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24/44.1 vs 24/48
Old 6th August 2005
  #1
Gear Maniac
 

24/44.1 vs 24/48

i know this has been covered in a lot of threads, but those threads get into the higher samplerates as well and it gets a bit confusing for me.

i track in 24/44.1 and a colleague suggested i start recording in 24/48 because it is a big improvement in quality. i don't really see that.

i usually stay in the box for processing, eq, etc.
my analogue i/o is a LynxTwo.

is 24/48 a big improvement over 24.44.1 when tracking and mixing in the box?
Old 6th August 2005
  #2
Lives for gear
 
Ziggy!!'s Avatar
 

Use your own ears and decide... everyone else has...
Old 6th August 2005
  #3
Gear Maniac
 

thats the plan, as always, but theoretically speaking what should get the best results?
Old 6th August 2005
  #4
Lives for gear
 

I think 48k sounds better than 44,1.
Old 6th August 2005
  #5
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DivineMusic's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by juicemaster1500
I think 48k sounds better than 44,1.
depending on the converters i think 48 is smoother but brighter too..when i use to record at 44 i never had siblance issues at 48 my vocals have more detail and siblance.. nothing a little eq/deesser can't fix though
Old 6th August 2005
  #6
Lives for gear
 

I don't think 44.1 sounds any better, but in some cases sounds worse. For instance when using man soft synths. They are designed for 44.1k an have to truncate in real time as you use them. This eats up more CPU and deteriorates the sound.
Old 6th August 2005
  #7
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
I don't think 44.1 sounds any better, but in some cases sounds worse. For instance when using man soft synths. They are designed for 44.1k an have to truncate in real time as you use them. This eats up more CPU and deteriorates the sound.
you mean 48 doesn't sound any better?
if not sure i'm not sure i understand you..
Old 6th August 2005
  #8
Lives for gear
 

depends

not much of an end result difference in sound really, If you have a really good monitor rig and a really nice dac you might hear the diff.

The real reason to go 48K is if you do any work for tv or film. 48K is the standard for delivery in these fields.
Old 6th August 2005
  #9
Gear Addict
 
mixer's Avatar
 

there is a difference in 24 and 16 bit..as for 44.1 and 48 i really don't hear it.for video i use 48.
Old 7th August 2005
  #10
Lou Judson
Guest
If you use 48k you will have to sample rate convert, which for my money degrades it enolugh to offest the advantages. Try it sometime - record some of each, convert the 48 to 44.1, and compare. Unless you take an inordinate amount fo tiime to do the conversion is isn't worth it.

When I get 48k DATs in from clients, I go analog to 44.1 - sounds just as good or better that converting it in the box.

<L>
Old 7th August 2005
  #11
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max cooper's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lou Judson
If you use 48k you will have to sample rate convert, which for my money degrades it enolugh to offest the advantages. Try it sometime - record some of each, convert the 48 to 44.1, and compare. Unless you take an inordinate amount fo tiime to do the conversion is isn't worth it.

<L>
I've always lazily assumed this to be the case; never tested it.
Old 7th August 2005
  #12
[EDIT: Just ignore all the nonsense I spew below about sampler rate conversion between 'uneven multiples' being problematic. I didn't know what I was talking about.]

A higher sample rate is better, all things being equal.

But things never are, are they?

The obvious downside is relatively negligible (as I'm sure most experienced hands would agree the improvement is, as well): a roughly 10% increase in processing/storage overhead.



But the really nasty downside -- depending on how you work -- is what happens when you take your nice, sparkly 48 kHz mix down to 44.1 kHz for output to CD, Mp3s, etc.

If you do it in the digital domain (through SR conversion utilities/plugs) the conversion entails a rather brutish remapping of sample values across time.) [This is nothing like moving from one digtial word length [bit depth] to another, which is a fairly non-destructive process, given the givens.]

I should point out that this nasty remapping only occurs when you move from a sample rate that is an uneven multiple of the target. If you go from exactly double the target sample rate (88.2 kHz) down to 44.1 kHz, the hit is simply a reduction in sample density (resolution). But if you move from 96 kHz or 48 kHz down to 44.1 kHz, watch out, you're going to be re-aliasing your entire file (on top of reducing resolution).


I went into some depth on this issue in this post, complete with graphics:

https://www.gearslutz.com/board/showthrea...920#post378920


Anyhow, bottom line -- if you record at 48 kHz and perform a sample rate conversion to get your audio down to the 'industry standard' of 44.1 kHz, you will very likely end up with a worse sounding product than if you started at 44.1 kHz in the first place.


__________________

This assumes, of course, you're keeping everything in the digital domain. If you mix 'out' through the analog outputs of your device (at 48) and record back into another device set to 44.1 kHz you won't have to perform that software SR conversion -- but you will be going through a whole 'nother D/A and A/D processing cycle.

Still, in the past, that's just what I did when going from 48 kHz (16 bit) DAT mixes into the computer. I first tried coming in via SPDIF and doing the SR conversion. And it really sucked. (This was a few years ago. The vendors will try to tell you that they've mastered SR conversion. I don't think so.)

So I ended up just taking the analog outs of the DAT and recording them into the analog ins on my computer rig. And it sounded a huge amount better. YMMV, to some extent. But 'uneven' SR conversion remains problematic.
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