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Assuming the Shure SM7 has less bleed then a LDC
Old 5th September 2009
  #1
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Energie's Avatar
 

Assuming the Shure SM7 has less bleed then a LDC

I have been itching for a SM7b, and I will be doing a semi live recording soon where the singer will be somewhat in proximity to other noises. I am assuming the SM7 will pick up less ambient noise then say a LDC? am I correct in this?
Old 5th September 2009
  #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Energie View Post
I have been itching for a SM7b, and I will be doing a semi live recording soon where the singer will be somewhat in proximity to other noises. I am assuming the SM7 will pick up less ambient noise then say a LDC? am I correct in this?
Generally yes. A 441 is good for this as well
Old 5th September 2009
  #3
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imloggedin's Avatar
 

Yes alot less. Especially when compressed.
Old 5th September 2009
  #4
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A LaMere's Avatar
 

Y-E-S!

The bleed rejection of the sm7 is kind of amazing...
best mic I've ever used for this anyways...
Old 5th September 2009
  #5
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Energie's Avatar
 

alrighty then. I may have to give this mic a spin then. Less bleed will certainly help in the upcoming situation if it works with the singer.
Old 5th September 2009
  #6
This is a very tricky and deceptive question to which I feel the answers so far have been simplistic and not really correct.

The problem is that you have merely said "a LDC" without specifying WHAT TYPE of LDC.

If the LDC you're referring to is a single pattern cardiod or omni (or a multipattern with only cardiod and omni patters available), then the answer would be yes, probably.

If the answer is ANY LDC, the answer would be NO, it depends on the available patterns. Some multipattern LDCs give you the choice of supercardiod and hypercardiod patterns which definitely have better rejection than an SM7. A figure 8 will have better rejection from the sides, but not the back (obviously). A shotgun will have better rejection as well, but is probably not desirable for your purpose for other reasons.

You simply can not lump all LDCs together in a question like this. It's like asking "Are all apples bigger than a potato?"

If bleed is really a problem and you want to use a dynamic, try a BeyerDynamic M88N(C) hypercardiod.
Old 5th September 2009
  #7
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MOST LDC's are more sensitive. For me its not a matter of being hyper or cardoid or whatever, its about sensitivity. Hypercardioids have a bigger pickup pattern from the back (room) than normal cardioids anyway.
Old 5th September 2009
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Eppstein View Post
This is a very tricky and deceptive question to which I feel the answers so far have been simplistic and not really correct.

The problem is that you have merely said "a LDC" without specifying WHAT TYPE of LDC.

If the LDC you're referring to is a single pattern cardiod or omni (or a multipattern with only cardiod and omni patters available), then the answer would be yes, probably.

If the answer is ANY LDC, the answer would be NO, it depends on the available patterns. Some multipattern LDCs give you the choice of supercardiod and hypercardiod patterns which definitely have better rejection than an SM7. A figure 8 will have better rejection from the sides, but not the back (obviously). A shotgun will have better rejection as well, but is probably not desirable for your purpose for other reasons.

You simply can not lump all LDCs together in a question like this. It's like asking "Are all apples bigger than a potato?"

If bleed is really a problem and you want to use a dynamic, try a BeyerDynamic M88N(C) hypercardiod.
my experience:
if your in a noisy or poor environment any condenser compared to an SM7 is going to pull in more room and noise.
I often cut vocals in acoustically challenged environments and hardly ever use an condenser becuase of it. With the SM7 I don't even need to put up goboes or blankets around the singer, and can even cut them in front of speakers; and compressed pretty well going in.
Old 5th September 2009
  #9
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hazelmossobrien's Avatar
 

the SM7 rejects because it is uber weak, you need a million db of gain just to achieve unity in your DAW. its a regular old cardioid pickup pattern with no more or less rejection than another cardioid dynamic mic set at the same level, it just is less sensitive and needs twice as much gain to achieve that level.

if you're recording the vocals from a Live show, just take a feed from the live board and smack a 58 in front of your singer?
Old 5th September 2009
  #10
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James Lehmann's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Energie View Post
I have been itching for a SM7b, and I will be doing a semi live recording soon where the singer will be somewhat in proximity to other noises. I am assuming the SM7 will pick up less ambient noise then say a LDC? am I correct in this?
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Eppstein View Post
You simply can not lump all LDCs together in a question like this. It's like asking "Are all apples bigger than a potato?"
John is right to pick up on a tendency to generalise on Gearslutz (itself a generalisation!), although I think this one is more reasonable than most. So I'll just say that the SM7B picks up a lot less ambient noise than the LDCs I have here which are a Gefell M930 and a Brauner Phantom.
Old 5th September 2009
  #11
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I think that the generalization of a condenser LDC being more sensitive and pickup up more then a dynamic mic is usually a pretty safe bet 9/10. Not having any first hand experience with the sm7, just asking if this would be the case with the SM7b, and if it would work in a semi live environment, to which is seems it would do a good job! As of now I would have to use a Mojave 200 or something like a Shure KSM32 for vocals.

have had good luck though with handheld consensers live such as the shure KSM9. The SM7 is more affordable, and I have dug what I heard on it for guitar amps as well and wouldn't mind having a dynamic vocal mic with good reputation. thanks for the thoughts.
Old 5th September 2009
  #12
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A LaMere's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Eppstein View Post
This is a very tricky and deceptive question to which I feel the answers so far have been simplistic and not really correct.

The problem is that you have merely said "a LDC" without specifying WHAT TYPE of LDC.

If the LDC you're referring to is a single pattern cardiod or omni (or a multipattern with only cardiod and omni patters available), then the answer would be yes, probably.

If the answer is ANY LDC, the answer would be NO, it depends on the available patterns. Some multipattern LDCs give you the choice of supercardiod and hypercardiod patterns which definitely have better rejection than an SM7. A figure 8 will have better rejection from the sides, but not the back (obviously). A shotgun will have better rejection as well, but is probably not desirable for your purpose for other reasons.

You simply can not lump all LDCs together in a question like this. It's like asking "Are all apples bigger than a potato?"

If bleed is really a problem and you want to use a dynamic, try a BeyerDynamic M88N(C) hypercardiod.

hahaha!! While I agree with the idea behind this post... and I agree that there are a lot of generalizations here at the slutz...
I don't think that this is a generalization...

Maybe you haven't used an sm7?? It blocks out ambient noise in a nearly magical manner... better than any other dynamic I've used as well... (when using the smaller of the two 'pop filters')

I SINCERELY doubt... that any true condenser mic will pick up less room or even the same amount as a Shure SM7. In fact, I'd challenge anyone to find even a single condenser that will work as well as the sm7 in this regard.

It isn't a generalization when the answer is = Yes, every apple in the world is bigger than any potatoe that has ever existed.
Old 5th September 2009
  #13
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EqnoixStudios's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Energie View Post
I have been itching for a SM7b, and I will be doing a semi live recording soon where the singer will be somewhat in proximity to other noises. I am assuming the SM7 will pick up less ambient noise then say a LDC? am I correct in this?
That is absolutely right. I tracked a band last week where the singer wanted to sing in the control room with the monitors blasting. I just plugged in the sm7b and let him rip. I couldn't have asked for a better mic for him.
Old 5th September 2009
  #14
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Brent Hahn's Avatar
 

Another factor is the character of the leakage. With an SM7 (or SM58), when you mix you can duck the fader between vocal phrases and the overall character of your mix won't change much. With a big condenser, it'll probably be more of an issue.
Old 5th September 2009
  #15
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hazelmossobrien's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by A LaMere View Post
hahaha!!

I SINCERELY doubt... that any true condenser mic will pick up less room or even the same amount as a Shure SM7. In fact, I'd challenge anyone to find even a single condenser that will work as well as the sm7 in this regard.

It isn't a generalization when the answer is = Yes, every apple in the world is bigger than any potatoe that has ever existed.
DUUUUDE!

there is no comparison! one is a dynamic and one is a condenser. If you use ANY dynamic mic it will pick up less ambient noise than a condenser. It will also pick up less critical detail, by nature! there is no debate here.

the SM7 is just another dynamic, but perhaps weaker than your average dynamic mic. The difference is with the SM7 you crank the pre higher to hit nominal level, so in the end you will pick up just as much noise as other dynamic mics, it just doesn't seem this way because you need more gain to get there. the SM7 is cardioid, not hyper-cardioid. If its isolation you're after than the OP would be better off with a shotgun or hyper-cardioid dynamic like a ATM61HE. If you want the SM7 sound, then get one.

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