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Need an advice for LITTLE LABS IBP
Old 9th April 2009
  #1
Gear Nut
 

Need an advice for LITTLE LABS IBP

Hi,

I'm tracking guitars with 2 mics into 2 preamps that both have phase reverse switches. Would LITTLE LABS IBP be something useful? Would I need 2 of them or just 1? Where in the signal chain does it belong?

Thank you
Mikas
Old 9th April 2009
  #2
Lives for gear
 

do some research. check out their site and you will find out.
Old 9th April 2009
  #3
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strewnshank's Avatar
 

You'd only need one (if only using two mics, since phase is a relationship between the two), it will make a difference. Feed it post pre-amp. Also, it is quite handy in the mix stage if you are OofTB.

http://www.littlelabs.com/IBPMAN.pdf
Old 9th April 2009
  #4
Here for the gear
 
benthebass's Avatar
One IBP is a great bonus to have on a mic path, can alter phase of one of two mics without having to move the mic from the sweet spot - all from the comfort of your control room and benefit of favorite monitors! Then the are ALSO great when recording drums, and bass, and the list just goes on and is equally relevant in mixing if your in analogue land. ((Gotta say though the UAD versions rock too....))

Old 9th April 2009
  #5
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Washington's Avatar
 

FYI, UAD has recently released hte IBP as a plugin, and it's a wonderful tool. I haven't used it as a hardware unit, but when miking just anything with more than one mike, any device that lets you sweep the phase shift in a continuous matter is a godsend, because things don't necessarily need exactly 180 degrees of rotation. Most interesting things happen somewhere in between.

That said, I mentioned the plugin version because IMO, nothing beats checking the phase relation of different mics after the actual take, when you can really experiment, calmly check it out in mono, etc... My advice would be for you to buy an IBP for sure, try and get the best possible sound at the recording stage but then, if at all possible with the hardware box as an insert just like with the plugin version, not to be shy to explore the relation between your different tracks a bit further. There's great things waiting for you there.

If I'm not mistaken, the UAD version also features a delay function that goes up to 4ms, which the original IBP doesn't have for obvious reasons. But you'll need a UAD card.
Old 9th April 2009
  #6
Gear Nut
 

Thank you very much everybody!
How important is placing IBP post-preamp? I'm asking because I was planning to buy Chandler TG2 and use the 2-channel summing feature, in that case I would have to use it before pre.
Old 9th April 2009
  #7
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strewnshank's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by speigas View Post
Thank you very much everybody!
How important is placing IBP post-preamp? I'm asking because I was planning to buy Chandler TG2 and use the 2-channel summing feature, in that case I would have to use it before pre.
Read that manual, hombre. It suggests that the unit is not designed to work with mic level signal, if I recall. Does the TG2 have insert points?

edit: page 4 of the link I posted earlier, left column, at the bottom of the page.
Old 9th April 2009
  #8
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heyman's Avatar
I used one recently with a Di bass and Amp'd bass signal.

I found that it made a big diffrence at tracking stage (got the signals about 85% where I needed them to be) but needed to be "altered again "with the Phase tool at mixdown. That took it the rest of the way..


Remember that I wasnt tracking 2 mic'd signals. One was a DI, so there was some bigger phase issue's at play than normal..


Best of luck..
Old 9th April 2009
  #9
Quote:
Originally Posted by speigas View Post
Thank you very much everybody!
How important is placing IBP post-preamp? I'm asking because I was planning to buy Chandler TG2 and use the 2-channel summing feature, in that case I would have to use it before pre.
Here is how I would do it: Patch the Bass Into the DI on the Channel 1 of the TG-2

Take the Output of this channel [line level] into a MULT, which will split the amplified signal two places. One side will feed the recorder, as a DI track, and the Other should feed the IBP in re-amp mode. You then send the signal out the amplifier and cab, only to listen back from the microphone being used, on the Second Channel of the TG.

Don't use the summing feature. Record TWO tracks. NOW, with this method, you can PHASE ALIGN on the WAY to the amp/cab, which will help keep the tone and response of the instrument, "full", and not out of whack. I'll suggest you will be cooking with some serious petrol for the application of recording a bass guitar.

I think you're going to run into some seroiusly bad issues, should you mess with the sum feature. I only use that when I have PSYCHICALLY ALIGNED TWO microphones on one source. OR, for the application of Top/Bot Snare or whatever, I simply correct the polarity using a XLR phase flip before it hits the amplifier.
Old 10th April 2009
  #10
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roc Mixwell View Post
Here is how I would do it: Patch the Bass Into the DI on the Channel 1 of the TG-2

Take the Output of this channel [line level] into a MULT, which will split the amplified signal two places. One side will feed the recorder, as a DI track, and the Other should feed the IBP in re-amp mode. You then send the signal out the amplifier and cab, only to listen back from the microphone being used, on the Second Channel of the TG.

Don't use the summing feature. Record TWO tracks. NOW, with this method, you can PHASE ALIGN on the WAY to the amp/cab, which will help keep the tone and response of the instrument, "full", and not out of whack. I'll suggest you will be cooking with some serious petrol for the application of recording a bass guitar.

I think you're going to run into some seroiusly bad issues, should you mess with the sum feature. I only use that when I have PSYCHICALLY ALIGNED TWO microphones on one source. OR, for the application of Top/Bot Snare or whatever, I simply correct the polarity using a XLR phase flip before it hits the amplifier.
Thank you Adam!
Old 10th April 2009
  #11
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doorknocker's Avatar
What's great about the IBP is the fact that it only effects the COMBINED signal of 2 sources.

So I might use a SM7 and a MD-421 on the same guitar amp and thus place the two mics where they individually sound the best. Let's say both mics go to a TG-2, one side will then go thru the IBP (usually the mic that is closer to the sound source but that's no hard rule so just experiment).

By doing this all the options are open:

a) You might like the combined sound of the two mics 'as is' with the IBP on bypass.

b) You fiddle with the phase on the IBP and come up with a sound that pleases you. It's best to check this in mono with both channels at the same volume but again there are no rules.

c) You have recorded the take with both mics and the IBP engaged but for some reason you decide only to use one mic/ch in the mix. No problem, as the IBP only affects the combined signal the single mics sound just like they would without the IBP in the chain!

I'm only takling about recording with the IBP here because that's the way I do it. Naturally you could use it in the mix for even more options.

Be warned that when you first get the IBP you might suffer from option anxiety. The possibilities are endless with even teh tiniest adjsutement making a big difference and you will find that there is no 'right' setting. Often I just wondered whether a sound was 'better' ot just 'different'. But I promise that it will get easier the more you use it. The IBP is absolutely fanastic but it is not always needed when using more than one mic on a source or when combining DI/mic etc.

BTW, The DI in the IBP is fantastic as well. I find it expecially great for bass guitar, very clear and deep sounding.
Old 10th April 2009
  #12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roc Mixwell View Post
I only use that when I have PSYCHICALLY ALIGNED TWO microphones on one source. OR, for the application of Top/Bot Snare or whatever, I simply correct the polarity using a XLR phase flip before it hits the amplifier.
I love the idea of psychically aligning microphones...
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