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Digidesign Pro Tools Next Move Audio Interfaces
Old 24th November 2009
  #331
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Kenny Gioia's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by PMoshay View Post
If you ask me, i'd like to go to one manufacturer and get a kick ass upgradeable system (like Digi, Apogee, etc)
I don't wanna keep depending on what Apple is doing, then Waves, Then Antares, etc.
There's too much inter-dependency already.

There's also way too much updating, i'm not even sure why i need all this stuff sometimes.......... i've become addicted like many others and i'm ready to go to music software rehab and kick the habbit.
Hell, i made some great records on Adat's and Akai 1212's.


Run out of power? - bounce some tracks and save time & money....... commit & move forward. Thats what i've been doing
Hey Pete.

Check out Propellerheads Record.

Propellerhead Software - Products - Record
Old 24th November 2009
  #332
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tamasdragon's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by DontLetMeDrown View Post
This post kinda sounds like you've been stuck in PTLE land for a while. Welcome to 2009. Using Sonar on an i7, I monitor in realtime with a buffer set at 64 with UAD1 and Soundtoys plugins. I don't have it open now, but I think it is 2.7 ms of latency. There is no perceivable latency that I or any of my clients notice. I really don't like to monitor with FX personally, but I had a client last week that wanted wet vocals. We were able to pull that off even after tracking the entire band + overdubs + reverb and delay sends. Everything went great. No math, no sliding, just makin music.
Well, welcome to 2009 with ptle. With real 2.5-3ms roundtrip latency with tons of plugins as well. It is a misinformation that you have to use low-latency in le.
You can even do this with a laptop.
TD
Old 24th November 2009
  #333
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nativeaudio View Post

The Digi rep confirms that a lot has happened in the native world since HD was launched, and also that reduced HD sales (of course) were expected. He also talks about Avid really wanting to listen to customers. In another post he talks about what customers ask for: a 'middle' product without the HD prices/DSP cards, but with ADC, more efficient software instruments and so on.

Then some DUC'er indicated that he didn't like the sound of 'middle', whereas the Avid guy said that he wasn't "necessarily" thinking of 'middle' in terms of features, but in terms of price. Personally, I'll just pretend that the word "necessarily" wasn't there.... :-)

In other words: They are working on a native system with pretty much the same features as HD (and more), but without the HD price tag - and without the DSP cards of course (which partially explains the reduced price). If it has the same feature set as HD + real time bounce, freeze, support for interleaved files, proper ADC, dynamic DSP allocation, HD sales will keep fading out. Or more that that, they be discontinued in max. a few years.

The Digi guy also seemed to recognize that RTAS isn't as efficient/optimized as in other DAWs, but that they are working on it.

The thing they may struggle with is the timeline; with *when* they can release something along these lines - and of course, that other DAWs already are way ahead of Avid in terms of native development, and also working on their next updates.

He also talked about everyone being "up in arms". Pardon my non-native English, what does that mean?

Anyway - from what I've read, the discussion is more or less over - they are going high-end native, like "everyone else", and seem to have started that process around a year ago.

They may even [speculation:] launch their new system as a mid-range product at a mid-price point, and let people slowly discover that it's as good as PTHD (with or without some tiny DSP chips in the interfaces, for people who record on laptops etc)... and without really declaring that they'll go "highend native".
Very interesting points.
Do you have a link to that discussion ?

Now the question is :
How much could they charge for a native HD system ?

Which "killer app" would they have to add
to make the low level logic / mac pro market convert to their system ?

Assuming the new system would be around 3k without I/O interface
they would have to drastically lower their upgrade prices for
pro customers from hd if they offer one at all...

They even might consider selling this middle line IN PARALLEL
to the existing hd line to offer tdm plugin / session compatibility
so the upgrade / crossgrade problem would be redundand.
Old 24th November 2009
  #334
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia View Post
As soon as they remove the DSP aspect of the program, they are now in competition with programs costing $500.

That would be a big mistake and they know it.
Don´t forget to add at least 3k for the latest mac
and another 3 for the latest mac next year.

I´m afraid they have no other choice to go native in some way.
Look at the latest imac, which is 1799 and about twice as fast
as a 3k mac pro last year + the 27 inch display allmost equals
a 1,7 k 30 inch cinema display.

They better find some striking arguments like some new
killer mix buss, killer plugins, killer....?
Old 24th November 2009
  #335
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nativeaudio's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaman View Post
Very interesting points.
Do you have a link to that discussion ?
I think it was in the LE section somewhere.... (the PC LE section maybe)? Long thread.


Quote:
How much could they charge for a native HD system ?
My guess is that they'll try to compete with Symphony/Lynx, so they'd probably operate somewhere in that price range.


Quote:
They even might consider selling this middle line IN PARALLEL
to the existing hd line to offer tdm plugin / session compatibility
so the upgrade / crossgrade problem would be redundand.
I think they have said that the HD range won't be discontinued in 2010, and also indicated that it will be supported after having been discontinued. Blind guess: will be discontinued in 2011, well after the introduction of a highend-native PT version, and supported for several years after that.

Regrading the "add DSP or not?" thing, I'm not really sure that they have to make that choice. They already have a DSP card based system, and a native system with some important limitations, and they could of course both make a high-end native system without DSP, and one with (some) DSP, but my impression is that they this won't be based on DSP cards (at least for the pro native version; "PT middle"), and who knows if there's market for a new card based system since so many HD users repeatedly let us know how happy they are with what they have.... Mac Pros are already screamingly fast, and will be 50% screamingly faster soon. This means that both Avid and Apple will need to focus more on software than hardware.

It can't take that much of an effort to offer two types of interfaces, one plain I/O and one with some additional, DSP based monitor section features... by making both products, they'll also find out what users want.

The 192 I/O isn't new anymore, so they probably have planned a follow-up to that interface for a long time anyway, so why not make a new I/O that can be used both in HD rigs and in native and "highend native" rigs? Apogee, RME, Lynx and others make really inexpensive PCIe cards that lets their users connect with great interfaces and reduce latency, and I can't think of one single reason that Avid wouldn't do the same. If it would be CoreAudio-based - or at least exist in a CoreAudio-supported version, it could even be sold to non-PT users. Then Avid could increase hardware sales, which is what they want anyway, and Apple could keep not focusing on external audio hardware, which is what they want.

Why wouldn't Avid want to create an interface that people could use with Logic, Live and Nuendo? They could even do this and still limit PT's compatibility with 3rd part interfaces.

There's one thing they (Avid) IMO do better than everyone else: remote control. Not remote control of transport functions, but remote control of the DSP process, because that that DAE and PTHD is about: using a native, OS X based app (Pro Tools) to control what happens in the DSP chips. For what I know, they may be working together with Apple on a transparent, similar protocol that would let all DAW users work the PTHD way with CoreAudio apps. They (we) already can, but not on laptops, on old-ish computers, or extremely busy songs with dozens of heavy soft-instruments. Or: we can, but may have to increase the buffer up from the 32 setting. With a native super-DAE, whatever mode (direct/software monitoring) we are in, we could control all routing, monitor levels etc., from our DAW's own mixer.

Quote:
Which "killer app" would they have to add to make the low level logic / mac pro market convert to their system ?
Being a big Logic fan and not thinking of the Logic/MacPro market as low level at all, I guess I can't respond to that, but if there's one single, new thing they could add to the native Pro Tools concept, it would IMO be to create a DAE that lets their native users work in PT - and, with CoreAudio support, other DAWs as well - without needing to deal with 3rd part software mixers (TotalMix, CueMix etc) ever. The 'killer app' would in that acse be a universal, native, CoAu based DAE, which even I - a Logic user - could use.

IMO this 'super-DAE' should exist on an operating system level in OS X, which is why I hope Apple, and not Avid will develop this, but so far, I've seen no signs of such a concept from Apple.


I'm pretty sure Avid would have launched a highend-native PT version today, if they could. People are going pro/native all over the planet nowadays, and it seems that they didn't start to plan such a move early enough (read: at the time where several Gearslutz members suggested that they should move in this direction, at least 2-3 years ago).

Again, re. all of the above: I have no inside info whatsoever... this is all speculation!
Old 24th November 2009
  #336
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nativeaudio

Great and convincing marketing analysis thumbsup
Will be interesting to watch what´s happening next year.

"low level" logic / mac pro I meant in comparison to the price of a fully blown hd accel rig with interfaces.


A different point for me is that PT HD systems should be more portable
for location recording.
The external chassis concept never has been tempting
and I´m envious to logic guys who can walk with a
mac book pro / uln8 etc .... under their arm and make great 96 k
recordings in the countryside.

The form factor of a new I/0 should reflect the mobile factor
because recording IMO gets more mobile anyway since you need less and less gear.

Size of interfaces should be half of the current ones maximum.
Interfaces should be without fans.
Old 24th November 2009
  #337
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sardi's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaman View Post
Assuming the new system would be around 3k without I/O
3k just for the software?

One would hope not. They couldn't possibly sell a native PT for that much coin.

I don't think they'd be getting many people jumping from Logic/Nuendo etc. at that price point.
Old 24th November 2009
  #338
Quote:
Originally Posted by sardi View Post
3k just for the software?

One would hope not. They couldn't possibly sell a native PT for that much coin.

I don't think they'd be getting many people jumping from Logic/Nuendo etc. at that price point.
I agree. It simply cannot be priced higher than Nuendo + NEK. It will definitely be more than Logic, though.
Old 24th November 2009
  #339
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they will definitely be more expensive than their competition. that is what they do. and they can get away from it because a lot of people will pay a premium to be able to use the PT software.

My guess is, if you can get into a Logic/Symphony system for around 3k (i have never priced it, just a guess) then Digi will charge about 5k for a similar system. And people will eat it up.
Old 24th November 2009
  #340
Registered User
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by nativeaudio View Post
I think it was in the LE section somewhere.... (the PC LE section maybe)? Long thread.



My guess is that they'll try to compete with Symphony/Lynx, so they'd probably operate somewhere in that price range.



I think they have said that the HD range won't be discontinued in 2010, and also indicated that it will be supported after having been discontinued. Blind guess: will be discontinued in 2011, well after the introduction of a highend-native PT version, and supported for several years after that.

Regrading the "add DSP or not?" thing, I'm not really sure that they have to make that choice. They already have a DSP card based system, and a native system with some important limitations, and they could of course both make a high-end native system without DSP, and one with (some) DSP, but my impression is that they this won't be based on DSP cards (at least for the pro native version; "PT middle"), and who knows if there's market for a new card based system since so many HD users repeatedly let us know how happy they are with what they have.... Mac Pros are already screamingly fast, and will be 50% screamingly faster soon. This means that both Avid and Apple will need to focus more on software than hardware.

It can't take that much of an effort to offer two types of interfaces, one plain I/O and one with some additional, DSP based monitor section features... by making both products, they'll also find out what users want.

The 192 I/O isn't new anymore, so they probably have planned a follow-up to that interface for a long time anyway, so why not make a new I/O that can be used both in HD rigs and in native and "highend native" rigs? Apogee, RME, Lynx and others make really inexpensive PCIe cards that lets their users connect with great interfaces and reduce latency, and I can't think of one single reason that Avid wouldn't do the same. If it would be CoreAudio-based - or at least exist in a CoreAudio-supported version, it could even be sold to non-PT users. Then Avid could increase hardware sales, which is what they want anyway, and Apple could keep not focusing on external audio hardware, which is what they want.

Why wouldn't Avid want to create an interface that people could use with Logic, Live and Nuendo? They could even do this and still limit PT's compatibility with 3rd part interfaces.

There's one thing they (Avid) IMO do better than everyone else: remote control. Not remote control of transport functions, but remote control of the DSP process, because that that DAE and PTHD is about: using a native, OS X based app (Pro Tools) to control what happens in the DSP chips. For what I know, they may be working together with Apple on a transparent, similar protocol that would let all DAW users work the PTHD way with CoreAudio apps. They (we) already can, but not on laptops, on old-ish computers, or extremely busy songs with dozens of heavy soft-instruments. Or: we can, but may have to increase the buffer up from the 32 setting. With a native super-DAE, whatever mode (direct/software monitoring) we are in, we could control all routing, monitor levels etc., from our DAW's own mixer.


Being a big Logic fan and not thinking of the Logic/MacPro market as low level at all, I guess I can't respond to that, but if there's one single, new thing they could add to the native Pro Tools concept, it would IMO be to create a DAE that lets their native users work in PT - and, with CoreAudio support, other DAWs as well - without needing to deal with 3rd part software mixers (TotalMix, CueMix etc) ever. The 'killer app' would in that acse be a universal, native, CoAu based DAE, which even I - a Logic user - could use.

IMO this 'super-DAE' should exist on an operating system level in OS X, which is why I hope Apple, and not Avid will develop this, but so far, I've seen no signs of such a concept from Apple.


I'm pretty sure Avid would have launched a highend-native PT version today, if they could. People are going pro/native all over the planet nowadays, and it seems that they didn't start to plan such a move early enough (read: at the time where several Gearslutz members suggested that they should move in this direction, at least 2-3 years ago).

Again, re. all of the above: I have no inside info whatsoever... this is all speculation!
This is good example of a arm chair quarterback post - You have zero experience in a corprate environment with respect to development or support of a viable usable DAW.
It's not all about CPU power to run plug-ins. Firewire, USB, Ethernet have have been used in audio and have all been proven to have limited bandwidth.
You need to get a job to gain some experience in DAW software development and you will change your point of view.
Old 24th November 2009
  #341
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3k for a native hd system incl. a 16 ch. digital multi format I/O (Madi,AES, adat, spdif)
with low latency monitoring would be O.K. for me.
PT software is a good old friend for me
and I don´t like to change friends very often.
Old 24th November 2009
  #342
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff16years View Post
they will definitely be more expensive than their competition. that is what they do. and they can get away from it because a lot of people will pay a premium to be able to use the PT software.

My guess is, if you can get into a Logic/Symphony system for around 3k (i have never priced it, just a guess) then Digi will charge about 5k for a similar system. And people will eat it up.
Yes, but now you're talking hardware as well... price-wise I meant just software. The hardware will be more expensive, for sure. And it will be a question of whether they stick to the existing business model of having software that is essentially "free with hardware purchase" or whether there will in fact be a stand-alone software version that can use any hardware the user wants. Time will tell.
Old 24th November 2009
  #343
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nativeaudio's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by hipass View Post
Firewire, USB, Ethernet have have been used in audio and have all proven to have limited bandwidth.
In the post you are commenting, I wrote "Apogee, RME, Lynx and others make really inexpensive PCIe cards that lets their users connect with great interfaces and reduce latency, and I can't think of one single reason that Avid wouldn't do the same."
Old 24th November 2009
  #344
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by hipass View Post
This is good example of a arm chair quarterback post - You have zero experience in a corprate environment with respect to development or support of a viable usable DAW.
It's not all about CPU power to run plug-ins. Firewire, USB, Ethernet have have been used in audio and have all been proven to have limited bandwidth.
You need to get a job to gain some experience in DAW software development and you will change your point of view.
Not only that but in the PC world Firewire, USB, and Ethernet use different manufacturer chipsets and drivers depending on the motherboard you happen to have in your system. DAW manufacturers that do not provide their own computer interfaces risk becoming yesterday's news as soon as the first bug shows up.

Another problem is when a DAW manufacturer adds a feature that is dependent on the PC hardware and the i/o companies keeping pace. An example of this is when Sonar first released a 64-bit version of their DAW...... what a nightmare!! Most i/o interface companies were in no big hurry to release 64-bit versions of their drivers. Then once that started happening the firewire/USB driver compatibility issues started creeping up.

In my opinion Apple is better off than most native DAW manufacturers because they make a computer platform, an OS, and a DAW. They also seem to have Apogee in their back pocket for developing i/o interfaces. It does seem to me that Apple has the best chance at competing with Digi. Native or TDM plugins have never been the biggest decision for me.......Time is money and I think reliability will play a big part in deciding which companies dominate the next generation DAW.
Old 24th November 2009
  #345
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Quote:
Originally Posted by terminal3 View Post
Yes, but now you're talking hardware as well... price-wise I meant just software. The hardware will be more expensive, for sure. And it will be a question of whether they stick to the existing business model of having software that is essentially "free with hardware purchase" or whether there will in fact be a stand-alone software version that can use any hardware the user wants. Time will tell.
ahh, i see and I think you have a good question.

i still might pay a couple grand of so for PT software if it solves ALL the limitations/problems with PTLE and let me use my Apogee converters.
Old 24th November 2009
  #346
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oceantracks's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by terminal3 View Post
And it will be a question of whether they stick to the existing business model of having software that is essentially "free with hardware purchase" or whether there will in fact be a stand-alone software version that can use any hardware the user wants. Time will tell.
Avid/Digi = Hardware company.

You will never see a native version of PT without a hardware dongle of some kind, forget it, not gonna happen.

TH
Old 24th November 2009
  #347
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nativeaudio's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by oceantracks View Post
Avid/Digi = Hardware company.

You will never see a native version of PT without a hardware dongle of some kind, forget it, not gonna happen.

TH
That dongle could be an iLok, or of course their interfaces.

Digidesign used to make sound replacement chips for the a drum machine, so if would have that discussion back then, someone could easily have said "Digidesign is a company that makes chips with drum sounds on, they will never make a digital recording system". Sometimes things change.
Old 24th November 2009
  #348
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blackcatdigi's Avatar
We've been pontificating these issues for a long time around these parts!

Here's some historical reflection if you're bored...

Will PC's triumph in the end? What's to become of Proo Tools?
Old 24th November 2009
  #349
Quote:
Originally Posted by oceantracks View Post
Avid/Digi = Hardware company.

You will never see a native version of PT without a hardware dongle of some kind, forget it, not gonna happen.

TH
You could have said that about Avid 10-15 years ago wrt their video stuff, and you'd have been wrong. Media Composer is now native, and uncrippled. There is hardware available for acceleration and fancier I/O of course that they make, but it's not mandatory. There's a protection dongle, yes, but no hardware required.
Old 24th November 2009
  #350
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oceantracks's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by terminal3 View Post
You could have said that about Avid 10-15 years ago wrt their video stuff, and you'd have been wrong. Media Composer is now native, and uncrippled. There is hardware available for acceleration and fancier I/O of course that they make, but it's not mandatory. There's a protection dongle, yes, but no hardware required.
Trust me.

TH
Old 24th November 2009
  #351
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PMoshay's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia View Post
Hey Pete.

Check out Propellerheads Record.

Propellerhead Software - Products - Record
That looks like a cool program. Are you switched to it? or just doing pre-production in it?
How's it for mixing?

Looks like we now have quite a few core audio mac programs for recording to choose from now, wish i had time to try them all in a shootout:
$79-$450 gets you big bang for your buck these days!.

1. Logic Pro
2. Ableton Live 8
3. Record
4. Harrison Mix Bus
5. Presonus Studio One
6. Nuendo
7. Digital Performer 7
8. Tracktion 3
9. GarageBand
10. Cubase

You can't say you can't afford the tools anymore!...... just add talent.
Old 24th November 2009
  #352
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SeniorityFedup's Avatar
 

I was going to post my opinion about what digidesign should do but the I realized that the illuminati controls avid/digidesign and want to steal our brilliant ideas. DONT LET THEM.

plus im a cubase supporter and i notice them configuring with yamaha products quite well and notice the only way to survive in the DAW industry is to keep making dedicated hardware for dedicated daws in order to simplify the setup for new users (band members / thug producers / music pastors/ high school music teachers) Pro tools lead the way... but doesnt mean they will stay in the lead... its all part of the business.. you get in and get out. you gotta lose the title sometimes.
Old 25th November 2009
  #353
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nativeaudio's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaman View Post
Very interesting points.
Do you have a link to that discussion ?
I'm pretty sure it was this thread:
Pro Tools LE to HD upgrade special: Open discussion - Digi User Conference

843 posts long and counting...
Old 25th November 2009
  #354
Gear Guru
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by nativeaudio View Post

at the time where several Gearslutz members suggested that they should move in this direction, at least 2-3 years ago
The suggestions that members of Gearslutz have been making to audio manufacturers are rarely based on a genuine concern for the corporate well-being. Though such suggestions almost always couched in terms of "if they were smart they would".... , the sentence always finishes with the equivalent of "give me lots and lots more and charge me much much less"
Old 25th November 2009
  #355
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PMoshay's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by nativeaudio;4818240e "Apogee, RME, Lynx and others make really inexpensive [B
PCIe cards[/B] that lets their users connect with great interfaces and reduce latency, and I can't think of one single reason that Avid wouldn't do the same."
You forgot to factor in that Apogee, RME & Lynx don't make a full solution product, they go all the way to the DAW software input and stop designing.
Its a bit easier to to just do A/D.
Old 25th November 2009
  #356
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relaxo's Avatar
Save Save Save!!! And get ahead! ………...Not.

Buying your lifetime tools just because they're the cheapest out there is the #1 biggest FOOL'S GAME.

Logic is $499 and $625 with some interface. Cubase is (K) (free) as is tons of other stuff. We make out living from this stuff, we feed our families. W.T.Freak does it matter if the initial cost of your DAW is $150 or $15,000? Get the best and most efficient tool for your tasks. Can't pay that much now? Get a loan or get a job or intern somewhere for free use of THE RIGHT TOOLS for whatever you're doing. And if the $150 DAW really is the best for you, be thankful and use it.

I know this thread is about all users, not just pro users, but I'm shocked at how much Gearslutz and DUC professionals are always talking about things that SHOULD ONLY MATTER TO HOBBYISTS, whether your DAW or your VIs are $100 or "far too expensive $1000" and blah blah blah and are "wondering" if $900 extra is worth it for software that you spend the next five years making $100,000-$500,000 with, and are including price as a deciding factor. Listen from this thread:

***************

"All Native DAWS are now under $500.00. "

"1. Spend 3 times as much as a Native user to upgrade and keep current with
little extra benefit.
2. Stick with your older machine and hope that Pro Tools 9 isn't something that
you really need, as you watch the Mbox guys get to use it for a $99 upgrade price.
3. Make the switch to a Native system and cash in those cards to buy a Mac Pro 8
core and pocket the difference.

"i still might pay a couple grand of so for PT software if it solves ALL the limitations/problems with PTLE and let me use my Apogee converters."

"I agree. It simply cannot be priced higher than Nuendo + NEK. It will definitely be more than Logic, though."

"3k just for the software? One would hope not. They couldn't possibly sell a native PT for that much coin."

"How much could they charge for a native HD system ?"

"But what I'd really like to know is about AVID's price points in the future."

"Everyone starts to gripe about how the prices are out of control."

"Even as I was literally thrilled with the power to mix music on my own terms the HD rig gave me (and still am!), when I first got it I knew it was overpriced for what it was. "

"Just got my Sweetwater catalog and I started checking prices.

"Except Pro Tools and Nuendo. So I believe other companies should have their issues as well. Can Nuendo survive with all other DAWS matching the Logic price point? Companies like Live and Cubase were built that way. Digital Performer? What does Nuendo give you for that extra money?"

"The only prices they have reduced are Logic and Final Cut. Everything else is high in the sky."

"and finally already have, by offering PTHD for half price. That will give them some cash"

"And at it's price point, Pro Tools LE is still in the game."

***************

This place sounds like the LUG (Logic Users Group) most days. 30,000 post a day from bedrooms around the world. 30 posts a day from pro studios. I could get more and more material just from this thread alone. A couple hundred dollars or a couple more grand is nothing for your main DAW that you'll spend tens of thousands of hours virtually existing and working in, making a living.

Price is SO insignificant when you compare it to your time. That's why I wish Avid would RAISE their prices if that's what it takes to avoid fiascos like Structure and the disastrous MBox2 crashing Macs with Core Audio on Intel Macs all day for OVER TWO YEARS and implement ADC, Freeze, fix RTAS and fix the bugs and get PT back on track and then keep on making it greater and greater and greater.

Don't even get me started on that "Macs are totally overpriced" or "Digi PT TDM is totally overpriced." When we are working we live and work inside of our virtual computer realm…literally living there for tens of thousands of hours. Do I want to have my head inside of a sh*t hole" for tens of thousands of hours? No, I use OSX on Macs, thank you. OSX is the the best product of any kind that I have ever bought in my entire life. And I use PTHD. They are the best for me and my studio. They're essential, they're untouchable at this job, they're fun, they look great, and the work great and I like living in there for 8-14 hours a day and so do the many of people that work in my studio. There are no other options and I'm not even looking for any others. I'm happy with PT at my studio. If I got rid of my $35,000 worth of Pro Tools and TDM plugins in my studio, my business would 99% dry up within hours. Finished. I'll go from buy-mode to sell-mode in "Gearslutz Secondhand gear classifieds."

Yes, I am all for $5000 or $10,000 native-only DAW software w/o hardware if it does everything better than PT HD and is brilliant at every level.









(Nothing against Cubase, Live, Sonar or Logic, etc. They are the best at what they do best. If I didn't have this recording studio business I wouldn't own PT. I like Logic for my songwriting...NO...LOVE Logic.)

(Also, Macs are totally overpriced in the same way that Mercedes are totally overpriced. And Mercedes ARE totally overpriced as a vehicle. But if I was a taxi driver 60 hours a week my whole life, I'd spend the extra $20,000 to look at the Mercedes dashboard all day rather than the Chrysler Minivan dashboard for thousands of hours every year...just me. And you pick up a hell of a lot more customers, have less down time and get twice as many years out of the car.)
Old 25th November 2009
  #357
Lives for gear
 
PMoshay's Avatar
 

Just put a hard disk recorder in one of these with 48 inputs & outs and allow me to record 48 tracks. Let me plug in up to 2 screens (or not - standalone mode)
Also let me upgrade the i/o if i want and add more processor power with a 1 space box.
attach it to PT8 with all the plug's i already own (and will buy)
~~~Take my money~~~
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Old 25th November 2009
  #358
Lives for gear
 
PMoshay's Avatar
 

I guess now if they do something like this, i can take all the credit for posting the idea.
Because typing your ideas on a internet forum is equal to developing a product with 100's of talented designers & developers, and typing involves lots of work.

Talk is cheap...... even cheaper than typing.heh
Old 25th November 2009
  #359
Lives for gear
 
DontLetMeDrown's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by PMoshay View Post
You forgot to factor in that Apogee, RME & Lynx don't make a full solution product, they go all the way to the DAW software input and stop designing.
Its a bit easier to to just do A/D.
Not sure what you mean. All 3 of those vendors sell their own interfaces. You're saying they should make their own DAW?
Old 25th November 2009
  #360
Lives for gear
 
PMoshay's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by DontLetMeDrown View Post
Not sure what you mean. All 3 of those vendors sell their own interfaces. You're saying they should make their own DAW?
I see people saying how easy it is for people to make great low latency interfaces....... true........ but finish the job and get it into my DAW, mix, eq, effect & sum it w/ADC with little latency while using a 3rd party computer & operating system (that people keep updating constantly).

So far i only see a few manufacturers up to that full task.

Interfaces (A/D) are easy and have been done well for years. It's from the back of your computer to your speakers thats a bitch.
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