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"Apprenticeship" compared to "Recording School"? Recorders, Players & Tape Machines
Old 30th August 2002
  #31
Jr. Gear Slut 2nd class
 
chessparov's Avatar
 

Case closed! (on munchies anyway)

Chris
Old 18th October 2006
  #32
Lives for gear
 
AshleySmith06's Avatar
 

Does anyone know of any apprenticeships available in the UK as a sound engineer?

I'm desparaetly trying to get a job at a studio anywhere. I've sent off numerous CV's etc... Yet no-one is willing to give me a try.

Any advice guys/gals?

Cheers

Ash

Old 18th October 2006
  #33
Lives for gear
 
numrologst's Avatar
i'm a young guy (23) and I own my own studio... If you ever want to make decent money doing it...in my opinion, you have to do it yourself.

I know guys that are twice my age, that are still working in good studios but only making $20 an hour. And they paid their dues, that I can't even imagine.

I guess i got lucy and have continued to be lucky so far.

I started recording on a casette recorder when i was young(er). Then i started hanging with a guy that had a small project studio... he helped me build up my chops. Then I started doing my own little project studios, **** sounding demos but i made some cash my first couple of years in college. I kept building my chops recording anything I could.

I finally met back up with an old buddy from high school who had an up and coming band. I joined up and that opened alot of doors for me. I finally met this dude that lived in the back house of this big 3 acre estate. This uninhabited estate happened to have a pretty decent studio in it. It was built by the dudes god parents, who were doctors, and had no idea how to run the damn thing. So it sat vacant for 2 years before I came along. My buddy had the keys, so we started doing some recording. This particular studio had some cool gear in it, nothing too fancy but and hd3, control 24, some good mics and pres.

So we started doing some recordings, and to our astonishment everything sounded so awesome... We could actually start building up real chops with real gear... So we kept recording stuff, and started to get really good at it. So at this point I decided hey we could make some good money doing this.

So I made a proposition to the owner to do everything the right way. I brought clients in and split the studio time 50/50... This was a good deal for me at the time, I was a college kid making $30 an hour.

Then some ********* came in to micro manage the studio. We started to make money and they got greedy. So they sent in this asshole to "streamline" the studio. Totally ****ed my workflow, so i put up with it for 6 months, then i quit before i graduated college. The studio closed 3 months later.

But after getting some experience, I decided that this is what i want to dedicate my life to... I had been saving up money from band shows, and we toured that summer so we could make some money. I took my saved money and borrowed some cash from my family and got the gear and the facility.

By band started getting bigger, and i kept getting better. My band helped me to draw in tons of clients. At this point I don;t have to fish for clients anymore and the studio stays booked when I want it to.

I got lucky, but it seems thats what you have to do these days to get anywhere is any business

sorry for my abbreviated auto biography, it's relevant though
Old 12th December 2007
  #34
All the people who were young when this thread started are old men now.
Old 13th December 2007
  #35
Gear Maniac
 

I did an apprenticeship before I enrolled at Metalworks Institute and my school experience is definitely more informative about learning about the entertainment business and learning the gear. In my internship I learned mostly how to clean toilets, answer phones, and make coffee. But I did it thinking that it was the only way to get a job in a studio. Now I think that school can help you get assistant engineer jobs more frequently.
Old 14th February 2008
  #36
Lives for gear
 

what's mm's diary?

What's MMs diary?

Quote:
Originally Posted by chessparov View Post
The gearslutz bug has bitten me so I'd like to actually be PAID for
my addiction for knob twisting.

Seriously, I'm considering entering Recording Connection's program, and would appreciate any insights, comments, whatever, regarding apprenticeships or schools, etc.
Their website is www.recordingconnection.com

Thanks in advance for any responses,
Chris

P.S. This is even after reading MM's "diary"!
Old 14th February 2008
  #37
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkEcho View Post
What's MMs diary?
The Mixerman Diaries: The Daily Adventures Of Mixerman | Welcome
A modern day literary classic.

As is the Slippermans distorted Guitars from hell.

The original poster hasn't been on for a couple of years, I wonder if he got a proper job?
Old 14th February 2008
  #38
Lives for gear
 
Kadden Heart's Avatar
 

being a full sail grad when i graduated this is what i did:

walked into the top notches in LA, slapped my business card down on the studio managers desk. (kadden heart, audio engineer/producer) told him i was trained a little bit on neves and SSLs, etc...
told him i ran a few sessions of my own.
i sat donw in the chair, lit up a cigarette, further explained that my training at FS made me a better engineer than him.
demanded he pay me at least $35/HR whatever hours i wanted to work,....and of course i get first crack at any incoming gigs.
then i saw the picture of his daughter on his desk, told him i'd hit it,....asked for her number....etc...

he signed over the lease ot the building to me and paid me $35,000 just for blessing him with my prescence.
that night i hooked up with his daughter, and got calls form all the major labels.
i took over CLA life. and now i'm a multi billionaire.

,.....

just so everyone knows... this was a crack against the expectations of a lot of the FS grads. lol
dont crucify me.
Old 14th February 2008
  #39
Lives for gear
 
Infernal Device's Avatar
 

I know much of "Recording Connection".

They used to send me students.

My advice? Take that money, buy a pair of 1073's, show up with them at a studio and say "I want to learn how to make records with these, put them in your rack."

They will hold the door open for you.

If you hate the job, sell them and you lost nothing.

Just my advice.
Old 14th February 2008
  #40
20+ years ago I almost signed up for engineering classes in NYC. After weighing the options, I payed a local engineer to teach me the fundamentals of recording. From there, I went on to intern at a great studio, and within 5 months was a paid assistant, and then full time in-house engineer for 6 years before going freelance. It was the best 1K I have ever spent in my life. The return on my investment has been great.

From experience of taking on interns from local schools, the students are barley able to properly wrap a guitar cable when they walk through the door. They know 5% of what their bio reads. They are basically useless. 75% of them are not willing to do any dirty work...like I had to. They want to immediately get a salary, because they just spent 15k on school. And, 90% of them are Rap Producers....hahahaha.

I think Puffy aka. P-Diddy should open up a recording / producers school. What a reality show that would be!
Old 14th February 2008
  #41
Old thread revived...

Not that anybody these days wants to hear that there are no shortcuts, but you should have both. Theory without application, and application without theory are equally deficient. Young engineers who have taken only one of these steps usually have big holes in their knowledge base. There's no substitute for experience, but the experience is so much more valuable when built upon a solid technical foundation. Learn the language, so-to-speak, so you can understand and appreciate what you see in an apprenticeship, good and bad. You can't buy skill at guitar mart.

Also, it's as unreasonable for a fresh recording school graduate to expect to be running sessions as it is for an employer to expect them to be able to. School just gets you ready to absorb the real knowledge through experience.
Old 16th February 2008
  #42
Lives for gear
 

Excellent post... a lot of truth there.

I am very much in this position right now. I have the drive to become a great audio engineer, but lack direction.. I dont know if I should find a local studio and attempt to volunteer to assist and learn, if I should get a degree in electrical engineering so that I can be an asset to a studio, thus allowing me to get into a nicer studio and go from there, or to go to school.

I think I should go to school and get that over with so I have a rough foundation and can be more comfortable with all of the expensive gear. that way when I jump in to assist, I can, like you said, have a foundation to build on..

I shouldnt expect to be a first engineer right out of class, so I need to do what I can to find a good, fast, program.
Old 16th February 2008
  #43
Quote:
Originally Posted by joelpatterson View Post
All the people who were young when this thread started are old men now.
omg joel - you're hilarious. as always.

or at least you WERE............wayyyyyy back then in your youth ...(in december).

.
Old 16th February 2008
  #44
Quote:
Originally Posted by Infernal Device View Post
I know much of "Recording Connection".

They used to send me students.

My advice? Take that money, buy a pair of 1073's, show up with them at a studio and say "I want to learn how to make records with these, put them in your rack."

They will hold the door open for you.

If you hate the job, sell them and you lost nothing.

Just my advice.
.summa the better advice here.


and just to add - don't spend your WHOLE goddam life arriving at the conclusion

that you need to sell them. because then you MIGHT have lost A LOT.

.
Old 16th February 2008
  #45
Lives for gear
 
tonymission's Avatar
 

Everytime I get called (im kind of a freelance engineer, im not trying to work fulltime) to a studio for the first time, there's usually *someone* there that asks me if I graduated from Full Sail (since it's so close) and almost looks at me as if I have to justify why Im sitting behind the boards.

I just tell them I was lucky enough to "apprentice" under Photek in LA and since they usually dont know who that is, they shutup because I say it like they should know hah. then "if you're unhappy with the mix, we'll either fix it or ill work for free". then everyone eases up.

Id say more guys in this city are educated on the topic versus coming up the way I did but man, if you can get in somewhere that's worth a namedrop, you can take that a long ways. like or leave it, until everyone knows you, being good at the politics game will really help you get opportunities. the whole who you know thing ... but once you know them, make sure they like you, that you keep it real and that you follow through on everything you say.

vibe, likability ... make sure you're making friends out there.
Old 17th April 2009
  #46
Gear Maniac
 
Deviated's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Infernal Device View Post
I know much of "Recording Connection".

They used to send me students.

My advice? Take that money, buy a pair of 1073's, show up with them at a studio and say "I want to learn how to make records with these, put them in your rack."

They will hold the door open for you.

If you hate the job, sell them and you lost nothing.

Just my advice.


Has anyone else had any experience with mentoring the students?

They have asked my studio to take a student interview. And Im not sure about it.

How was your experience?

Did you get paid with out hassle?

Do you still do it?
Old 17th April 2009
  #47
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by chessparov View Post
Mike, your ideas have merit IMHO.
In fact, "Recording Connection"'s program is based largely on those ideas. (reminds me of the "dowry" system!)

Anyone one who'd like to check out their site at Music Connection: Recording Engineer School -- Learn Recording Studio Technique is welcome to state any further thoughts on this matter.

Thanks again everybody for the quality input!
Chris

After reading some of the marketing material it looks like its been written by a little kid. I would be very careful forking out $7750.

They basically connect you with a mentor in a studio so why don't you offer 1/3 the price to the Engineer if you want real world mentor.

Some great engineers out there who will gladly take you on if you are willing to spend that much money. I'm sure the money will be determining factor between you and some intern but to a pro engineer you willing to learn and spend that much money will mean seriousness on your side.

I would start here on GS to see if any serious known engineer will take you on. I have similar guy here in Orange County who is willing to pay to learn but has not found anyone yet.

If anyone is willing to take intern who is willing to pay in the Orange County Ca. area please PM me as well. I will also start a thread for engineers/interns.
Old 3rd March 2010
  #48
Gear Maniac
 

Man i love these old threads!

I went through the recording connections program almost 10 years. Since then i've opened my own studio and have been doing it full time since 2007 with great success. This year they contacted me from out of nowhere (They didn't even realize i was a former student) and asked me to take on an apprentice. I accepted right away.

It's a great program as long as you get a good mentor. Just remember that initial interview goes both way. In hind sight the mentor i went with was a poor choice compared to a studio I interned at after my coarse, but it was still a great experience. There is no faster way to learn audio than by apprenticing.
Old 12th July 2010
  #49
Gear Maniac
 

I'm a newbie so what would be your advice for getting into thew recording business? Do I need a degree, what about mentor programs. Will studios take me seriously without a degree? What exactly are studios looking for? Help please.
Old 12th July 2010
  #50
Lives for gear
 
mixerguy's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by teo View Post
Will you pls stop this BS viral ad campaign for recordingconnection on multiple threads on this forum?

It's obvious, it's annoying, it won't bring you any business. Nobody is willing to give his money to somebody so desperate to go the fake post "RC is great" route.

Please go away.
+ 1 !!!

I could not agree more.

Old 23rd July 2010
  #51
Gear Maniac
 

Read a very interesting article in the Washington Post regarding BBB The Better Business Bureau and the fact that they have been caught giving terror group HAMAS an A- rating. Well maybe people should stop thinking the sun shines out of their butt hole. You can google/ yahoo it for yourselves. Very interesting read.
Old 26th July 2010
  #52
Here for the gear
 

I liked the recording connection – it worked for me

Hi everyone:
I am a new member. I have read in this forum that some of you suspect that new members are spam. I am not spam. Please remember, your posts show up in the search engines so even thought the forum is “private” the posts are public. So when I saw that you were talking about Recording Connection, I had to join and post as the Recording Connection is a subject that I know a lot about. I should, I went to the school. Let me tell you about my experience.
First off this place is far from a scam. They get you inside a real recording studio and oversee that you are trained one on one inside a real studio. No money at all is asked for up front. You pay only after you are accepted.
Many say why pay for an Internship? And that is what I originally thought, but the reality is, this is not an Internship, it is an apprenticeship. You are learning from a professional in a real studio from a course curriculum. My Recording Connection mentor is Warren Huart. Look him up. Warren is the Producer of Korn, Better than Ezra, and just about every alternative band at Sony Music. He is also a composer for Grey’s Anatomy, Scrubs, etc.

Look, I’m in my 30s and so I’ve been around the block, as I’m sure many of you have. I love the Internet, blogging, and posting in forums, but let’s be real people, NEGATIVE comments in forums and on blogs will always be in the majority because most people don’t post positive things when they are happy. We humans are just not wired that way unfortunately. If there are 5-20 negative comments in this or other forums, Praedo’s Law says there are probably 500 people who loved this school. I am one of them. Is the Recording Connection perfect? No. But it got me in a real studio and I learned under a man (Warren) who is real life music producer. Warren would not have trained me if I knocked on his door cold and asked him for an Internship.

Also, here are some other guys that endorse The Recording Connection and also teach for them in their studios:

TIM PALMER – Produced for U2, Pearl Jam, The Cure, David Bowie
CHRIS SHELDON – Engineered and Produced Liz Phair
JOHN ALTMAN – James Bond Film Composer
BRIAN BLACKWELL – Sony Music Executive for 30 years.
BRIAN LEVI – Engineered for Dwight Yokam
PRESTON BOEBEL – Engineered for Hoobestank, Whitesnake, Clint Mansell

This place is not a scam. If anyone wants to talk to me live about it, post and we can arrange a chat.

Best Wishes,
Brian Hulnick (Recording Connection Graduate)
Old 27th July 2010
  #53
Gear Maniac
 

Have we Americans become so jaded that we dismiss anything we don't fully know as rubbish? Is it easier to dismiss than to believe? It seems as soon as anyone says anything nice about Recording Connection then they are ripped apart like Christians in a Roman arena. Is it so hard to believe that people actually had good experiences with them?
Old 27th July 2010
  #54
Gear Maniac
 
pianomog's Avatar
 

recording connection

I also attended RC in chicago. I'll break it down real quick.
1: there program is not a scam

2: There administration is bad, once i got in the school i never really heard from them. I graduated in March 1st, called and sent emails requesting my certificate i didn't hear from them till july. I was told they fired the guy responsible for that and that i fell through the cracks. to me those problems start at the top IMO.

3: There are 20 lessons and some are good, some are just a joke. with questions like, "what color is your mbox"

4: I learned a ton from My mentor. that is by far the best part of the program. my mixes sound professional and I learned the things i needed to achieve a more professional mix. I have a home studio and do freelance work and have been booked up all year. so for me overall it was worth it. but it was FAR from perfect.
Old 29th July 2010
  #55
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by pianomog View Post
I also attended RC in chicago. I'll break it down real quick.
1: there program is not a scam

2: There administration is bad, once i got in the school i never really heard from them. I graduated in March 1st, called and sent emails requesting my certificate i didn't hear from them till july. I was told they fired the guy responsible for that and that i fell through the cracks. to me those problems start at the top IMO.

3: There are 20 lessons and some are good, some are just a joke. with questions like, "what color is your mbox"

4: I learned a ton from My mentor. that is by far the best part of the program. my mixes sound professional and I learned the things i needed to achieve a more professional mix. I have a home studio and do freelance work and have been booked up all year. so for me overall it was worth it. but it was FAR from perfect.
Thank you pianomog for an honest assessment of your experiences with recording connection. I must admit that I have had not problems myself with admin, but no company is perfect is it? I would be more concerned about the actual mentor program and you hit the nail firmly on the head. It works. I am so pleased that you have posted your experiences. Thank you..
Gary
Old 29th July 2010
  #56
Gear Addict
 
payne104's Avatar
I don't have any first hand experience with Record Connections, but someone was telling me that he had a really bad experience with that program, or one by the same name.

He said it was at Blackbird Studios and they made him pay $1000 up front and $250 a month and basically had him mopping floors and dusting off rack gear. Basically, he was paying them to be an intern.

He quit after a few days and they wouldn't give him any kind of refund.

This is just hearsay though, he might be trippen
Old 30th July 2010
  #57
Gear Maniac
 
pianomog's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by payne104 View Post
I don't have any first hand experience with Record Connections, but someone was telling me that he had a really bad experience with that program, or one by the same name.

He said it was at Blackbird Studios and they made him pay $1000 up front and $250 a month and basically had him mopping floors and dusting off rack gear. Basically, he was paying them to be an intern.

He quit after a few days and they wouldn't give him any kind of refund.

This is just hearsay though, he might be trippen
i did some work to. but i knew what i was getting into. I was happy to check my ego at the door and do some clean up. I wired alot of drum sets to lol! but just to be in the studio was worth it for me!
Old 30th July 2010
  #58
Gear Maniac
 
pianomog's Avatar
 

rc

Quote:
Originally Posted by goldeneye13 View Post
Thank you pianomog for an honest assessment of your experiences with recording connection. I must admit that I have had not problems myself with admin, but no company is perfect is it? I would be more concerned about the actual mentor program and you hit the nail firmly on the head. It works. I am so pleased that you have posted your experiences. Thank you..
Gary
Its hard for me to believe it was smooth sailing for you with there admin so bad lol. or they just completely forgot about me. No company is perfect, but at that price they should try harder IMO. thanksthumbsup
Old 30th July 2010
  #59
Gear Maniac
 

The important thing is did you learn a lot of important and valuable stuff that will help you get working in a studio. How much time did you spend with your mentor?
Thanks
Old 3rd August 2010
  #60
Here for the gear
 

I had this sent to me this last night, thank you James. It makes very interesting reading. Here's the link.

Recording Connection Scam - The Real Deal - Recording Connection Scam - Zimbio
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