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Vocals only mic
Old 29th August 2002
  #1
Gear Nut
 
MickeyBee's Avatar
Vocals only mic

After reading this forum i was almost certain to go for the TLM 103
as my "vocals only mic" upgrade.
I have to buy it unheard cause music dealers aren´t that happy to let people take home and try this delicate stuff.... i can understand that.

Anyway, i got another tip on a "vocals only mic" .The AKG C 414 B-TL II. This one i can get for a testrun.

Money is an issue and they cost almost the same.

Have anyone used em both ?

If it´s of any imortance it´s going to be used on male rock/pop
vocals most of the time.
Old 29th August 2002
  #2
Moderator emeritus
 

Re: Vocals only mic

Quote:
Originally posted by MickeyBee
After reading this forum i was almost certain to go for the TLM 103
as my "vocals only mic" upgrade.
I have to buy it unheard cause music dealers aren´t that happy to let people take home and try this delicate stuff.... i can understand that.
I can't understand that - you're spending a fairly large chink of money - if they won't let you hear the mic in your room with your signal chain, you need to develop a relationship with a dealer who will let you do so. Other possibilities include renting, borrowing, or even renting some time in a studio which has both available. But in any case, any reputable audio dealer should let you try them before you buy them.

Since you're in Sweden, perhaps someone closer to you can offer suggestions. about where to go to get the service you deserve.
Old 29th August 2002
  #3
Gear Maniac
 
Stizz's Avatar
If you are definitely choosing between between the TLM 103 and the 414TLII, I would recommend the 414 - First of all, you can try it out to see if you like it! Also, it is more flexible in terms of pattern and rolloff. And personally, I prefer the sound - the 103 does have some of the Neumann quality, but its output is VERY high, and to me it just feels too much "in your face" (hows that for technical specs?
Old 29th August 2002
  #4
Jr. Gear Slut 2nd class
 
chessparov's Avatar
 

Mickey, if possible check out the Studio Projects C3 too.
It sounds excellent, and typically costs less than half of either of the
other two microphones. They have a list of dealers at
www.studioprojectsusa.com along with reviews and product information.

Good luck on your selection!
Chris
Old 29th August 2002
  #5
Gear Nut
 
MickeyBee's Avatar
Dave wrote:
>you need to develop a relationship with a dealer .....

I got i good relationship with my dealer, they even sends me
christmas-cards
The problem is that the general agent for TLM 103´s wont send any mick for tryouts. Everything in the store though i can come and get. I didnt like Rode or Octava mics enough, cant say why but it´s the same way with things that i like , cant describe it i just like what i hear.
So if i like the AKG i guess i go for it.
..oh i´ll check on the studioprojects mic too, if it´s not the same agent that keeps the TLM´s under lock and key.

Cheers.
Old 29th August 2002
  #6
Moderator emeritus
 

Quote:
Originally posted by MickeyBee
Dave wrote:
>you need to develop a relationship with a dealer .....

I got i good relationship with my dealer, they even sends me
christmas-cards
The problem is that the general agent for TLM 103´s wont send any mick for tryouts. Everything in the store though i can come and get.

Oh, I think I understand - your dealer doesn't have any 103's in stock for you to try, and the Sweden rep for Neumann will only send one if the store will buy it? That makes a little more sense, I guess. What you'd have to do is convince you dealer that someone will buy the 103 - if not you (though you'll ither buy the 104 or the 414), then someone else...

Hey, isn't Pearl a Swedish mic company? I've played with one of their large diaphram mics, and remember it as pretty cool.
Old 30th August 2002
  #7
One with big hooves
 
Jay Kahrs's Avatar
The 103 is good for vocals most of the time. Make sure you get an in-line pad with it because if a singer really opens up it'll fry just about any mic pre out there. It's kind of on the bright side IMHO and I have a love/hate relationship with mine. Though, one day I am going to get another one so I have a pair for overheads and things. It's a nice utility mic to have around. Other things to look at would be the Blue Baby Bottle, maybe a Blueberry (but those are almost too bright for me, others love 'em) and maybe some of the Audio Technica mics like the 4050 and 4060. All I had for a while was a 103 and AT4047 and I could cover lots of different voices with those and an SM57. A 414 can be cool. Even if you don't like it on vocals I'm sure you'll find something else that you do like it on. The one I have here has been in front of just about everything at one point or another but hardly ever vocals. While it hardly ever sounded really bad I was never amazed by it. YMMV.
Old 30th August 2002
  #8
Gear Maniac
 
vsl666's Avatar
 

*sob*


this is a very sad and serious post !
this poor gentelman is going to have to spend his hard earned
akkers on a mic he is going to have to love without trying it ???

there should be a law against it !
how much is a 103 ? or a 414 ?
i dont want to confuse the issue but surley
there must be a better alternative for male vocals ??
(soundelux)

ps .. chess ... never spend 500 when u can spend 1000!!(gearslut code 1423)
Old 30th August 2002
  #9
Gear Nut
 
MickeyBee's Avatar
Quote:
What you'd have to do is convince you dealer that someone will buy the 103 - if not you (though you'll ither buy the 104 or the 414), then someone else...
Yes, they often do so with behringer stuff. I think that they have to make some agreement that they can send back unsold stuff.
Otherwise they have to try and sell it..and that can be tricky with
"unusual" mid-price gear.
There is always easier to get gear to tryout if you convince them that you are going to buy at least one of em. But once i almost had to buy something i did not want.
I had problems with my former monitors, i overcompensated low end on every mix. I thought i needed bass-sub´s . Well i convinced my dealer to get me those kinda expensive subs.
I even think they had to get them from U.S. After some weeks they arrived and i took em home to testrun my new monitor-rig.
OH OH OH, i was in for a suprise.. !!
I realized bass-subs was not the way to go, in any way.
Well i had to take em back to the store and say i didn´t want them or any other kind. They had em on the shelfs for years.

..End of storytellers night and back to the vocal mic :


Quote:
Make sure you get an in-line pad with it because if a singer really opens up it'll fry just about any mic pre out there.
Learning new things every day..thats what i like about this place.
The "singers open up" is a problem i know a lot about...distrotion
in micks, pres,mixerboard..compressor ducking and digital overload.
Now im slidin off topic again but is it really a common recording tech. to adjust the pre/compressor or rec level between lets say verse and refrain ? I have not made it sound normal.
My latest own ideas is that im using too little gear in the signal chain that can handle dynamics well.

Quote:
how much is a 103 ? or a 414 ?
1000$-1200$ here in Sweden.
...IF there is a "No doubt about it" better mic just above those
numbers i can wait. But gearsluts never stops )
i have to set a limit.

..off to look at the Soundeluxe and Pearl mics.
Old 30th August 2002
  #10
Gear Maniac
 
Mats Olsson's Avatar
 

Mickey, you are getting royally screwed if you pay that much for gear in Sweden.

FWIW, I'm in Sweden too, and there are a number of places where you can get better deals AND a tryout before purchase.

Perhaps I can set you up, where in Sweden are you?


/Mats
Old 30th August 2002
  #11
Gear Nut
 
MickeyBee's Avatar
Its going to be a little local talk here
>Mats.

Im from Sundsvall , (well almost)..
Tlm 103 10,000 kronor
Akg 12.000 kronor
..mabye the akg gets a little cheaper it´s a "call for best price".
Old 30th August 2002
  #12
Gear Nut
 

If you live in sweden your always royally screwed when buying gear, dealers profit plus 25% tax on EVERYTHING!!!

While this wont make you popular with your dealer its great for your wallet. Try to borrow the mics youre interested in and try them out, then return them and buy the mic you want from germany instead. Germany = home of Neumann and AKG. plus the have only 17% tax and thank god for EU you pay tax in the country you buy the stuff.
So here are some prices form www.musicians-gear.com

AKG C414B-ULS $811= 7500kr
Neumann TLM103 $715=6600kr
add freight to that, $30=300kr for a 10kg package.

pretty good deals huh?

/mike
Old 30th August 2002
  #13
Gear Nut
 
MickeyBee's Avatar
>-=glEnn=-
Check your PM. I sent you a message regarding another topic here in Gearsluts.

Back to this topic,, kind of :
Is there a moral issue here we Swedes have to deal with ?
I know very well about the german site. But... first im very intressed in gear at my local dealer, ask everyting possible, take home and try all kinds of stuff for free.
They have started to charge the full price as deposit for "newbie" customers.
Then when i found what i like i import it from Germany.
The more high-end the more money to save.

Is it my moral that i know these guys at the music-store?
Before i bought my new monitors i wanted to try out everyting they had and then import em. They was always asking if i decided what speakers to go for when i was in to buy cabels or other small things. They even did some reseach for me and emailed me
the things i wanted to know. It would have felt kind of wrong to tell them later that ive orded just those speakers i tested and asked so much about from Germany.

"I then stumbled over a pair of different used monitors at a nice price so that wasn´t hard to tell"

Can anybody see this dilemma ? I feel like im using this fellows.
The simple answer to me would be like
- Hey do what you want with your money. )
..but the money-part is always a big issue to me...and though i have mixed emotions about importing, it´s soooo much cheaper.
Old 31st August 2002
  #14
Gear Nut
 

well thats the downside in being buddys with your dealer
keep your dealer happy and buy the cheaper stuff from them, like mic-stands, cables, SM57's etc, the stuff u wouldnt save much in importing. And import the expensive gear where there's mucho dinero to save.

/mike
Old 31st August 2002
  #15
Gear Guru
 
Drumsound's Avatar
Not to take this somewhere eles, but...don't forget to try the mic on other sources.tut
Old 31st August 2002
  #16
http://www.netzmarkt.de/thomann/thoiw5_index.html

Svensca flikurs rock!

Hay!

haydo!

Tack tack

Korve moose!

Senap!

Old 31st August 2002
  #17
Gear Nut
 
MickeyBee's Avatar
LOL Bigtime !!

Thanks for the course in swedish Jules.
You´ve got almost everyting in there to get by in Sweden.
I wont dig any deeper into why those phrases dug into your mind though

..awesome link , now im gonna compare prices ´til my eyeballs pops out.
Old 31st August 2002
  #18
Motown legend
 
Bob Olhsson's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally posted by Jules
http://www.netzmarkt.de/thomann/thoiw5_index.html

Svensca flikurs rock!

Tack tack
My Swedish vocabulary also includes "ya, "ney" and "skol."

My dad always wanted me to learn Swedish but I could never learn other languages to save my life. In the late 1960s we visited his sister in Malung. The funny part was that dad spoke such an old dialect that the people in his home town were begging him to speak English so they could understand what he was saying!
Old 1st September 2002
  #19
Lives for gear
 
Steve Smith's Avatar
 

Quote:
The "singers open up" is a problem i know a lot about...distrotion in micks
I hear Jules has alot of problem with the Irish distorting... ( I know it was a typo or lag thing, but way too punny...)
Old 2nd September 2002
  #20
Gear Nut
 
MickeyBee's Avatar
..oh thats the solution. To much drive on the vocalist. )
I see i cant even spell distortion...distrotion.

Let this be a warning to you all, see what happens if all you read are badly translated audiogear-manuals.
Old 2nd September 2002
  #21
One with big hooves
 
Jay Kahrs's Avatar
Quote:
Originally posted by MickeyBee

Learning new things every day..thats what i like about this place.
The "singers open up" is a problem i know a lot about...distrotion
in micks, pres,mixerboard..compressor ducking and digital overload. Now im slidin off topic again but is it really a common recording tech. to adjust the pre/compressor or rec level between lets say verse and refrain ? I have not made it sound normal. My latest own ideas is that im using too little gear in the signal chain that can handle dynamics well.
It's pretty common. I've done it a bunch of times. It's also pretty common to set up two different mics for a vocal. One for the chorus and one for the verse. I don't do that too often but I have done it when needed.
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