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fakery in todays music
Old 31st May 2011
  #91
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12ax7's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by los marbles View Post

Always looking for the next sound that will move mountains.
Oh, Haven't you heard?

...They come out of the sky (and they stand there)!

.
Old 31st May 2011
  #92
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cavern's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by 12ax7 View Post
...Or otherwise, why the hell would these kids be sampling these old farts' work (instead of actually playing their own damn instruments)?

.
Yeah, why is that...heh
Old 31st May 2011
  #93
Gear Maniac
 

Lady Gaga is actually quite talented as a song writer, I'm just pretty sure there was some LSD thrown in there at some point as her career started to take off because she certainly seems to have a few screws loose haha
Old 31st May 2011
  #94
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"Popular" music in this country has always had roots in the song and dance music halls of Vauldeville, and Elvis and every other big star performed an act. It's the very essence of rock and roll with the longhair and costumes. And art repeats itself over and over across genres. Jack Johnson has replaced Ricky Nelson. And the music business has always been about people hustling to make a buck doing something they love. Today it's the same actors in the same play but technology has made the stage shows more elaborate and the lip syncing more effective. I agree if you're after just listening to a performance stick with jazz and classical. Rock has always been a traveling sideshow.
Old 31st May 2011
  #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ebulb View Post
Why shouldnt you expect both though ? Norah jones being boring is because you dont like her, not because it was being played live.. You can be authentic and entertaining.
On the contrary. I love Norah Jones, but her show was boring and disappointing, it was no different than just listening to her CDs at home eventhough they were great musicians. Everyone I know who went said the same thing.

I did not like Michael Jackson at all when I went to his show but he really surprised and amazed me, he was a great showman and entertainer.
Old 31st May 2011
  #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Swami Digital View Post
Because that is what people want, and that is what sells? What you want or do not want doesn't have bearing on whether they have talent or not.
So the conclusion is that its important for artists to have talent when they get up there and mime ?

I dont think the "market" has driven artists to this point either, i think it stems from the belief that its too hard to play live, people have grown to believe you can cut corners and no one will care.. If you asked most punters though im betting they would rather belive the artists they like are real and actually playing..

This is not to mention that you loose a huge portion of the "charge" in live music when its all coming off a tape.. A backing track cannot feed of the audience at a gig and lift with the vibe. It will sit there at the same tempo without any dynamics like a zombie.. This gets worse the more things you put on it.. Also there is appeal in watching people lift to their limits of skill, like a real singer belting out big notes, and like watching sports people break a record.. All that aspect goes down the drain under the fakery model..

Ive since watched a few youtube clips and it would appear Gaga has a live mic and is singing across the tape that is layered to buggery with vocals.. So its basically miming.

Im still waiting to hear from people who dont mind things being fake whether it would be acceptible to use someone else that looks like Gaga miming the words at a gig instead of her ? given that it would still look and sound exactly the same i mean..
Old 31st May 2011
  #97
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if anyone wants to see a real LIVE performance from a pop artist and how good it can sound..

YouTube - ‪Pink - Funhouse Tour 2009 - 03 - Who Knew - 23rd Dec 09‬‏
Old 31st May 2011
  #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by takman View Post
WOW that was extremly good performance... I am dnb/dubstep dude with musical taste lightyears away from this kind of stuff but did I played the whole video,it was so good performance... but the gaga I see on tv is nothing like this but its bulletproof evidence that deep inside,hidden in countless layers of makeup,autotune and other evil things she is incredible talent
Old 31st May 2011
  #99
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I think the early videos of Gaga playing piano and singing point out the fact that it's all an act.. a very calculated, business-savvy act. She learned business from Madonna and wardrobe from Dale Bozzio.. I think all the bizarro things she says are equally calculated.

Marilyn Manson is/was another good example.. he was a fairly normal guy when it was 'the spooky kids'.. then started to take on a persona when it became 'marilyn manson and the spooky kids'. Their local shows got more and more bizarre on-stage.. and it became a spectacle that EVERYONE turned out to see. Once they got big, and it was just 'marilyn manson'.. the persona never got turned off (not publicly, at least). Same deal, different musical genre.
Old 31st May 2011
  #100
Sky
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Quote:
Originally Posted by biggator6 View Post
I think the early videos of Gaga playing piano and singing point out the fact that it's all an act.. a very calculated, business-savvy act. She learned business from Madonna and wardrobe from Dale Bozzio.. I think all the bizarro things she says are equally calculated.

Marilyn Manson is/was another good example.. he was a fairly normal guy when it was 'the spooky kids'.. then started to take on a persona when it became 'marilyn manson and the spooky kids'. Their local shows got more and more bizarre on-stage.. and it became a spectacle that EVERYONE turned out to see. Once they got big, and it was just 'marilyn manson'.. the persona never got turned off (not publicly, at least). Same deal, different musical genre.
It's always been that way. I remember booking an established regional band back in the 70s for a college gig. They were solidly progressive rock in the spirit of early Genesis, which is how I promoted them, then out of nowhere they showed up and executed an equally stunning Iggy and the Stooges.

Sky
Old 31st May 2011
  #101
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeRL View Post
not that i disagree with you on some points, mainly the one about not liking lady gaga. (altho if you take 2 minutes and search on youtube, you'll find plenty of footage of her playing in damned piano bars and KILLING it.. just cause you don't like her, doesn't mean she's not talented)

BUT at risk of being the bearer of bad news.. there were A LOT of groups playing to tracks in the 60' and 70's
And a lot of hit records with session guys playing the tracks

TH
Old 31st May 2011
  #102
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fakery in todays music

I guess the first caveman that played a flute instead of using it's own voice was considered a fraud.....
Old 31st May 2011
  #103
Lives for snowflakes
 
12ax7's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joram View Post

I guess the first caveman that played a flute instead of using it's own voice was considered a fraud.....
...Only if he claimed to be SINGING!

.
Old 31st May 2011
  #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by takman View Post
Brilliant! She is great...period! But, if she stuck to the "real jazz" music, she would be struggling to pay her rent....instead she found a way to make a lot of money from her art....some of you knock her for that...but deepo down you just hate the fact that this little girl from a small town is making millions, while the rest of us have to have a day job to continue w/our music! I say, more power to you Lady GAGA!!!!!
Old 31st May 2011
  #105
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Tom View Post
Great topic...

I'm suprised everyday that ppl eat this stuff
up with a spoon...

The Rat-race takes up all of their time,
no time to question anything----

They wanna work less,
but buy more material things...
Gotta keep up The appearence!

Here's a great article about the state of music:

The Quietus | Opinion | Black Sky Thinking | How The Music Industry Is Killing Music And Blaming The Fans


Amazing!

Best,
Tom

GREAT article ! Thanks for posting the link.

The author pretty much sums it all up in this piece. I like the part about how governments are quite happy with the current status quo, because voices of dissent are completely non-existent in the current mainstream pop culture. Anyone who can see this but not see that it is largely by design is pretty naive IMO.

What's truly sad is that the listening public will suffer the most as a result. Music has always been a way of teaching people to identify with their inner core, to "tap in" and go beyond what they have been programmed by society to be. It's supposed to transcend money, politics, etc. and connect people to something truly special. But if the system is so harsh and cruel (as it is today) then you will basically just have a huge black hole where nothing is left but the accountants posing as artists.

I personally think we are already there.

The next phase will be "holograms" of famous dead artists. I think the suits will get so greedy in the near future that they will no longer want to pay a living, breathing artist anything. And I would expect the public to be so dumbed down by that time that they will cheerfully accept the holograms without any complaints.
Old 1st June 2011
  #106
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by sage691 View Post

The next phase will be "holograms" of famous dead artists. I think the suits will get so greedy in the near future that they will no longer want to pay a living, breathing artist anything. And I would expect the public to be so dumbed down by that time that they will cheerfully accept the holograms without any complaints.
It's here already.

YouTube - ‪CV01 Hatsune Miku - World is Mine Live in HD (1080p 1920 x 1080)‬‏
Old 1st June 2011
  #107
Gear Guru
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by oceantracks View Post
And a lot of hit records with session guys playing the tracks

TH
I know for a fact that these guys did not play their own parts:


Old 1st June 2011
  #108
Prove it!
Old 1st June 2011
  #109
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loopy's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by joeq View Post
I know for a fact that these guys did not play their own parts:


Ron Dante, mostly....Barry Manilow's friend....
He was also The Cufflinks (Tracy) and several other bands I can't remember right now.

I know this is going to cause heartbreak amongst the loyal fans, but The Partridge Family didn't sing or play their own tunes either, except for Shirley and David.
Mostly "the wrecking crew"

The first clue was the mics and instruments didn't appear to be plugged in
Too cheap for cables I suppose....
Old 1st June 2011
  #110
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Making a song is no different than making a very tiny movie. You have a storyline (even music with no vocals still tells a story), a pace, a mood, a climax and an ending. Storytelling with pure audio.

A good performance? Well, that's more like watching a play.
Old 1st June 2011
  #111
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oceantracks's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by loopy View Post
Ron Dante, mostly....Barry Manilow's friend....
He was also The Cufflinks (Tracy) and several other bands I can't remember right now.

I know this is going to cause heartbreak amongst the loyal fans, but The Partridge Family didn't sing or play their own tunes either, except for Shirley and David.
Mostly "the wrecking crew"

The first clue was the mics and instruments didn't appear to be plugged in
Too cheap for cables I suppose....
Yep, good example. And the non-existent "Edison Lighthouse" of "Love Grows Where My Rosemary Goes" fame (with RICK WAKEMAN on piano!)

TH
Old 1st June 2011
  #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquid360 View Post
Making a song is no different than making a very tiny movie. You have a storyline (even music with no vocals still tells a story), a pace, a mood, a climax and an ending. Storytelling with pure audio.

A good performance? Well, that's more like watching a play.
I think that's a good analogy.

I also think that if someone spent $120 to go see a show on Broadway, they'd be pissed if it were played off a CD and everyone lip-synced the whole thing.
Old 1st June 2011
  #113
Gear Guru
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by biggator6 View Post
I think that's a good analogy.

I also think that if someone spent $120 to go see a show on Broadway, they'd be pissed if it were played off a CD and everyone lip-synced the whole thing.
you would be amazed at how much beautiful girls in skimpy costumes can alleviate that
Old 1st June 2011
  #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joeq View Post
you would be amazed at how much beautiful girls in skimpy costumes can alleviate that
Touche, Joe.. Touche.
"-)
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