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pro tools upgrade
Old 9th August 2002
  #1
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pro tools upgrade

hey all,
i just stumbled on this forum from the duc it looks great, and i happen to have a question-
i live out in the pacific in hawaii, maui,
i have a home studio setup o.k. i guess
samplitude and sonar running on a athlon 1.8 pc
various prosumer gear joe meek, studio projects, hhb radius lots of plugins some o.k. rack gear,
here's my dilemna-
i have done some pretty good work, acoustic electric, some keys kind of a pop thing, i am fortunate enough to be building a new addition and have made room for a studio apprx 650 sq ft.
i have a long history in music mostly as a player, writer- but am thinking of dropping around $30,000 on equip for a good project studio and hopefully get some work and provide a reasonable service for the locals and make a little money
at first i was considering going w/ a radar, outboard pres good mics and as good an analog board as i could get
i will not post everything but it was high end-
radar, cranesong spider, disstressors, ksp8, soundelux, royer, neumen mics, maybe a soundcraft ghost, maybe something vintage like a trident 80 and keep my computer gear for editing-
the question is after researching a bit more it looks like i could get into a pro tools hd 2 w/ control24 board for about $20,000
of course it comes down to quality but also salebility and pro tools of course has the name and around here also the cache-
so i am now in a quandry- i like digital recording, have not used pro tools but am familiar w/ it- it would of course allow me to use the tdm plug-ins instead of outboard gear- i think i would still stick w/ the spider to get its pres and converters and the tape emulation and of course some good mics
1st question w/ the control24 would i be able to use outboard fx to patch into protools
2nd and i know this one causes a lot of grief-
can i mix inside of pro tools without going out to an analog board and get comparable results to my first setup (radar, cranesong, analog board)?
3rd, i am like i said a novice w/ protools, but if i got a core mix card is it possible to not use the 888s for converters and use the cranesongs or apogee or lucid instead- i am a bit confused on this point, it seems that i would have to use the digi innerface 192 i/o w/ the hd but i got the impression that w/ the mix i could use different converters, is this so?
like i said i like digital recording for the non-linear approach and the awesome capibilities, but what of the sound? i am on a limited budget, and there is no doubt i would be able to get more business w/ pro tools than lets say nuendo- everyone knows pro tools, who knows the cranesong spider, radar, except...
i think you get my point.......any input would greatly be appreciated thanks. dfegad
Old 9th August 2002
  #2
Old 9th August 2002
  #3
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C.Lambrechts's Avatar
 

Re: pro tools upgrade

Quote:
Originally posted by catfish11
1st question w/ the control24 would i be able to use outboard fx to patch into protools
2nd and i know this one causes a lot of grief-
can i mix inside of pro tools without going out to an analog board and get comparable results to my first setup (radar, cranesong, analog board)?
3rd, i am like i said a novice w/ protools, but if i got a core mix card is it possible to not use the 888s for converters and use the cranesongs or apogee or lucid instead- i am a bit confused on this point, it seems that i would have to use the digi innerface 192 i/o w/ the hd but i got the impression that w/ the mix i could use different converters, is this so?
like i said i like digital recording for the non-linear approach and the awesome capibilities, but what of the sound? i am on a limited budget, and there is no doubt i would be able to get more business w/ pro tools than lets say nuendo- everyone knows pro tools, who knows the cranesong spider, radar, except...
i think you get my point.......any input would greatly be appreciated thanks. dfegad

1. .... yes you can ... get a 192 i/o and hook upyour anolog or digital outboard up to that. you can use it as inserts on channels or create Auxiliaries and use sends on channels to adress your outboard. If 1 192 isn't enough ... get a second one or a 96 i/o .... and if that isn't enough ....a third. one of the great things about ProTools is that you can build as you get along ....


2. Yes .... ProTools in combination with good quality outboard is a match for any other recording mixing medium out there. There will allways be Pro's and Con's to any kind of system.


3. well you can still use a Spider for example in a ProTools setup. If you're not happy with the AD the 192 gives you ... get another one. Apogee/ Prism/Cranesong/ .... whatever you like best.
Old 9th August 2002
  #4
Max
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Check out this link:

http://www.apogeedigital.com/pthd_upgrade.html

We have been seeing a great deal of users either upgrading or buying this configuration outright. It will cost you about $800.00 more to go this way, but you will be very happy with the results.
Old 9th August 2002
  #5
Jax
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Quote:
Originally posted by Max
Check out this link:

http://www.apogeedigital.com/pthd_upgrade.html

We have been seeing a great deal of users either upgrading or buying this configuration outright. It will cost you about $800.00 more to go this way, but you will be very happy with the results.
madd Yuck! The last thing I want to see is this the GS forums become a place for manufacturers to peddle their wares. No thanks.... "please".
Old 9th August 2002
  #6
Max
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Quote:
Originally posted by Jax


madd Yuck! The last thing I want to see is this the GS forums become a place for manufacturers to peddle their wares. No thanks.... "please".
Hi Jax,

Sorry if your offended, but giving a link to a possible solution is not exactly what I would call a solicitation. It was more like an FYI.
Old 9th August 2002
  #7
Max is cool, Apogee are helpfull here on GS, very low profile and several employees hang here off duty as genuine Gearsluts!

I agree Jax, it is a drag when manufacurers foam at the mouth about products and or any critisizms on net forums..

But IMHO Apogee are cool - hey, they are purple!

Peace



Anyhoo, one would think you could save money by using a HD Digi i/o unit instead of a 192...
Old 9th August 2002
  #8
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Forget protools and go PC Native!
With the extra cash you save you can buy more really great mics great converters (better than digi), great monitors, and outboard gear.
This will serve you much better in the long run, better sounding product is what will drive business to you, not the protools name.

Pick up August EQ mag for the ultimate PC build for DAW at 1/2 the cost of a Mac. Do the math and see what you can aquire for the same money as a protools rig.
Old 9th August 2002
  #9
Gear Addict
 

Yeah waste a bunch of money on a "state of the art" computer to run native crap that will be outdated nearly immediately. One of the hidden bonuses of a nice ProTools rig (and there are many) - is that your computer can stay the same for while (and thus your rig is "stable) - even through upgrades - you don't need to keep upgrading your computer hardware, because its not doing the work!

I can see no reason for this thread to turn into yet another "PC vs. Mac" or "Pro Tools Always Sucks" debate that many posters feel is constantly necessary.

I put my vote down with Chris - PT HD with a 192 + nice outboard can get you nearly any good sound you'll need (especially if that "outboard" includes a 2"!). Its certainly not the only way or the cheapest way - but it is a "standard" that works both creatively and in the 'market'.

For the record I do indeed run an HD3 with 4x192's on a Mac G4/933.

Flame away anti-Mac anti-Digiheads.
Old 10th August 2002
  #10
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loudist's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally posted by Paul Turpin
Yeah waste a bunch of money on a "state of the art" computer to run native crap that will be outdated nearly immediately. One of the hidden bonuses of a nice ProTools rig (and there are many) - is that your computer can stay the same for while (and thus your rig is "stable) - even through upgrades - you don't need to keep upgrading your computer hardware, because its not doing the work!

I can see no reason for this thread to turn into yet another "PC vs. Mac" or "Pro Tools Always Sucks" debate that many posters feel is constantly necessary.

Yet that is exactly what you are doing...

Instead, having to upgrade digi hardware every three years, sweet!
Steinberg VST link, say it again...Steinberg VST link
allows you to strap multiple PC's together in perfect lock so you might have a computer dedicated to signal processing, one for midi, another for your loops, yet another for your software synths (like Reason) oh yea I forgot, macs do do soft synths very well...
Another for your gigasampler... each pc should cost about $500.00 or less and you can them to the setup as needed. Rather than buy closed hardware for 20,000.00 that will be obsolete in 3 years... right?

Radar with nyquist-s converters is by far the best sounding platform going, except to the folks who laid out 25 - 30 k for their PT setups and need tp protect their investments.

You scared of the native 'crap' Paul? It is passing you by.
Reminds me of the novelty song from the 60's "Beep Beep"

Stable platform? Pro Tools? HAH!
Go to the DUC http://duc.digidesign.com/cgi-bin/ub...ubb=forum;f=16 and see how trouble free PT is...

Start telling the truth Paul.
Old 10th August 2002
  #11
"Radar with nyquist-s converters is by far the best sounding platform going, except to the folks who laid out 25 - 30 k for their PT setups and need tp protect their investments."

OK, what are the 'little extras' that you would need going the Radar route?

Desk $$$$ ?
Outboard ?
2 x more Radars to get the track count folks expect?
Old 10th August 2002
  #12
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C'mon Jules, you remember when you would make decisions during the 24 track recording process... I kid, I kid...

So you do agree that native is the way to go then... cool!
Old 10th August 2002
  #13
I haven't yet heard how 48 track 96k sessions run on Radar, and no one mentions console or hardware outboard / FX cost when chirping 'get Radar instead of PT'.

PT is 'all in one' (sort of)

Radar is just one piece in a 'separates' package
Old 10th August 2002
  #14
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This desk looks interesting...Console
Old 10th August 2002
  #15
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catfish11's Avatar
 

great info thanks-
i already have the pc and i agree i could probably do quite well going native perhaps vst w/ system link- but i have been doing this awhile and i am very leary of trusting ANY steinberg product in a day after day working situation
secondly i don't really trust pcs, i am now on my third mobo because of driver and other issues, though now it's running stable-
but this is all a mute point, $600.00 a month more in business because i am using a product that people recoginize pays for the whole gig after 5 years.
i believe if i wanted to get the best possible sound i would stick with radar, mix on an analog board with really good outboard, but i like automation!
the deal is it seems to me, that, digi's got it locked up with name recoginition.
i went down to our local music store today, hawaii has a pretty big music scene, and was just asking what would attract people to a new studio all things beside gear being equal, and i was talking to one of the managers who is also a musician about radar, ''radar?'', he really didn't know anything about it.
but pro tools......... his eyes lit up.
so at a pro level it's not really about saving X amount of bucks if the product one is using is going to generate Xx10 in revenue
the real question becomes will pro tools give me comparable sound quality?
i am not fully decided, i believe pro tools would generate more income, attract more clients, have more compatibility with the rest of the industry but i would pay for it and not be able to get as much cool gear from my initial investment. but if i get the pro tools i will have o mix in pro tools, WILL I GET AS GOOD SOUND?
options-
1- radar nyquist and a good board= $20,000.00
no outboard

2-pro tools hd w/ control 24 w/ mac around= $24,000.00
no outboard

3-radar into a pc running samp or nuendo = $14,000.00
no outboard

4-dedicated samp, nuendo or sx system, dual athlon 2.0,
uad card, cranesong spider, empirical labs disstressors,
empirical labs fatso, drawmer 1969, masterlink, hammerfall,
ksp2 = $ 20,000.00


mmmmmm......
i just did this list, and like the man said it is the sound that grabs them........
and i like cool outboard........

question for you native guys how do you mix using native (nuendo, sx)
through a board?
looped back into the program? latency?
if i wanted to use outboard gear and have automation in my mixes is there a way to do it?
in pro tools can i add outboard while i mix in pro tools?
thanks for any more insight.

by the way there is no reason to turn this into a war zone-

PCs suck, bill gates sucks.....
apple is an idiot company that could of ruled the market but chose to play it coy and now over charges for under performing gear
pro tools is a one eyed gargoyle smashing all good things analog
with their digital hammer
steinberg is a german miser taking cash from loyal customers so they can create different products with similiar functions to sell to other customers, stumbling about forever adding new gimmicks before they fix what is already there
sonar sounds like s**t, but they tell you they don't.
the only good one is samplitude and no one buys it, go figure.
Old 10th August 2002
  #16
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catfish, so you are on Maui?
Where? I recorded a Jazz album there about 3 years ago in Kihea.
Had a blast there.

Here is some ironic news:

Microsoft convicted of software piracy
By James Middleton [09-05-2002]
Delicious irony has geek community in raptures
Microsoft was found guilty of software piracy last year by a French court, according to facts unearthed today by the geek community.
But the Redmond giant's conviction and three million franc (ยฃ285,000) fine somehow managed to escape the headlines. In fact, until today the only place the story has appeared is in French newspaper Le Monde Informatique.

According to the article, the Commercial Court of Nanterre fined Microsoft because it had illegally included another company's proprietary source code in SoftImage 3D, a top-level animation package that it acquired from SoftImage in 1994.

During the six-year court wrangle that followed, the French company which originally owned the code used in SoftImage, Syn'X Relief, ran out of cash and went bankrupt.

The fight was then taken up by the original individual authors of the code in question and, in September last year, Microsoft was found guilty and fined.

The software giant said that it would appeal against the decision, but the strange thing is why the story remained in obscurity until now.

One school of thought is that because the court decision followed so close behind the 11 September attacks, the world simply missed the 'Microsoft in piracy shock' story.
Old 10th August 2002
  #17
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hey loudist-
i live in haiku on the north shore right over the mountain from "kihei"
figures a $60,000,000,000.00 rich asshole would rip-off small time code writers, only in america. enough just isn't enough, anymore.

hey- i checked out that tube board from vintec but i couldn't find it anywhere on muscian's friend web site, WHAT'S UP WID DAT!

hey- you're a pc slut how can i use my outboard with samp or nuendo or sx, do i have to use an analog board?
but i want to use automation on my mixes is this a pipe dream or what?
or is there a card with zero latency i could loop back in on,
or would i just have to use outboard on the mix buss and bring it back in,
or should i be looking at a digital board,
or a masterlink
so many questions, so little grey matter left to proccess the answers......oh well.
Old 10th August 2002
  #18
Gear Addict
 

Has anybody been using VST link in real life? Is it supported in Cubase SX and the current version of Nuendo? And has SX beaten the Steinberg reliability jinx? I keep trying to convince myself it's time to commit to a DAW, but wait and see has kept me out of some hellish obsolescence.

Bear
Old 10th August 2002
  #19
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soapbox's Avatar
 

<< Pick up August EQ mag for the ultimate PC build for DAW at 1/2 the cost of a Mac. >>

I read this "1/2 the cost of a Mac" stuff a lot regarding PCs. However, low-end Macs are cheaper than, or on par with, the PC prices ($983 - $1,995, not including monitors) quoted in the article. In fact, a low-end iMac costs $799; and that price includes a monitor.

The most expensive "Bundle 3" PC in the article costs $1,995 pre-made. (Considering that all Macs are pre-made, this PC is the closest comparable example.) It is the only PC, of the three bundles, that includes the "luxury" of a CD-RW drive. Yet, the most expensive desktop Mac with a CD-RW drive is $1,599, 3/4 the cost of the "inexpensive" PC! Sure, you could build that same PC yourself for $1,699, according to the article; but it would still cost $100 more than the Mac, and your time is worth something too.

However, I'm being equally unfair with this argument as is the "1/2 the cost of a Mac" notion. Let me explain. In reality, it's difficult to make across the board comparisons because many of the features are different. The Apple Store doesn't allow the flexibility to make an equivalent Mac to the PCs described in the article. The simple way to look at it is that one could buy Macs that cost less than the PCs under discussion; but while they would have similar features as the PCs, they would have less power - this is what's unfair in the example I gave above. On the other hand, one could buy Macs that cost more than the PCs under discussion; but while they would have similar power as the PCs, they would have more features (such as a Super Drive, for instance). This makes cost comparisons anything but simple!

Another thing to consider is that the value of a PC and a Mac can be very subjective as well. How much is a computer worth that can run Sonar compared to a computer that can run Digital Performer? How much is a computer worth that runs Windows XP compared to a computer that runs Mac OS X? In other words, no matter what way you slice it, we're comparing apples and oranges (no pun intended).

Suddenly, I'm hungry! heh
Old 10th August 2002
  #20
Hmmmm..

How about a sideways divergence for a moment. Clients, lets talk about them for a moment.

A few questions, and click! ON COME THE HOT LIGHTS!

Are you trying to justify a high gear spend by deluding yourself that recording clients will become a new money spinner?

Have you got the weird mindset required to hop over to the service side of the recording industry at will then hop back to being a self recording artist?

Are you building your place so that a client might be able, with an engineer chum, to 'self drive' you facility?

Are you hoping to become a place where guys with small DAW systems could perhaps come & track drums then leave to overdub, perhaps returning to mix?

Do you think you can have clients in and still maintain domestic harmony? (will clients have the run of your house, or a separate entrance, mini kitchen and toilet , clear of roller skate booby traps, wild dogs and 'little savages' running around?)

Do you have space for or want a large console, or does compactness appeal?

We can talk about gear till the cows come home (and long after) but we need more to go on....

So?............

Old 10th August 2002
  #21
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Well I have a Control24 and a HD3 with Digi convertors.
If you are going to do a lot of automation the C24 is cool, the pres are average(better then Mackie)....The wow factor on vegas is high.

I went from Steinberg to PT so I understand about a product where day 2 day bugs are normally not reconised by steinberg until of course they have a fix.

A Spider would be cool,
I would look at mics then pres
This is what your sound comes from.

I would go PT or Radar. Or DP if native.
Although a lot of people seem to like Neundo.
What about a secondhand Mix3 with a AD8000, ADAT bridge and Spider. A secondhand box could come with plugs.

ummm thats about it for my ramblings....Hope it helps.
Old 10th August 2002
  #22
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Jules, you have asked the right questions for consideration...
Should be your sig... heheh

catfish, the Vintec console was sort of an attempt at humor.
It is wildly expensive (I assume), probably sounds great.

Haiku... (cue ZZ Top's La Grange) 'they got a lot of nice girls down there...'
Nice spot you are in man, good luck.
Does Bob Rock still have a studio on Maui?

In answer to the outboard question.... Jules has been using a Dangerous 2 Bus and I think he likes it... a lot.

Over at Recording.org in the DW part of it there is a section called 'computing' moderated by Opus2000 (Gary Brenner) who can answer your PC hardware latency questions as well as has come up with a monster build for a PC based DAW for about 1200.00 (Do it Yourself).

Hope this is helpful...
Old 10th August 2002
  #23
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thanks for the time-
loudist- i was of course kidding about the board at musicians friend, ha!ha!
yes bob rock has a place here.
jules- i am looking towards clients, i have a business backround
i don't need to make that much money and i am not trying to get rich, i woul be quite pleased to book $400.00-$600.00 a week
i do some other stuff too.
@ 40-50 hr for a full blown pt rig that's 10 to 20 hrs/ 30 hr for aspiring locals,
i am not sure on price
there's a guy w/ the mackie db8 rig down the road he's booked all the time, his studio is not that nice- square rooms, no acoustical treatment kind of ugly all white , sterile.
yes i would consider allowing qualified engineers to bring in their own project
this place would be separate from my living area w/ it's own bath
space 8'x7' booth drums, vocals/ 16'x 22' live room / 17' x 15' control room
and yes people could come and track for drums, ect.

my wife loves the idea- we don't have kids, we have dogs, they have inclined little interest towards the music biz
we would have seperate entrances
i have the tools and know how to pretty much build the place myself, so it will be isolated for sound, ect.
the one thing to understand is that i live on maui-
there is a different mindset here, i do not think one would quite run into the craziness one would in a large city
there is more respect between parties and it is definitly more low key
for myself i could easily justify the expense of let's say $20,000.00
to achieve the kind of quality i would like to work with, so for a bit more and if i can throw some paying customers into the mix...
i think it could work
i am not trying to achieve some big materialist dream here-
i all ready live on maui.... now if i lived on maui with a cranesong spider, soundelux mic, well.......

i think that this place could be one of the better studios around here, and music is a very big deal here.
i am looking to get a system that will either pay for itself in lets say 5 years in order to upgrade or preferebly be usable for even longer.
given that pt is just beginning the run with this product and it has capibilities to 192k i would hope that an investment in it would have some pretty decent returns
a pc native system could easily be upgraded for much less cost but would not have the overall compatibility w/ the industry, nor the cache-
but i could put more money towards high qualilty outboard gear which of ourse would be a lifetime investment
the radar system i believe given their upgrade path would also be
a fairly long term deal. i hope.
it seems to me that even if computers increase in speed greatly, sonically we will start to plateu.......we are gettin pretty damn close to bit perfect digital, now don't you think?
it comes down i suppose to performance vs price vs compatibility vs longevity vs reliability plus that ellusive wow factor.
it seems to me that if i desire to use outboard i will have to have a console with either radar or a native system
any recommendations, i have considered a soundcraft ghost or something used and vintage
i also was looking at the dangerous 2 bus, jules i know you use that do you think it helps quite a bit with mixdown and is it usable for applying outboard effects?
Old 10th August 2002
  #24
"i also was looking at the dangerous 2 bus, jules i know you use that do you think it helps quite a bit with mixdown and is it usable for applying outboard effects?"

I run delays & reverbs 'returns' out via one stereo pair
eg:
Plug in reverbs
Plug in delays & FX
Returns from TCM3000 & Eventide DSP4000 (i/o of PT via an 888)

I then use another pair to return my ageing AMS RMX 16 reverb.

This leaves me 6 pairs (or 12 mono) to split out the rest of the audio from my 16 ch PT interface...

Prior to reaching those on the DB2 I can insert old skool hardware outboard like EQ's and compressors but these are POST FADER. Not much of a harship on an eq, but on a compressor, it can make a big difference (I work with it fine)

Old 11th August 2002
  #25
jon
Capitol Studios Paris
 
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Well, I sort of own both a big ProTools system and a big analog system/console (OK, the banks own it). Anyway, having access to both sides of the fence, I reckon I can answer your question with some objectivity.

For overdub and editing sessions, a ProTools is a seriously great tool and an excellent commercial choice. You WILL have to invest a lot of time keeping up with Digi doings though...count on many hours at the computer and surfing the DUC.

For mixing, ProTools is not where it's at. It's possible, but it is at best a compromise. There are countless home and project studists who strive to achieve a $1M studio mix sound with a $30k ProTools system, but at the end of the day, plugins and summing and all that math manipulating and approximating your audio become your waterloo. A ProTools mix sounds like a ProTools mix. That's not to say it can't do the job for demos or budget projects. It does mean that people who have the means to go mix in a studio with a good analog board and outboard won't book your ProTools room for mixing.

Most of my studio clients have ProTools systems at home and many of them also have pretty good home/project studios. They go to real studios when they can't take the level any higher...which is generally either for big tracking sessions or, most often, for the mix.

If you are looking solely for the best sound quality, the Radar nyquist with a good analog console + outboard setup + analog 2" or 1/2" is your best of the options you listed. Lots more money...and better sound.

But you will eventually probably still need a ProTools for your clients...as a multitrack machine and editing station which can deal with their home PT sessions.

You may find that your $20k budget is only the beginning in terms of what you will need to invest. Don't forget to account as well for the cost of your time...and the huge opportunity cost involved...opportunities that you will forgoe due to investing gobs of your life in your studio.

What is your niche? Do you aim to be a good overdub/editing room or a low-end mix room? Do you someday intend to become an upper-level mix room? What level of clientele do you want to deal with and service? What level of projects do you want to be involved with?

Try to think about the future, and not just your present prospects, when answering those questions.

I think the answers to those questions will clarify the direction you should take and what equipment to invest in.
Old 11th August 2002
  #26
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catfish11's Avatar
 

thanks jon, jules, loudist, davemc, et al....

really all i want to do is record a good sounding acoustic guitar.

sort of...


i entered into this deal because of my desire to produce my own record, at my own pace without all the bull****...the daw thing that is.
what i have learned is that it takes much better equipment and polishing skills to achieve a product that could be considerd of commercial quality.
i also learned that i have good ears, i am extermely tenacious, and love recording and editing-
i play several instruments, not all well, but i can get them to work cohesively, to form what i might desribe as a sonic painting- following the same artistic rules-
subject, juxiposition, color, continuity

i also have learned over the years that there are a lot of people in the sound business that really shouldn't be in it.
there are many examples, in many different forms, but one i find amusing has to do with daw software-
there are people, making their livelihood in the sound business that will have you believe that all these various software multitrackers and sequencaers pretty much sound the same-
this is, if one has any hearing and tone consciousness at all, is utter nonsense
there are people who will, in all seriousness, take wave files and through some math wizardry subtract or multiply or what the f**k ever and say ''see i told you these are the same''
are they deaf?
if you can't hear a difference between sonar and let's say, samplitude or cubase or nuendo (ones i happen to have experience with) why are you in this?
you shouldn't be.
or if you think you're little waves Rverb sounds as good as a ksp2
you are deluded and need professional help
so i do this first as something i love, second cuz i think i have a gift for it, thirdly cuz all them boxes look cool with the lights turned low.
and cuz i could for about $30,000.00-$40,000.00 which i'm willing to spend, think i could have a bitch'n studio and maybe just maybe record some good sounding music- and music is what i want to do

i love all different kinds, i like jazz, classical, punk (sid singing ''my way'' a truely splendid thing) korn, acoustic hawaiian, reggae, all
kinds
so, i also look at this investment as more than a personnel deal but perhaps as a way to give a service.
one thing about maui is that we have a huge amount of tourists coming and going, a lot of venues for working musicians, and alot of opportunity to sell well recorded music.

my problem is i am not able to hear all these various possible sonic solutions, and i have found the web to be an incredible source of info (one i wish had known of before i bought my rodes nt1's, oh well)
seeing how i am desireous of getting the highest quality possible and not fruitlessly investing in a resource (pro tools) that will loose immense value as soon as the next upgrade comes out
i am leaning towards the radar solution
that way i can use outboard that i know sounds better and will not loose so much value
i already have a powerfull daw with samplitude and sonar and a million plug-ins, so i imagine i could edit in samp, sequence with sonar, buy a uad-1 and a lynxtwo card for overdubs for extra tracks and bang it all bak out of the daw through the nyquist converters to -----------> ???????

any ideas on a fairly good, reasonably priced analog board
remember i live in the middle of the pacific, so if i could get a fairly compact, trouble free board that would be great.
i was thinking on a souncraft ghost, any good or should i say... good enough?
i will track direct with high qual pres and mics
i think i just need a medium to apply some verb, comp and maybe a little eq, and a decent summing bus



Old 11th August 2002
  #27
Well you are, if you will pardon my analogy, exhibiting all the classic signs of a rat trapped in the studio startup maze.

I feel it comes down to this. Either you go down an audiophile path - (Radar real desk) and satisfy your golden ears, or you go down the PTHD route and use you golden ears to help you get great sounding stuff out of a DAW set up.

You do the math's!

Old 11th August 2002
  #28
jon
Capitol Studios Paris
 
jon's Avatar
 

Jules is right, your situation is a classic one.

There are two ways to get that acoustic guitar recording you want: the fast way (go to a good studio) or the slow, way more expensive way (build a good studio).

When do you want your record to be completed? Now or in ten years?

P.S. I was in your situation and chose the slow way. Ten years later, I have one of the best rooms in the country...but that record never got finished.
Old 12th August 2002
  #29
Lives for gear
 
catfish11's Avatar
 

thanks you guys great info, i'm as confused as ever-
i'm off to N.Y. N.Y. now to research further.........
o yea and get married too.
mahalo and ALOHA!rollz rollz rollz rollz rollz rollz rollz rollz rollz
Old 12th August 2002
  #30
Lives for gear
 
loudist's Avatar
 

Heheh, most people go to Maui to get married, (had a friend who had a wedding business there).

Good Luck and a pleasant journey to both of you!!
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