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Neumann's being sold "at cost"!
Old 12th April 2003
  #1
Jr. Gear Slut 2nd class
 
chessparov's Avatar
 

Neumann's being sold "at cost"!

Mercenary is selling their stock of (new) Neumann's at cost.
www.mercenary.com

Chris
Old 12th April 2003
  #2
Lives for gear
 
heinz's Avatar
 

Man, when Fletcher lights up, he does it with a BANG! That picture on the Neumann page is...umm.. blunt.
Old 13th April 2003
  #3
Gear Maniac
 

IMHO, way over the top.

Neuman wants to keep the M.A.P. (maufacture's Advertised Price) policy at a specific price point. They dont want dealers to advertise the price any lower then their MAP. a dealer can sell it at any price they choose, but they cant advertise it, especially on the net.

have you ever seen the words 'call for price' that means the dealer is selling the productfor less then the manufacture wants them to state.
Old 13th April 2003
  #4
Lives for gear
 
Steve Smith's Avatar
 

I suspect the Neuman policy is a bit more encompassing than advertising. I know that Sony, for the DMX consoles, make the client write the check directly to them and pay the seller a commission to ensure sale price.
Old 13th April 2003
  #5
Super Moderator
 
Remoteness's Avatar
Based on the March 13, 2003 letter I received from Neumann USA, it's strictly about the new Neumann pricing and MAP policy which was set for April 1, 2003.

It stated; Neuman will take immediate action with any retailer who advertises discounts in excess of the stated minimum advertised price points in any print, radio, Internet or other electronic advertising medium. This includes online pricing and features like "click for pricing" or "add to shopping cart" options.

Neuman also added...

Any sales of new product via online auctions sites like eBay, etc., are no longer acceptable by authorized Neuman USA dealers.

And that's all they wrote. I'm not sure what happen with regard to Mercenary Audio. Fletcher would be the best person to explain his position and points on the matter.
Old 13th April 2003
  #6
Lives for gear
 

Fletcher has quite publicly stated that the new Neumann production is fairly dismal, and that the are better choices for the same money.

So, here's guy literally putting his money where his mouth is. Outstanding!

Kudos, fletcher.
Old 13th April 2003
  #7
Lives for gear
 
e-cue's Avatar
 

Probably the 1st good deal I've ever seen on Merc.com. Now if only Crane Song would piss him off...
Old 13th April 2003
  #8
Gear Maniac
 

yeah as long as he orders plenty of products before he pisses them off...

Not much neuman stuff in stock at the mercenary site.

Damn what picture would he use to promote the blowout sale? manely and crane song wasn't around in the 40's. Is Sadam available for a product placement photo?
Old 13th April 2003
  #9
Lives for gear
 
e-cue's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally posted by Fuzzy Logic
yeah as long as he orders plenty of products before he pisses them off...

Not much neuman stuff in stock at the mercenary site.

Damn what picture would he use to promote the blowout sale? manely and crane song wasn't around in the 40's. Is Sadam available for a product placement photo?
lol, the mental imaginary of Saddam tweaking an IBIS...
Old 13th April 2003
  #10
Jr. Gear Slut 2nd class
 
chessparov's Avatar
 

Chinese based manufacturers who affront Mercenary get a poster
of Chairman Mao along with the blow-out sale!

Chris
Old 14th April 2003
  #11
Gear Maniac
 

What did the 149's go for? just curious...also I wonder what he will consider the 149 and u87 replacement... I assume the soundelux E47 for the 149 which sounds better anyway
Old 18th April 2003
  #12
Lives for gear
 
littledog's Avatar
 

I was away for a few days. So I just read this and ran right over to the Mercenary website. Not even a single mention of ANY Neumann microphone (on sale or not) in the mic section.

whassup wif dat?
Old 18th April 2003
  #13
Lives for gear
 
David R.'s Avatar
 

Whoever has a few hours to kill should look at the discussion going on at rec.audio.pro, lots of talk about it there. As for the photo, it was not doctored. Think about it, what kind of microphone would a German leader be speaking into at that time? I'm sure if you did some searches you could find more just like it.

Personally, it is over the top. The implications are more than what is necessary for his point. My understanding is that Neumann is not being fair with their policies, I'm guessing they are afraid of thier product being 'diluted.'
Old 19th April 2003
  #14
Gear Addict
 

And selling their mics at Banjo Mart doesn't dilute their product? The "call/ask for" pricing is the same, the service sucks, the product knowledge is non-existant, and they certainly don't double the warranty.

Bear
Old 20th April 2003
  #15
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally posted by littledog
I was away for a few days. So I just read this and ran right over to the Mercenary website. Not even a single mention of ANY Neumann microphone (on sale or not) in the mic section.

whassup wif dat?
I wonder why? heh
Old 20th April 2003
  #17
Gear Maniac
 

I hope Rupert Neve doesnt piss him off. i would hate to find out after all these years, that Neve (really) sucks!
Old 20th April 2003
  #18
Lives for gear
 
Steve Smith's Avatar
 

I would hate it if Rupert started building things that sucked.

I ahve never heard Fletcher bitch about a good condition 47 or 67, just the new crap.
Old 21st April 2003
  #19
member no 666
 
Fletcher's Avatar
Quote:
Originally posted by Steve Smith
I have never heard Fletcher bitch about a good condition 47 or 67, just the new crap.
Key words in that sentence: "good condition"
Old 21st April 2003
  #20
Lowdbrent
Guest
Quote:
Originally posted by Fuzzy Logic
I wonder why? heh
I am no attorney, but I believe that the MAP thing is illegal. If not, is is just stupid. Everybody knows who the wheeler-dealers are and who doesn't discount. So why make the dealers waste ink and print a false price, or a "call-us".

It was my understanding that MAP policies cannot go any further that suggesting what the mic sells for. They make you sell it for a price, unless they just give you no margin, like a C or a D price. Anything further is a blocking of the free-trade act in the US.

Some engineer/attorney can straighten this out.
Old 22nd April 2003
  #21
member no 666
 
Fletcher's Avatar
Quote:
Originally posted by Lowdbrent
I am no attorney, but I believe that the MAP thing is illegal. If not, is is just stupid. Everybody knows who the wheeler-dealers are and who doesn't discount. So why make the dealers waste ink and print a false price, or a "call-us".

It was my understanding that MAP policies cannot go any further that suggesting what the mic sells for. They make you sell it for a price, unless they just give you no margin, like a C or a D price. Anything further is a blocking of the free-trade act in the US.

Some engineer/attorney can straighten this out.
It may be a state to state issue... but MAP's are [as far as I know] entirely legal... "price fixing" isn't, but "MAP"s are. There are also things like 'fair trade laws', which vary from state to state... which is why M-A was officially fired for "bad language" [telling them to go **** themselves... which in my book means we quit... but just to make sure their ass was covered they fired us for a non-distribution related event].
Old 22nd April 2003
  #22
Lives for gear
 
jazzius's Avatar
 

hmmmm......if i was German i think i'd be seriously offended by Fletchers' antics!

A German company pisses him off so it's out with pictures of Hitler and babbling about WWII!

What kind of infantile racist foolishness is that?dfegad
Old 22nd April 2003
  #23
Gear Maniac
 
fishtop_records's Avatar
 

Neumann USA is not a German company.
It is just the US distributor of the German-made
product. They also distributed Sennheiser.
(Maybe with separate letterhead).

Still, if Fletcher is pissed, he can post whatever
he wants. Even if he isn't pissed.

As an aside, it is interesting. The TLM 103 appears
to be history, casualty of the improving
quality of the Shanghai LDCs. And
maybe the rediscovery of ribbon mics
like the Royer and AEAs.

And the fall of the Dollar against the Euro
does not help the pricing of "fine old world
craftsmenship"
Old 22nd April 2003
  #24
Lives for gear
 
jazzius's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally posted by fishtop_records
Neumann USA is not a German company.
It is just the US distributor of the German-made
product. They also distributed Sennheiser.
So, even less reason for taking the "Basil Fawlty" route?
Old 22nd April 2003
  #25
member no 666
 
Fletcher's Avatar
Quote:
Originally posted by jazzius
A German company pisses him off so it's out with pictures of Hitler and babbling about WWII!
No... we posted a picture of some vintage Neumann CMV-3 microphones that had some dude with a bad haircut making a speech... how is that "anti-German"?

The speaker was born and dead long before I arrived on the planet... so there is no way I could have contributed to the speaker's rise, nor fall from grace... and the microphones were made by Neumann Gmbh, before Mercenary Audio was even a remote concept...

Mercenary has bought and sold several 'Hitler' mics [a common alternative name for the Neumann CMV-3... how it got that alternative name I'm unsure... but I don't think it takes a degree in rocket science to do the math to be able to have an educated guess on the subject] during it's time... but we never made them, nor did we have anything to do with the microphone selection nor placement from the historical event portrayed in the photo on our website.

It's a historical photograph. We didn't take the photograph, we didn't create the photograph in "photoshop" nor any other photo manipulation program... so, I'm kinda curious... exactly how are we 'racist'?

History is history... you either learn it or you're doomed to repeat it. If that's racist... then I reckon I'm a ****ing racist. I've been called worse.
Old 22nd April 2003
  #26
Lives for gear
 
Steve Smith's Avatar
 

jazzius, perhaps you should look at your Avatar and read your post again?
Old 22nd April 2003
  #27
Lowdbrent
Guest
MA, Neumann, Politics, Irreverance

Well, I guess Neumann boys haven't ever been to an AES or a NAMM show. I guess that they have never associated with any musicians, rappers, engineers, producers, record company execs, or any person with a sense of humor. I hope that when I am at their booth, that I see bibles laying around, and no hot babes, no booze, no cursing going on in their presence. What crap.

EVERYBODY knows that Fletcher speaks his mind, and uses some colorful metaphors. There are some people that I was related to that used potty speak, every-other-word, and didn't think anything of it. It was a matter of their upbringing and environment (WWII era in Rhode Island, Conneticut and New York). I myself am a Christian and try not to talk that way, but I sure would be the first to e-mail or call Fletcher and listen to his sermon, because he doesn't waste time, and when you have gotten his opinion, you know EXACTLY what he thought.

As far as Neumann goes, the market is going to fall out of the used market. It is getting harder (and more expensive) to locate parts and have them refurb'ed. Neumann isn't making anything that competes with what they had in the KM100, 54, 56, 47Fet, 48Tube, etc. etc. Unless they can do some exact replicas or something, The 797's, etc will be the mics to choose. The differences are too slim to justify the added expense.

Germans are VERY anti-semetic. Consider why Germany did not want us going in to Habib-ville. They were providing Saddam Insane with technology and uclear reactor product. They also have an insterest in the demise of Israel, just as Russia does. So one picture about THEIR PROUD PAST should not offend them.

Fletcher, you should have put a picture up of a Volkswagon Beetle. That would have hacked them off too. That thing WAS commissioned by Hitler to be "the peoples car."
Old 22nd April 2003
  #28
Lives for gear
 
malice's Avatar
 

Re: MA, Neumann, Politics, Irreverance

Quote:
Originally posted by Lowdbrent
Germans are VERY anti-semetic. Consider why Germany did not want us going in to Habib-ville. They were providing Saddam Insane with technology and uclear reactor product. They also have an insterest in the demise of Israel, just as Russia does. So one picture about THEIR PROUD PAST should not offend them.

Fletcher, you should have put a picture up of a Volkswagon Beetle. That would have hacked them off too. That thing WAS commissioned by Hitler to be "the peoples car."
The problem with making such a funny joke like Fletcher just did, is not people who understand and dislike your sense of humor, it is people, like you, who doesn't understand, and start to suport you and make stupid comments and lame interpretations about it ...

malice
Old 22nd April 2003
  #29
Lowdbrent
Guest
Hey Malice, when your country grows some balls and gets out of bed with every political *****, you can have an understanding of where I am coming from. Maybe you forgot. Had we irreverant people not interceded, you would not exist today, nor would your little country. If your bloodline did exist, you would be German.

I don't see how I misinterpreted anything. Read Fletchers post again, then read mine. He used a picture of the Hitler mic, they didn't like it, or approve of Fletchers language. Show me where I missed it. I made the point that a Volkswagon would be more offensive to everyone, than that pic, as it WAS commissioned by Hilter directly, and we all see them or use them today. I also made the point that if Neumann is going to sensor their dealers, that they should sensor themselves at the shows, or any place that they are in public eye as Neumann employees.

I am not supporting Fletcher specifically, but his role in the market and his right to operate how he wants (lawfully), as we have freedom to do so here.
Old 22nd April 2003
  #30
Lives for gear
 
malice's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally posted by Lowdbrent
Hey Malice, when your country grows some balls and gets out of bed with every political *****, you can have an understanding of where I am coming from. Maybe you forgot. Had we irreverant people not interceded, you would not exist today, nor would your little country. If your bloodline did exist, you would be German.
Hey Lowdbrent, go to the war thread in the moan zone, it is more than 50 pages long, but I'm sure you have time between two HD rental.
You might learn that :

- French army was first line in the first gulf war
- You would not exist too if french did not help you against british (you might have to open an history book occasionaly)
- Being German is not a disease, as being american, even when some of you are making such childish understatments like you did about german people.
- That George Bush grandfather himself made business with **** Germany before, and during WWII, that Joe Kennedy had some unavowable preferences too
- That US created Bin Ladden AND Saddam along with Nato country giving WMD during Iran/Iraq conflict
- That a similar veto was used in the Suez conflict by US against France ...

I could get on and on, but I won't answer you here, you'll have to read that thread, inform you a little, then I might discuss that matters in the appropriate forum ...

Quote:
I don't see how I misinterpreted anything. Read Fletchers post again, then read mine. He used a picture of the Hitler mic, they didn't like it, or approve of Fletchers language. Show me where I missed it.
the part where you are assuming Germany as a people are just a bunch of **** perhaps ...

Quote:
I made the point that a Volkswagon would be more offensive to everyone, than that pic, as it WAS commissioned by Hilter directly, and we all see them or use them today.
How about General motors factories in **** Germany building bombers motors and troop transportations for hitler ?
Everyone knows about the beettle and bmw, well, maybe not in Tulsa ...

Quote:
I am not supporting Fletcher specifically, but his role in the market and his right to operate how he wants (lawfully), as we have freedom to do so here.
Well, hopefully I am, but you would have to understand my post to understand that I was not bashing Fletcher.
What I don't like is racist peoples, and you just proved you are racist ...

btw, part of my family died in cocentration camps during WWII, and I don't have any wishes to say that Germans are anti-semitic.

Fortunatly, I suffered from your tone in that post, and I won't be anti-american either in the future...

go figure

malice
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