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China Mic Trip Pictures and Thoughts Condenser Microphones
Old 7th December 2009
  #361
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mingustoo View Post
Here's hoping I wake up tomorrow as intellectually flawed as Thomas Jefferson.
Michael, does the K47H fit on an MXL 993? If not, is there anything that can be done to this mic to make it useful?
For sure. Not only were those guys great artisans, inventors and thinkers - they could write beautiful compound sentences to express their ideas like nobody's business. And please, for anybody who is tempted - lets not get into the old "flawed dead white guy" rant here - take it to the Moan Zone.

re: 993 - I have not had that mic in my hands so I don't know if the thread pitch and contact recess dimensions are exactly the same as the MXL 603 - so further research is required.
Old 7th December 2009
  #362
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RMJAZZ's Avatar
 

More opinions...

Well, I think it is admirable to be concerned about jobs in the US, and I feel for everyone who has been "downsized" recently.

However- What I see in the entire music industry is folks trying to hold on to the way everything has been done in the past.....it happened with the invention of Pro Tools style recording, the record labels refusing to take control of music on the internet, and is now happening with the shift of manufacturing goods from domestic plants to China, and a ton of other countries. is this a bad thing...it is panful in the beginning, like when you discovered that it wasn't going to be easy to buy that reel to reel tape anymore. It is tough to change our ways of thinking.....but times are a changin if we like it or not.

Why shouldn't the Chinese workers have a job? Ever seen how a lot of them live? It would make our U.S. out of worker people feel rich.

The manufacturing in the U.S. ( I can't speak to the situations in the EU) subject is simple....if you hire U.S. workers and pay a standard living wage here, plus health, retirement etc... you WILL go broke. I do realize there are a few people like John Hardy who make their products out of their garage and do well, but this is not the norm and those companies have very limited product to offer. It isn't the company's fault, it is the way congress has chosen to line their pockets. Our lawmakers do nothing for us in this department. They get kick-backs, perks, and all kinds of crap to swing votes certain ways. This is why there are so many attachments to bills. No bill passes without at least 10-20 additional topics tagged on...that usually have nothing to do with the bill itself.

So, if you are mad about manufacturing jobs going to China, thank your congressmen. But don't bitch about the guy trying to make a good product and choosing to find his plant in China, unless you are willing to pay 5 ties as much for that same product if manufactured here...and btw- history shows that you are NOT willing to pay more! And thus the balancing act begins. LOL

Another issue is putting blame on the "Chinese". If you are complaining about manufacturing jobs going to China...then change your wording. B/C when you use the word "Chinese" you ARE talking about the people.....whether you mean to be racist or not- you are coming across that way. Miscommunication of thoughts have lead to many wars! LOL

So Mike- I have 2 of your Apex 205 mods and love them. I use them on acoustic and electric guitars, and drum overheads. Keep up the good work. I will probably have a pair of MXL 603's modded by you in 2010, and am looking at your new capsule heads as well. I do not think that by comparing your designs to other older mics is a crime, unethical, or stealing as others have insinuated. Most very well respected mic designers have made these comparisons at one point or another......ie Tracy Korby ( I love his work!), Bock, Wunder Audio, and the list goes on and on. So I don't understand why people feel the need to jump on you about this at all.....maybe they need to grow up a bit, or learn how to go out of the house and network so they can be getting more work...the climate has changed!

Keep making good products!

Rob
Old 7th December 2009
  #363
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memphisindie's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael_Joly View Post
Not only were those guys great artisans, inventors and thinkers - they could write beautiful compound sentences to express their ideas like nobody's business.
Ha ha true.
Quote:
And please, for anybody who is tempted - lets not get into the old "flawed dead white guy" rant here - take it to the Moan Zone.
Not where I was heading, just don't want to elevate any person to deity status.
His comments were particular to his reality and are out of context for our time for the most part, but, I stipulate, he does hit a long one frequently.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RMJAZZ View Post
Well, I think it is admirable to be concerned about jobs in the US, and I feel for everyone who has been "downsized" recently.

Why shouldn't the Chinese workers have a job? Ever seen how a lot of them live? It would make our U.S. out of worker people feel rich.
Heard that!
Quote:
The manufacturing in the U.S. ( I can't speak to the situations in the EU) subject is simple....if you hire U.S. workers and pay a standard living wage here, plus health, retirement etc... you WILL go broke. I do realize there are a few people like John Hardy who make their products out of their garage and do well, but this is not the norm and those companies have very limited product to offer.

So, if you are mad about manufacturing jobs going to China, thank your congressmen. But don't bitch about the guy trying to make a good product and choosing to find his plant in China, unless you are willing to pay 5 times as much for that same product if manufactured here...and btw- history shows that you are NOT willing to pay more! And thus the balancing act begins. LOL
I don't think that's necessarily true as an "either/or" type analogy, there is no reality with only two options. Nothing is one or the other in America. I have a relative in Mass with a Large full union shop including transportation, union everywhere. He makes plenty and employes dang near the whole town. He lives modestly for a man of his wealth.
Quote:
Another issue is putting blame on the "Chinese". If you are complaining about manufacturing jobs going to China...then change your wording. B/C when you use the word "Chinese" you ARE talking about the people.....whether you mean to be racist or not- you are coming across that way. Miscommunication of thoughts have lead to many wars! LOL
true dat.
Quote:
So Mike- I have 2 of your Apex 205 mods and love them. I use them on acoustic and electric guitars, and drum overheads. Keep up the good work.

maybe they (naysayers) need to grow up a bit, or learn how to go out of the house and network so they can be getting more work...the climate has changed!
Keep making good products!

Rob
Got that right.
Old 8th December 2009
  #365
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Quote:
Originally Posted by memphisindie View Post
Just because he was "Thomas Jefferson", doesn't mean he was correct, no matter how good his flowery speech was. He was just another human with "a dream".
Man, I have read some crazy shît here on GearSlutz, but this really takes the cake.

Someone thinks they have a point to make by tearing down the quality of Thomas Jefferson's thinking and accomplishments? Seriously?

Thomas Jefferson - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This is a new high-water mark for misplaced ego.

JSL
Old 8th December 2009
  #366
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memphisindie's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by jslevin View Post
Man, I have read some crazy shît here on GearSlutz, but this really takes the cake.

Someone thinks they have a point to make by tearing down the quality of Thomas Jefferson's thinking and accomplishments? Seriously?

Thomas Jefferson - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This is a new high-water mark for misplaced ego.
"Other interests
My main hobby is trying to help people see how wrong they are.
Here's another good pledge: "I have actually used my brain."
JSL
Ego, really. Why would you even post that? Obviously not THAT seriously.
Tell me when TJ got magic powers and became more than human.
I can tell you when. When he became a historical figure, like many others.
Doesn't make it all real.
Saying he's human is NOT tearing him or any accomplishment down either. It's the truth.
You know this because you" use your brain".
Not even a water mark.
That's a PM type message, next time PM me and clear it up.

Last edited by memphisindie; 8th December 2009 at 03:20 PM.. Reason: Being not very nice.
Old 8th December 2009
  #367
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jslevin's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by memphisindie View Post
Tell me when TJ got magic powers and became more than human.
He didn't. He was human. He was exceptionally accomplished, however, and there is significant historical evidence of his brilliance. This is not to say he was perfect, but it's just ridiculous to hold him up as an example of especially flawed thinking, or as someone who didn't accomplish much.

Quote:
Doesn't make it all real.
You could say this about any historical figure. This is not informed critique; it's claptrap. You sound like Dwight Schrute.

JSL
Old 8th December 2009
  #368
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memphisindie's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by jslevin View Post
He didn't. He was human. He was exceptionally accomplished, however, and there is significant historical evidence of his brilliance. This is not to say he was perfect, but it's just ridiculous to hold him up as an example of especially flawed thinking, or as someone who didn't accomplish much.
Well, it's a good thing that isn't what I was doing then.
Quote:

You could say this about any historical figure. This is not informed critique; it's claptrap. You sound like Dwight Schrute.

JSL
You chose to put in a meaning I did not intend.
Ask yourself why, maybe it'll go somewhere new. Who knows.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Joly quoting Thomas Jefferson
"He who receives an idea from me, receives instruction himself without lessening mine; as he who lights his taper at mine, receives light without darkening me.

That ideas should freely spread from one to another over the globe, for the moral and mutual instruction of man, and improvement of his condition, seems to have been peculiarly and benevolently designed by nature, when she made them, like fire, expansible over all space, without lessening their density in any point, and like the air in which we breathe, move, and have our physical being, incapable of confinement or exclusive appropriation. Inventions then cannot, in nature, be a subject of property."
But what the heck, it's only word and time we're spending here, Jay.

Fire needs fuel, not taken into account in this argument, water of a finite specific volume does spread out and thin, air of a finite volume does thin when spread. None of these inconvenient facts seemed to come into consideration in his argument. Conservation of resources seems to elude this statement. The entire earth only has so much of anything on the current version of the periodic table, and it is deployed by nature in different regions in different concentrations.
If you think that taking an argument from yesterday is best taken as dogma over 100 years later and can be with the statement as is in that context, fine.
Maybe Jefferson would have solved problems with space-time travel and made it useful for mass transit if he had known the finiteness of resources, but, in his day, there was very little known about that and basing his ideas in what we know now would have precluded the industrial revolution as we know it. He would have taken a much more measured approach than just free everything for everyone.
When we're all super, no one is super.

Now, if you take the last statement qualifier, "in nature" that's the gold. We don't exactly build our societies with living in the"natural way" in mind, in fact, acting naturally for the human animal is expressly prohibited by law. Try walking around naked in public and carousing with whatever female you may want to mate with an see what happens.
You get busted.
Intellectual property is a reality.

WHO is Dwight Shrute?
Old 8th December 2009
  #369
Gear Maniac
 
low_z's Avatar
 

Not to step into an argument that isn't mine, but shouldn't we at least be arguing about Alexander Bell, for a little more relevance guys? heh

Michael, I have a nady cm 90 that has seen many a classical guitar gig (so not a pampered studio mic) but is in decent condition (hit the ground a couple of times though). Would it still be a good candidate for the k47 head? Also, I basically liked the red MJE brand you posted a picture of. Any updates on that?
Old 8th December 2009
  #370
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Michael_Joly's Avatar
 

Yep. The CM-90 is a great candidate. You only need the Premium Electronics upgrade and not the Ultimate SDC Mod if you're going to dedicate that body to an MJE-K47H capsule head.

re: logo - thanks for the feedback. I haven't taken this up with my graphic designer yet, will do so soon!
Old 9th December 2009
  #371
Gear Maniac
 
drp audio's Avatar
 

Congratulations Michael!! Best of luck to you! (And get some sleep for goodness sake ...)

I am saving to get a couple of Oktava 012 mics, hope you are still available to mod them for me yourself in the future. (Unless you have a strong equivalent to the 012 in your MJE line.)

I would like to throw my design hat into the ring. Samples are free, if you use anything I show and want to give props back to me, then sweet! This is obviously a variation of what you are working on already...

Aside from the Oktavas on my xmas list, my heart is nagging me for a tube mic, any tube mics in the works for MJE?

Attachment 147577

Attachment 147578
Old 9th December 2009
  #372
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Michael_Joly's Avatar
 

OMG! that is beautiful work. Please email (not pm) so I can talk to you about the possibility of purchasing your logo design. Yes, an MJE-K47 capsule-based, multi-pattern tube mic is in the works. Pricing and performance to be consistent with my shootout-winning mod'd Apex 460 mic.
Old 9th December 2009
  #373
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memphisindie's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by drp audio View Post
Congratulations Michael!! Best of luck to you! (And get some sleep for goodness sake ...)

I am saving to get a couple of Oktava 012 mics, hope you are still available to mod them for me yourself in the future. (Unless you have a strong equivalent to the 012 in your MJE line.)

I would like to throw my design hat into the ring. Samples are free, if you use anything I show and want to give props back to me, then sweet! This is obviously a variation of what you are working on already...

Aside from the Oktavas on my xmas list, my heart is nagging me for a tube mic, any tube mics in the works for MJE?

Attachment 147577

Attachment 147578
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael_Joly View Post
OMG! that is beautiful work. Please email (not pm) so I can talk to you about the possibility of purchasing your logo design. Yes, an MJE-K47 capsule-based, multi-pattern tube mic is in the works. Pricing and performance to be consistent with my shootout-winning mod'd Apex 460 mic.
THAT is the type of logo I was trying to describe, CLASSY, better than any other logo with red and it doesn't whisper "budget" at you, it says "solid, awesome, detailed, high quality, and serious", make that red a metallic translucent candy apple red and you get "proud, rockin, badass" added to the mix, everything your product is, and later you can have them done with glass in pewter and polished.

That thing looks like jewelry, which is what it should look like. From diamonds in the rough to jewels, that's how you started.

I remember trading emails with you about them 5 or 6 years ago, before the "premium electronics mod" was sussed, discussing all kinds of things, you even sent me some parts before you went 100% into business. I sent you some nutty pictures of my "lady frankenmic" 319 (big blue 5 gig resistors).
This is a great progression for ANYONE to have, couldn't happen to a better man.
Rock on!
Old 9th December 2009
  #374
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Michael_Joly's Avatar
 

Thanks Memph! You've been there to keep me sharp. I really appreciate the color and design suggestions.
Old 9th December 2009
  #375
Gear Maniac
 
drp audio's Avatar
 

Aw shucks ...

Thanks for the kind words MJ and Memphis! Yes, Memphis indeed deserves credit for the raised look. I often envision things in 3d and I may have arrived there on my own, but certainly Memphis' comments resonated with me and influenced me from the start, along with the existing layout that Michael seemed fond of.

Michael, I will email you tomorrow to talk more.
Old 9th December 2009
  #376
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Dr.P's art is the real deal. Sweet work! That shield, perfect, protecting you from crappy audio! It's all you Dr. P, I only had suggestions, Your Art is where the rubber hits the road. I'm sure you had the same thing in mind already. For me, it's a privilege to be considered "of any service" when your words and actions are only said and done to be "in service to", my ONLY purpose, done in different fashions, with one under-lying and one over-arching goal.
I fail miserably often.
Old 9th December 2009
  #377
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tapehiss's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by drp audio View Post
Congratulations Michael!! Best of luck to you! (And get some sleep for goodness sake ...)

I am saving to get a couple of Oktava 012 mics, hope you are still available to mod them for me yourself in the future. (Unless you have a strong equivalent to the 012 in your MJE line.)

I would like to throw my design hat into the ring. Samples are free, if you use anything I show and want to give props back to me, then sweet! This is obviously a variation of what you are working on already...

Aside from the Oktavas on my xmas list, my heart is nagging me for a tube mic, any tube mics in the works for MJE?

Attachment 147577

Attachment 147578

there it is!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

awesome designs man!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! i felt that was everything necessary to make the logo "POP"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

beautiful graphic designing!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

now the only hard part is telling the guy who designed the last logo that you don't need his logo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Old 9th December 2009
  #378
Gear Maniac
 
low_z's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by tapehiss View Post
there it is!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

awesome designs man!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! i felt that was everything necessary to make the logo "POP"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

beautiful graphic designing!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

now the only hard part is telling the guy who designed the last logo that you don't need his logo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Ditto! thumbsup
Old 9th December 2009
  #379
who cares? people want cheap stuff..

let michael Joly make the good "cheap" stuff or buy your Bock-audio mic if you can afford it.

I think in 10 years no one will complain anymore about production quality in China.. but.. the prices will raise..

that happend with Japanese production in the 80s, India and Taiwan in the 90s.

cheers
G
Old 9th December 2009
  #380
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big country's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by George Necola View Post
who cares? people want cheap stuff..

let michael Joly make the good "cheap" stuff or buy your Bock-audio mic if you can afford it.

I think in 10 years no one will complain anymore about production quality in China.. but.. the prices will raise..

that happened with Japanese production in the 80s, India and Taiwan in the 90s.

cheers
G
I dont think its a question if they can make nice stuff , its more a question is this fair ,
we are dealing with work preformed by human beings.
what is the trade , giving them paper money for them building us mics .
MJE going to china and having them make his mics kinda makes an ambassador of trade ,

If he goes over there with nothing and leaves only money it wouldn't be a trade
the only way a real trade circle would truly work is if the
trade of mics was backed by another trade that was backed by another trade a non stop circle and the trade of just being rich couldn't enter
that trade loop with out lessing the value to all the trades in the circle

him going to china if he looks bad the US / GEAR Industry trade could also look bad
I kinda would think it would be of interest to Up keep the image of our so beloved gear industry
if it was done right by some of sort of thought out fair deal .



China Mic Trip Pictures and Thoughts-circle-20of-20fifths-20wheel.gif
Old 9th December 2009
  #381
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Michael_Joly's Avatar
 

I loves me some philosophy in the morning, especially when it includes the cycle of fifths. Speaking of which, leave it to the Western mind to bludgeon Sacred ratios of 3/2, 4/3 and 5/4 into equal-tempered bastardizations of the Creator's perfect order.

Trade you suggest?

China has bestowed upon me the grace, warmth, intelligence and beauty of its people. Let more of us travel there and return as ambassadors to spread this love from East to West.
Old 9th December 2009
  #382
big... I deal a lot of american gear (new and used)..

it's sometimes evil, how bad americans perform in documentation of their product (and production), service and parts labor. dont get me wrong, I like the gear soundwise, but it's terrible to see the degradation of QS, parts, labor and stuff like that in the last few years.

Studer for example can tell you who built wich desk and who turned wich screw on this certain desk since they started production in 1960...

cheers
G

add: I am not pro China.. I just think this lacks realism.

Quote:
Originally Posted by big country View Post
I dont think its a question if they can make nice stuff , its more a question is this fair ,
we are dealing with work preformed by human beings.
what is the trade , giving them paper money for them building us mics .
MJE going to china and having them make his mics kinda makes an ambassador of trade ,

If he goes over there with nothing and leaves only money it wouldn't be a trade
the only way a real trade circle would truly work is if the
trade of mics was backed by another trade that was backed by another trade a non stop circle and the trade of just being rich couldn't enter
that trade loop with out lessing the value to all the trades in the circle

him going to china if he looks bad the US / GEAR Industry trade could also look bad
I kinda would think it would be of interest to Up keep the image of our so beloved gear industry
if it was done right by some of sort of thought out fair deal .



Attachment 147617
Old 9th December 2009
  #383
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memphisindie's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael_Joly View Post
I loves me some philosophy in the morning, especially when it includes the cycle of fifths. Speaking of which, leave it to the Western mind to bludgeon Sacred ratios of 3/2, 4/3 and 5/4 into equal-tempered bastardizations of the Creator's perfect order.

Trade you suggest?

China has bestowed upon me the grace, warmth, intelligence and beauty of its people. Let more of us travel there and return as ambassadors to spread this love from East to West.
Me too, and I was looking for a good circle of fifths for the kiddos, ok, and for me too. The printer stoped working, so, I gave it "tactile manipulation" and it works again. Now I can print and hang it up. Thanks Big Country.

George, the literal degradation of quality started when some guy tried to nudge out his competition with the idea that "I could make this cheaper and take over".
Was that Japanese auto industry with it's knockoffs of yesteryear?Was it American auto industry with using robots to assemble cars?
Indians didn't do it.
Didn't do that at Stonehenge.
I think Mike is working toward a quality ethic, his main focus, not toward cheapness to nudge out competition. That whole false economy of "saving you money" could only last as long as it would take to destroy the entire world's economy bubble. Voila.
Old 9th December 2009
  #384
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chrisdee's Avatar
Who is that skinny chinese rocker dude that looks like a Yngwie imitator.heh
Old 9th December 2009
  #385
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One member of Rustic, winner of the Chinese section of the International Battle of the Bands. They'll go onto the UK for the finals.
Attached Thumbnails
China Mic Trip Pictures and Thoughts-rustic2.jpg  
Old 9th December 2009
  #386
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jslevin's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by memphisindie View Post
You chose to put in a meaning I did not intend.
I don't think I put it there, but let's not split hairs.

It's clear now that you were giving a specific critique of one of Jefferson's arguments. I thought you were making a very broad statement about the quality of his thinking. It is now clear that that was not your intent.

I do think Jefferson was brilliant, but with that as a given, the mere fact that he said something would not make it true. Much of what he wrote is still sound nearly three centuries later, which is pretty impressive. Other ideas have not aged as well, which is understandable.

I think his statements do reflect the reality that we can't hide away inventions from public ownership forever; ultimately, humanity needs to be able to build upon the advances of prior generations in a fairly unfettered way. This concept is still upheld in the law, but it has been tempered by the necessity and fairness of compensating creators for their work. I support both of these ideas strongly, as well as the need to balance them.

JSL
Old 9th December 2009
  #387
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big country's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by George Necola View Post
big... I deal a lot of american gear (new and used)..

it's sometimes evil, how bad americans perform in documentation of their product (and production), service and parts labor. dont get me wrong, I like the gear soundwise, but it's terrible to see the degradation of QS, parts, labor and stuff like that in the last few years.

Studer for example can tell you who built which desk and who turned which screw on this certain desk since they started production in 1960...

cheers
G

add: I am not pro China.. I just think this lacks realism.
I have a college loan most of that money was used to buy stuff
made in china . yet I have had people from a Sacramento based collections
agency bugging the **** out of me for the past year non stop calls
hell they didn't even make the stuff they are wanting money for
its driven me nuts as it makes no sense .
the american credit system is messed up and I think it wouldn't be cool
to bring that ethic to a foreign country

I guess thats what my worry is , so understand my concerns as I'm sure mike is more than
capable of good buisness
Old 9th December 2009
  #388
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big country's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael_Joly View Post

China has bestowed upon me the grace, warmth, intelligence and beauty of its people. Let more of us travel there and return as ambassadors to spread this love from East to West.
thumbsup
Old 9th December 2009
  #389
Gear Maniac
 
low_z's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by George Necola View Post

let michael Joly make the good "cheap" stuff or buy your Bock-audio mic if you can afford it.

G
Ahem... inexpensive would be the proper term here. (Behringer is cheap) heh But I do agree with your point.

Quote:
I loves me some philosophy in the morning, especially when it includes the cycle of fifths. Speaking of which, leave it to the Western mind to bludgeon Sacred ratios of 3/2, 4/3 and 5/4 into equal-tempered bastardizations of the Creator's perfect order.
As a student of the Oud, I can (and must) appreciate non-tempered tuning of modes. I have to say, the Maqam Rast is one of the most beautiful sonorities I have ever heard, as it involves two half-flats (equivalent to the ionian mode with degrees 3 and 7 as half-flats) . I think western scales were born out of this, as 'scales' actually came from seven modes. I love it all though!
Old 9th December 2009
  #390
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jslevin View Post
I don't think I put it there, but let's not split hairs.

It's clear now that you were giving a specific critique of one of Jefferson's arguments. I thought you were making a very broad statement about the quality of his thinking. It is now clear that that was not your intent.

I do think Jefferson was brilliant, but with that as a given, the mere fact that he said something would not make it true. Much of what he wrote is still sound nearly three centuries later, which is pretty impressive. Other ideas have not aged as well, which is understandable.

I think his statements do reflect the reality that we can't hide away inventions from public ownership forever; ultimately, humanity needs to be able to build upon the advances of prior generations in a fairly unfettered way. This concept is still upheld in the law, but it has been tempered by the necessity and fairness of compensating creators for their work. I support both of these ideas strongly, as well as the need to balance them.

JSL
The fault was mine, and I agree with your post 100%.
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