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Starting to nail some good drum sounds in a square room
Old 16th December 2011
  #1
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Starting to nail some good drum sounds in a square room

Moved into my new house about a year ago now and after playing around with different set ups and rooms I think I am finally starting to get pretty happy with the drums.

These we're recorded in a square room. About 10x10. Maybe a touch bigger. Ceiling looks about the same height. I set up two 6x4 gobs either side of the kit and another ate the front wall. Haven't put up a cloud yet to hang over. It's not ideal but it's all I have to work with right now.

My "control room" is much larger with wood ceilings that I thought about using as the live room but it's much nicer to mix/record from than crumbing everything in the box room plus I think it would be **** to mix from.

I placed two Rode NT2A's in the hallway outside the room facing away in Omni to get a bigger room sound.

Anyway, would like to hear what you guys think. In the clip I mute the room miss every now and then so you can hear what it sounds like all dry.
Attached Files

Drums.mp3 (7.07 MB, 786 views)

Old 16th December 2011
  #2
It sounds like you've either got a very consistent drummer or sample replaced. Either way, the kit sound good but I always find mixing drums is a bit of a wasted excersize and it helps to size up the kit during mix time. I've done mixes with really nice drum sounds in the mix and when solo'd have not sounded good at all.
Old 16th December 2011
  #3
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Thanks, jordanvoth

Absolutely NO samples at all. The guy on drums is very good. Very relaxed when he plays and is always consistent. This was done all is 1 take. Straight through. No fly ins or anything.

Drums for me sound great in the mix as well. I never "go for a sound" without hearing it in the mix first. I just wanted to show people what the drums themselves sound like without anything else "hiding anything". I'll post that actual mix in a few minutes.
Old 16th December 2011
  #4
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Silent Sound's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by anemicrock View Post
The guy on drums is very good.
That can make all the difference in the world right there. I'd take a good drummer in a bad room over a bad drummer in a good room any day!
Old 16th December 2011
  #5
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Here is the full mix/master. The vocals are definitely not to everyones taste so please listen subjectively! It is what it is.
Attached Files
Old 16th December 2011
  #6
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Quote:
I'd take a good drummer in a bad room over a bad drummer in a good room any day!
Absolutely. I used to have a fantastic live room and the drums NEVER sounded this good. Wish every drummer that comes through my doors was this good. However, this past couple months I have been getting some really good ones in.

Hope it keeps up.
Old 16th December 2011
  #7
Gear Addict
 

Those toms sound awesome.
Old 16th December 2011
  #8
Gear Maniac
 
digibiu's Avatar
 

Did you mute the room/OH mics during the verse? Sounds like all of the life gets sucked out on the verses.
Old 16th December 2011
  #9
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Here's another mix of another great drummer I had in using the same room. Less room sound on this one. Hardly at all really and is a good guy.
Attached Files
Old 16th December 2011
  #10
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Quote:
Did you mute the room/OH mics during the verse? Sounds like all of the life gets sucked out on the verses.
That's me muting the room miss to show what it sounds like dry!
Old 16th December 2011
  #11
Gear Nut
 

great sounding drums. wow. awesome job!
Old 16th December 2011
  #12
Lives for gear
 

Thanks guys. Can you hear anything bad as in comb filtering problems or anything like that I should take a look at?

I gotta get a cloud up over the kit soon. If i clap my hands I can hear a strange pig type noise bouncing back at me so I suspect it's the ceiling.
Old 16th December 2011
  #13
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Here is a quick shot of the room. Apologies for bad quality. Where I am standing taking the shot is roughly where I place my room mics. In the hallway facing away from the drum room.

Wish I could set them out in from to get a more stereo spread but I just gotta work with what I have.
Attached Thumbnails
Starting to nail some good drum sounds in a square room-room.jpg  
Old 16th December 2011
  #14
Gear Maniac
 

which mics have you used on those two sets?
Old 16th December 2011
  #15
Quote:
Originally Posted by anemicrock View Post
Thanks guys. Can you hear anything bad as in comb filtering problems or anything like that I should take a look at?

I gotta get a cloud up over the kit soon. If i clap my hands I can hear a strange pig type noise bouncing back at me so I suspect it's the ceiling.
I can. The kick sounds tubby, like you've got a weird boost and cut around 125~150Hz. And their isn't much low end on the kick or toms around 80Hz. In my room, on the mains, kick drums usually move a lot of air. Yours isn't. Maybe you EQ'd it that way? While you don't want a lot of sub bass 50~100Hz, a little bit adds the umph. The standing waves might be making that range a little wacky. And while the snare doesn't sound bad, I can hear in the mid range, that the room is small. It's like the crack of the snare is centered more in the 600~750Hz range instead of the 2KHz~3KHz range. Does the snare sound different when you put it on the wood floor as opposed to the carpet? I might try to use a thinner rug and look into a diffusor overhead... and play with putting some of the gobos across the corners or play with bass traps to see if they can even out the tubbiness.

You do a great job of getting it to work though. Kudos.
Old 16th December 2011
  #16
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Thanks Etch-A-Sketch. I think what your hearing on the kick is how I eq'd it. Same with toms. What you mentioned is pretty much bang on on how I set those eq's however I didn't want a whole bunch of low end on them with them being tuned so low. Maybe I went a bit too much on the HPF. Still I liked them.

Snares I actually like to multi band compress the crap out of on just the mids. I really like how it makes it deeper and more full to my ears anyway.

I think the room sounds better with the flooring down. The carpet just sounded too dead.

The sounds that you think are whacky, are you noticing them from more of the room miss in the hallway or when I mute the rooms and you hear just the dry kit?

I just put up a cloud over the kit a minute ago. Hopefully it doesn't come crashing down. lol Should help though I'm still hearing slightly a strange ping when I clap my hands.
Old 16th December 2011
  #17
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Xander's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by anemicrock View Post
Here is the full mix/master. The vocals are definitely not to everyones taste so please listen subjectively! It is what it is.
I think you mean "objectively"!

I will listen when I get back to the studio tonight!
Old 16th December 2011
  #18
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Ha. Thanks man
Old 17th December 2011
  #19
Gear Nut
 

Your guitars are MESSED up.

Please de ess the guitars(or something at least..)
Old 17th December 2011
  #20
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Sound just fine to me and on everything I have listened to it on.
Old 18th December 2011
  #21
Gear Maniac
 

There's no pleasing some people ;-)
I think these sound fine- I hope your studio's busy cos it deserves to be.

ps I remember you doing a really great Paramore recreation on here a year or 2 ago, keep up the good work!
Old 18th December 2011
  #22
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Thank you so much axismatt. That was really nice to read. Thank you. Happy Holidays!
Old 18th December 2011
  #23
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blacklight_uk's Avatar
 

Hi anemicrock. Sounds really good to me! Much bigger than the room would suggest. I'd be really interested to hear the unprocessed sounds if you're willing to post them? Also any information as to your mic choice and placement would be fantastic. I'd be very happy if I could achieve a similar sound for some projects I have coming up.
Old 19th December 2011
  #24
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Thanks Josh, I'll try and post the raw unprocessed mix up soon of the drums.

Chain for drums was
Audix D6 - Avalon 737sp - Lynx Aurora 8 - Kick
MD421 - Tg Channel - Lynx Aurora 8 - Snare
SM57 - Focusrite OctoPre - Lynx Aurora 8 - Snr Bottom
MD421 Focusrite OctoPre - Lynx Aurora 8 - Rack
D112 Focusrite OctoPre - Lynx Aurora 8 - Floor
SE Electronics SE1A's - Manley Duel Mono Mic Pre - Lynx Aurora 8 - Overheads
Rode NT2A's - Digi 003 Pre's - Room Mics

I get plenty of Hi Hat form the rooms so there was no need to throw an additional mic on the hats.

The D6 I have set inside the kick quite deep but pointed towards the corner rather than the beater. I find I get a bit more body without the bleed this way than if I had another mic on the outside while still getting enough click from the attack.

I have been using a 421 on the snare recently as so far I have found it's best minimizing hat bleed. I also like the Heil PR-20 but went with the 421 this time.

I have tried for years now getting an awesome snare sound without processing it and for me it just never happens. Doesn't matter who is behind the kit or what room I am in or what mic I use. I really like to squash JUST the mids with a multi band compressor to make it sound nice and thick and then add a touch of hi end to give it a bit more bite.

I then just use a compressor more to control peaks. Most of the time it's doing nothing at all.

Bit of eq on the rack tom to cut some mids and boost some hi's and a hi q at about 80hz

The floor needed no eq with the D112. Much prefer it the floor than a 421.

I had the miss about 1 inch off the head pointing at the centre for more attack just over the rims.

Same with the snare mic.

Overheads I try these days to just capture the cymbals. I much prefer getting the sounds of the drums from the room mics so I had the SE1A's about 1 foot off the cymbals. 1 over the left crash and hat and the other over the ride/crash.

Nothing special really. I honestly think the room miss "make the drum sound". I tried my drums in every room that actually should work much better but having the drums in this room with the miss in the hallway works really well plus I just couldn't stand having the square room for my control room. Having 6 or 7 guys in there all day would be uncomfortable and my mixing would suffer.

Hope this helps bud!
Old 19th December 2011
  #25
Gear Maniac
 

A bit off topic, but I was looking for that paramore thread you did and I came across a recreation you did of Chelsea Smile on here.
Now please don't take this the wrong way, but that sounds so close to the original in terms of guitar tone, playing and drum sound/programming that I almost can't believe you did it..... was it a wind up and you used guitar hero files or something??!!
If not then wow, thats amazing dude, how can you say you can't play guitar!?! Would you mind sharing info of how you did the guitar and drums?
Old 19th December 2011
  #26
Gear Head
 
klogg's Avatar
 

This sound really good for my ears. Good job anemicrock.

Really nice
Old 19th December 2011
  #27
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Thank you klogg, axismatt, The BMTH thing I did was all me. The guitars we're done using a 6505 and TS9 Pedal. Guitar was a Schecter Dimanond Series with Duncan Designed Pic Ups. I also used Fender Tele for just a few of the open notes on the main riff.

The setup inn the 6505 was quite strange for this one. Lot's of low end.
Lead Pre Gain - 5
Low - 10
Mid - 4
High between 3 and 4
Post Gain - Pinch over 3
Resonance - 10
Presence - Pinch Under 4

The TS9 was used to tighten up all that low end.
Drive - Off
Tone 9 O'clock
Level - Full

Guitars went through a Bogner Uberkab using the top left 75 speaker. Dead Center and about 1 inch off the grill. I used a 421 I believe.

Drums were samples taken from my Gretsch USA Custom kit apart from the cymbals. I used my Vinnie Paul 14x8 snare tuned pretty low. I eq'd it how I do all my snares which I mention above. The reverb I found on the snare that sounded really close is the Sony Oxford Reverb.

Hope this helps
Old 19th December 2011
  #28
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I wish I could find some more cover sessions I have done in the past to post up. Stuff from Weezer to Escape The Fate etc.

It's how I learned or shall I say learning. If something I hear blows me away I just gotta figure out how it was done, not to rip another persons style but to jus simply learn so I know how to achieve different kinds of sounds when the time calls for it.
Old 19th December 2011
  #29
Gear Maniac
 

Yeah, I like to do exactly the same but I can't play guitar well enough! I'm blown away that you managed to create such a close recreation of BMTH - I've got a Uberkab and 6505 here at the studio, don't suppose you have the raw guitar DI from your version that I could steal to try reamping it do you?

By the way I run a studio in the north of England doing similar styles of bands to yours Axis Recording Studio | Facebook - if there's anything I can help you with in return for all this great info you gave me dont hesitate to ask!
Old 19th December 2011
  #30
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Ah thank you so much man. I don't have the any DI's of the guitars as i still don' have a re amp box yet. Need to get one!

I can send you the session though if you like and you can match the guitars as best you can?
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