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Click track or no click track Ribbon Microphones
Old 30th December 2010
  #1
Click track or no click track

THIS is what's wrong with music today. This thread scares me.

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Old 30th December 2010
  #2
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Aaron Miller's Avatar
What is wrong with the conversation?
Old 30th December 2010
  #3
Maybe I'm being overly sensitive about the situation, but when bedroom "engineers" make blanket statements about ALWAYS using a click track regardless of the situation, it makes me understand why the life is sucked out of modern music.

I'm probably being to cynical.
Old 30th December 2010
  #4
Same philosophy as mastering. It has to be loud regardless of what genre. Some of these guys think oh it needs to be locked to this grid but the truth is some styles of music lend themselves well to the freedom of not having a click. Use your ears. Same goes with mastering, not everything sounds good smashed like that.
Old 30th December 2010
  #5
RTR
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glitchfactor View Post
Maybe I'm being overly sensitive about the situation, but when bedroom "engineers" make blanket statements about ALWAYS using a click track regardless of the situation, it makes me understand why the life is sucked out of modern music.

I'm probably being to cynical.
ya I think you are, I don't think it has ANYTHING to do with a click track and everything to do with bedroom producers AND pro's smashing the life out of everything! Nothing wrong with everything being on time..hell every band I know looks for a drummer that can hold as close to perfect time as possible! It's the overuse of GEAR and loudness that is sucking the life out of music!
Old 30th December 2010
  #6
Personally, I never use a click. I tap my foot to keep time and that works fine for me. I find that for the style of music I play click tracks are more of a hindrance than a help.

However, I don't think that click tracks are necessarily the cause of lifeless grooves. The problem is that too many people think that to be 'in time' you have to be exactly on the beat which often ends up with things sounding mechanical and predictable.

It takes a certain amount of musical intelligence to play to a click and still retain the nuances of rhythm that help bring a song to life.
Old 30th December 2010
  #7
I don't have a problem with click tracks at all. I use them all the time. What i do have a problem with is the word ALWAYS. You shouldn't always do anything.....be it click, autotune, eq, compression, whatever.
Old 30th December 2010
  #8
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Aaron Miller's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by glitchfactor View Post
Maybe I'm being overly sensitive about the situation, but when bedroom "engineers" make blanket statements about ALWAYS using a click track regardless of the situation, it makes me understand why the life is sucked out of modern music.

I'm probably being to cynical.
It's all good. I just didn't see any consensus in the conversation you posted and my only take away was that it really depends, which of course we all know anyway.

A click track is just a tool that may be helpful or may be abused. Either way, I don't blame its existence for any of modern musics' alledged faults.
Old 30th December 2010
  #9
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I don't think I've ever had a session so far where I've used a click track.

Groove is all about the imperfections.
Old 30th December 2010
  #10
Quote:
Originally Posted by jampottt View Post
I don't think I've ever had a session so far where I've used a click track.

Groove is all about the imperfections.
No it's not, great players play in time, and groove like M#therf$ckers. That's a ridiculous statement
Old 30th December 2010
  #11
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Click track or no click track

As per one of my favorite musical quotes via Victor Wooten, "You can't hold no groove if you ain't got no pocket."

I sometimes edit the $#^* out of things for a living and there are some cool things you can do with a "grid" but by far most of the best music I have recorded (and most of my favorite music to listen to that I haven't recorded) has been made without a click track.
Old 30th December 2010
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Musiclab View Post
That's a ridiculous statement
I thought I'd been genre specific, seems I missed that out.

in rock n roll.

My bad.

Listen to Bonzo, Keith Moon etc.. etc.. etc.. So much groove, so many imperfections.

However, Steve Gadd during the Steely Dan sessions, so much groove and click track I assume.

There are limits though. Sometimes it just sucks the life out of things, such as modern day grid music.
Old 30th December 2010
  #13
Gear Maniac
Music without click track is always more interesting...but if you're going for that modern, clinical radio sound ...you should use a click.

FWIW, I played almost all the instruments on my last record (Todd Hunter | Star | CD Baby - vocals and rhythm guitar first, then more vocals/bass/keys etc. next, then drums LAST. Rarely used clicks. Very vibey results!
Old 31st December 2010
  #14
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Using a click track does NOT mean that everything is locked to the grid... it's just a reference, folks.

If you use a click - and then go in and edit everything and quantize it.. now that's a different conversation. THAT is what is sucking the life out of music today (among other things).. people have been recording with a metronome for YEARS.

You can groove with a click.. try just doing whole notes.. or even every other '1'.. it gives you a lot of room to push and pull, but a reference to know if you're drifting too far.
Old 31st December 2010
  #15
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Clayphish's Avatar
 

I totally agree with the op. The moment you begin putting rigid limits on the things you do, the moment you begin closing yourself off from being musical.
Old 31st December 2010
  #16
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py75's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by biggator6 View Post
Using a click track does NOT mean that everything is locked to the grid... it's just a reference, folks.

If you use a click - and then go in and edit everything and quantize it.. now that's a different conversation. THAT is what is sucking the life out of music today (among other things).. people have been recording with a metronome for YEARS.
I agree with this.
Most of the time if you use a click as reference it's only to keep a basic tempo for the first tracks. It's not just to stay in Grid for Copy/Cut/paste/Repeat etc.....
A click track is very usefull in soundtrack session too.
How many here use the visual click from DP ? I mean in the quicktime window (PT13 Update ??).

Cheers
PY

PY
Old 31st December 2010
  #17
I used to try to record with a click as much as possible. Not anymore.
I track a full band to a click only if the drummer is experienced enough(practices with one). Otherwise why give them something else to worry about.
I've found myself trying to "fix in the mix" what was not broken before the click.

Yes I've recorded drummers that run circles around a click with groove and feeling.
Old 31st December 2010
  #18
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bash's Avatar
 

As was stated above, no one locks to a click and if they do they're not clear on the concept. I groove better to a click because it provides something to push and pull against. And FWIW, in addition to the obvious benefits in tightening up a band and facilitating recording/edits, listeners/dancers don't always have the best internal tempo clocks themselves and benefit from a predictable pulse, imo. Easier to find the groove. As a player and a self-embarrassing dancer I prefer a predictable beat. Obviously this is referring to simple dance/pop music, not jazz or some other free form style.
Old 31st December 2010
  #19
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+1000 Never always anything

There's an odd paradox in that the only players who can really groove well with a click are the ones who don't need one to play in time.

If it's a matter of weird push-pull within the barlines (often in piano or guitar ostinatos), I'll have the artist practice the part at a slower tempo with a 1/4 note or even 1/8 note click just to hear what's going on, and usually they can self-correct once they hear what's up & practice it a little.

If it's a matter of slowdown/speedup over the course of the song (especially near the end of a long tracking day) sometimes a click is just the right thing to bring everyone together. Not always.

If the chorus is speeding up, then maybe the chorus just wants to speed up, ya know? I'm all for letting a track breathe.

addendum: if i'm the one playing i love the click. sometimes i'm playing way behind the beat & sometimes i'm right on top of it, depends on the feel of the track and that can throw some drummers off. man, i love that feeling of stretching the time out a little bit and the drums just keep dropping right on time. nothing better.
Old 31st December 2010
  #20
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Unclenny's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by bash View Post
I groove better to a click because it provides something to push and pull against.
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