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SM7b vs RE20 vs MD421
Old 3 weeks ago
  #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andychamp View Post
As much as I love the RE 20, I suspect it won‘t be used for lead vocals in productions where s/n ratio is overly critical.
Quote:
Originally Posted by andychamp View Post
Great lead vocalists for sure. But not productions with, say, soft, breathy vocals in a ultra-sparse areangement, where the hiss from the mic gain would present a problem.
I'm not so sure:


Anyway, it's interesting that you talk about a significant amount of hiss: maybe you experienced that with one of the new RE20 built after 2011?...
Old 3 weeks ago
  #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tymish View Post
SM7 is similar.. the element is 2 inches back from the end of the mic so proximity boost is mitigated. I have at least 50 of them in a big radio facility I've been working at for 20+ years. Used them with some pretty low gain pres like Yamaha O2Rs. For speaking voice, just barely enough gain. Singing it would be fine. That said, higher gain pres are a help with these kind of mics. I've been wanting to try something like the Soyuz Launcher in line for some slightly colored boost.
Yeah, my brother has one SM7B so I can somewhat confirm what you are saying: I've been able to use it (with variable results) not only with the budget dedicated pre, but also with the audio interface preamps (Saffire Pro 24)...

But while the RE20 can be similar for some aspects (if I'm not wrong also the RE20 has the element placed a little bit back in the body), I think the way it minimize proximity effect is different (variable-d and all), and also more effective...

You can literally touch it with your lips while singing (see the Thom Yorke video I posted in my previous post), and while it may sound not so "natural" (not like Frank Sinatra singing from a much bigger distance in a wonderful condenser), it can be used in this "fashion" nonetheless...

And in this way I think it could require even less gain than an SM7B (or than a RE20 used from a more "natural" distance)...

But I never tried one, and so I asked for opinions...
Old 3 weeks ago
  #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stewix View Post
I'm not so sure:


Anyway, it's interesting that you talk about a significant amount of hiss: maybe you experienced that with one of the new RE20 built after 2011?...
Well, I never talked about „a significant amount of hiss“, simply an amount that might become problematic.
Even in this last video example, if there‘s any hiss, it‘s probably hidden under everything else. Also, these guys probably have pretty good preamps, *and* he‘s right up on the mic, so: not one of the cases I meant.
Macca and Stevie Wonder are both very powerful singers, so again, gain and (possibly) hiss are not a problem.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stewix View Post
(...), but a budget dedicated pre (65dB), which is not so clean when you have to drive it?...
What do you guys think?...
Maybe I got that wrong. I was just trying to say that even under these conditions, a scenario where any hiss *might* become a prublem is very unlikely.

FYI, my RE20 is around 30yrs old and was recently refurbished. I never had any hiss problems with it, but would also never put it up for, say, Johnny Cash singing „Hurt“.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #94
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Also, wondering what you mean by „dedicated budget pre“?
Old 2 weeks ago
  #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andychamp View Post
Maybe I got that wrong.
Maybe it's me that got it wrong...

I was thinking that, when you wrote about "hiss problems", you were referring to something inherent to the RE20...

But now I think I got you better, and it seems that you were talking about the hiss of the pre, when used with the RE20...

But the point is, and this is where you probably didn't get me right (my bad, because I was not more explicit), when I wrote "not so clean when you have to drive it", I was not worried about the hiss, but about the distortion of the pre...

The way I see it: the hiss of the pre, in a "real world scenario", will be lower than the room noise (even if the room is somewhat treated); so that, in this case, it would not be a problem (it would not be THE FIRST problem)...

On the other hand, in a professional studio, where the ambient noise is lower, there will surely be also a pre capable to avoid hiss problems, even if used with something like the RE20 (like you also noted about the Radiohead guys)...

So, in both cases, the hiss would not be a (or the first) problem; but, in the "real world scenario", distortion could be...

So, if someone prefers to avoid the RE20 to track something like "Hurt", I think this has to do also with other technical/artistical reasons/choices, not (only) the hiss...

If we were talking about the SM7B, then I would completely agree: I would avoid it to track "soft, breathy vocals in a ultra-sparse areangement" (to use your same words)...

But the video I posted seems to be just that: "soft, breathy vocals in a ultra-sparse areangement"...

So, I repeat: I'm not so sure that it is better to avoid also the RE20 for something like that, especially considering that you can literally kiss that mic without the proximity!...

Well, of course in this case (the video I posted) the mic has been chosen also to minimize the spill from the guitar...

And just to be clear: I'm not saying there are not better choices, but still...

Quote:
Originally Posted by andychamp View Post
Also, wondering what you mean by „dedicated budget pre“?
With the word "dedicated" I meant a preamp "not integrated" in the audio interface, but a separate one; and so of a (supposedly) better quality, even if budget...
Old 2 weeks ago
  #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stewix View Post
Yeah, my brother has one SM7B so I can somewhat confirm what you are saying: I've been able to use it (with variable results) not only with the budget dedicated pre, but also with the audio interface preamps (Saffire Pro 24)...

But while the RE20 can be similar for some aspects (if I'm not wrong also the RE20 has the element placed a little bit back in the body), I think the way it minimize proximity effect is different (variable-d and all), and also more effective...

You can literally touch it with your lips while singing (see the Thom Yorke video I posted in my previous post), and while it may sound not so "natural" (not like Frank Sinatra singing from a much bigger distance in a wonderful condenser), it can be used in this "fashion" nonetheless...

And in this way I think it could require even less gain than an SM7B (or than a RE20 used from a more "natural" distance)...

But I never tried one, and so I asked for opinions...
You can sing right on the SM7 as well. Play with the switches until you get the tone you want. I usually go with the sound of the capsule.. which is no bass rolloff and no Hi-cut (though it looks like a hi boost on the switch, electronically it's a cut).
Old 1 week ago
  #97
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tymish View Post
You can sing right on the SM7 as well. Play with the switches until you get the tone you want. I usually go with the sound of the capsule.. which is no bass rolloff and no Hi-cut (though it looks like a hi boost on the switch, electronically it's a cut).

My brother prefer the sound of the capsule as well, and so, considering that I used the SM7B only when "collaborating" with him, I did not use the switches when I tried it (if I remember correctly)...

Sooner or later I think I'll try that...

Anyway, I've used other mics with the low cut, and I'm still curious about the Variable-D of the RE20, which technically is something different (almost like an omni, I suppose)...
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