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Paradigm monitors... wow... Studio Monitors
Old 12th December 2002
  #31
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Marshall Simmons's Avatar
 

I personally have not heard the pmc speakers
What do you think of them?
how expensive are they anyways? i'd just like to see what else is in their price range...

Everyone seems to be on the ATOM bandwagon, but i have yet to head these either. i'm actually pretty interested in those as well


This is a good time in audio.
Marshall
Old 12th December 2002
  #32
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Lars FM's Avatar
 

I always had the impression that high end audiophile gear was constructed with the purpose of making music sound detailed and beautiful, whereas pro audio monitors were designed with the aim of providing the user with an unmasked picture of what was going on, detailed but not necessarily pretty..
Am i missing something?
Old 12th December 2002
  #33
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Quote:
Originally posted by Benjy King
Hey,
Since this went kind of high end:Do you have any experience with PMC AML-1 monitors? http://www.pmcloudspeaker.com/amlp.htm
I am very interested in these but have found very few people with hands on experience. Any thoughts?
I auditioned a pair of the PMC AML-1's in my studio for about a week. I also carted them to another studio where I work a lot. Although I had high hopes for them, and really wanted to like them, they just didn't do it for me. In both rooms, they were clear, big and articulate in the low-end, but they were also rather forward and brash-sounding in the upper-mids and in the high-end for my tastes.

They might be perfect in somebody else's room, or with someone else's ears yuktyy, but I didn't like them.

Bryston should have a demo pair you can check out, or perhaps you'll find a dealer who will sell them to you with an audition/return period.. I personally wouldn't buy anything in this price range without a chance to hear them in the room where I'd be using them the most.

-dave
Old 12th December 2002
  #34
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Quote:
Originally posted by Marshall Simmon
Everyone seems to be on the ATOM bandwagon, but i have yet to head these either. i'm actually pretty interested in those as well
I think you mean the ADAM bandwagon, which are indeed a forum phenomenon.

However, they are very nice speakers, very useful reference monitors. If you're looking for more info on them, email [email protected]... and tell him dave-G sent you.

-dave
Old 12th December 2002
  #35
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I always thought that the makies and the genelecs made everything sound better then it was. We had a pair of the genelecs at a school i went to, and yea they sounded great, but i felt like i lost alot moving to another set of speakers. The makies see to do the same thing.

Marsh
Old 13th December 2002
  #36
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Wow, this thread took off. Hardly any mention of the actual Paradigms I started it over though
Thats ok, though.
From what I gather, most people prefer the Pardigms over the B&W's in the same and somewhat higher price range.
I have a line on a pair of Paradigm mini monitor MKII's for $260 if anyone wants them. They are a demo pair and really never used much. Toss in shipping.
My monitors need to be good for rock, as thats 99% what I use them for.
Old 13th December 2002
  #37
Quote:
Originally posted by Jax
Don't get me wrong, I didn't mention the two Dun's because I thought someone here could afford them. The art of mastering came up and the most oft used speakers weren't even mentioned, so I felt it was my duty to point out another tool that helps mastering engineers hear more detail than we can ever hope to on our crappy pro audio monitors.

BTW, ME's also mention that the HF drivers on either Dun blow out alot. Personally I would be more than a little pissed to pay 75 grand for a speaker with poor durability!
Duntechs and Dunleavey's can be bought for cheap on the used audiophile market($5000-$6000).

Whoever told you that they were $75,000 is crazy.

Wilson's are maybe $35,000-$40,000

And Egglestons(which Ludwig uses) are around $25,000...maybe?

But $75,000 for the Duns...nah.

A lot of the mastering guys to be honest don't know what they are using. They usually go with something that had been recomended. The Duns are ok in my opinion, the same with the Egglestons. Greg Calbi uses a pair of Pro Acs, Dave Collins was using B&W 802's with a Velodyne sub, some guys use Tannoys,I think Brad Blackwood uses Questeds.

All of the speakers sound different. Each had their strengths and weaknesses. It basically comes down to the user.
Old 13th December 2002
  #38
Quote:
Originally posted by Lars FM
I always had the impression that high end audiophile gear was constructed with the purpose of making music sound detailed and beautiful, whereas pro audio monitors were designed with the aim of providing the user with an unmasked picture of what was going on, detailed but not necessarily pretty..
Am i missing something?

To be honest, most of the audiophile speakers are of the pure variety and the studio monitors are the ones that color the sound.

I think this is so because in the studio know one wants to hear their music flat. It just won't inspire you to perform or work better(that is why no one likes a totally flat room with no Rev characteristics).

I think this kinda thinking is changing.
Old 13th December 2002
  #39
Quote:
Originally posted by tubedude
Wow, this thread took off. Hardly any mention of the actual Paradigms I started it over though
Thats ok, though.
From what I gather, most people prefer the Pardigms over the B&W's in the same and somewhat higher price range.
I have a line on a pair of Paradigm mini monitor MKII's for $260 if anyone wants them. They are a demo pair and really never used much. Toss in shipping.
My monitors need to be good for rock, as thats 99% what I use them for.

I think the B&W 802 is a perfect monitor for rock(my choice if I were mastering it, I could see why Dave Collins uses it). You do need a sub with it though. It doesn't go down very low(its biggest dawback).


Its not cheap though(used around $5000) but its a cool speaker.
Old 13th December 2002
  #40
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Is the 802 highs really clinical and harsh like the cdm series?
Marsh
Old 13th December 2002
  #41
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Lars FM's Avatar
 

Thanks Thrillfactor.
I can see the point in optimizing the room for performance.
Old 13th December 2002
  #42
Quote:
Originally posted by Marshall Simmon
Is the 802 highs really clinical and harsh like the cdm series?
Marsh
Its one of the only monitors in the "audiophile" category that works great for rock. I would describe the speaker as "studio sounding" but with a little more depth, but no lows!!(a sub is highly reccomended, maybe a Wilson?)

Compared to an 801 its a drastic change. The 801 has the big woofer so they sound very bassy. You need a large room to make them work( I don't know how the guys at Abbey Road get around that). I think because the Nautilus series sounds so "excited" is one of the reasons they are detested by most audiophiles(even though they look trey cool!!)


But as I mentioned in an earlier post,my favorite is the top of the line Nautilus 800, a no nonsense design speaker. Its the best of the best, my favorite for just music listening. They carry a heavy price tag($16,000 without the amps, with a pair of Levinson 20.5 monoblocks...$20,000..ouch!!!)
Old 15th December 2002
  #43
Don
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Well I went down and listened to the Paradigm's{20's}..$650.00 a pair..Sound similar to the Tannoy Reveals{passive}which I like better than 20/20's ect..But less congested.. they were pretty open sounding..For referance I used OK Computer/Radiohead and a quick mix of a preproduction I'm working on..They are rear ported..Now for all you speaker guys.. is there a way deflect the the porting?I'm in a tight space 12/12 control room..I've got to be close to the walls and if there was a way to take the rear fireing port out of the equasion that would be great without chokeing them!I'm 8" to the wall....These are in the running for my mixing nears..They didn't have the 40's in the shop{sold out}..Anyways very cool speakers for the cash!Thanks for your input..
Old 15th December 2002
  #44
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Tim L's Avatar
 

What's the price on the Reference 40's?
Old 15th December 2002
  #45
Don
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Approx..$650.00/20's and $950.00/40's these are for pairs and not indiv. speakers
Old 15th December 2002
  #46
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Tim L's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally posted by Don
Approx..$650.00/20's and $950.00/40's these are for pairs and not indiv. speakers
Thanks... how did you find the mid's... I saw someone mention they felt there was a bit of a hole.
Old 15th December 2002
  #47
Don
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Well one listen so take this as that..They were pretty even..No gapeing hole like say the 20/20's..The transisions between feqs seemed..lets see..Smooth I guess be the best way to put it..They are not foward in the mids..not lacking just not foward..Maybe some straight heavy guit rock would show this more..My next listen I'll see about that ..The RaidoHead came off great but I don't know how something like Tool would sound..I didn't know I was gonna listen to these speaks yesterday so I wasn't prepared with ref CD's/Material...
Old 15th December 2002
  #48
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Cool... I just found a place right near me that carries Paradigm. I'm gonna give them a call and see if they have the line on the floor. I like my Passive Reveals quite a bit and I'm very used to them but the Paradigms seem to strike an interest in me... gearslut that I aspire to be.
Old 15th December 2002
  #49
Don
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Tim..Cool!See if they will let you bring in you Tannoy's to A/B..Post what you find..And these speakers are biampable{I belive the 40's anyways.. maybe the 20's also but not sure} see if they will hook them up like that..Pain the ass for them but they want a sale ...Good luck go forth and slut
Old 15th December 2002
  #50
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I'm glad you are all giving the paradigms a chance. I'm planning on getting a pair of minimonitors for the studio that i'm working at now, and we are using a pair of tannoys so i'm interested to hear your reactions.

THe 40's they should sell to you in the 800 dollar/pair range... don't settle for paying list price for them.

Marshall
Old 16th December 2002
  #51
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Glad to see people might feel the same about em as I do. Maybe we'll start a revolution here. Or not.
Post your feelings when you get to listen.
I dont find the Studio 20's to be much better than the mini monitors, if at all, and for the price, $340 a pair the minis are killer. How about that stereo image? Me likes.
Old 16th December 2002
  #52
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Monitor 3s??

Do you think the Monitor 3s with the 8 inch woofer would be much of an improvement over the Minimonitors? Anyone know what the price difference is?

Thanks,

Keith
Old 17th December 2002
  #53
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Meyer X10's

I'm going to be obtuse here as I have never heard much in the Hi-Fi line that I liked. I found the B&W's 801's to sound veiled and lacking in detail when I auditioned those. Electrostatics suchas the quad ELS 63's have no bottom end, and are highly room reactive, same problem with the Magneplaners. Many hi-fi speakers are deliberately made to sound reticent in the mid. Sounds great to listen too, but its not very accurate as to what is really going on there. Equally as well I don't subscribe to the Tannoy type studio monitor thing either. I find they sound impressive and go loud, but mixes can be all over the place if monitored on those alone. Genelec's for me sound tizzy at the top, and their big sytems although they go very low I can here the box sound in the low end.

I have however heard great things about the new Meyer X10's Around about $45,000 a pair, but there is some really clever stuff going on in there. With the new breed of digital electronic crossovers it will be possible to do some very clever alignment and equalization providing us with unrivelled studio speaker accuracy in the next few years. Dynaudios air system, I believe, is another one that is taking this route.

Regards

Roland
Old 17th December 2002
  #54
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Marshall Simmons's Avatar
 

perhaps thats the case... but the majority of us do not have 45k to spend on speakers. Heck, half of our studios don't cost 45k

We all know there are better things out there, but for the price, some of these speakers are awesome...

If i had the money i'd be looking at a JM audio grand utopia

but i don't have 70k to spend on speakers.

I do appreciate your observations
Marsh
Old 31st December 2002
  #55
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Beating this to death!! Sorry

Has anyone compared the Paradigm Minis to the Pinnacle Gold Mini Monitors? Are they even in the same league?

Thanks!!

Keith
Old 31st December 2002
  #56
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Marshall Simmons's Avatar
 

I've honestly never heard of the pinnacle line of speakers. Where can i learn more about them?
Marsh
Old 31st December 2002
  #57
Re: Meyer X10's

Quote:
Originally posted by Roland
I'm going to be obtuse here as I have never heard much in the Hi-Fi line that I liked. I found the B&W's 801's to sound veiled and lacking in detail when I auditioned those. Electrostatics suchas the quad ELS 63's have no bottom end, and are highly room reactive, same problem with the Magneplaners. Many hi-fi speakers are deliberately made to sound reticent in the mid. Sounds great to listen too, but its not very accurate as to what is really going on there. Equally as well I don't subscribe to the Tannoy type studio monitor thing either. I find they sound impressive and go loud, but mixes can be all over the place if monitored on those alone. Genelec's for me sound tizzy at the top, and their big sytems although they go very low I can here the box sound in the low end.

I have however heard great things about the new Meyer X10's Around about $45,000 a pair, but there is some really clever stuff going on in there. With the new breed of digital electronic crossovers it will be possible to do some very clever alignment and equalization providing us with unrivelled studio speaker accuracy in the next few years. Dynaudios air system, I believe, is another one that is taking this route.

Regards

Roland
Meridian has been doing this for years.

$45K for Meyers?

No way. I always felt they were some of the most overrated monitors.

With the B&W 801's you need a big room to really appreciate them(and they are picky on what kind of amps). The 802's are cool sounding(lacks bass though). My favorite B&W's are the Nautilus 800's. Brad Blackwood and i just had a discussion about them on the High End forum.

My favorite small audiophile monitor these days are the Dynaudio 1.3SE's($2000 used). I thik they rival any small studio monitor out there.

Under a $1000 the Thiels 1.6's were kind of cool.
Old 1st February 2003
  #58
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Quick question... I am going to go look at some Rotel high current power amps tomorrow, and I am wondering if there is something else I need between the output of my converter and the speakers themselves. I have a a switchable output level( pro and consumer) on the converters, so thats not a problem. I just see that they have some kind of preamp available too, and I would hate to have to buy something like that pre-poweramp.

Anyone else checked out the Paradigms yet? Pretty sure I am going to pick up some monitor 3's tomorrow, which are essentially the Studio 40's with not-as-high-grade components inside. Same tweets and speakers though.

Whats with that audiogon place? All used auction stuff or what? Kinda sucks.

Thanks!
Paul
Old 1st February 2003
  #59
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By the way... anyone compared the Paradigms to the close-in-price Tannoy Reveals? Preference? Thoughts?

For the price, the Yorkville actives are really decent, only like $430, and pretty juicy, 85 watts. Good monitors for the price, the non actives are like $220 a pair. Real good price.

Peace.
Old 2nd February 2003
  #60
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Talk about ear-frying high-end harshness and undistinct sound stage those Yorkville near fields...

A friend had those in his home studio... Ouch!
Give me NS-10 please! grggt

Well, mybe others find hem more useful... more power to them!
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