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Anyone running balanced power?
Old 10th July 2002
  #1
Here for the gear
 

Anyone running balanced power?

I'm looking to get a balanced power setup for my studio (less than $2,000 preferrably) and I'm unsure what to get. I've got one helluva noise floor and it's all cuz the power in my area sucks like a Hoover. grudge

There's a few units that intrigue me... Equitech's ETR units, Monster HTPS7000, and the Furman IT line. Anyone here use any of these? Any testimony that it cuts the hiss out significantly?

Heard about a bunch of massive studios that are using this stuff now... Thought it about time I take that leap...
Old 10th July 2002
  #2
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Fibes's Avatar
 

I use a Furman it25 (or something like that) that I purchased as a scratch and dent from Musicians friend for 850. It is the best thing I could've done for my studio. The noise floor dropped immensely. Be carefull where you place it because it can be it's own source of hum...
Old 10th July 2002
  #3
Moderator emeritus
 

I'm running a couple of Furman it-1220's - one on the console and the other for tape machines and computers and such. The only issue I have with noise is from my effects, mostly the Lexicon PCM 80 and PCM 90. I'm going to try (when I get some time) to power those from the Furmans, but I did that in my last room and it really didn't help much.
Old 10th July 2002
  #4
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Fibes's Avatar
 

Didn't help my lexis much. They are their own noise generators. When I have my auxes down the board is a s quiet as I can imagine. Now for the G4 issue.
Old 10th July 2002
  #5
member no 666
 
Fletcher's Avatar
I run it on guitar rigs like a religion... other than that, when I consult on a "studio build" in the US I have as much of the gear run on 220v as possible. Here in the US 220v is two symmetrical legs of 110... a.k.a. "Balanced Power".
Old 10th July 2002
  #6
Moderator emeritus
 

Quote:
Originally posted by Fletcher
I run it on guitar rigs like a religion... other than that, when I consult on a "studio build" in the US I have as much of the gear run on 220v as possible. Here in the US 220v is two symmetrical legs of 110... a.k.a. "Balanced Power".
Hmm - that may be a cool answer for me - to take one of the units out of the machine room (where it's not needed) and make it available in the tracking room for guitars. Thanks for the idea!
Old 10th July 2002
  #7
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Fibes's Avatar
 

You could run a couple lines out the back to "technical" power locations. I have two quads run where the amps live that are heavy duty extensions from the Furman. It provides flexibility and I didn't have to move anything. It cleans up Vox amps like scrubbing bubbles.
Old 11th July 2002
  #8
Moderator emeritus
 

Quote:
Originally posted by Fibes
You could run a couple lines out the back to "technical" power locations. I have two quads run where the amps live that are heavy duty extensions from the Furman. It provides flexibility and I didn't have to move anything. It cleans up Vox amps like scrubbing bubbles.
Well, in my case, there's a sub panel in the machine room, which is the panel for all of the tech power in the building. I'd could conceivably take power from the sub panel to the Furman and then back into the panel to distribute to the tracking room, but I'm not sure either that it's possible or that it's legal. But it's another option to consider.
Old 11th July 2002
  #9
How about a small gas powered generator next to the amp? It would save on all the hassle of cabling.

Old 11th July 2002
  #10
Do you guys in the US have a LOT or power problems? Its not an often discussed topic here in the UK.
Old 11th July 2002
  #11
Gear Maniac
 
Mats Olsson's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally posted by Jules
Do you guys in the US have a LOT or power problems? Its not an often discussed topic here in the UK.
Not here in Sweden either.
Still, I think it would be a good idea to spend the issue some attention.

Regarding guitar amps (and almost everything electrical): the power plugs we are using are symetrical so that we can alter the phase-relationship by turning the plug 180 degrees, this often makes a big sonic difference on most gear - it affects sound quality and hum. All new gear we get is phase-checked by ear and then marked at the plugs.

/Mats
Old 11th July 2002
  #12
In the Uk we often try 'lifting the earth' off gtr amps that hum...

All amps have 3 pins here


Old 11th July 2002
  #13
member no 666
 
Fletcher's Avatar
Quote:
Originally posted by Jules
Do you guys in the US have a LOT or power problems? Its not an often discussed topic here in the UK.
It's not that we have "a lot" of power problems, but they do exist more so here than in the UK. I don't think I've seen more than a 10 volt fluctuation from Scotland to Wales... while you could get a 20 volt fluctuation between sound check and the show in certain parts of certain US cities...

I don't know about the power in Sweden... but the power in France is a fucking nightmare of biblical proportions... it seems like there must be some dude name Pierre that runs the power for most of France... if the wife gives up a blowjob... you get 240- 280volts that day... if she doesn't feel like giving up a 'hummer'... then you're lucky to see 180 volts. I've never done a gig anywhere in France where "power conditioning" of the highest magnatude wasn't absolutely necessary... even in Paris.

Maybe it's just my bad luck...
Old 12th July 2002
  #14
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Fibes's Avatar
 

...and then there is Japan.
Old 12th July 2002
  #15
Gear Nut
 

...not to mention Italy..tut
Old 12th July 2002
  #16
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largeunit's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally posted by Fletcher


It's not that we have "a lot" of power problems, but they do exist more so here than in the UK. I don't think I've seen more than a 10 volt fluctuation from Scotland to Wales... while you could get a 20 volt fluctuation between sound check and the show in certain parts of certain US cities...

I don't know about the power in Sweden... but the power in France is a fucking nightmare of biblical proportions... it seems like there must be some dude name Pierre that runs the power for most of France... if the wife gives up a blowjob... you get 240- 280volts that day... if she doesn't feel like giving up a 'hummer'... then you're lucky to see 180 volts. I've never done a gig anywhere in France where "power conditioning" of the highest magnatude wasn't absolutely necessary... even in Paris.

Maybe it's just my bad luck...
So, you're saying English chicks give more head?
Old 12th July 2002
  #17
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Volodia's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally posted by Fletcher


but the power in France is a fucking nightmare of biblical proportions... it seems like there must be some dude name Pierre that runs the power for most of France..
Maybe it's just my bad luck...
Surely your bad luck,cause I had no problem with the power so far (I don't do gigs though)
Old 13th July 2002
  #18
jon
Capitol Studios Paris
 
jon's Avatar
 

Where I live in the 18th arrondissement of Paris you see the occasional *momentary* power cuts...particularly on Sundays, it seems.

Sometimes it's a split-second dip, sometimes it's off and then full back on 5 seconds later -- which are the worst because the unprotected guys don't have time to shut the gear off before the power jolts back on.

Our new studio is running on tri-phased balanced power lines provided courtesy of a special contract with the folks at EDF, the state electrical monopoly, and we pay through the ****ing nose for it ($1000/month on average). That, along with some industrial-strength line protection installations here, has been working well so far.
Old 13th July 2002
  #19
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largeunit's Avatar
 

I'm running the Furman IT-1220 + APC battery backup on the computer hardware. Works well. The Furman noticeably reduced the noise in my console. My electricity brown-outs all the time, so the APC is fantastic. I like the LED readout on the Furman.
Old 13th July 2002
  #20
"Our new studio is running on tri-phased balanced power lines provided courtesy of a special contract with the folks at EDF, the state electrical monopoly" -Jon

"Friends" of yours Fletcher? heh
Old 13th July 2002
  #21
Gear Addict
 

Add me to the list of happy IT-1220 owners. My old studio was small enough for the IT-1220 to power everything - now it just covers most of control room A - so sometimes Guitar amps get left out - which is bad. I was thinking of upgrading to one of those balanced power circuit breaker boxes by Equitech. Would it be worth it ?
Old 13th July 2002
  #22
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Steve Smith's Avatar
 

I have a 20 amp Equitech rack unit that runs the entire place here ( the one benefit to digital, if you call it a benefit) Amazing Difference.
Old 15th July 2002
  #23
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Fletcher's Avatar
Quote:
Originally posted by largeunit
I'm running the Furman IT-1220 + APC battery backup on the computer hardware. Works well. The Furman noticeably reduced the noise in my console. My electricity brown-outs all the time, so the APC is fantastic. I like the LED readout on the Furman.
Do yourself a serious favor... never put an oscilloscope on the waveform coming out of the wall... if you do, you'll all of sudden start to realize that APC and "Furman" stuff really sucks!! They're OK for computer shit... but not anything that actually has to pass audio.
Old 15th July 2002
  #24
Gear Maniac
 

OK Fletcher, so what do you recomend then ?
Old 15th July 2002
  #25
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Fibes's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally posted by Fletcher


Do yourself a serious favor... never put an oscilloscope on the waveform coming out of the wall... if you do, you'll all of sudden start to realize that APC and "Furman" stuff really sucks!! They're OK for computer shit... but not anything that actually has to pass audio.
I'll agree with the APC side of the story but for a small studio the Furman AT 1220 is much much better than nothing. FWIW I don't mess with the cheap Furman stuff.

Fletcher do you have experience with the 1220?
Old 18th July 2002
  #26
Here for the gear
 

Equitech or Monster?

I figured Furman might be a little too "rough"...

What would you suggest, Fletch? I'm looking seriously at a Monster combo setup: AVS2000 and the HVPS7000. I'll get 120 volts regulated to within +-1.2 volts, balanced power, 5 stages of filtering, etc. 18 amps for about $2000.

Seems the Equitechs and the Furmans left voltage regulation out of the loop?
Old 22nd July 2002
  #27
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digitaltoast's Avatar
Quote:
Originally posted by Fletcher
I run it on guitar rigs like a religion... other than that, when I consult on a "studio build" in the US I have as much of the gear run on 220v as possible. Here in the US 220v is two symmetrical legs of 110... a.k.a. "Balanced Power".
Not quite. In an ideal world, sure. But likely those 110v legs would also be used separatly - as not all runs on 220v. In that case unequal loads on the legs effect the power factor (pf) of the lines in different ways thereby dehabilitating the advantage of balanced power.

What I am curious about is the possibility of creating a virtual ground via an equi-resistance voltage divider between the line and the neutral. I can't imagine this being legal - and I can foresee it as being rather hazardous with 60v differential between the studio ground and the code specified ground.
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