The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
 Search This Thread  Search This Forum  Search Reviews  Search Gear Database  Search Gear for sale  Search Gearslutz Go Advanced
Gear Measurements (e.g., 2 ch. converters)
Old 3 weeks ago
  #1
Here for the gear
 

Gear Measurements (e.g., 2 ch. converters)

Hi,

Some of you have might have heard that amirm and a few others over at ASR measure gear and post the reviews/teardowns: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/f...x.php?reviews/

Check out the reviews of these familiar units:This is a really kind contribution to the community given the kinds of claims manufacturers make, and the kinds of debates that go on (on the basis of very little data). The discussions that follow are usually pretty revealing of industry standards and buyers' attitudes.

However, most of the measured gear, DACs and headphone amps, is from the consumer market. I recently asked in the wishlist thread if he could evaluate pro 2 channel converters from these companies:
  • Lavry Engineering
  • Crane Song
  • Dangerous Music
  • Prism
  • Weiss
  • Forssell
  • Burl Audio
  • Antelope Audio
  • Apogee
  • Presonus
  • Fostex
The reviewed gear is lent by members in the majority of cases, so if anyone is interested in getting something measured, please contact him.

Thanks,

pozz
Old 3 weeks ago
  #2
Lives for gear
 
bowzin's Avatar
Yep, I signed up and suggested (along with others) some pro gear and he actually ended up testing it, pretty cool place overall.

That site needs to be taken with a grain of salt though, as with anything. First, it is not production-oriented, rather it is mostly consumer-oriented and high marks are given to stuff with unbalanced RCA outs, etc., for example, which is mostly unusable/uninteresting to me. And they skew very "objectivist" i.e. if it's not measurable it doesnt exist. Or... if it's measurable, it might be important, even if it's miniscule differences and sort of missing the forest (sound and/or production-oriented workflow) for the trees (specs).

I appreciate that approach, and try to skew that way generally but I dont ENTIRELY reject the subjectivist approach. While religiously gatekeeping an "ideal" of clinically clean, you can miss a whole world of useful and musical color. Usually though, overly subjectivist or "audiophile" type arguments or preferences are too hyper-personal to be of any real use for production-focused purposes, or too tainted by psychological bias or unscientific thinking, etc. Too hard to tell, and it's usually not helpful, so I do appreciate the independent measurements.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #3
Quote:
Originally Posted by bowzin View Post
That site needs to be taken with a grain of salt though, as with anything. First, it is not production-oriented, rather it is mostly consumer-oriented and high marks are given to stuff with unbalanced RCA outs, etc., for example, which is mostly unusable/uninteresting to me.
If there is balanced output, I measure that. As you know a lot of consumer gear doesn't (sadly) have balanced so I measure RCA output.

If you all loaned more pro gear with XLR output, it would remedy what you are complaining about.


Quote:
And they skew very "objectivist" i.e. if it's not measurable it doesnt exist. Or... if it's measurable, it might be important, even if it's miniscule differences and sort of missing the forest (sound and/or production-oriented workflow) for the trees (specs).

I appreciate that approach, and try to skew that way generally but I dont ENTIRELY reject the subjectivist approach. While religiously gatekeeping an "ideal" of clinically clean, you can miss a whole world of useful and musical color. Usually though, overly subjectivist or "audiophile" type arguments or preferences are too hyper-personal to be of any real use for production-focused purposes, or too tainted by psychological bias or unscientific thinking, etc. Too hard to tell, and it's usually not helpful, so I do appreciate the independent measurements.
I am still searching for that musical color. Without exception, when a device has measurable distortion, to my ears that distortion is annoying, not euphonic. I think many people automatically assume if a device has a lot of distortion, that is by design and there is goodness to it. You know, the "warmth" of tubes, etc. Such observations need to be tested using controlled listening tests like I perform.

In my opinion, any musical color needs to be created by you all and embedded in the music we consume. If I need color, I will deploy (global) DSP/EQ, not look for some fixed distortion in a DAC or whatever.

Anyway, thanks for the words of support. I hope more of the members here choose to see their devices objectively characterized. The consumer community is getting huge value out of the measurements performed so far (nearly 150 devices a year!). It is a shame that pro gear has not benefited as such.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #4
Here for the gear
 

This is a good example of what I was talking about in my original post: Misunderstandings about preamp noise

I have to praise the OP for taking the time to carefully measure his gear, record the results, and clarify a general relationship between linearity, dynamic range and "noise", all of which should be seen in action to be really understood. Makes workflow and recording decisions much simpler, in my experience.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #5
These guys are doing the work the manufacturers are hiding from you. You can usually count on that stuff being designed/tested with Audio Precision or similar test gear at the factory. But they won't release those test results. I used to do the same thing with REP product reviews but full AP plots were also published. It made some friends and also ruffled some feathers too, but they had it coming because the test gear doesn't lie.
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearslutz Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…
Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Similar Threads
Thread
Thread Starter / Forum
Replies
midiquestions / So Much Gear, So Little Time
8
overman / So Much Gear, So Little Time
1
Eq_1084 / So Much Gear, So Little Time
11
onefromjupiter / High End
37

Forum Jump
Forum Jump