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Bae 1073/neve 1073/stam 1073
Old 30th March 2018
  #1
Bae 1073/neve 1073/stam 1073

Is there any reason why there hasn’t been a gear shootout, comparison on the Stam 1073 and a Bae, or a Neve ?
I’ve seen the Stam vs the GAP and the Manley and even plug-ins,
but there isn’t anything to be found with comparing something on the same level as the Stam 1073 ?
I know there are a ton of Stam lovers out there !!!
Anyone out there care to indulge us ?
Old 30th March 2018
  #2
Old 16th May 2018
  #3
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I've searched for a shootouts between 1073 clones about 1000 dollars such as Stam 1073, Warm WA-73, and Heritage HA73 etcs.
I found several Youtube videos or audio clips about Warm vs Heritage, or Warm vs Neve etcs. But I couldn't find anything about Warm vs Stam or Heritage vs Stam.
I'm really looking forward to some reviews about Stam vs the competitors!!!
Old 16th May 2018
  #4
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Because we are talking about two different market niches: the folks that buy Neve and BAE usually don't buy Stam and Warm and vice versa. As such there's no easy way to compare these. There's no secret conspiracy behind this lack of shootouts as some forum members tend to imply when talking about some cheaper Neve clones. But since we are in the conspiracy epoch if you wish to expand this further, go on...
Old 16th May 2018
  #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AyaGo View Post
I've searched for a shootouts between 1073 clones about 1000 dollars such as Stam 1073, Warm WA-73, and Heritage HA73 etcs.
I found several Youtube videos or audio clips about Warm vs Heritage, or Warm vs Neve etcs. But I couldn't find anything about Warm vs Stam or Heritage vs Stam.
I'm really looking forward to some reviews about Stam vs the competitors!!!
I should be able to do this pretty shortly (but only with eq off since the stam with EQ is not due to be out for a while). When the stam arrives I can compare GAP MkIII, Heritage Elite HA-73eq, Wa273eq, Stam SA73.

I don't have a Neve or BAE, though. As noted, different market niche. I might be interested in trying the Neve out, though, and selling it or something else after the demo.
Old 16th May 2018
  #6
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I’ve got a Stam MKI with Sowters, a BAE, and a Heritage HA73EQ here. I shot them out a week ago on a re-amped electric guitar. The Stam is darker than the other two, probably because of the Sowters. The Heritage and BAE sound really close. I think the BAE is slightly richer sounding. I’m guessing the Stam with Carnhills would sound really close to the BAE. I did own the Warm for awhile too. It’s the most vintage sounding of the bunch, which can be a good or bad thing.
Old 16th May 2018
  #7
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deuc647's Avatar
 

If im not mistaken the BAE uses jensen transformers.
Old 16th May 2018
  #8
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ProgFree's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by deuc647 View Post
If im not mistaken the BAE uses jensen transformers.
You're mistaken, it is Carnhill
Old 16th May 2018
  #9
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deuc647's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ProgFree View Post
You're mistaken, it is Carnhill
Damn I could have swore they used Jensens, i remember reading about it cuz i wanted to try and make a 1073 with Jensens to see how it would sound. Maybe i was drunk
Old 16th May 2018
  #10
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The Avedis MA5 is a 1073ish preamp with Jensens
Old 16th May 2018
  #11
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deuc647's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrentA View Post
The Avedis MA5 is a 1073ish preamp with Jensens
Bingo, damn i was probably drinking lol thanks Brent
Old 16th May 2018
  #12
Quote:
Originally Posted by deuc647 View Post
Damn I could have swore they used Jensens, i remember reading about it cuz i wanted to try and make a 1073 with Jensens to see how it would sound. Maybe i was drunk
Maybe you were drunk, but you got it right anyways: Bae has an option to include Jensens on the DI input (only on the DI), but even with that mod (called bootsy) both the input and output stage transformers are Carnhill.

I think that the hand wiring involved in the Bae's make them more expensive and at the same time more faithful to the vintage ones. The Stam probably sounds better than clones at its price range because you're not going thru any distributor and also because Josh starts manufacturing (and probably purchasing some of the expensive components - transformers) after receiving orders, so he diminishes that risk and can adjust prices better. So I am sure that the Stams sound better than the Warm Audio and the Heritage Elite, but the Bae's are probably a different story, just like the Great Rivers, they are a little bit better overall. (they cost 3 times more so no question they should)
Old 16th May 2018
  #13
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I have a pair of MKI Stam 73s with Carnhills on the way and also preordered a 1073MPA (MkII with Sowters). I believe the Sowter transformers are intentionally a little bit darker to try and mimic the Marinar sound. That's what I was hoping for, personally, so it will be interesting to see how it compares to the Carnhill ones, too. Of course there's also the MkI vs MkII factor, so it won't be a scientific test.

Begun, the clone wars have.
Old 16th May 2018
  #14
I decided to go with older Brent Averill 1073's which sound amazing IMO
I wanted to go with a company who had the reputation, and i am very happy.
1st unit has a Carnhill Mic input with a Maranair Line input
2nd unit also has a Carnhil Mic Input with a St Ives L31267 Line input.
these are from the 2002 era.
Attached Thumbnails
Bae 1073/neve 1073/stam 1073-img_0274.jpg  
Old 16th May 2018
  #15
Quote:
Originally Posted by ProgFree View Post
Because we are talking about two different market niches: the folks that buy Neve and BAE usually don't buy Stam and Warm and vice versa. As such there's no easy way to compare these. There's no secret conspiracy behind this lack of shootouts as some forum members tend to imply when talking about some cheaper Neve clones. But since we are in the conspiracy epoch if you wish to expand this further, go on...
Theres no conspiracy at all,
You are talking about a company cloning a neve 1073 ?
why wouldn't someone shoot this out ?
There isn't a single video out comparing a Stam to Neve and IMO thats strange.
Maybe your right about the Neve folks not even looking at the Stam stuff, but, for everyone else, it would be nice to compare and hear the differences between the original and the new gear.
Just my opinion.
Most of the time in this life, you get what you pay for.
Old 16th May 2018
  #16
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The biggest reason the Stam is so cheap is because of how less expensive it is to manufacture something in Chile compared to the USA or the UK. They don't seem to be cutting corners on the quality of the parts.
Old 16th May 2018
  #17
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrentA View Post
The biggest reason the Stam is so cheap is because of how less expensive it is to manufacture something in Chile compared to the USA or the UK. They don't seem to be cutting corners on the quality of the parts.
are you the real Brent Averill lol ?
Old 16th May 2018
  #18
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cheu78's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrentA View Post
The Avedis MA5 is a 1073ish preamp with Jensens
Avedis still uses a Carnhill on the input (like the other manufacturers) but uses indeed a custom made Jensen on the output.

Ttattwa got it right: BAE uses carnhills and has the bootsy collins mod for the DI only (and that transformer, again DI only, is a jensen).


Cheu
Old 16th May 2018
  #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dreckdirect View Post
are you the real Brent Averill lol ?
Ha nope
Old 17th May 2018
  #20
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrentA View Post
Ha nope
That would’ve been so cool
Old 1st June 2018
  #21
My understanding is that’s the BAE is closest to the original Neve design and uses the Carnhill St. Ives transformers by the original manufacturer (their modern day counterpart anyway). They even out bid AMS Neve to use those specific transformers. Everyone else is using a copy or variant.

I had been doing a bunch of research on this and had settled on buying the BAE before stumbling upon and purchasing a dual channel Dan Alexander Class A preamp, which is a reracked original Neve preamp. There were two versions, the blue face used the original circuit boards and replacement transformers. The black face, which I picked up, uses replacement circuit boards, but has original Carnhill St. Ives transformers. The preamp sounds huge and finished.

I haven’t used the Warm or Heritage Elite yet, but I’m hoping to get my hands on the Heritage Elite soon to film/record a shoot out for my YouTube page.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCAh...YW1nfSeG7pIbuQ

I was using the UAD 1073 Unison preamps for a while and I also own an old TNC ACMP-84, which is a very early Neve clone release in a group buy here on GS. Neither has the huge sound of the Dan Alexander. I have used the Stam MKI at my friend Martin’s studio. It definitely has a similar sound. I really want to try to get them in the same room, especially with the MKII coming soon and with the EQ enabled version. Martin made a nice video with his StamSA73 vs the UAD 1073. I think it says a lot.

Old 1st June 2018
  #22
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toledo3's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheShadowV View Post
My understanding is that’s the BAE is closest to the original Neve design
An original 1073 consists of a BA283 and BA284 gain stages.

The Brent Averill unit takes only the BA283 gain stage, and then sets it up to get more gain overall, which winds up being a bit more saturated/mushy sound at higher gain settings, and gives less headroom.

It’s not necessarily a big deal given how much clean gain is on tap in digital, and the BAE idea may even be preferable if you want more harmonic distortion at the top end of the gain. But, it is a difference, and maybe a significant one depending on what you are expecting.
Old 1st June 2018
  #23
Quote:
Originally Posted by toledo3 View Post
An original 1073 consists of a BA283 and BA284 gain stages.

The Brent Averill unit takes only the BA283 gain stage, and then sets it up to get more gain overall, which winds up being a bit more saturated/mushy sound at higher gain settings, and gives less headroom.

It’s not necessarily a big deal given how much clean gain is on tap in digital, and the BAE idea may even be preferable if you want more harmonic distortion at the top end of the gain. But, it is a difference, and maybe a significant one depending on what you are expecting.
Interesting. I did not know that.
Old 1st June 2018
  #24
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Rockabilly69's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by toledo3 View Post
An original 1073 consists of a BA283 and BA284 gain stages.

The Brent Averill unit takes only the BA283 gain stage, and then sets it up to get more gain overall, which winds up being a bit more saturated/mushy sound at higher gain settings, and gives less headroom.

It’s not necessarily a big deal given how much clean gain is on tap in digital, and the BAE idea may even be preferable if you want more harmonic distortion at the top end of the gain. But, it is a difference, and maybe a significant one depending on what you are expecting.
A few weeks ago I bought a BAE 1073 MPF and I found it has more than enough clean gain for my needs (acoustic guitar / vocals), but I think I'm going to buy a Warm 1073 EQ and compare them as direct as I can (bypassing the EQ on the Warm). If I do I will post the results.

I've never owned a real Neve 1073 and most owners of the BAE stuff typically seem to hold their 1073s in high regard so I though it would give one a try. The only pre that I own, that is remotely similar to a 1073, is my Neve Portico 5012 (with the silk button pushed in), and I can say without a doubt, the BAE1073 MPF has way more saturation on tap than the 5012
Old 3rd June 2018
  #25
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LockStock's Avatar
BAE MP and MPF models do not have three gain stages like a real 1073. Heritage, DON Classics, AMS and others get this right, but BAE has that modded 1272 History/heritage and I imagine these models are holdovers since they sell so well.
Old 3rd June 2018
  #26
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iangomes's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheShadowV View Post
My understanding is that’s the BAE is closest to the original Neve design and uses the Carnhill St. Ives transformers by the original manufacturer (their modern day counterpart anyway). They even out bid AMS Neve to use those specific transformers. Everyone else is using a copy or variant.

I had been doing a bunch of research on this and had settled on buying the BAE before stumbling upon and purchasing a dual channel Dan Alexander Class A preamp, which is a reracked original Neve preamp. There were two versions, the blue face used the original circuit boards and replacement transformers. The black face, which I picked up, uses replacement circuit boards, but has original Carnhill St. Ives transformers. The preamp sounds huge and finished.

I haven’t used the Warm or Heritage Elite yet, but I’m hoping to get my hands on the Heritage Elite soon to film/record a shoot out for my YouTube page.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCAh...YW1nfSeG7pIbuQ

I was using the UAD 1073 Unison preamps for a while and I also own an old TNC ACMP-84, which is a very early Neve clone release in a group buy here on GS. Neither has the huge sound of the Dan Alexander. I have used the Stam MKI at my friend Martin’s studio. It definitely has a similar sound. I really want to try to get them in the same room, especially with the MKII coming soon and with the EQ enabled version. Martin made a nice video with his StamSA73 vs the UAD 1073. I think it says a lot.

I'm pretty sure that AMS Neve uses carnhill transformers as well.
Old 3rd June 2018
  #27
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mikeyman's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrentA View Post
I’ve got a Stam MKI with Sowters, a BAE, and a Heritage HA73EQ here. I shot them out a week ago on a re-amped electric guitar. The Stam is darker than the other two, probably because of the Sowters. The Heritage and BAE sound really close. I think the BAE is slightly richer sounding. I’m guessing the Stam with Carnhills would sound really close to the BAE. I did own the Warm for awhile too. It’s the most vintage sounding of the bunch, which can be a good or bad thing.
yes but if you had to keep only one what one would you choose
Old 4th June 2018
  #28
Quote:
Originally Posted by iangomes View Post
I'm pretty sure that AMS Neve uses carnhill transformers as well.
My understanding is that even though it is essentially the same transformer it is not made by Carnhill. This video is for the 500 series version, but shows what I had been told by numerous people.

Old 4th June 2018
  #29
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mikeyman's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheShadowV View Post
My understanding is that’s the BAE is closest to the original Neve design and uses the Carnhill St. Ives transformers by the original manufacturer (their modern day counterpart anyway). They even out bid AMS Neve to use those specific transformers. Everyone else is using a copy or variant.

I had been doing a bunch of research on this and had settled on buying the BAE before stumbling upon and purchasing a dual channel Dan Alexander Class A preamp, which is a reracked original Neve preamp. There were two versions, the blue face used the original circuit boards and replacement transformers. The black face, which I picked up, uses replacement circuit boards, but has original Carnhill St. Ives transformers. The preamp sounds huge and finished.

I haven’t used the Warm or Heritage Elite yet, but I’m hoping to get my hands on the Heritage Elite soon to film/record a shoot out for my YouTube page.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCAh...YW1nfSeG7pIbuQ

I was using the UAD 1073 Unison preamps for a while and I also own an old TNC ACMP-84, which is a very early Neve clone release in a group buy here on GS. Neither has the huge sound of the Dan Alexander. I have used the Stam MKI at my friend Martin’s studio. It definitely has a similar sound. I really want to try to get them in the same room, especially with the MKII coming soon and with the EQ enabled version. Martin made a nice video with his StamSA73 vs the UAD 1073. I think it says a lot.

both sounded good .I thought the Stam had a thicker sound not that that was better
and on acoustic guitar you can really hear it ...not so much on the other tracks
Old 4th June 2018
  #30
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I wonder if his stam was the carnhill or the sowter version.

I should be getting my pair of carnhill stams this week. I don't have a BAE, but can compare them to the WA273EQ, a heritage elite, and GAP MkIII with Zenpro mod and carnhills.

I do also have the stereo rackmount stam mk II with sowters on order. When that will arrive...I dunno. But I will also look forward to testing that vs everything else.
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