Inceptic's Avatar
 

Yeah, I get the same impression too.

They don't seem to be very popular, but the few people that own them only talk wonders.

Here are some questions:
1. Since the PSI's aren't dead silent when no audio is playing, are the Spiral Grooves quiet? Or would that depend on the amp?
2. Since the Spiral Grooves are meant only for mixing and not tracking, how are the PSI's for tracking?
Old 13th March 2013
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HotFieryTech View Post
See what I mean?? lol :P
Whereabouts do you live? When spending this kind of serious cash it's worth travelling to audition if you're unable to demo pairs at your own studio. But whatever country you're in, try calling up stores or distributors and just see if they can help you out.

I wouldn't mind auditioning the Spirals to hear what they're like, all I can say as others have said, the PSI are absolutely stunning all-rounders, so dry revealing and precise, without being in any way fatiguing.
Old 14th March 2013
  #7
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arksun View Post
Whereabouts do you live? When spending this kind of serious cash it's worth travelling to audition if you're unable to demo pairs at your own studio. But whatever country you're in, try calling up stores or distributors and just see if they can help you out.

I wouldn't mind auditioning the Spirals to hear what they're like, all I can say as others have said, the PSI are absolutely stunning all-rounders, so dry revealing and precise, without being in any way fatiguing.
Well, I'm actually talking to someone from PSI right now to see if I can get a pair to demo, but in the States, nobody has even heard of PSI and there's only a couple places not around me that sell them. I tried contacting Spiral Groove, but it seems like they aren't interested in talking to you unless you've purchased their product, because they haven't responded. I think the only way you can get the Ones is through their website, but I don't think they let you demo them in your studio because the videos and their marketing dude on GS just say to buy and return and that's your demo. :/
Old 14th March 2013
  #8
Gear Nut
 
ac55's Avatar
 

I have the SGS1's. And yes I love them - really doubt they'll ever leave my studio.

I have heard the 21's and the 17's - and they are good. I heard them after I already owned the SG's. Keep in mind that the 21's are 8" drivers and not exactly the proper comparison to the SG's. the 17's are the ones to compare if you're into apples vs. oranges.

When you get to this caliber of monitors, you really need to give them a listen in your room. I had E8B's before the SG's and they were really more than my room could handle properly, yet I liked them a lot.

I bought the SGS1's on the blind and waited 3 months to get them, because Brian Lucey (grammy winning mastering engineer) has a long history on GS of referring people to great mixing monitors.

I'd say he was very instrumental in helping build the sales of Barefoots way back then - and others, because of his love and knowledge of this biz. He never got a penny from any of them for his referrals.

He came across this monitor and totally believed it to be a huge game changer for ME's. He masters with a pair of the same brand.

I don't know of any business that would let me take home their product to demo without 1st paying for it, so why should SG be any different.

You do get a 30 day no questions asked return policy with them - what's so difficult to comprehend? Buy them and love them or hate them and return them! Very simple. Pretty much what every Music store offers nowadays.

So order a pair and get closer to God! lol
Old 14th March 2013
  #9
Gear Maniac
 
Yagya's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ac55 View Post
I have the SGS1's. And yes I love them - really doubt they'll ever leave my studio.

I have heard the 21's and the 17's - and they are good. I heard them after I already owned the SG's. Keep in mind that the 21's are 8" drivers and not exactly the proper comparison to the SG's. the 17's are the ones to compare if you're into apples vs. oranges.
Very interesting, you are probably one of the very few that have actually heard both speakers. Could you please describe the difference between PSI and Spiral Groove?
Old 15th March 2013
  #10
Quote:
Originally Posted by ac55 View Post
I have the SGS1's. And yes I love them - really doubt they'll ever leave my studio.

I have heard the 21's and the 17's - and they are good. I heard them after I already owned the SG's. Keep in mind that the 21's are 8" drivers and not exactly the proper comparison to the SG's. the 17's are the ones to compare if you're into apples vs. oranges.

When you get to this caliber of monitors, you really need to give them a listen in your room. I had E8B's before the SG's and they were really more than my room could handle properly, yet I liked them a lot.

I bought the SGS1's on the blind and waited 3 months to get them, because Brian Lucey (grammy winning mastering engineer) has a long history on GS of referring people to great mixing monitors.

I'd say he was very instrumental in helping build the sales of Barefoots way back then - and others, because of his love and knowledge of this biz. He never got a penny from any of them for his referrals.

He came across this monitor and totally believed it to be a huge game changer for ME's. He masters with a pair of the same brand.

I don't know of any business that would let me take home their product to demo without 1st paying for it, so why should SG be any different.

You do get a 30 day no questions asked return policy with them - what's so difficult to comprehend? Buy them and love them or hate them and return them! Very simple. Pretty much what every Music store offers nowadays.

So order a pair and get closer to God! lol
Yeah. Problem is I don't have enough money for either of these monitors yet. But I agree with the post above mine. Can you compare the two monitors?
Old 16th March 2013
  #11
Gear Nut
 
ac55's Avatar
 

Having heard them all at different times, in different places, I'm hard-pressed to give any sort of review that would be meaningful. However, the 21's were very impressive..... the 17's I didn't spend very much time with.

It seems there are so many brands of monitors popping up lately - all claiming to be sort of the holy grail of monitor.

This, I know.... the SGS1's made an extremely significant impact in my mixing choices - just made it so much easier to feel what I should do, and know what I shouldn't.

That being said, I have also noticed a few people who had bought the SGS1's, then sell them after a while and move to something different....that won't happen here with me....... but it goes to show that "no" monitor is the right one for everybody - hence you absolutely must hear them in you room!

On a another note, because the PSI's seem to be getting their share of attention here on GS and "inquiring minds want to know" lol...... I'm arranging a "performance" of the PSI 21's and the 17's side by side with the SGS1's.

I believe I can put this together soon, and I will report my thoughts here on this thread. Mind you, it will be "my impression only", with maybe a chance that my host ( who really knows his stuff ) will chime in also - but it will not be a sales pitch for either pair, nor one that means to sway anyone one way or the other.

I am quite happy with my current choice of monitors and I only pass along my experience with the SGS1's in the hope that anyone looking for a new set of monitors gets the chance to audition these - And I must add that I have now stopped looking...my quest is over.

If I feel they are equals or one being more to my liking, I will state that, even if it's the pair I "don't" own.....or your money back! Stay tuned
Old 16th March 2013
  #12
Gear Maniac
 
Yagya's Avatar
 

that's excellent! looking forward to read about your impressions
Old 16th March 2013
  #13
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Karloff70's Avatar
 

Subscribed.
Old 17th March 2013
  #14
Gear Head
 
Camembert's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Inceptic View Post
Yeah, I get the same impression too.

They don't seem to be very popular, but the few people that own them only talk wonders.

Here are some questions:
1. Since the PSI's aren't dead silent when no audio is playing, are the Spiral Grooves quiet? Or would that depend on the amp?
2. Since the Spiral Grooves are meant only for mixing and not tracking, how are the PSI's for tracking?
1. The PSI aren't dead silent, yes , but do you really ever heard a dead silence monitor? Electronic does make noise and on the PSI it's one of the most silent monitors I know, I bought them for this reason too.
Maybe on bad stuff with a noise gate inside, which is a bad idea.
It's hardly possible to hear that noise at 50 cm inside a proper setted pro studio. If you put your ears 1 cm to the PSI the noise is very sweet, soft, musical.. the hi are spectacular on the PSI.
It has been reported that hi end monitor like opal on some version have hiss issues, not PSI!
I never heard a problem with PSI, they really test the monitor before you buy, I think they are the only one serious on this.
Old 17th March 2013
  #15
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Musician's Avatar
I have SGS1's too and now MSP7's next to them.

Actually I felt a bit uncomfortable with the SGS1's recently having had them as my only main monitors for mixing as they seem to sound VERY forgiving!

My mixes had too much 'air' at first which really irritates when being played back on KRK's, Yamaha's, PA etc. and other hifi-sounding speakers.

So I had to learn to mix on them in a much more "relaxed" mindset, so the mix doesnt sound too airy or hi-q'ed.
Now I have MSP7's to crosscheck and they mixes translate much better now.

So yes, they are superb for mastering, but for mixing you HAVE to have extra speakers at least to crosscheck, speakers which are more consumer/hifi for sure!

Take my word for it ...

PSI, dunno.
Old 17th March 2013
  #16
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Musician's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by ac55 View Post
That being said, I have also noticed a few people who had bought the SGS1's, then sell them after a while and move to something different....that won't happen here with me....... but it goes to show that "no" monitor is the right one for everybody - hence you absolutely must hear them in you room!

Read my previous comments, thats the reason I think people who bought them are selling them again later... Mixes will translate only if you know HOW to mix on them as they sound very neutral and open.
And the other thing is: only a 5 inch woofer doesnt get your bass or whole mix pumpin'.... but its tight sounding allright!

Therefore: the S1's (mixing) with the MSP7 (hifi sounding for tracking/crosschecking) is working much better for me now. And the MSP7's have a 7 inch woofer so more then enough power also for checking the lows.

But as always: you have to check what works in YOUR room !!
Old 18th March 2013
  #17
Gear Addict
 
Grasshopper11's Avatar
I just got a pair of Spiral Groove Anima in ebony that were released before they switched to bamboo and called them studio one. I'm really liking them but they are a little light on the lowend. I was thinking of adding a sub, any recommendations? Or should I just use a second pair of bigger monitors to check the extreme lowend.
Old 18th March 2013
  #18
Gear Nut
 
felixocean's Avatar
 

From what I understand, Rythmik servo subs are fantastically detailed, punchy and accurate. The F12 or F15 would be my first choice. I'm about to order the SGS1's and a pair of F12s (multisub arrangement to smooth out the bass response).
Old 19th March 2013
  #19
Gear Nut
 
ac55's Avatar
 

Quote:
I just got a pair of Spiral Groove Anima in ebony that were released before they switched to bamboo and called them studio one. I'm really liking them but they are a little light on the lowend. I was thinking of adding a sub, any recommendations? Or should I just use a second pair of bigger monitors to check the extreme lowend.
Mbrew, have they been broken in beyond the initial 150 hours? They do get better in the low end with more hours.

I have the same ebonies and they eventually got pretty darn good at telling me everything I need to know about the low end.

I have a 15" sub in line easily switched in and out with volume control at my fingertips to dial in just the right amount, but I find the bass in my mixes to translate better without using it.

I now only use it to excite a client (or myself!) a little more.

Bass traps, bass traps, bass traps - the more the merrier!
Old 19th March 2013
  #20
Gear Nut
 
felixocean's Avatar
 

ac55, have you tried multiple subwoofers? Last year, I bought materials to make 16 bass traps (2'x4'x4"), having been swayed by the "more bass traps the better" argument, but it's a pain! Really cuts down space in small rooms, too. I acoustically treated a friend's studio with just RFZ traps, diffusers on the back wall, and two flanking subwoofers in addition to the mains. With a little EQing of the subs I achieved +-0.5dB response under 100Hz. This was a TINY room - on the order of 12' wide by 6' long. The realism of jazz recordings was simply stunning... could reach out and touch the bass player, and could hear every note perfectly. That's performance I didn't even touch previously in my own room, with two giant steel VPRs and 16x 4" thick, 2'x4' bass traps all around the room in the trouble spots. In my new room that I'm currently working on, I'm definitely going to do a multi-sub setup.

After reading more in-depth into the multi-sub thing, I see why it's so much more effective in small rooms than massive amounts of bass traps at removing peaks/nulls (and preserves more of your room's space as well).

Interesting that you found your mixes translated better without subs. Hmm. What about turning them down low enough that they simply even out the frequency response without adding a ton of low end (that most speaker systems can't reproduce, causing problems with translation)?
Old 19th March 2013
  #21
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felixocean's Avatar
 

Whoops, didn't mean to hijack the thread!
Old 19th March 2013
  #22
Gear Addict
 
Grasshopper11's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by ac55 View Post
Mbrew, have they been broken in beyond the initial 150 hours? They do get better in the low end with more hours.

I have the same ebonies and they eventually got pretty darn good at telling me everything I need to know about the low end.

I have a 15" sub in line easily switched in and out with volume control at my fingertips to dial in just the right amount, but I find the bass in my mixes to translate better without using it.

I now only use it to excite a client (or myself!) a little more.

Bass traps, bass traps, bass traps - the more the merrier!
I bought them used, but I assume they were broken in beyond 150hr because the person I bought them from had them in use for over 2 years. I do need to add some more bass traps to my room, I have got a gik monster trap and some corner panels.

AC55, are you using a second pair of monitors for reference? If so what model? The SG's are unique because they kind if fall between main monitors and smaller Reference monitors. I feel the need for a second pair to check on but I'm not sure which direction I want to go.
Old 19th March 2013
  #23
Gear Addict
 
Grasshopper11's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by felixocean View Post
From what I understand, Rythmik servo subs are fantastically detailed, punchy and accurate. The F12 or F15 would be my first choice. I'm about to order the SGS1's and a pair of F12s (multisub arrangement to smooth out the bass response).
Cool, thanks for the info these look nice. Dual subs makes sense, but my room is kind of small, maybe I'll try one sub first. Might try an Adam sub8 wonder how that would work with the SG's
Old 23rd March 2013
  #24
Any news? Any shootouts?
Old 23rd March 2013
  #25
Gear Addict
 
Grasshopper11's Avatar
I ended up getting dual Adam Sub's to go with the Spiral Groove's and in my opinion they really make a great Combo. I had to mess with the positioning of subs a bit and adjust the crossover freq and volume to get them sounding right, but now I can't separate the sound of the subs from the monitors. They sound very cohesive, detailed and full range.
Old 24th March 2013
  #26
Gear Nut
 
felixocean's Avatar
 

HotFieryTech, I think there was no shootout - read that on another thread somewhere.

M.Brew, nice on the dual subs! Have you tried taking any measurements of your room response now? I've used a miniDSP to EQ dual subs a little bit with great success in the past, to make everything under 100-150Hz ruler-flat at the mix position. Used RoomEQWizard to take the measurements (has EQ export settings for miniDSP).
Old 24th March 2013
  #27
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Inceptic's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by felixocean View Post
HotFieryTech, I think there was no shootout - read that on another thread somewhere.
Wasn't that thread about the shootout that Brian Lucey was organizing back in February?

Cause on this thread, ac55 has volunteered to try and compare them against the PSI's.
Old 24th March 2013
  #28
Quote:
Originally Posted by Inceptic View Post
Wasn't that thread about the shootout that Brian Lucey was organizing back in February?

Cause on this thread, ac55 has volunteered to try and compare them against the PSI's.
Yeah that's what I meant. :P
Old 24th March 2013
  #29
Gear Guru
 
Karloff70's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by HotFieryTech View Post
Yeah that's what I meant. :P
The other thread was Pelonis 4288 v Spiral Groove. No PSI.

Still waiting with baited breath for more PSI v Spiral Groove results and impressions......
Old 24th March 2013
  #30
Gear Nut
 
felixocean's Avatar
 

Based on aesthetics alone, I'd go for the Spiral Groove monitors. PSI color/finish doesn't quite jive with me. Shallow or what? :P

Have a pair of Spiral Grooves on order, should arrive within two weeks. I can only compare them against my Focal CMS65, but I will definitely post impressions here.
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