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SDC for Vocals? Condenser Microphones
Old 24th December 2010
  #1
Gear Head
 

SDC for Vocals?

Anybody ever used a SDC for vocals and liked it? Just wondering, I've never tried it and wondering if maybe there would be a certain type of voice to use my KM184 for vocals?
Old 24th December 2010
  #2
Lives for gear
 
Lance Lawson's Avatar
 

I've used Rode NT3 for vocals especially when recording on location. The NT3 is not exactly a SDC but more like a MDC. It's actually 3/4" as opposed to the true small 1/2" or true large 1". It has a lot of body and proximity effect as well as a nice high end.
Old 24th December 2010
  #3
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lance Lawson View Post
I've used Rode NT3 for vocals especially when recording on location. The NT3 is not exactly a SDC but more like a MDC. It's actually 3/4" as opposed to the true small 1/2" or true large 1". It has a lot of body and proximity effect as well as a nice high end.
funny you mentioned nt3. i used the m3 on female vocals as a scratch track last year and we ended up using it in the final mix.

the thing about mics is that if they work then why not.
Old 24th December 2010
  #4
Jr. Gear Slut 2nd class
 
chessparov's Avatar
 

+1 on the Rode M3. It's one of the best microphones tried for my voice.

Also the AT 3527 omni BTW.

Chris
Old 24th December 2010
  #5
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Daedalus77's Avatar
Rarely. But it can work. I had a singer-songwriter tracking this fall. We tracked his acoustic with a single Mercenary KM69, and after the take, he asked if he could quickly do a scratch vocal by simply pointing the mic up towards his face (he was sitting down to do the acoustic track). The vocal sounded so good, we used it in the final mix. (Disclaimer: This was a pretty stripped-down arrangement—just acoustic, mandolin, and vocals. The BGVs were done later with a UM930.)
Old 24th December 2010
  #6
AB3
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In the early 80s, I used a Neuman KM83 omni on vocals to tape and it sounded great. Of course, it helps if the singer is great!
Old 24th December 2010
  #7
Gear Guru
 
u b k's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by OzarkRoots View Post
Anybody ever used a SDC for vocals and liked it?

Absolutely and unequivocally yes.

That said, my experience with the km184 is that is it *extremely* bright when used as a close-mic; that huge presence peak was designed to compensate for the hf loss you get when mic'ing something at a distance in a large hall, which was what the km184 was built to do and it sounds balanced in that application.

But on vocals up close there's a better than good chance it'll be screechy. If so, don't rule out all sdc's as a result, most sdc's are considerably more flat in their response.


Gregory Scott - ubk
Old 24th December 2010
  #8
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Salty James's Avatar
Love the NT3 too! I think it is great for male vox that aren't too bright.
Old 24th December 2010
  #9
Gear Maniac
 
tobias schuch's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Daedalus77 View Post
Rarely. But it can work. I had a singer-songwriter tracking this fall. We tracked his acoustic with a single Mercenary KM69, and after the take, he asked if he could quickly do a scratch vocal by simply pointing the mic up towards his face (he was sitting down to do the acoustic track). The vocal sounded so good, we used it in the final mix. (Disclaimer: This was a pretty stripped-down arrangement—just acoustic, mandolin, and vocals. The BGVs were done later with a UM930.)
That seems to be a good position for sdc's. Whoever the engineer was on the newest Black Keys album used a km194 pointed at Dan's forehead. He said it sounded bigger and fatter than the u47 they also had on hand.
Old 24th December 2010
  #10
Gear Addict
 
Buss-me's Avatar
 

I used an SM81 once on a female singer, and it worked quite nice. Positioning was REEEALLY touchy though. It had a HUGE proximity effect. This was over 10yrs ago....I'd be curious to try it again today
Old 24th December 2010
  #11
Gear Addict
 

Just read this on the "Little Blondie" thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Caroboe View Post
These beautiful mics live up to their Gearslutz lovefest-like reputation.
I received 2 wooden blondies yesterday. I bought these as drum OHs but think I might need one for my studio vocals now! I've been using a Neumann TLM-103 for the past 6 years, the little blondies capture a more natural sounding spectrum, which is much more flattering to my voice. I'm still in shock. Absolute craziness for the price I tell ya!
By the way, these are omni so they don't really have proximity effect issues (if I'm correct). I haven't tried them on vocals yet, but will most likely do so this weekend.

Last edited by hossman777; 24th December 2010 at 04:12 PM.. Reason: Additional info
Old 24th December 2010
  #12
Lives for gear
Some early Madonna was a 451, high, pointed down at her forehead.

The song Holiday was done this way. I think they had the old 451 pop filter on it, not sure.
Old 24th December 2010
  #13
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evangelista's Avatar
 

with one lady vocalist I've worked with, having tried multiple mics (including multi-thousand $$$ ones) we settled on the $50 MXL 603s. That mic just killed it.
Old 24th December 2010
  #14
Jai guru deva om
 
warhead's Avatar
 

A KM84 or Oktava MK-012 can work very well, actually.

War
Old 24th December 2010
  #15
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audiogeek's Avatar
 

Theoretically speaking, the smaller diaphragm size has a smaller mass, and thus responds to SPL fluctuations faster and more readily than a large diaphragm. This translates to a more detailed transient response and high frequency articulation.

What does this mean to us? All things being equal, a SDC would be less pleasant to the ears than a LDC when recording vocals.

In application... anything goes, and you won't know until you try.

Post your results!
Old 24th December 2010
  #16
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JonesH's Avatar
SDC for Vocals?

I've used both DPA 4006, 4015 and 4011 for vocals. Sometimes it's lots of fun, great detail and everything.
Old 24th December 2010
  #17
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matucha's Avatar
km76 works quite well if I want bright vocs... and it works well as a voiceover mic ime.
Old 24th December 2010
  #18
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petsematary's Avatar
 

I used a Röde NT3 for at least a year, for spoken word stuff. I loved that mic, very well built and sounded great, especially if tilted slightly to the side, I found that lessened the sibilance a bit for some reason.
Old 24th December 2010
  #19
Gear Guru
 

I have an old Sony ECM22-p that works great on some singers.
Old 24th December 2010
  #20
Gear Addict
 

There was a thread on here somewhere where a very seasoned pro noted that many of the recordings done in the 50s/60s where people thought U47s were used were actually Schoeps mics.
Old 24th December 2010
  #21
Here for the gear
 

SDC for Vocals

Your KM184 should work fine for vocals if you place it at it's intended 1 meter distance in a dead room.... Directional SDC's in general have their proximity effect optimized for flat response at a greater distance than typical LDC's...

I would more likely choose an omni such at the KM183 for vocals... no proximity but plenty of bass response so you can do what you want in eq later... It has a little high end boost because it is intended to be used at a greater distance... a little eq can remove it if needed.
Old 24th December 2010
  #22
Motown legend
 
Bob Olhsson's Avatar
 

Between 1967 and 1972 virtually all of Motown's vocal recordings were done using Neumann KM-86s and prior to that a fair percentage were done using a Neumann SM-2 which was a stereo version of a KM-56. All of this was in a studio having several U47s and a forest of U67s. Patsy Cline and Brenda Lee both sang their first hits into a Schoeps in another studio full of U-47s.

Today I'd take a KM-84/86 over anything short of a U-67.
Old 25th December 2010
  #23
Gear Guru
 
monkeyxx's Avatar
I was kind of shocked how good a KSM141 sounded on my voice when I tried it. If you have one around give it a shot. I've heard good things about the AT4051 on voice, too, haven't tried it yet. I was kind of planning on trying a pair for background vocals, maybe with an STO-2 thrown in the mix
Old 25th December 2010
  #24
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There's a thread here on GS that talks about a KM184 being used for vocals on the last Black Keys record.
Old 25th December 2010
  #25
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loujudson's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeq View Post
I have an old Sony ECM22-p that works great on some singers.
HAH! This is funny, and true. In 1971 I was working six nights a week in a funky local rock club, and the PA was two Shure M-67s and a pair of Altec A7 speakers. Normal gear for the day! But not great sounding with 58s. I got four ECM-22s and used them for vocals and things like organ Leslie tops and overheads... EVERYONE noticed the difference, even the deaf club manager. I got great points for my choice - nothing else they were willing to invest any cash in.

I was off on the road for a year and when I got back I found them all crushed and bent in the junk box. I stopped doing rock for ten years I was so disappointed...

L
Old 25th December 2010
  #26
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bcgood's Avatar
 

Yes, SDCs can be great for vocals. I used a stereo matched pair of Miktek C5s the other day with the Langeven Vocal Combo.

The Miktek C5 is a great mic. Totally under the radar right now. With a stereo matched pair I think they sound great on acoustic guitar. I also tried one with the windscreen and a pop filter for my voice.

Here's a little song that I came up with and recorded in a day with the aforementioned chain.
Attached Files

Dreams.mp3 (7.08 MB, 1557 views)

Old 25th December 2010
  #27
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by houndog328 View Post
There's a thread here on GS that talks about a KM184 being used for vocals on the last Black Keys record.
Yep. It was placed up a bit and pointing down at dude's forehead.
Old 25th December 2010
  #28
Lives for gear
 
lord_bunny's Avatar
 

recording classical vocalists.... i was an assistant at a session with pre-baroque instruments and a vocalist. it was a 184, up and away from the singer, at least three feet away.

genre appropriate in that situation.

a friend of mine loves showing me his songs and making me guess which song was c1000 or mxr tube or something he borrowed from me.

humbling stuff.
Old 25th December 2010
  #29
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loujudson's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by lord_bunny View Post
recording classical vocalists.... i was an assistant at a session with pre-baroque instruments and a vocalist. it was a 184, up and away from the singer, at least three feet away.

genre appropriate in that situation.

a friend of mine loves showing me his songs and making me guess which song was c1000 or mxr tube or something he borrowed from me.

humbling stuff.
That is totally appropriate for KM-184. Doen it that way myself a few times.

C-1k on vocals? Jeez, spare me. Only person I know who liked C1k was a banjo player. I sneaked in an NT3 and he loved the sound, never knew. NTs is better than cardboard-sounding C1k...
Old 25th December 2010
  #30
Jr. Gear Slut 2nd class
 
chessparov's Avatar
 

FWIW the Rode M3 is relatively "darker" in tone than the NT3, so the M3 works well on a bright voice like mine. (same for AT 3527)

IIRC read that some of Roy Orbison's hits, at Monument, were done on a SDC.

Chris
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