The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
 Search This Thread  Search This Forum  Search Reviews  Search Gear Database  Search Gear for sale  Search Gearslutz Go Advanced
if higher sample rate doesnt matter then why .... Effects Pedals, Units & Accessories
Old 13th September 2011
  #181
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by narcoman View Post
Okay - now I know you're just pissing about. Chaps - he's on a wind up. Time to drop it...... No sinc function my ass - I could ****ing build you one!!!

you clearly dont know what a sinc function is

you cannot build one in hardware

you may build a crude approximation of something you call a sinc but it would not be a sinc
Old 13th September 2011
  #182
Gear Maniac
 
ArnieInTheSky's Avatar
 

Anyone know a good brand of hotdog? They don't sell J Kwinter anymore at my local grocer.
Old 13th September 2011
  #183
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_monkey View Post
No, I'm pretty sure that it's you don't understand. Maybe just that you're horrifically bad at communicating what you mean. Please tell me you're not a teacher in "real life"?!

i do understand
and i know what i dont know
which is something most others here fail at doing for themselves

i have been a professor at major universities
got very good reviews from the students

at least in class i didnt have to type answers quickly
generally could have the images ready to project
but answering questins did take time writing on a whiteboard
however talking why putting down notes helped
too bad i cant talk while i type here
it would help
Old 13th September 2011
  #184
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by apple-q View Post
Quote from their specs sheet:

384000 KHz of bandwidth from 768KHz Fs?! Have they overcome the Nyquist law or something?

How are they reproducing or even picking up an audiofrequency of 384 Mhz?! That would be 100 times more bandwith than the sample-frequency of DSD?!

Sounds like complete bull$hit to me.

Since it´s only a DAC how the flip did they record Audio with a frequency of 384 MHz?!

First they should read up a little on the difference between the prefix "kilo" and "Mega"...
yes they forgot the epsilon on the sample rate
but nyquist only fails when you lock the samples onto a sine wave of 1/2 sample rate at exactly the zero crossings.
so in real life 2x works in theory
but still fails in practice due to hardware limitations of there being no sinc functions in hardware

while i suspect typos
nyquist only said band limited
it did not say that the band had to go from 0 to N

it could go from 1000000 to 1000000 +N

but if you limited the signal to audio
you can sample it at multimegacyclespersecond and do quite well thank you
Old 13th September 2011
  #185
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArnieInTheSky View Post
Anyone know a good brand of hotdog? They don't sell J Kwinter anymore at my local grocer.
Don't eat any brand of those disgusting things!
Old 13th September 2011
  #186
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldeanalogueguy View Post
i do understand
and i know what i dont know
which is something most others here fail at doing for themselves
I don't think you do. You've been called out at least once by someone I KNOW personally (as in have hung out with, worked with, would call a friend) who knows exactly what he's talking about - he knows way more than me on this sort of stuff, if he says you're talking BS, you're talking BS.

Quote:
Originally Posted by oldeanalogueguy View Post
i have been a professor at major universities
got very good reviews from the students
You must have been more clear, and less cynical and opinionated than you ever are on here!

Quote:
Originally Posted by oldeanalogueguy View Post
at least in class i didnt have to type answers quickly
generally could have the images ready to project
but answering questins did take time writing on a whiteboard
however talking why putting down notes helped
too bad i cant talk while i type here
it would help
Shocking. Maybe type half as much then, and make it count. use some punctuation. Spell check. Most of your posts are hot air, cut them out, and make the rest relevant.
Old 13th September 2011
  #187
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by oldeanalogueguy View Post
you clearly dont know what a sinc function is
Hey everyone ...

///

On a more serious note, oldanalogueguy, do you have any old lecture prep material that you could use in this discussion? Surely it would consist of more clearly arranged arguments than your posts, and as such would be pretty useful for us as well as you right?
Old 13th September 2011
  #188
Gear Maniac
 
ArnieInTheSky's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by timlloyd View Post
Hey everyone ...

///

On a more serious note, oldanalogueguy, do you have any old lecture prep material that you could use in this discussion? Surely it would consist of more clearly arranged arguments than your posts, and as such would be pretty useful for us as well as you right?
Sorry Tim... this topic is now about Hotdogs. What are your thoughts?
Old 13th September 2011
  #189
Lives for gear
 
Old Goat's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ArnieInTheSky View Post
Sorry Tim... this topic is now about Hotdogs. What are your thoughts?
Vintage analogue hotdogs are much better than the new digital ones.
Old 13th September 2011
  #190
Moderator
 
narcoman's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by oldeanalogueguy View Post
you clearly dont know what a sinc function is

you cannot build one in hardware

you may build a crude approximation of something you call a sinc but it would not be a sinc
I'll cut you a break for that one cus you're new round here - but most know my background.....


You're being pedantic! An FIR filter is an implementation of a sinc function (limited cus of COURSE we can't go on for infinity). One can build those!!! One can build DA converters which use an implementation of a sinc function. Of COURSE we rely on making finite that which (in theory) is infinite. But - duh - that's what we do with all bandlimiting and DSP processing.


It's FAR from crude, and if you do know anything about this topic (I've a PhD in signals for satellite - involves this maths exactly - and lead researcher for the Virtuosi project sponsored by BT, GEC and BICC) you know that.

And dear chap, I can match you as lecturer as well. In maths. In Nottingham for many years before going pro in music. C'mon - it's all gone a bit arse biscuit here!!! Your well made points are becoming lost in your boot pissing!
Old 13th September 2011
  #191
Lives for gear
 
MonoBrow's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Goat View Post
Vintage analogue hotdogs are much better than the new digital ones.
I dont know if i would like a Sample of that.Would probably Interrupt my Stomach sync.

Srsl..this Topic...
Old 13th September 2011
  #192
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ArnieInTheSky View Post
Sorry Tim... this topic is now about Hotdogs. What are your thoughts?
I don't really like 'em - much prefer a nice Lancashire sausage
Old 13th September 2011
  #193
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldeanalogueguy View Post
Some have derided my observation that higher sample rates do improve quality.

So if higher sample rates do not matter then why would a vendor produce this new DAC?

Phasure NOS1 24/768 async USB :

Asynchronous USB with maximum input of 32 bit 768KHz.
Output : 24/768 max. All further sample rates supported.

So feel free to tell me why they andor I are idiots for believing that higher sample rates are better.




should this be in the new gear listing too ?
more info at
Phasure NOS1 24/768 async USB DAC
Quote:
Originally Posted by theblue1 View Post
I believe your understanding would be well served by a careful reading and absorption of the information in the explainer article on this page: Solid State Logic | Music

There's more and it would probably be well worth your time absorbing it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldeanalogueguy View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by theblue1
You've had the benefit of digital design engineers trying to explain it to you. You were pointed to a very cogent, straightforward explanation from the makers of SSL consoles and software -- who sort of have a rep for having more than half a clue what's going on. Intersample peaks are a real phenomenon of the DAC process, whatever your feelings about the logic or lack thereof behind their nomenclature.

and i irritated the heck out of my students when i said the textbook was wrong and then proved it.

logical fallacy to appeal to authority to prove something

i have shown that there is no intersample peak problem because there are no intersample peaks. and that if you do have problmes it is due to the bad d/a design or violating nyquist in the digital domain.


Somehow I don't think this is a matter of the experts all being wrong and you being right.
of course not
it is a matter of what *IS* right
and what is just internet whizdumb , urban myth, or what high school seniors know.
[material currently in red above was inserted as bold/black into the body of my quotes by oldeanalogueguy]

So, when you cite some audiophile gear company making what seem to be fabulist claims about their product, we're supposed to accept that as proof of the validity of your concerns.

But when others cite authoritative sources like the folks at Solid State Logic (who've crafted some of the most respected analog and digital designs around) or converter design legend Dan Lavry (who was designing digital data converters for medical equipment even before the effective beginning of the digital audio era), those widely respected sources are not to be trusted?

Quote:
Originally Posted by oldeanalogueguy View Post
i do understand
and i know what i dont know
which is something most others here fail at doing for themselves

i have been a professor at major universities
got very good reviews from the students

at least in class i didnt have to type answers quickly
generally could have the images ready to project
but answering questins did take time writing on a whiteboard
however talking why putting down notes helped
too bad i cant talk while i type here
it would help
And I guess we're supposed to accept your own claim that you got good reviews from students -- students of an unknown subject matter, at that, unless I missed that detail above somewhere -- as convincing evidence of your knowledge and grasp of the facts at hand here?

Talk about boundless faith in expert authority, eh?



PS... I don't know how you think multi-quote is supposed to work -- since you cited its dysfunction as an excuse for mangling quotes by others in the fashion described above -- but it most certainly does work and is how I included the quotes in this post. (Although the quote-within-quote had to be inserted by hand. And, of course, I changed the material you inserted into my quote to red for clarity's sake.)
Old 13th September 2011
  #194
Gear Maniac
 
ArnieInTheSky's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by timlloyd View Post
I don't really like 'em - much prefer a nice Lancashire sausage
You have no effin' idea what you're talking about. Saying a Sausage is better than a Hotdog is like intersample peaks oozing out of a well designed A-D convertor. Don't be ridiculous with your statements on this board. This is public domain and there are several people reading this garbage and they know. THEY KNOW! This topic is bull-schnitzel.
Old 13th September 2011
  #195
Lives for gear
 
DaveUK's Avatar
Just rubbernecking .Are the medics here yet?
Old 13th September 2011
  #196
I'm going to selll 1 million records.
Old 13th September 2011
  #197
Lives for gear
 
TurboJets's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArnieInTheSky View Post
Sorry Tim... this topic is now about Hotdogs. What are your thoughts?
A nice roasted Nathan's dog on a toasted bun smothered in chili with cheese and jalepeno's, a side of fries, and a pint of Mackeson Triple Stout.

Now you guys can hate me the rest of the day for bringing up the topic of Mackeson's XXX
Old 13th September 2011
  #198
Quote:
Originally Posted by TurboJets View Post
A nice roasted Nathan's dog on a toasted bun smothered in chili with cheese and jalepeno's, a side of fries, and a pint of Mackeson Triple Stout.

Now you guys can hate me the rest of the day for bringing up the topic of Mackeson's XXX
I've only got one word to say on this subject: chorizo.

But I think we statesiders may be talkin' a different lingo than our Britterati pals here.
Old 13th September 2011
  #199
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ArnieInTheSky View Post
You have no effin' idea what you're talking about. Saying a Sausage is better than a Hotdog is like intersample peaks oozing out of a well designed A-D convertor. Don't be ridiculous with your statements on this board. This is public domain and there are several people reading this garbage and they know. THEY KNOW! This topic is bull-schnitzel.
LMFAO!
Old 13th September 2011
  #200
Gear Maniac
 
ArnieInTheSky's Avatar
 



Now we're talking.
Old 13th September 2011
  #201
Gear Nut
 

I'm more of a Hebrew National guy - kosher you know? Best with a Newcastle or six.

Anyone up for a double-blind finger-pulling contest to better rate these brands of hotdogs?
Old 13th September 2011
  #202
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by arnieinthesky View Post


now we're talking.
lololol
Old 13th September 2011
  #203
Moderator
 
narcoman's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ArnieInTheSky View Post


Now we're talking.
you horrible horrible manheh
Old 13th September 2011
  #204
Lives for gear
 
dcollins's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldeanalogueguy View Post
yes they forgot the epsilon on the sample rate
but nyquist only fails when you lock the samples onto a sine wave of 1/2 sample rate at exactly the zero crossings.
so in real life 2x works in theory
but still fails in practice due to hardware limitations of there being no sinc functions in hardware
The sampling rate has to be greater than 2f. No real-world implementation allows anything else. Nyquist doesn't fail.

sinc is everywhere in hardware. Where do you get this idea? Does it go on to +/- infinity? No, but truncating the response is trivial.

Quote:
but if you limited the signal to audio
you can sample it at multimegacyclespersecond and do quite well thank you
The signal is always band-limited. Always. It's a basic requirement for sampled data systems, whether audio, video, MRI machines, whatever.


DC
Old 13th September 2011
  #205
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ArnieInTheSky View Post


Now we're talking.
Are you nuts??

What is wrong with you??

Crazy, crazy, crazy!!!

Someone should get you checked out!!











I mean seriously...

A White Bun??? That **** will kill you!!!!!!!

heh
Old 13th September 2011
  #206
Lives for gear
 
Old Goat's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Id Ridden View Post
Are you nuts??

What is wrong with you??

Crazy, crazy, crazy!!!

Someone should get you checked out!!











I mean seriously...

A White Bun??? That **** will kill you!!!!!!!

heh
Now that's funny...
Old 13th September 2011
  #207
Lives for gear
 
TurboJets's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Id Ridden View Post
I mean seriously...

A White Bun??? That **** will kill you!!!!!!!

heh
And it's not even toasted!

On top of which, that hot dog doesn't look pure.

Looks suspiciously like a hybrid to me.
Old 13th September 2011
  #208
Quote:
Originally Posted by Id Ridden View Post
Are you nuts??

What is wrong with you??

Crazy, crazy, crazy!!!

Someone should get you checked out!!











I mean seriously...

A White Bun??? That **** will kill you!!!!!!!

heh
heh It's all in the timing. Nice use of white space.

I will have to disagree on a minor point with my esteemed colleague Turbo, though. The cracking of the bun seems to suggest that it is is, indeed, toasted. Or stale. But serving a fresh dog with a stale bun? Unthinkable!
Old 13th September 2011
  #209
Lives for gear
 



heh
Old 13th September 2011
  #210
Lives for gear
 
duckoff's Avatar
 

Quote:
I'm going to selll 1 million records.
lol!
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearslutz Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…
Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Forum Jump
Forum Jump