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BNC signal to SPDIF?
Old 28th July 2007
  #1
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BNC signal to SPDIF?

I'm interested in the Black Lion Microclock, but I need to have one slave sync to word clock over SPDIF. The Microclock only uses BNC for wordclock output.

Is there anything that will convert a BNC signal to SPDIF? If there is, will it add jitter? tutt
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Old 28th July 2007
  #2
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lemix's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Amaysn' View Post
I'm interested in the Black Lion Microclock, but I need to have one slave sync to word clock over SPDIF. The Microclock only uses BNC for wordclock output.

Is there anything that will convert a BNC signal to SPDIF? If there is, will it add jitter? tutt
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Well..the "signals" are identical.
Get a BNC> RCA adapter, should be a couple of bucks
a
Old 28th July 2007
  #3
isn't that whole setup problematic in that most S/PDIF inputs expect audio with a clock signal piggybacked on top, whereas BNC signals from master clocks are signal-only, no 'audio'?

please correct me if I'm wrong!

do you have one device with BNC wordclock inputs and S/PDIF inputs/ouputs (for example, a digital fx processor)? perhaps it could receive clock over BNC and pass it along over S/PDIF out with the audio that's coming in to be processed over the S/PDIF in.
Old 28th July 2007
  #4
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lemix's Avatar
You're correct in that typically only sync travels over the BNC.
I was under the impression, that the poster [Amaysn'] needed simply to convert the connection type to sync his equipment together.

a
Old 29th July 2007
  #5
Quote:
Originally Posted by lemix View Post
You're correct in that typically only sync travels over the BNC.
I was under the impression, that the poster [Amaysn'] needed simply to convert the connection type to sync his equipment together.
this could be true, but I've yet to see a piece of equipment that pulls *just* clock from s/pdif... which is why I raised the point!

perhaps the OP could clarify...
Old 29th July 2007
  #6
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Thanks for your replies.

I have a Tascam DM-24 mixer. The DM-24 will not slave to word clock in "High Sampling Mode" - 96 KHz or 88.2. However it will slave to clock over SPDIF in "High Sampling Mode." I have a Black Lion modified 2408 MKIII. I'm interested in getting the Microclock. Originally Black Lion stated that the Microclock would have SPDIF out as an option. I've been informed; however, there is no SPDIF option in the works for the Microclock.

I've tried using an SPDIF adapter that is BNC female on one end and male SPDIF on the other, plugged into a BNC cable with a clock that was operating. I plugged this into one of the DM-24's SPDIF inputs. The DM-24 does not recognize this signal. BTW the DM-24 syncs fine to the SPDIF out of the MOTU - music playing or not.
Old 29th July 2007
  #7
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Clarification. That is SPDIF over RCA.
Old 29th July 2007
  #8
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BNC and RCA are connector types, like XLR or 1/4" TS or TRS. They have nothing to do with the type of signal being carried.

s/pdif and AES/EBU and wordclock are signal types, and could be connected using any connection that has enough wires.
Old 29th July 2007
  #9
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I thought I clarified things. The Microclock only sends word clock over BNC. I have one device that needs to recieve word clock via RCA.
Old 29th July 2007
  #10
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So get a BNC to RCA cable or adapter - $2. But you say that you've already tried this and it doesn't work. That suggests to me that the signal you are trying to pass is not being recognised by the other, so perhaps it isn't Word Clock.

I was just highlighting the fact that cables and connectors are one thing, and digital protocols are another thing - but you are still mixing up the terminology.

It seems you need a device that will accept Word Clock and then spit out a S/PDIF signal that your next device can clock to? (Regardless of whether the wires are connected via BNC or RCA or TS or whatever).

I believe there are a number of digital boxes that do that - typically A/D converters or digital format converters. I believe Behringer make a digital format converter that is one Behringer product that doesn't suck too much and can't do too much damage. I think my Lucid AD9624 does that, and isn't too expensive.
Old 29th July 2007
  #11
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I tried an adapter. The DM-24 did not reconize the signal.
Old 29th July 2007
  #12
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I found a BNC to RCA cable on the net for $20.00:<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
http://www.svideo.com/rcabnc1.html<o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
But I'm wondering, why will this work when the adaptor did not?<o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
Maybe as terminal3 suggested the DM-24 is looking for an audio and clock signal over the digital RCA input. <o:p></o:p>
<SCRIPT type=text/javascript> vbmenu_register("postmenu_1405111", true); </SCRIPT>
Old 29th July 2007
  #13
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I'm fairly sure a Lucid AD9624 would slave to a word clock signal, and simultaneously output a s/pdif signal that the next device could slave too. The fact that no audio was being sent over s/pdif shouldn't worry it.

Edit - removed suggestion about Behringer Ultramatch, as I don't see a word clock input.
Old 29th July 2007
  #14
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Kiwiburger, thanks for your help. Is the protocol of the clock signal received on the the DM-24's digital, RCA input, different than the clock signal protocol it receives over the BNC input? <?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
Also, if needed. Do you think the Behringer device would add jitter?<o:p></o:p>
Old 29th July 2007
  #15
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I think with s/pdif the audio and clock signal are basically the same data. But an audio signal of silence (e.g. Lucid converter with no audio input connected) is still a valid audio signal.

A cable or adapter is a connectivity issue. It shouldn't matter how the wires are connected. If one doesn't work, the other won't work.
Old 29th July 2007
  #16
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A Drawmer M-Clock might be able to sort this out?

I'm pretty sure it can perform all the correct voodoo
Old 29th July 2007
  #17
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It's looking like I may have to pursue a clock other than the Microclock. Microclock - $325.00 (for those who received the analog mod from Black Lion.) The Lucid converter is about $550.00 used $750.00 new. The Drawmer M-Clock ($1200.00 - $1,400 new). Man, A lot more than a $2.00 adaptor.

I asked Jim of Black Lion the following also:


"If a Motu 2408 MKIII is slaved to the Microclock's BNC word, what
clock will be transmitted out of the 2408's BNC out and SPDIF, RCA out?
Will it be a mirror of the Microclock, the 2408's internal clock, or
no clock at all?"

His reply:
-technically you can't send a clock signal out of the 2408 if it's
receiving it's clock signal from the Microclock, or any other master
clock. That would involve daisy chaning the clock signal which is not
possible.
Old 29th July 2007
  #18
jhg
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BNC to SPDIF directly works nicely when signals are 75ohm, 1v peak to peak. If not, look to a balun.

Regards,

jhg
Old 29th July 2007
  #19
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Useless information. BNC is a connector. s/pdif is a protocol. Over short distances, impedance matters little. Even voltage isn't hugely critical for a digital signal.

But if the maker of the equipment states that this configuration isn't going to fly, I think I would call it a day.
Old 5th July 2010
  #20
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SO...Will or will not an adapter work in this situation..?. (I wanna send a W/C output ( BLA clock) into a SPdif input)..Do they make BNC/SPDIF combo cables that works and don't cause trouble...
Old 7th November 2011
  #21
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Is there converter for this combination... making it possible to sync device with bnc wordclock out to one with spdif input?
Old 8th November 2011
  #22
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Its too bad that the blacklion doesnt output AES/EBU which you could easily convert to Spdif with a simple adapter. The BNC to Spif conversion...to my knowledge and experience when I was working in the clocking industry, does not have a viable solution or adapter for that specific conversion, because the typical BNC to Spdif "adapter" is meant for video signal and not word clock. WC operates at a higher voltage than video clock therefore this typical adapter will not work to solve your issue. There are distribution amps like the Aardvark Sync DA or the Lucid AESx4 which will convert BNC to AES...but then you would need a simple adapter to go from the AES to the Spdif... for example.... Blacklion WC out to:

BNC signal to SPDIF?Symetrix/Lucid AESx4 AES/EBU Digital Audio 1x4 Wordclock Distribution Amplifier | eBay

Then to:

Mercenary Audio - Neutrik Digital Transformers


or just buy a clock with an AES out put and get the adapter and avoid having to get a distro amp to do the conversion
Old 14th June 2014
  #23
Gear Head
From my experience, a clock signal is pretty fragile. You dont want to use an adapter in this specific case, but a wire designed for this, not to mention you can't use a regular RCA cable for SPDIF purpose. There are couple websites suggesting solution for this, prices range from 16$ to 595$ for a spdif to BNC wire. However, usually if you have a bad clock(in case you try with an adapter) you should still have a result, even if it's a bad result. In this case the autor of the post says it just didn't work. He should actually ear artifacts or aggressive noïse, except maybe if the soundcard makers integrated a security to prevent bad clock from ruining your ears or monitors(cause this can get pretty nasty, like in the case you send 48K master clock and receive on 44.1K slave). There is another possibility of course: maybe he just did it wrong. You need to config your hardware properlly for this to work. There is a least on company reporting success for this application, but paying 595$ for a wire is definitely not for me...
So anyway for those who want to try this, check this out:

16$ spdif to BNC: Digital Audio Cables at Blue Jeans Cable

595$ spdif to BNC: Boomslang Digital Cable - spdif BNC - BNC [Boomslang BNC-BNC] : Snake River Audio, High-End Audio Cables Audiophile Interconnects Gold Silver

I actually own a BLM Digi 002R that I want to sync with an Octopre mk2, so I will try the 16 bucks solution and report back, if no one else can tell us if this works or not...

Old 14th June 2014
  #24
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I know first hand that decent quality BNC to RCA adapters are really a non issue for clocking use and are used everyday in professional digital audio product development with testing devices such as scopes or Audio Precision testing units that usually only have BNC connectors on them.

Early versions of the TC Electronic DBMAX which is the higher end broadcast version of the Finalizer, used BNC connectors for both WC & S/PDIF I/O.
Old 13th July 2015
  #25
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I have a quick question i was trying to slave my focuse rite to my big ben but my adat connection is already in use with my rosetta. I stil have the spidif rca conection available in both my big ben and 18i20 would the conection be like this: rca out of the big ben to rca in of the 18i20?
Old 13th July 2015
  #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raizel View Post
I have a quick question i was trying to slave my focuse rite to my big ben but my adat connection is already in use with my rosetta. I stil have the spidif rca conection available in both my big ben and 18i20 would the conection be like this: rca out of the big ben to rca in of the 18i20?
Well afaik, Rosetta and 18i20 both have BNC wordclock connections - why don´t you get two bnc-wordclock cables and hook them to the bigben ("star-configuration") and leave adats, spdifs strictly for digital audio transfer ?
Old 14th July 2015
  #27
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I dont know exactly what you mean with leaving them for digital audio transfer? Can you explain And i already have the rosetta and 18i20 connected via word clock to the big ben but the only thing is i need to get the signal of the big ben back to the interface. Othere wise how is the big ben returning the signal back? Is there another way you would do it
Old 14th July 2015
  #28
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Helge's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by raizel View Post
I dont know exactly what you mean with leaving them for digital audio transfer? Can you explain And i already have the rosetta and 18i20 connected via word clock to the big ben but the only thing is i need to get the signal of the big ben back to the interface. Othere wise how is the big ben returning the signal back? Is there another way you would do it
PM sent cause I think we´re getting too much off the original topic here...
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