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SA-251 Stam
Old 19th November 2019
  #1
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SA-251 Stam

I pre-ordered the SA-251 and can't wait to get it sometime next year.

Wondering if anyone else has tested this and would be willing to do a shootout or just link me to material they've recorded on it. Thanks guys!
Old 21st November 2019
  #2
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Bump. Anyone?
Old 21st November 2019
  #3
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That's Stam, right?



Good Luck....
Old 21st November 2019
  #4
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I doubt one has been built yet. For sure none have been delivered. Give it another year.
Old 21st November 2019
  #5
MYN
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We certainly could have some fun around here with a Stam shipping date betting pool.
Old 22nd November 2019
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MYN View Post
We certainly could have some fun around here with a Stam shipping date betting pool.
Not really. Everyone would just want the farthest out square. And they'd all be right.
Old 22nd November 2019
  #7
MYN
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drumsound View Post
Not really. Everyone would just want the farthest out square. And they'd all be right.
LOL. No kidding. But what if you could pick any date on the calendar for $5? Proof would have to be something like the date the first photo of the piece in the wild is posted on social.
Old 22nd November 2019
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrentA View Post
I doubt one has been built yet. For sure none have been delivered. Give it another year.
I think it was sold out a couple months ago, so maybe some people have them.
Old 22nd November 2019
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrentA View Post
I doubt one has been built yet. For sure none have been delivered. Give it another year.
I realized I'm willing to wait if the product is excellent. The WA251 got here in a few days but it just wasn't professional enough. And besides, I think Stam has learned their lesson. When the microphone gets here I'll let you guys know how it sounds and ect.
Old 22nd November 2019
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nathansnud View Post
I realized I'm willing to wait if the product is excellent. The WA251 got here in a few days but it just wasn't professional enough. And besides, I think Stam has learned their lesson. When the microphone gets here I'll let you guys know how it sounds and ect.
I'll be shocked if you have it before July 2020.
Old 22nd November 2019
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nathansnud View Post
I think it was sold out a couple months ago, so maybe some people have them.
Where did you see that? Their website is notorious for having bad info, and so are the employees. I haven't seen or heard anything about them building a batch of these yet. The real question is if they've even built a prototype yet. I know there's pictures of a mic out there, but they usually have mock ups put together before they've actually built any of the product.

I've been waiting on an 1176 for about 16 months now. Last I heard from Stam, he said it would be shipping this month. So I'm expecting to get it sometime in the summer of 2020. Two years is a pretty standard wait time when pre-ordering from this company.

That being said, it should be a fantastic mic as long as he still has a good working relationship with Tim Campbell by that time.

If you want a good deal on a 251 sooner, I would take a look at the Zen Pro modified Warm 251 with Heiserman capsule. Put a NOS 6072a in there you'll have a great mic.
Old 22nd November 2019
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrentA View Post
Where did you see that? Their website is notorious for having bad info, and so are the employees. I haven't seen or heard anything about them building a batch of these yet. The real question is if they've even built a prototype yet. I know there's pictures of a mic out there, but they usually have mock ups put together before they've actually built any of the product.

I've been waiting on an 1176 for about 16 months now. Last I heard from Stam, he said it would be shipping this month. So I'm expecting to get it sometime in the summer of 2020. Two years is a pretty standard wait time when pre-ordering from this company.

That being said, it should be a fantastic mic as long as he still has a good working relationship with Tim Campbell by that time.

If you want a good deal on a 251 sooner, I would take a look at the Zen Pro modified Warm 251 with Heiserman capsule. Put a NOS 6072a in there you'll have a great mic.
I was planning on saving for the unit before paying the remaining cost, so maybe that long wait time isn't a terrible thing haha. Every test of modified Warm audio stuff just sounded like warm audio to be honest.
Old 23rd November 2019
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nathansnud View Post
I pre-ordered the SA-251 and can't wait to get it sometime next year.

Wondering if anyone else has tested this and would be willing to do a shootout or just link me to material they've recorded on it. Thanks guys!
Posting this in January makes a better fit!
Old 23rd November 2019
  #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nathansnud View Post
I was planning on saving for the unit before paying the remaining cost, so maybe that long wait time isn't a terrible thing haha. Every test of modified Warm audio stuff just sounded like warm audio to be honest.
Interesting. The clips I heard with the Heiserman capsule sounded great and completely different from the stock version. Which makes sense because it’s going from an edge terminated capsule pretending to be a CK12 to one of the best CK12 capsules around. It’s already got a decent transformer and capacitors so the the most significant remaining component you could upgrade would be the tube.
Old 23rd November 2019
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrentA View Post
Interesting. The clips I heard with the Heiserman capsule sounded great and completely different from the stock version. Which makes sense because it’s going from an edge terminated capsule pretending to be a CK12 to one of the best CK12 capsules around. It’s already got a decent transformer and capacitors so the the most significant remaining component you could upgrade would be the tube.
I'll clarify actually. The microphone the WA251 is emulating is the c12, and it gets really close, especially with the upgrades. But the C12, unlike the 251, has a weird harshness in the uppermids that I don't like, so the 251 is what I want my microphone to sound more like. The modified wa251 sounded slightly better but not enough closer to the Elam 251 to justify the extra money.
Old 24th November 2019
  #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nathansnud View Post
I'll clarify actually. The microphone the WA251 is emulating is the c12, and it gets really close, especially with the upgrades. But the C12, unlike the 251, has a weird harshness in the uppermids that I don't like, so the 251 is what I want my microphone to sound more like. The modified wa251 sounded slightly better but not enough closer to the Elam 251 to justify the extra money.
Really? Any more info on this?
Old 24th November 2019
  #17
Really thought Stam Audio would've stopped the pre-order stuff by now. Why not just make stuff in batches like Audioscape and so many others?
Old 24th November 2019
  #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by graphicnomad View Post
Really thought Stam Audio would've stopped the pre-order stuff by now. Why not just make stuff in batches like Audioscape and so many others?
You'd think...
Old 24th November 2019
  #19
Constantly answering e-mails from clients who are waiting for their gear, keeping track of those orders etc. is also very time (and therefore financially) consuming. I can't imagine it being a beneficial model.
Old 24th November 2019
  #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blade_sg View Post
Really? Any more info on this?
Pretty sure I saw this written somewhere, but just using ears it's pretty clear that the WA251 is much closer to the C12 than to the Elam 251.

Here's a shootout between the WA-251 and the Elam 251. Turn the volume up and you'll notice the lack of depth in the WA-251 recording, especially on the guitar, when compared to the Telefunkin.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DRQI7jXys0w

But then there's this shootout, where the differences aren't very obvious between the WA-251 and the Flea C12 clone (which is very close to the Telefunkin C12).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-DJ2XhQ_mX8

The shape of the microphone is another clue. If you're wondering why they wouldn't just sell it as the WA-12, the WA-12 name was already assigned to another unit, and a 251 clone probably sells better. Even real C12's are nowhere near as silky on vocals as 251's.
Old 24th November 2019
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nathansnud View Post
Pretty sure I saw this written somewhere, but just using ears it's pretty clear that the WA251 is much closer to the C12 than to the Elam 251.

Here's a shootout between the WA-251 and the Elam 251. Turn the volume up and you'll notice the lack of depth in the WA-251 recording, especially on the guitar, when compared to the Telefunkin.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DRQI7jXys0w

But then there's this shootout, where the differences aren't very obvious between the WA-251 and the Flea C12 clone (which is very close to the Telefunkin C12).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-DJ2XhQ_mX8

The shape of the microphone is another clue. If you're wondering why they wouldn't just sell it as the WA-12, the WA-12 name was already assigned to another unit, and a 251 clone probably sells better. Even real C12's are nowhere near as silky on vocals as 251's.
Thanks. Will have to have a proper listen to that on headphones or monitors.

I'd be interested in the thoughts of @ cdkelly on this one too as I was certainly under the impression that the WA-251 was based on the ELA M251 and that Dany Bouchard (vintagemicrophonepcbkit) helped WA with the PCB.

Also correct me if I'm wrong but from the photos I've seen of Stams other microphones it also appears to be the work (the PCB that is) of Dany Bouchard so I'm wondering how different the SA-251 will be from the WA-251 other than capsule and transformer? Maybe I'm way off base.... wouldn't be the first time
Old 24th November 2019
  #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blade_sg View Post
Thanks. Will have to have a proper listen to that on headphones or monitors.

I'd be interested in the thoughts of @ cdkelly on this one too as I was certainly under the impression that the WA-251 was based on the ELA M251 and that Dany Bouchard (vintagemicrophonepcbkit) helped WA with the PCB.

Also correct me if I'm wrong but from the photos I've seen of Stams other microphones it also appears to be the work (the PCB that is) of Dany Bouchard so I'm wondering how different the SA-251 will be from the WA-251 other than capsule and transformer? Maybe I'm way off base.... wouldn't be the first time
OK, so the WA had Dany's involvement on the mic PCB side of things at the very least (the PSU and other aspects are a re-used Alctron design) but particular voicing decisions that (IMHO) gave it a distinct and overly scooped sound that was, while not at all unpleasant, also not really sounding like a 251 (IMHO). My understanding is that the Stam uses Dany's board directly, as in they just purchased an allotment of his PCB kits to build the mics. I understand Stam uses a legitimate CK12 capsule, which would certainly be one plus on the Stam side and a much better value proposition (those capsules ain't cheap no matter how you slice it!), assuming the mic is in stock and can ship readily. I do know that both mics are based on the Ela M 251 (12AY7 circuit version) for sure, although that does not preclude some coincidental voicing that could make it more C12-ish.

The C12 has a lot of circuit similarities to the 251, and IMO the main sonic differences are a smoother and brighter sound, where as the 251 has a little bit faster and more articulated, less processed sound... still bright but often not as bright. those are my recollections, at least; given that every working specimen is probably a little different. Its not outside the realm of possibility to voice either to lean a bit more toward the other. Like, when I build a 251 for instance, I do some things to extend the low end response nicely so it doesn't sound anemic. I try to keep the low end flat, so neither a muddy 'hump' nor an early rolloff. So there are some things you can do, within limits. It just takes some trial and error.

Chad
www.unitedstudiotech.com
Old 24th November 2019
  #23
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Thanks for clearing that up Chad.
Old 25th November 2019
  #24
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Funny you said "anemic" Chad, in your last post. Exactly my words, describing my only experiencing/singing through the stock WA-251 at the last NAMM.
Nothing like the fullness of a Bock 251 or the non-vintage T-Funk.

Agree also with your assessment of an excellent C12 style microphone. My experience limited to trying the FLEA 12, with Tim Campbell's capsule.
It's cool that the "brightness" is beyond my sibilance area (6.5 KHz), and love that smooothness.
Chris

P.S. I highly respect the stock WA-47 though.
Old 25th November 2019
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chessparov2.0 View Post
P.S. I highly respect the stock WA-47 though.
I respect the Warm Audio stuff a lot. For the prices, they really are great microphones.
Old 25th November 2019
  #26
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IMHO I expect your upcoming 251 style mic, from STAM... Will be quite a bit better, partly due to Tim C's capsule.
Kidding aside-regarding the quips on STAM's delivery times, I hope you get it in a (relatively for STAM) timely manner.
Chris
Old 25th November 2019
  #27
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Stam stuff I've recieved sounds phenomenal, and is always very clever or has a "twist." The prices I paid were ridiculous, I see them for sale used more than I paid new. I've had my problems but as a small business owner in Chile I'm rooting for him. Certainly a case of good, affordable, and fast... can only pick 2.

When the gear is more often in stock, and they hopefully eventually end the down payment nonsense, the prices will almost assuredly need to go up. Rightfully so, they are interesting designs and he has a nose for good-sounding components/circuits, the sound quality is well above average and competes easily in the small-batch gear world. But the pre-orders/down payments... not a believer in that, and have communicated that often. Pre-ordering a place in line is fine, but tying up money for months/years with the poor communication/estimated-delivery track record, not great.
Old 25th November 2019
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bowzin View Post
Stam stuff I've recieved sounds phenomenal, and is always very clever or has a "twist." The prices I paid were ridiculous, I see them for sale used more than I paid new. I've had my problems but as a small business owner in Chile I'm rooting for him. Certainly a case of good, affordable, and fast... can only pick 2.

When the gear is more often in stock, and they hopefully eventually end the down payment nonsense, the prices will almost assuredly need to go up. Rightfully so, they are interesting designs and he has a nose for good-sounding components/circuits, the sound quality is well above average and competes easily in the small-batch gear world. But the pre-orders/down payments... not a believer in that, and have communicated that often. Pre-ordering a place in line is fine, but tying up money for months/years with the poor communication/estimated-delivery track record, not great.
That's my take on it too. He said in an interview on youtube that he's taking steps to communicate better. The gear always sounds really damn good in comparisons, but he seemed aware that customer service was just as important.
Old 25th November 2019
  #29
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I do believe Joshua means well. Also he's very fortunate to have Tim Campbell and Camila (customer service) on his team too.
Chris
Old 4 weeks ago
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chessparov2.0 View Post
P.S. I highly respect the stock WA-47 though.
I do too, it came out good.
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