The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
 Search This Thread  Search This Forum  Search Reviews  Search Gear Database  Search Gear for sale  Search Gearslutz Go Advanced
SSL SiX small format mixer???
Old 20th May 2019
  #841
Gear Maniac
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.HOLMES View Post
Do you make your living from music?
Just in case the answer is no... Than your perspective is a total different from those who fight from month to month, year after year. If you ask me ITB is the future for all pros, special if the budget is tight....
Yes and no to your first question or I should say not entirely I'm blessed to have other revenue streams. I agree with your last statement though if the budget is tight, sure to a degree. That said at what point do you invest your earnings toward a more sonically rewarding setup. I'm not here talking down to 100% ITB engineers, I was one thus I feel I know it's limitations as well as anyone could.

Analog gear isn't inherently expensive there's great gear new and used at reasonable prices(like the SiX). I like most modern engineer/home recordist/procuder started out with the bare minimum a preamp, midi controllers and then 100% ITB, I wasn't satisfied with my results after years so I chose to invest in quality used analog gear slowly now I'm estatic at my sound today and that's largely due to my analog studio gear. I think I've said this before in this thread; at the basics of analog, a versatile stereo comp/eq is all that's needed for 90% of tasks that can be as cheap or as expensive as you want it to be(certainly could be done below $2k or $1500 if needed some plugin bundles cost much more).

It comes down to preference not budget; when I was an artist primarily I'd track at this guys place where he was all ITB with an insane Mac Pro, Waves Diamond or so plus other pricey plugs, mic not above $500, but he had a very pro isolated vocal/tracking booth(in a mom-in-law back house) I loved. He spent a big chunk being ITB that was his choice, I didn't care for his mixes or sound they always felt lacking(he was a lazy yet school certified engineer).

I found another guy who I feel is one of the best in my city at ITB mixing we met around the time I built my first studio, he's got golden ears great sound for ITB but as he saw me progress in hardware he started moving that direction too way less hybrid than me but since he's 90% tracking he got a much better frond end today. He had years ahead of me and knows his craft but today I've well eclipsed him(my gear and understanding of it took over) I still respect him and he made a living from music for some time now but today he has a day job also.

It's hard out here for engineers hell every level of musician, I get it, but it's even harder to attract clientele with a gear list of solely plugin bundles IMO. Yes your ears and knowledge will bring some business(even 100% ITB) but investing in good gear will as well, the combination of both will put u on a higher level faster than ever and you will more than see a return on what you've invested. I'm living proof.
Old 20th May 2019
  #842
Gear Maniac
 

Has anyone compared the main out and the direct out sound of the channels 1-2 when recording vocals etc...?
Having the main outs connected to Apollo Twin at all times would be convenient workflow.
Old 20th May 2019
  #843
Lives for gear
 
Mr.HOLMES's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by ucanhatemenow View Post
Yes and no to your first question or I should say not entirely I'm blessed to have other revenue streams. I agree with your last statement though if the budget is tight, sure to a degree. That said at what point do you invest your earnings toward a more sonically rewarding setup. I'm not here talking down to 100% ITB engineers, I was one thus I feel I know it's limitations as well as anyone could.

Analog gear isn't inherently expensive there's great gear new and used at reasonable prices(like the SiX). I like most modern engineer/home recordist/procuder started out with the bare minimum a preamp, midi controllers and then 100% ITB, I wasn't satisfied with my results after years so I chose to invest in quality used analog gear slowly now I'm estatic at my sound today and that's largely due to my analog studio gear. I think I've said this before in this thread; at the basics of analog, a versatile stereo comp/eq is all that's needed for 90% of tasks that can be as cheap or as expensive as you want it to be(certainly could be done below $2k or $1500 if needed some plugin bundles cost much more).

It comes down to preference not budget; when I was an artist primarily I'd track at this guys place where he was all ITB with an insane Mac Pro, Waves Diamond or so plus other pricey plugs, mic not above $500, but he had a very pro isolated vocal/tracking booth(in a mom-in-law back house) I loved. He spent a big chunk being ITB that was his choice, I didn't care for his mixes or sound they always felt lacking(he was a lazy yet school certified engineer).

I found another guy who I feel is one of the best in my city at ITB mixing we met around the time I built my first studio, he's got golden ears great sound for ITB but as he saw me progress in hardware he started moving that direction too way less hybrid than me but since he's 90% tracking he got a much better frond end today. He had years ahead of me and knows his craft but today I've well eclipsed him(my gear and understanding of it took over) I still respect him and he made a living from music for some time now but today he has a day job also.

It's hard out here for engineers hell every level of musician, I get it, but it's even harder to attract clientele with a gear list of solely plugin bundles IMO. Yes your ears and knowledge will bring some business(even 100% ITB) but investing in good gear will as well, the combination of both will put u on a higher level faster than ever and you will more than see a return on what you've invested. I'm living proof.

To not hijack the topic.
I used to be in hardware land for the last 9 years and I slowly come back to ITB mixing because the differences are too minor to not work entirely ITB - it also gives my creativity a lot more freedom. I have a city home and a home on the countryside. I just save all songs in the cloud and I can open them up everywhere in the world.

Time moves on and I can't afford to stay 100% old school.
I need to make money.

BTW.
To just name one plug in that sounds a lot like hardware.
Try buss colors by Airwindows.

I was blown away the first time, and I am still crazy about it.
If time moves on like this, there is no reason for hardware anymore.
Buss Colors shows it can be done at a crazy low CPU hit.

Last edited by Mr.HOLMES; 20th May 2019 at 01:36 PM..
Old 20th May 2019
  #844
Lives for gear
 
IM WHO YOU THINK's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.HOLMES View Post
Thanks for this.

Not to forget the ongoing mentality....
"Do more for less..."

The fact that we can have great music itb!
Why using outboard if you can have the tools on a laptop anywhere in the world?

The fact that new bands/acts get pennies from heaven.
But yes main fact technoligy moves on time moves on live goes on.

Cheers
HOLMES
Don't get me wrong, I'm not firmly stuck on either side of the fence, and I'm looking at spending more for analog outboard flavor pieces these days. Most things I want to try out next are analog pieces. I don't think I will ever be the dude who buys every plugin and uses 1/10 of what's on his system.

Any thing that alters sound in a positive way is open for testing at my spot.

I'm not of the mindset that it can't be done with plugins, but I don't think it has to be either.

Mixing is like cooking IMO. It's a lot of small flavor layers that come together for great end product. It's not so much what digital or analog can't do. There's nothing I can do in analog gear that I can't do with digital, but I can't get either one alone to match what I can do with bits of both.
Old 20th May 2019
  #845
Lives for gear
 
IM WHO YOU THINK's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thebigcomedown View Post
I’m sorry man. I didn’t mean to imply you use soft synths. I was just generalizing.

Slamming the 2-bus is how you get loud mixes. How hard you can slam it depends on your mix.

This is why people squeeze everything as much as they can and ride the faders during recording.

You want dynamics just not absurd peaks that ruin your mix either by nasty clipping or terrible sounding limiting.

The psycho-acoustic stuff helps, too. Distortions at certain freqs add “energy”.

By and large, a balanced mix is one that you can slam the ANALOG to DIGITAL 2-bus with.

I’ve found slamming the ITB just doesn’t any perceived loudness. It just adds “thin”.

This is why I love the SiX.

I can treat all of my tracks and stems and shoot them out to the Six for final touches with the Pultecs and G-comp.

I do want to get one more mix bus comp to couple with the G-comp. I’m not using my plugin mix bus comps now because I’m coming out in stems. The G-comp adds mojo but I need a comp I can slam before printing stereo AD mix down
I disagree with you that "slamming the two bus" is how you get loud mixes. I respect your view point if that's what works for you and sounds good on your mixes. I'm good with it.
Old 20th May 2019
  #846
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thebigcomedown View Post
For me, the SiX just made my mixes 4-5 LUFS LOUDER and the RMS half again as loud.
... I'm really sad, whenever I read that from someone TBH.
Sometimes I feel like popular music nowadays is like Olympic games in loudness and seeking shortcuts to copy some trending style.. Quality differentiation in dBs, everyone pushing round peg to square hole and bend whole production around that effort.. Just to please crowds, who grown up listening synthetic and abused stuff with earbuds and boomboxes.. so it's part of mainstream and that kind of treatment is expected to perceive something like a record.

But that's OT rant, sorry for that, it's not anything against you..
I'm happy, you're happy with SiX.

And I see, what do you mean by that.. analog outboard is IME often much more forgiving and allows you to push it quite bit more than plugins before unwanted side-effects stop you with that.

Michal
Old 20th May 2019
  #847
Lives for gear
Look at all the new posts on this thread! About absolutely nothing of interest to SiX owners or prospective owners.
Old 20th May 2019
  #848
Lives for gear
 
Lando Calrissian's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hyder boy View Post
What are you guys thinking about, get a Patchbay.
Ha! I made myself sound like the console newbie that I am!

I was considering custom DB25 cabling to keep the cleanest possible signal, but it doesn't seem worth the hassle. I have a few very nice pieces of outboard to incorporate, but not many. I'll most likely add a patch bay.

The $1500 price tag of the SiX might seem low, but I've spent more than double that amount on top-level converters and cabling. It's expensive, but I do love the fun workflow and the sound I’m getting.

Last edited by Lando Calrissian; 21st May 2019 at 02:48 AM..
Old 20th May 2019
  #849
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
Dudes posting from computers made in China proclaim ineptitude or ethics of manufacture.

The hubris is crushing.

Back to the product anyone??
Jim, maybe a silly question but anyway, how well does the SSL SIX handle microphones with high output, i got an Neumann M149?

Last edited by DCommand; 21st May 2019 at 06:17 AM..
Old 21st May 2019
  #850
Lives for gear
 
IM WHO YOU THINK's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lando Calrissian View Post
Ha! I made myself sound like the console newbie that I am!

I was considering custom DB25 cabling to keep the cleanest possible signal, but it doesn't seem worth the hassle. I have a few very nice pieces of outboard to incorporate, but not many. I'll most likely add a patch bay.

The $1500 price tag of the SiX might seem low, but I've spent more than double that amount on top-level converters and cabling. It's expensive, but I do love the workflow!



What's the sign? Isn't this good for SSL? I didn't buy the SiX because it was affordable, I bought it because it made more sense for me over anything else they had to offer. Now I'm looking to expand by adding some X-Rack modules.

I think it's the exclusivity that may be nearing its end. Serious question, do you foresee SSL halting the production of large format consoles built in the UK? Will bedroom producers with SiX's suddenly stop going to the local studio with the 4k console? I don't make a living doing this, so I'm sincerely interested in getting your take.
Go with the patchbay. You'll be happy you have the flexibility. The Six doesn't have many channels, so it's likely to have different roles during different phases of work for you. (tracking, mixing etc...) You'll be able to facilitate things better with patch bays.

Last edited by IM WHO YOU THINK; 21st May 2019 at 04:07 AM..
Old 21st May 2019
  #851
Lives for gear
 
12tone's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by IM WHO YOU THINK View Post
Go with the patchbay.
Substitute 'spaceways' with 'patchbays'. Patchbays incorporated is a happy thing.

Old 4 weeks ago
  #852
Gear Nut
Six vs SSL G comp

https://www.sweetwater.com/insync/ta...desktop-mixer/

Anyone listen to this comparision and think the SiX sounds thinner and less 3d?

Def sounds like it to me. I know you're getting way more for your money but if it compromises the sound in a negative way with other high end gear I'm not sure I'm interested.

I was really hoping it would be great for me considering you can monitor with 0 latency through it and track/sum easily.

Perhaps it could be just the bus comp that sounds a little thinner. Wish they shared the source files.

Could anyone run a stereo mix through the six and compare with a bounce itb?

Thanks
Eric
Old 4 weeks ago
  #853
Here for the gear
 

For me this could be a great solution along with a 6 space 500 series rack of pres. I could have 2 ch on SiX, 6 channels of 500 pres, 2 channels on RME for 10 total. A small set of monitors, a mic box and I'm ready to go record almost anywhere. Regardless of all the debate, I use an SSL G series everyday, as well as tons of other high end gear. It's just gear, tools, no magic. Good gear sounds better than crap gear, but in the end good music, good performances beat all. I try not to fall into the "this is the missing piece for my world domination" trap. When I'm on, my music sounds great no matter what I'm using. When I don't feel inspired it sounds exactly like that. I think we use the gear to avoid the real issues - good writing and arrangement. That being said, I GAS just like anyone. I'm probably getting a SiX and I can see using it for all sorts of tasks - keyboard / drum submixer, mobile recording, small gigs, and podcasting. It seems well designed and priced to sell. Hope they don't start having issues but I have no problem rolling the dice on this.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #854
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by LiveMusicNY View Post
https://www.sweetwater.com/insync/ta...desktop-mixer/

Anyone listen to this comparision and think the SiX sounds thinner and less 3d?

Def sounds like it to me. I know you're getting way more for your money but if it compromises the sound in a negative way with other high end gear I'm not sure I'm interested.

I was really hoping it would be great for me considering you can monitor with 0 latency through it and track/sum easily.

Perhaps it could be just the bus comp that sounds a little thinner. Wish they shared the source files.

Could anyone run a stereo mix through the six and compare with a bounce itb?

Thanks
Eric
I´m blowen away how good the SSL SIX sound, both A & B sound great no matter what
Old 4 weeks ago
  #855
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
Rack ears should be confirmed shortly. Hopefully available in a few weeks, and yes it will look a bit like the picture posted.
Good Day Jim,

Is there any chance that American Musical Supply or zZounds will be one of the suppliers for the SSL SiX or SSL Fusion in the near future? Their brand list has expanded pretty decent over time, and I'm just wondering if there's any possibilities of these showing up in their inventory.

Thanks for your forthcoming response
Old 4 weeks ago
  #856
Gear Nut
 

Verses API 1608

On an album project main desk API 1608.

Best thing about the six is the summing - fast and punchy tons of headroom. Eq’s sound super smooth, not a fan of the mic pre’s, not a fan of the monitor controller don’t like what it does to the image. The six has excellent head room really excellent. Build quality is great other than faders feel cheap.Won’t go into the difference between the 1608.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #857
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alphablast View Post
On an album project main desk API 1608.

Best thing about the six is the summing - fast and punchy tons of headroom. Eq’s sound super smooth, not a fan of the mic pre’s, not a fan of the monitor controller don’t like what it does to the image. The six has excellent head room really excellent. Build quality is great other than faders feel cheap.Won’t go into the difference between the 1608.
What's it doing to the image? How would you describe the tone / character of the pres?
...and you can use an SSL large console pre or API pre for comparison...
Old 4 weeks ago
  #858
Here for the gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
Rack ears should be confirmed shortly. Hopefully available in a few weeks, and yes it will look a bit like the picture posted.
Hi Jim,

Will there be rack ear kit for 2 Sixes linked together?
Old 4 weeks ago
  #859
Solid State Logic
 
Jim@SSL's Avatar
 

Yes, eventually.
I know we're a bit slower than planned but the rack kits are nearly ready to go on sale through our dealer network.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #860
Lives for gear
 
Lando Calrissian's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
Yes, eventually.
I know we're a bit slower than planned but the rack kits are nearly ready to go on sale through our dealer network.
Any preview pics? I'm building a rack, that's why I keep asking...

Last edited by Lando Calrissian; 3 weeks ago at 07:22 PM..
Old 3 weeks ago
  #861
Gear Nut
Quote:
Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
Rack ears should be confirmed shortly. Hopefully available in a few weeks, and yes it will look a bit like the picture posted.
any news on the rack ears? would help tremendously!
Old 3 weeks ago
  #862
Lives for gear
 
DirkP's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by mr.dangamira View Post
any news on the rack ears? would help tremendously!
Poor Jim, he replied just 14 hours ago. I think he should post an update at least 2 times an hour...
Old 3 weeks ago
  #863
Gear Nut
Quote:
Originally Posted by DirkP View Post
Poor Jim, he replied just 14 hours ago. I think he should post an update at least 2 times an hour...
Obviously I overlooked his post today. But thanks for playing nice and clearing that up.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #864
Gear Head
 

Help! I have some credit at sweetwater and I think I've decided to buy the SSL as soon as this coming Monday. So, can someone answer the following:

1) How do the super analog pres sound with acoustic guitar? I will be converting with an Apollo Twin
2) What do you think of the 2 channel compressors and bus compressor?
3) Can I use it as a monitor control? I have 2 pair of monitors and I'm hoping I can send from the Twin into the Six and switch between the 2 different pairs of monitors on the Six.

I think I kind of know the answers to these questions, but I would really appreciate actual user input on this. I hate buying something and having to return it.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #865
Lives for gear
 

Totally floored how good the Six sounds! Can’t believe what you get for the price. My wife and I were super skeptical at first. Kind of like “how do we get SSL quality at this price!??!”

Well we’re converts now. Local dealer here in Paris lent us a demo unit and it sounds fantastic.

We needed a master fader between our 2buss processing and our ADC as we are doing a lot of live recordings and we had to have a way that allowed us to do console style fades at the end of a set.

The Six gives us that plus the added juiciness of 2 channels of VHD and the bus comp which sounds amazing.

As high end gearsluts, my wife and I are floored by the fact that you can get a “micro SSL console” for about 1300€. SSL has created a future classic with this one.
Attached Thumbnails
SSL SiX small format mixer???-ssl-six-ksl.paris.jpg  
Old 3 weeks ago
  #866
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by neofolk View Post
Help! I have some credit at sweetwater and I think I've decided to buy the SSL as soon as this coming Monday. So, can someone answer the following:

1) How do the super analog pres sound with acoustic guitar? I will be converting with an Apollo Twin
2) What do you think of the 2 channel compressors and bus compressor?
3) Can I use it as a monitor control? I have 2 pair of monitors and I'm hoping I can send from the Twin into the Six and switch between the 2 different pairs of monitors on the Six.

I think I kind of know the answers to these questions, but I would really appreciate actual user input on this. I hate buying something and having to return it.
I've been using the SiX about 2 days now. Just for reference, I use a large format SSL E/G daily and many other top shelf pres/comps/EQ. I'm a 30 year professional and I'm a gear slut but not a gear snob. I'm of the 'if it sounds good it is good' mentality. These are my initial impressions of the SSL SiX.

Overall sound quality is excellent: clear, punchy, high headroom, very low noise.

I haven't used the pre yet but the compressor and EQ are both very useful and sound quite nice. Perfect for tailoring the sound on the way in.

The bus comp is a bit of a miss for me due to filter being fixed at 50 Hz. Any significant low end just squashes the detector circuit and really limits the usefulness. It does sound good though.

Monitor section is really great. Flexible routing and multiple outs should help those with limited I/O on their interface - you don't have to use a 2nd set of outs to use alt monitors.

This is a very useful audio tool that is totally at home in a professional environment. I did a few hybrid ITB / SiX mixes and I really enjoyed balancing 6 stereo pairs and summing through it, albeit without the bus comp. I have zero complaints with the sonics of this thing. The functionality is great and very well thought out. The tiny footprint is extremely impressive given the amount of I/O, flexibility, and overall sonic quality.

It's a keeper for me.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #867
Lives for gear
 
12tone's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by siddhu View Post

The Six gives us that plus the added juiciness of 2 channels of VHD and the bus comp which sounds amazing.
Them pres don't have VHD.

A pair of the SSL VHD 500 series is basically the same cost as the SiX.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #868
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by phillyguitar View Post
I've been using the SiX about 2 days now. Just for reference, I use a large format SSL E/G daily and many other top shelf pres/comps/EQ. I'm a 30 year professional and I'm a gear slut but not a gear snob. I'm of the 'if it sounds good it is good' mentality. These are my initial impressions of the SSL SiX.

Overall sound quality is excellent: clear, punchy, high headroom, very low noise.

I haven't used the pre yet but the compressor and EQ are both very useful and sound quite nice. Perfect for tailoring the sound on the way in.

The bus comp is a bit of a miss for me due to filter being fixed at 50 Hz. Any significant low end just squashes the detector circuit and really limits the usefulness. It does sound good though.

Monitor section is really great. Flexible routing and multiple outs should help those with limited I/O on their interface - you don't have to use a 2nd set of outs to use alt monitors.

This is a very useful audio tool that is totally at home in a professional environment. I did a few hybrid ITB / SiX mixes and I really enjoyed balancing 6 stereo pairs and summing through it, albeit without the bus comp. I have zero complaints with the sonics of this thing. The functionality is great and very well thought out. The tiny footprint is extremely impressive given the amount of I/O, flexibility, and overall sonic quality.

It's a keeper for me.
Thank you for the reply! Just what I needed to hear to place my order next week
Old 3 weeks ago
  #869
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by 12tone View Post
Them pres don't have VHD.

A pair of the SSL VHD 500 series is basically the same cost as the SiX.
Your absolutely right! I don't no why I was thinking they had VHD - but running our Octatrack through them and doing some EQ and comp tweaking on the 2 mono channels gives some really nice flavour.

Last edited by siddhu; 3 weeks ago at 12:59 PM..
Old 3 weeks ago
  #870
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by phillyguitar View Post

The bus comp is a bit of a miss for me due to filter being fixed at 50 Hz. Any significant low end just squashes the detector circuit and really limits the usefulness. It does sound good though.
Do you mind explaining what you mean? Wouldn't this make it unworkable on a master mix?
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearslutz Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…
Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Similar Threads
Thread
Thread Starter / Forum
Replies
gregory / Live Sound
23
Rakrum / Low End Theory
0
finalrequest / Low End Theory
0
RusRant / Geekslutz Forum
10
TeReKeTe / Low End Theory
4

Forum Jump
Forum Jump