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LDC for drum overs? Condenser Microphones
Old 5th September 2011
  #1
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James Lugo's Avatar
 

LDC for drum overs?

My buddy is looking to get a pair of drum overs, he loves my pair of 87s I have but not looking to spent that kind of dough. What's a good pair for rock drum overs? Maybe around $600 to $1000 a pair.

Audio-Technica? Shure?

??
Old 5th September 2011
  #2
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dandeurloo's Avatar
The advanced Audio CM-87's would fit the bill.
Old 5th September 2011
  #3
mml
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I'd say a pair of AKG 414-b ULS are the best overheads I've used for rock. They might need a little high shelf but they take the EQ very well. I tried all kinds of SDC's, ribbons, etc and once I put these up I was just "finally!" the sound I'd been looking for. Find an old used pair in good shape and they should be around a grand or a little more. Use the Pads and high pass to taste.
Old 5th September 2011
  #4
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Frost's Avatar
 

I love my um70s but that's a lot more than yer budget. I also like the 4047 for lots of things but it's high end is too much for drum oh. In your budget I would get a pair of shure ksm 32 or used ksm 44.
Old 5th September 2011
  #5
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Aisle 6's Avatar
In the right room the AT 4047 works a treat. Also the Beez Neez Elly.
Old 5th September 2011
  #6
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Slikjmuzik's Avatar
 

M179's sound awesome as overheads my friend...
Old 5th September 2011
  #7
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u87
Old 5th September 2011
  #8
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James Lugo's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by robertshaw View Post
u87
Did you read my OP? He likes my pair of 87s but can't afford 2.
Old 5th September 2011
  #9
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Convectuoso's Avatar
Yes maybe check out the Beezneez Producer series. Same capsules and everything as their more expensive products, but they source the bodies. Might be an option?
Old 5th September 2011
  #10
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Capashitor's Avatar
AT 4033. Big and wide, the presence peak in the upper highs make the cymbals feel very close and intimate.
Old 5th September 2011
  #11
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Shure KSM32. A little bit more than 1K$ though
Old 5th September 2011
  #12
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James -

speaking of "87-ish" (as in non tube, non high end sizzly, fairyl neutral sounding, etc) LDCs for OH duties on a budget, I would go for:
-the Studio Electronics 4400
-the Shure KSM32
-Dave Thomas's Advanced Audio LDCs, either the U87 type or the 414 type
-the quite amazing (& ridiculously cheap) Kel HM7U or the somewhat flatter HM3
-the made in Sweden wonderful SM6 / SM3 oddballs by Line Audio... multiple small dipahragm capsules combined into a one large capsule type performance/sound!

That said, and on an other budget, as LDC OH mikes I personally really like the older AKG 414 BTLII and their now discontinued stereo 462 B for the high end sizzle, or the stereo Neumann USM69 for a flatter & more neutral sound - or the newer Neumann TLM 170s for somewhere inbetween, a neutral but airy sound.

For anyone who's ever tried & liked a tube LDC (like the venerable AKG C12... and there ARE quite a number of really great sounding albums with that old legend on OH!) for this use, I find the M-Audio Sputnik mic to be a really good performer - apart form many of the more obvious, and often discussed, sub 1000 eur oriental made or partly oriental sourced tube clones of this or that mic.

On another note - like your honesty & approach in the whole SSL revelation, hunt, find, purchase, install and now learn-to-love & make-the-most-of.
Bravo, man!


A
F
Old 5th September 2011
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Capa****or View Post
AT 4033. Big and wide, the presence peak in the upper highs make the cymbals feel very close and intimate.

yeah for not a lot of dough...they are a great OH mic... transparent, bass roll off and pad can be very useful, particularly if its a small room... shock mount bands are pretty flimsy though and not a great design...IMO, I have a pair of 4033as and am local if you want to try them out for a session...shoot me a pm... there are a few auth dealers that sell them for under 300 a piece on ebay
Old 5th September 2011
  #14
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Slikjmuzik's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Erik Thomas View Post
yeah for not a lot of dough...they are a great OH mic... transparent, bass roll off and pad can be very useful, particularly if its a small room... shock mount bands are pretty flimsy though and not a great design...IMO, I have a pair of 4033as and am local if you want to try them out for a session...shoot me a pm... there are a few auth dealers that sell them for under 300 a piece on ebay
I've heard really good things about the Side address ATM450. Any thoughts? Also, every time I've used sm81's I've gotten really rice results as well.
Old 5th September 2011
  #15
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AT4050s
Old 5th September 2011
  #16
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Interesting low cost option

Brandon Drury's shoot out of Gefell M930 vs Karma K10 On Drum OverheadsHigh End Overheads: Are You Missing Out?

I've used the Karmas. They work just fine as OHs.
Old 5th September 2011
  #17
Another vote for the 414 B-ULS, I love that mic. I especially like that it's not overly bright, and it makes the snare and toms sound pretty monstrous in the overheads. It's a great value considering you can use it on anything.

I just heard some samples of the newer C 214 vs. the C 414 B-ULS and they can hang with the B-ULS pretty well; if a cardioid-only mic is an option I imagine they'd fit the bill well.
Old 5th September 2011
  #18
I've used AT4050 and 4047s as OHs plenty and they can be just the ticket (if fact I'm selling one of my 4047 pair at the moment...).
Old 5th September 2011
  #19
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At 4050
Old 5th September 2011
  #20
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RKrizman's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by James 'LA' Lugo View Post
My buddy is looking to get a pair of drum overs, he loves my pair of 87s I have but not looking to spent that kind of dough. What's a good pair for rock drum overs? Maybe around $600 to $1000 a pair.

Audio-Technica? Shure?

??
Has to be LDC?

-R
Old 5th September 2011
  #21
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James Lugo's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by RKrizman View Post
Has to be LDC?

-R
I think he wants something a little fuller then SDC. What do you think? What are you using?
Old 5th September 2011
  #22
A Pair of ADK Hamburgs work great for drum OHs if you want the toms to come through along with the cymbals. If you get a little more from the individual drum mics, then the slightly brighter ADK Vienna might be the better choice for cymbal capture. They're right in his price range.

Also should consider the 3 Zigma mics which have swappable capsules, so they can be either large or small-condensers. I've used those for overheads many times with great results.

3 Zigma Audio - Condenser Microphones
Old 5th September 2011
  #23
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Tom Higgins's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by James 'LA' Lugo View Post
I think he wants something a little fuller then SDC. What do you think? What are you using?
I don't mind using SDCs for OH as I get the 'body'/fullness from the close mics and LDC room.
Old 5th September 2011
  #24
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JoeyM's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by James 'LA' Lugo View Post
I think he wants something a little fuller then SDC. What do you think? What are you using?
Would that be a faux pas to get the cheap Mic Joly U87 clone mods? The graph shows it to be precisely the same frequency response to the ends, where it's very gently hyped, check the chart:

Award-winning microphone engineering from Michael Joly

On paper I'm amazed. Must try.

p.s. This suggestion is only because your friend is happy with the sound you're getting.

I still urge you and anyone to try the Rode K2 as a room/overhead mic. I like it so much I put it on a PSA1 Studio Arm and mounted that to an Atlas MS25 heavy mic stand. Wherever you move it, it will stay there for months.

Last edited by JoeyM; 5th September 2011 at 08:19 PM.. Reason: added my favorite
Old 5th September 2011
  #25
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Chris Parsons's Avatar
 

Shure KSM 32 are great OH mics for rock and very useful for other things as well.
Old 5th September 2011
  #26
Quote:
Originally Posted by Convectuoso View Post
Yes maybe check out the Beezneez Producer series. Same capsules and everything as their more expensive products, but they source the bodies. Might be an option?
I think you're thinking of their "Studio Series". the Producer Series is their more expensive line. They recently released all-new Studio series mics that no longer share names with the Producer series.
Old 5th September 2011
  #27
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RKrizman's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by James 'LA' Lugo View Post
I think he wants something a little fuller then SDC. What do you think? What are you using?
I don't record drums enough to be the expert, but I've found that the much maligned KM-184s have a low end reach and fullness they often don't get credit for. Two of those, a snare and kick mic and I'm good if the drummer is. I think there's a deal that you get less off axis coloration with SDC. (Is that true?)

Lately I've been trying Flea 49 and 47 in Glyn johns. Also in the past have found 414's to be nearly universally reliable. Think I might try my old 451s next time around.


Sorry, not very helpful.

-R
Old 5th September 2011
  #28
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SoZo's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by RKrizman View Post
I don't record drums enough to be the expert, but I've found that the much maligned KM-184s have a low end reach and fullness they often don't get credit for. Two of those, a snare and kick mic and I'm good if the drummer is. I think there's a deal that you get less off axis coloration with SDC. (Is that true?)

Lately I've been trying Flea 49 and 47 in Glyn johns. Also in the past have found 414's to be nearly universally reliable. Think I might try my old 451s next time around.


Sorry, not very helpful.

-R
I have 4033's and and KM184's, I like the KM-184's better cymbals sound much more traditional rock and not hyped to me...
Old 5th September 2011
  #29
Quote:
Originally Posted by andreaeffe View Post
James -

speaking of "87-ish" (as in non tube, non high end sizzly, fairyl neutral sounding, etc) LDCs for OH duties on a budget, I would go for:
-the Studio Electronics 4400
-the Shure KSM32
-Dave Thomas's Advanced Audio LDCs, either the U87 type or the 414 type
-the quite amazing (& ridiculously cheap) Kel HM7U or the somewhat flatter HM3
-the made in Sweden wonderful SM6 / SM3 oddballs by Line Audio... multiple small dipahragm capsules combined into a one large capsule type performance/sound!

That said, and on an other budget, as LDC OH mikes I personally really like the older AKG 414 BTLII and their now discontinued stereo 462 B for the high end sizzle, or the stereo Neumann USM69 for a flatter & more neutral sound - or the newer Neumann TLM 170s for somewhere inbetween, a neutral but airy sound.

For anyone who's ever tried & liked a tube LDC (like the venerable AKG C12... and there ARE quite a number of really great sounding albums with that old legend on OH!) for this use, I find the M-Audio Sputnik mic to be a really good performer - apart form many of the more obvious, and often discussed, sub 1000 eur oriental made or partly oriental sourced tube clones of this or that mic.

On another note - like your honesty & approach in the whole SSL revelation, hunt, find, purchase, install and now learn-to-love & make-the-most-of.
Bravo, man!


A
F
Thanks so much for suggesting the sE 4400a, if a cardioid only LDC would do, then perhaps your friend would like audition the sE 2200a? We can arrange a demo loan of either microphone and the SDC sE 4a if you guys are interested, email me anytime.

best luck in your search!

Jonathan
Old 5th September 2011
  #30
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AllAboutTone's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by BLUElightCory View Post
Another vote for the 414 B-ULS, I love that mic. I especially like that it's not overly bright, and it makes the snare and toms sound pretty monstrous in the overheads. It's a great value considering you can use it on anything.

I just heard some samples of the newer C 214 vs. the C 414 B-ULS and they can hang with the B-ULS pretty well; if a cardioid-only mic is an option I imagine they'd fit the bill well.
Are you kidding, to be honest that is one of the worse mics on market for anything, what a low blow for AKG, I would use a MXL before a C214, sorry just my 2 cents.

Right now I am torn between 414 vs TLM102
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