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SSL SiX small format mixer???
Old 28th March 2019
  #211
Gear Head
 
buka's Avatar
 

How to make a mixdown of 12 channels on this mixer? How to control levels?
Old 28th March 2019
  #212
Lives for gear
 
wallyburger's Avatar
 

I like the idea of this mixer, and it is very tempting. When I first saw it I thought "got to have this!" But after investigating I can't think of one reason for me to own one. Being an acoustic/classical type recordist sometimes, I'm after a fairly uncoloured sound, mic pres that are as near as damn-it perfect, lots of gain, low noise etc, I already have that, and a brilliant mixer combined, but it's always good to have duplicates or back-ups. And, simplicity of operation and blind familiarity is essential in the heat of a session. As far as I can see, the Six really doesn't tick any of these boxes for me personally, but I'm not saying it won't be ideal for some folks, this is only from my own perspective.
After watching some videos on YouTube the routing is very confusing, and it forces you to make what I would call extreme workarounds that I would only have to do on a mixer of far lesser breeding. Plus, the connections don't make any sense at all, not at all user friendly to me.
I think SSL should have done a mock up and offered it up for appraisal first, it's a brilliant idea, and there is a gap in the market for a "reasonably priced" high quallity small mixer, but I think SSL have missed a great opportunity to fill that gap. I think people have raised a few good points in this thread, and maybe SSL should take them onboard regarding future revisions.
But....despite what I've said in this thread, there is a little voice in my head that is still urging me to consider getting one, and you could say that the two SSL mic pres and flexible talk back are actually worth the price alone.
Old 28th March 2019
  #213
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by wallyburger View Post
I like the idea of this mixer, and it is very tempting. When I first saw it I thought "got to have this!" But after investigating I can't think of one reason for me to own one. Being an acoustic/classical type recordist sometimes, I'm after a fairly uncoloured sound, mic pres that are as near as damn-it perfect, lots of gain, low noise etc, I already have that, and a brilliant mixer combined, but it's always good to have duplicates or back-ups. And, simplicity of operation and blind familiarity is essential in the heat of a session. As far as I can see, the Six really doesn't tick any of these boxes for me personally, but I'm not saying it won't be ideal for some folks, this is only from my own perspective.
After watching some videos on YouTube the routing is very confusing, and it forces you to make what I would call extreme workarounds that I would only have to do on a mixer of far lesser breeding. Plus, the connections don't make any sense at all, not at all user friendly to me.
I think SSL should have done a mock up and offered it up for appraisal first, it's a brilliant idea, and there is a gap in the market for a "reasonably priced" high quallity small mixer, but I think SSL have missed a great opportunity to fill that gap. I think people have raised a few good points in this thread, and maybe SSL should take them onboard regarding future revisions.
But....despite what I've said in this thread, there is a little voice in my head that is still urging me to consider getting one, and you could say that the two SSL mic pres and flexible talk back are actually worth the price alone.
I can see a ton of these selling for sure. Since I record full bands almost exclusively, this won't be a great fit for me, but for solo artists working in the box, I can see this really taking off.
Old 28th March 2019
  #214
Gear Head
 

I'm getting one for my live solo shows, as well as to use as a sub mixer for my band gigs. I'm always looking for the best fidelity possible in the smallest form factor available, but with all the features of the SIX, so this looks perfect for what I would be using it for. Even the dedicated talk-back pre for announcing tunes is appreciated.
Old 28th March 2019
  #215
Lives for gear
 

One thing I don't understand is why SSL used DB25 send/return for mono channels 1 and 2. I've only seen DB25 cables breakout to 8 XLR and my apollo doesn't have db25 connections to do db25 to db25. So, it seems like I'd have to buy two cables that are db25 to XLR and I'd have 12 unnecessary XLR connectors just dangling around not being used just so I could get the mono 1 and 2 signals into my apollo and signals back into those channels for processing.

Help me out here
Old 28th March 2019
  #216
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by brysava View Post
I'm getting one for my live solo shows, as well as to use as a sub mixer for my band gigs. I'm always looking for the best fidelity possible in the smallest form factor available, but with all the features of the SIX, so this looks perfect for what I would be using it for. Even the dedicated talk-back pre for announcing tunes is appreciated.
It's your money, but in a live situation, this would be total overkill.
Old 28th March 2019
  #217
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
I’d imagine they’re being cautious, units en route to Sweetwater as I type
What about Vintage King?

I was supposed to have mine on the way today or tomorrow.

I noticed Alto Music of New York has them on eBay for for delivery by Friday.
Old 28th March 2019
  #218
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by gravyface View Post
It's your money, but in a live situation, this would be total overkill.
Maybe "overkill" for your average dive bar, but it absolutely would not be overkill for the live situations I do. I currently use a much more expensive mixer than the SIX for my larger shows, and the sound quality difference is not only appreciated by me, but by the audience, also. Of course they don't say "wow, we really like the fact that this show uses a class A discrete signal chain!", but their reactions tell the story.
Old 28th March 2019
  #219
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by gravyface View Post
It's your money, but in a live situation, this would be total overkill.
I dunno about that... My live keyboard rig is two keyboards running in mono, with at least one and sometimes both of them making use of an extra output for to bass sounds (FOH always appreciates the hell outta that by the way). (I don't always need two boards, and I don't always need to play bass sounds, admittedly.) I send those 3 and sometimes 4 channels to the FOH most of the time but sometimes I have to submix them myself using my mackie 820 and send a mono feed to the FOH. And on the off chance I'm playing with another board player, I have no problem filling up the remaining inputs on the mackie.

I have no problem justifying the features and channel count of the SiX for gigging (still working on the price thing though...). Funnily, its in my personal setup where the calculus seems to be a bit off...
Old 28th March 2019
  #220
Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
Depends on the console...
Putting it into a more "real world" example and comparing it to the £800 each (!) XR621 Mic Pre' module for X-Rack from the 9000K series I have at home I'd comment the following;

The X-Rack mic pre' is a teeny bit sparklier, teeny bit faster, deals with transients from acoustic instruments slightly better. All stuff that's realistically the last 2-4%.

The SiX pre actually has a bit more "character" - while it is unashamedly on the "clean" and "fast" side of things it does have a distinct "bite" which gives it a bit more of a tone than the XR621. Gels nicely and seems to work well on most sources.

Rolling that outwards, my writing rig at home is an X-Desk and X-Rack with 2x XR621 mic pre', 2x XR728 Stereo Dynamics, 2x XR725 E Series EQs and a Bus Comp. A number of times I've looked at it all and wondered if I should just replace it all with a Six. Putting aside that fact that this is just a broadly similar spec (albeit with far more control and parameters, and TR, and 4 bands of EQ....) do I honestly believe that it sounds £8000 better than a Six?

No.

Do I think it sounds a bit better than a Six?

Yes, but only a little bit on a like-for like basis (ignoring the extra processing options I have with all the extra controls). All depends how much that little bit is worth to you. Then again, I'm incredibly familiar with the sound of my rig so I'd notice tiny differences because I'm used to hearing them. if I was coming in to it cold it might not be quite so easy to pin down.

Not sure if that answers your question about "big studios" - some would tell you that any studio with a 4000 it's madness to use the onboard pre's. Go figure.

I think this is rightly quotable.

The sonic differences we perceive (or even only read about) between summing ITB or OTB, or between the SiX and the X-Desk, or between the X-Desk and a legit SSL console...these are mostly apparent at the outside edges of what we're doing. Or as Jim says "the last 2-4%."

Many, many devices will work quite well when used within their intended capabilities. Some will stop being useful when pushed beyond those limits. Others will keep going with you right to the edge.

But how many of us are tiptoeing along the limits of our gear's capabilities? Hopefully not too many.

I think it's smart for SSL to reach down into this market. Maybe they develop customers who will climb up the ladder with them. Maybe it's just a new niche to develop.

In any case, it would be insane for them to sit around discussing all the prosumer products they're too principled to make while waiting for some sheik to order a 96-channel custom desk.
Old 28th March 2019
  #221
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by mp3 View Post
I dunno about that... My live keyboard rig is two keyboards running in mono, with at least one and sometimes both of them making use of an extra output for to bass sounds (FOH always appreciates the hell outta that by the way). (I don't always need two boards, and I don't always need to play bass sounds, admittedly.) I send those 3 and sometimes 4 channels to the FOH most of the time but sometimes I have to submix them myself using my mackie 820 and send a mono feed to the FOH. And on the off chance I'm playing with another board player, I have no problem filling up the remaining inputs on the mackie.

I have no problem justifying the features and channel count of the SiX for gigging (still working on the price thing though...). Funnily, its in my personal setup where the calculus seems to be a bit off...
I always encourage everyone who can afford to upgrade their sound (whether live or studio) to do it! Of course if someone's PA is no good or some other aspect of the chain has problems, getting a stellar mixer might not be the first thing to deal with, but the great engineers and music performers of history didn't get there by thinking an upgrade to their sound was "overkill", whether for live or the studio.
Old 28th March 2019
  #222
Solid State Logic
 
Jim@SSL's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by UKtotalitarians View Post
What about Vintage King?

I was supposed to have mine on the way today or tomorrow.

I noticed Alto Music of New York has them on eBay for for delivery by Friday.
VK too.

An avalanche of SiXes has been leaving the factory the last few days...
Old 28th March 2019
  #223
Gear Nut
 

Jim,

You guys did a really great job with this feature set.

I remember big conversations on this board asking for a mixer like this. With more channels, but this is a great start. You know, back in the X-Desk release days.

Think about all the monitoring setups people pay big bucks for (D-Box, SPL) and this mixer has so much more. Mic pres, compressors, eq etc

For live use, for monitoring and as a front end. $1499

Good stuff
Old 28th March 2019
  #224
Lives for gear
 

[email protected]

Could you please help me understand the DB25 connections on the Six to an apollo without having all of those unnecessary XLR hanging about?

thanks
Old 28th March 2019
  #225
Here for the gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ox Han View Post
[email protected]

Could you please help me understand the DB25 connections on the Six to an apollo without having all of those unnecessary XLR hanging about?

thanks
Just get a DB25 to 8 TRS. You can find them on Amazon or anywhere. I have one that I’ve used to run a variety of things with my Apollo.
Old 28th March 2019
  #226
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymous161 View Post
Just get a DB25 to 8 TRS. You can find them on Amazon or anywhere. I have one that I’ve used to run a variety of things with my Apollo.
How do channels 1 and 2 flow out of the db25? is signal sent to all 8 trs from the db25 sends? Or, is it channel one on trs 1 and channel 2 on trs 2? If so, then what about the other six trs?

and vice versa back into the SSL six. Can I route any 8 of trs from the out of my apollo into the db25 return? or just trs 1 and 2 go into the SSL on their respective tracks and the rest of the db25 is useless?

It seems like a massive waste to me, but maybe I'm missing something. I just don't get the use of db25 cables here.
Old 28th March 2019
  #227
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by brysava View Post
I always encourage everyone who can afford to upgrade their sound (whether live or studio) to do it! Of course if someone's PA is no good or some other aspect of the chain has problems, getting a stellar mixer might not be the first thing to deal with, but the great engineers and music performers of history didn't get there by thinking an upgrade to their sound was "overkill", whether for live or the studio.
Like I said: if money is no object, great. But for live sound, there are plenty of less expensive digital mixers with clean preamps, great headroom, and more features suited to live use than the SiX, like full recall, built in effects, groups/matrix routing, more outputs in general, CAT5 snakes, iPad integration/WiFi, etc.
Old 28th March 2019
  #228
Gear Head
 
Bollinja's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ox Han View Post
How do channels 1 and 2 flow out of the db25? is signal sent to all 8 trs from the db25 sends? Or, is it channel one on trs 1 and channel 2 on trs 2? If so, then what about the other six trs?
I think what you want is the bottom left of this:

https://s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/s...art+Poster.pdf

Or Appendix A here:

http://sslweb.solidstatelogic.com.s3...March_2019.pdf
Old 28th March 2019
  #229
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bollinja View Post
I think what you want is the bottom left of this:

https://s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/s...art+Poster.pdf

Or Appendix A here:

http://sslweb.solidstatelogic.com.s3...March_2019.pdf
Thank you!
That's exactly what I wanted. I glossed over that on their website
Old 28th March 2019
  #230
Here for the gear
 

Mine came today and I’m in love already. This thing sounds really nice.
Old 29th March 2019
  #231
Gear Nut
 
IAMCRISIS's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by obdt View Post
Mine came today and I’m in love already. This thing sounds really nice.
How's the channel and Bus compressor's?
Old 29th March 2019
  #232
Lives for gear
I will get one so I can advertise SSL Console equipped studio* I just spent 1800 in UAD plugins that I need to charge the clients this month, will probably get one in May and will plug my Moog modular into it and then to Apollo X.




























* SSL Six mini console.
Old 29th March 2019
  #233
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PettyCash's Avatar
 

Not sure if this has already been brought up, but it would have been nice if you could link the compressors on the two mono inputs.
Old 29th March 2019
  #234
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by IAMCRISIS View Post
How's the channel and Bus compressor's?
They sound lovely. The channel comp is more felixible than you think. The attack time is program dependant and the comp sits after the eq. So it feels as if the eq has a big effect on what the comp does. It can be nice and snappy when you want it to be.

The bus comp is every bit as good as you’d expect. Created a nice bounce when I ran drums through it.

The eq is really nice too. Pushing the high freq shelf adds something I’ve never heard before ITB.

The whole thing really is lovely. It weighs a ton too!
Old 29th March 2019
  #235
Deleted be25781
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elsapo2001 View Post
I will get one so I can advertise SSL Console equipped studio*
You´re not serious are you?
Old 29th March 2019
  #236
Lives for gear
 
wallyburger's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by obdt View Post
They sound lovely. The channel comp is more felixible than you think. The attack time is program dependant and the comp sits after the eq. So it feels as if the eq has a big effect on what the comp does. It can be nice and snappy when you want it to be.

The bus comp is every bit as good as you’d expect. Created a nice bounce when I ran drums through it.

The eq is really nice too. Pushing the high freq shelf adds something I’ve never heard before ITB.

The whole thing really is lovely. It weighs a ton too!
It's been mentioned that there is a fan inside? If there is, can you hear it, in any way whatsoever.
It would also have been nice to use it for M&S "stand alone" but there are only two mic amps so I'd have to split one channel into two in my DAW which means I'd have to drag along a computer, any ideas?
Old 29th March 2019
  #237
Gear Maniac
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deleted be25781 View Post
You´re not serious are you?
I mean he technically ain't lyin tho ... SuperAnalogue state of mind ...
Old 29th March 2019
  #238
Solid State Logic
 
Jim@SSL's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by wallyburger View Post
It's been mentioned that there is a fan inside? If there is, can you hear it, in any way whatsoever
No fan
Old 29th March 2019
  #239
Gear Head
 

Isn’t it also something that can be used like those $1500 two channel mic pres filling everyone’s racks, but with more functionality? I’m certainly not going to spend $4500 for a mice pre channel but this looks like something I’d want for the tracing character it can give. I don’t think the type of stuff I do will be for from a mixer standpoint but for a pre and comp, if it sounds good, it seems like a deal.
Old 29th March 2019
  #240
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by gravyface View Post
Like I said: if money is no object, great. But for live sound, there are plenty of less expensive digital mixers with clean preamps, great headroom, and more features suited to live use than the SiX, like full recall, built in effects, groups/matrix routing, more outputs in general, CAT5 snakes, iPad integration/WiFi, etc.
That’s true.

But let’s say you have a gorgeous analog synth collection and you bring 2 of them live with a couple of singers and a drum machine. Like a Moog Sub37, an OB-6 and Tempest.

Or you’re a DJ with a RYTM, SP-16, Minitaur and Lancet.

There are reasons why you may want to stay all analog. There are cheaper boards like Soundcraft, Mackie and Yamaha but are they SSL? Nope.

This little board has a lot to offer. Imagine just fanning out your SP-16 through. Or Tempest. Or RYTM. I haven’t thought about it in detail, but it seems you you could use the two channel comps, eq and glue it all together and also track most of this.

There are just so many possibilities with this thing. That’s why I bought one. It’s why I bought a UA 4-710d. And my Octatrack. Some devices have certain limitations but also, oddly, so many possibilities. I think the siX is in this category.

Just my gut opinion. Not trying to say anyone’s criticism is wrong.
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