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Paying for Internships, New Trend??
Old 19th September 2007
  #1
Gear Head
 

Paying for Internships, New Trend??

I was looking on a website for local studios in my area and this one particular one puzzled me:

Nightsky Studios

They want $1000 for a 6 month internship, is this the wave of the future? Is this a common practice and i'm just unaware?

I thought internships were either paid or paid via sweat...

maybe i'm just old school
Old 19th September 2007
  #2
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matt thomas's Avatar
Quote:
Nightsky Studios is taking on a new Internship Policy. Due to lack of dedication and punctuality in some of our past interns, the studio will now follow in line of what most other studios are now doing at this time. A six month internship at Nightsky Studios will now cost $1000. We have researched this extensively and found that the studios that do it this way tend to weed out the interns that are just at the studio for leisure. We are looking for interns that are there to learn and help not just sit back and go to sleep or not show up. This is BY FAR the best schooling you can get and it is 1 on 1 with tons of hands on. So before you look at the price remember that schooling at any institution will cost thousands more. Internships at working studios are very valuable and look great on your resume. We will only be taking 1 intern for every six month period so they can work as much as they like. The Studio generally runs 5 to 7 days a week. This is a first come first serve position. Minor Pro tools and other experience are preferred but not entirely necessary if you are good at learning quickly. Any interested parties should contact Ro
If the "intern" knows what they're doing and is an asset to the studio they should get paid, if they are learning then I don't think this sounds all that unreasonable (although at first I did until I read their explanation)

naro
Old 19th September 2007
  #3
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travisbrown's Avatar
It's not really an internship then; it's tutelage.
  1. Apprentice: fixed wage for a predetermined term under the supervision of a skilled superior
  2. Intern: minimal or no wage in order to gain experience.
  3. Student: pays to learn
Old 19th September 2007
  #4
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Fleaman's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by audio syndicate View Post
I was looking on a website for local studios in my area and this one particular one puzzled me:

Nightsky Studios

They want $1000 for a 6 month internship, is this the wave of the future? Is this a common practice and i'm just unaware?

I thought internships were either paid or paid via sweat...

maybe i'm just old school
Geez, this studio doesn't even have a console...just a pro control with pro-tools.

They should just call it what it is...an unaccredited engineering course. Yet that studio is mid-level at best, so not much of a reference for the 'student' after the fact....he/she will probably still have to intern if they go to a bigger studio.
Old 19th September 2007
  #5
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Empire Prod's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fleaman View Post
Geez, this studio doesn't even have a console...just a pro control with pro-tools.

They should just call it what it is...an unaccredited engineering course. Yet that studio is mid-level at best, so not much of a reference for the 'student' after the fact....he/she will probably still have to intern if they go to a bigger studio.
Yeah...Those guys look like jokers. I mean seriously....Give me $1000 to come and work for free at my project studio?!

That doesn't seem right.
Old 19th September 2007
  #6
Gear Addict
 

They probably need the money...


why would that be?

It enforces the statement that there are too many studios and people that want to record.
Old 19th September 2007
  #7
Gear Addict
 

and a first come first served basis? that's a good way to get the right intern for your studio. i think that a decent interview could easily weed out the leisurelies. working out a schedule / list of aims during an interview is always a good idea too. i think if you want an intern to work for you you have to do a bit of work yourself, rather than just banking $1000
Old 19th September 2007
  #8
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lowfreq33's Avatar
 

"We specialize in all aspects of recording, mastering, etc."

How can you "specialize" in everything?
Old 19th September 2007
  #9
Gear Maniac
 

what's sad is they'll be suckers who will actually pay that money.
Old 19th September 2007
  #10
Gear Guru
 
Glenn Kuras's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by pegleg View Post
As someone with experience in professional audio and audio education, I have never heard of a studio charging for an internship;

However, most audio programs (especially accredited programs) charge the students for their internship program in order to receive credit. So, perhaps some studios want "in" on that action. In all honesty, I can understand where they are coming from:

Audio schools (just like any other schools) have a lot of lazy, non-punctual, self-righteous time-wasters. It's within the right of ANY studio to pay an intern, require an intern to work for free, or require the intern to pay for the privilege. By the way - watching someone work and learning from them IS a privilege, not something you're born with a right to.

Of course, if you're paying them $1000, now you're a paying client, and have a right to expect a lot more than you might if you were going there for free; meaning, you should have some written agreement stating what YOU get out of it - tracking and mixing experience, one-on-one time with the chief engineer, whatever...

But, yes, at that point, it's more a casual education program than an internship. For some prospective engineers, this might be a better plan in the long run... Especially if you have more money than time or patience.

I can just see it now. You pay them $1000 then they hand you a toilet brush. dfegadheh

Glenn
Old 19th September 2007
  #11
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alexstringer's Avatar
 

Go to Starbuck, you will get actually paid to serve coffee! heh
Old 19th September 2007
  #12
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by lowfreq33 View Post
"We specialize in all aspects of recording, mastering, etc."
where does it say that?

anyway, i think i might start specialising in etc., anyone got an internship for that?
Old 19th September 2007
  #13
Quote:
Originally Posted by myfipie View Post
I can just see it now. You pay them $1000 then they hand you a toilet brush. dfegadheh

Glenn
Actually, the fine print reads: "The successful candidate will show up on Day One with his or her OWN toilet brush."
Old 19th September 2007
  #14
Lives for gear
What a bunch of B.S.!

This is a total scam because they aren't even going to weed out any lazy folks. The reason is this:

a) if the intern is a student at a school then they are ALREADY paying to do the internship. The school gives them credits for the interenship just like a class so you are either paying by semester or by the unit. Either way, they are paying.

b) Let's be real. Interns don't have day jobs - that's how they have time to intern. What kid without a job is going to have $1000 to pay for this internship. Even if they have a job, it's going to be a min. wage job flipping burgers or someting - they aren't going to have $1000 just laying around. The answer: a kid who's PARENTS will pay for the internship. The money isn't coming from the kid's pocket, so how exactly is that going to make them more responsible - it's not their money to lose.

So basically, it ain't gonna work. If anything it will probably backfire because it will weed out the hard workers and leave the privelaged kids who don't have to work for what they want because they just buy it.
Old 19th September 2007
  #15
On the intern thing, I agree with Chris to a fair extent... many schools have formal or quasi-formal intern programs and requirements.

A studio looking for a dedicated intern might want to look at hooking up with such a program on some level (though they might find that the intern program has stringent requirements for them).

If, indeed, this studio gets a paying intern and that kid doesn't have a job (and possibly/likely never had a real job) and his internship is being paid by mom & dad, I'd be afraid that that 1000 bucks would "buy" a sense of entitlement on his part... you know, "Look dude, I'm paying to be here, lighten up, old man!"

heh

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ibvee View Post
They probably need the money...


why would that be?

It enforces the statement that there are too many studios and people that want to record.
I'm not sure that "too many people who want to record" would be a bad thing (for studio owners) as long as they're willing to pay a professional studio. (Of course, there's the rub, I suspect, in a lot of cases.)


It's a general business rule that as production paradigms shift, markets will follow and adapt. The explosion of low cost production tools has opened up a lot competition at the very bottom.

To stay competitive, it's imperative for studio owners to differentiate themselves and make clear the added value that they bring in knowledge, facilities, and efficiency. Potential clients may balk at "higher" rates charged by real studios but studio owners need to convince them that professional facilities and technical staff can actually deliver a better product at a competitive price -- with less fooling around.

But... you guys knew that. (I'm going to go study spoof guitar god vids, now. heh )
Old 19th September 2007
  #16
I gotta say as I read the Nightsky homepage, I get the sense of an utterly snotty attitude permeating everything. Maybe this is standard for the industry... the part about "how well your band plays" really set off alarms, but that's just me?
Old 19th September 2007
  #17
This is garbage. I hope this isn't a trend. As mentioned, a simple phone class or interview and contacting a few references would weed out the bad interns. I have a feeling the interns stopped showing up in the past because they either weren't getting anything out of it or the people at the studio were assholes.

I've been trying to find some place in my area where I can sit in on session and do some grunt work (getting coffee/lunch and helping clean up) but haven't had much luck. I will assist/intern at any studio in Nashville/Murfreesboro/Franklin for free 7 days a week as long as it doesn't conflict with class, and would never ask question/give opinions unless given I was addressed or the session was over.
Old 19th September 2007
  #18
Gear Guru
 
drBill's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by audio syndicate View Post
They want $1000 for a 6 month internship, is this the wave of the future? Is this a common practice and i'm just unaware?
heh heh I knew it would come to that. Good old supply & demand economics at work. FINALLY, a way to make my studio profitable. I just need to take on 2-3 interns. heh heh heh heh
Old 19th September 2007
  #19
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Gregg Sartiano's Avatar
 

If the "intern" messes something up, can the studio fire him/her?
Old 19th September 2007
  #20
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RCM - Ronan's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by theblue1 View Post
On the intern thing, I agree with Chris to a fair extent... many schools have formal or quasi-formal intern programs and requirements.
Many of these schools include internships as part of total course training hours. An internship means that you go and work at some commercial music or audio related business for free (and not necessarily in recording). So if we take a school with a $13,500USD tuition for a 900 hour program and 280 hours of this is an internship, then you are paying $4200USD to go work some where for free!

This makes Nightsky seem like a bargain.
Old 19th September 2007
  #21
Quote:
Originally Posted by drBill View Post
heh heh I knew it would come to that. Good old supply & demand economics at work. FINALLY, a way to make my studio profitable. I just need to take on 2-3 interns. heh heh heh heh
if you could round up about 50-100 "interns" you could buy some sweet gear for them to learn on.
Old 19th September 2007
  #22
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Audio Hombre's Avatar
 

maybe they should take the $1000 as a deposit and refund it after the candidate has successfully participated to the studios satisfaction, based on their reason for wanting money upfront in the first place
Old 19th September 2007
  #23
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TREMORS's Avatar
I think the concept is, you're booking x hours of studio time. You just arent a band. It keeps the room booked in off hours. I actually did something similar, though at a much better studio. Learned A LOT more there than in some of the college classes I took. They had an SSL though =)

But, then as someone else said...intern is for young people that dont work. I had to schedule on off days. Interned for a bit, but every minute ticking by means I wasnt getting paid by anyone, and actually learning less, since I know longer had block time for just me and the engineer. Then I had some family stuff happen and I kinda disappeared. So, i just gotta go it alone, make my own way, since I cant work for free (i'd even scrub toilets, I just cant afford to spend many hours doing that for no money...it's a matter of practicality, vs thinking I am too good for it)

Having said that, I dont think Nightsky there really has the rep/room/console to offer much. Who knows? They should at least offer you a tour, meeting with the people before committing to anything.

-D

On a side note, I hate the bedroom PT guys with websites calling it a studio. Im one of those guys. I can record ya, but I am not going to pretend my bedroom/living room is a "studio" with dual doors, isolated floors and ceilings, etc.
Old 19th September 2007
  #24
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Sigma's Avatar
looks like a nice little studio to me
Old 19th September 2007
  #25
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Sigma's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by TREMORS View Post
On a side note, I hate the bedroom PT guys with websites calling it a studio. Im one of those guys. I can record ya, but I am not going to pretend my bedroom/living room is a "studio" with dual doors, isolated floors and ceilings, etc.
my PT STUDIO is next to my bedroom and it is a STUDIO..i do mixing mainly with the ocassional direct o/d and small vocal booth recording..the product is as good as when i ran our multimillion dollar multi state facilities
Old 19th September 2007
  #26
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TREMORS's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sigma View Post
my PT STUDIO is next to my bedroom and it is a STUDIO..i do mixing mainly with the ocassional direct o/d and small vocal booth recording..the product is as good as when i ran our multimillion dollar multi state facilities
Its splitting hairs, perhaps. Semantics. You gotta booth, though, at least. Im just not comfortably calling my set up that. Wasnt trying to slag anyone. There's room for all of us, no?

I'm referring more to the Diamond Dave looking guy from belize that there was a thread on here about.

-D
Old 19th September 2007
  #27
Lives for gear
 

You can get a virtual internship right now (for 2 1/2 more hours).. without even leaving your home.

thewhitetieaffair's Xanga Site
Old 19th September 2007
  #28
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lowfreq33's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sigma View Post
my PT STUDIO is next to my bedroom and it is a STUDIO..i do mixing mainly with the ocassional direct o/d and small vocal booth recording..the product is as good as when i ran our multimillion dollar multi state facilities
No offense man, but you have a mix/overdub room. I know, I know, it's a studio. But not the way Avatar or Ocean Way are studios. And you may very well have a studio's worth of gear in there, so you're a little closer than a lot of people with a "studio" in their spare bedroom. I think we're mainly talking about the guys with a Dell and an Mbox acting like they're Dr. Dre or whatever. I've got a mix/overdub room myself, so don't feel bad.
Old 19th September 2007
  #29
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lowfreq33's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by upinflames View Post
I've been trying to find some place in my area where I can sit in on session and do some grunt work (getting coffee/lunch and helping clean up) but haven't had much luck.
They don't help you with that at MTSU? Shouldn't your faculty advisor be able to give you a few leads?
Old 20th September 2007
  #30
Gear Guru
 
u b k's Avatar
 

for a grand i'll build you a badass mix, show you how to do it, and smoke you out on the nyc diesel so bad you'll need help with the doorknob on your way out.

let's see the maryland ghetto metal place promise you *that* thumbsup.


gregoire
del
ubk
.
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