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Which mixer and cables for old RME soundcard? Audio Interfaces
Old 21st May 2017
  #1
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Which mixer and cables for old RME soundcard?

Hello,

This is just a temporary bandage upgrade until I do a full studio revamp. Upgraded from mbox to the Hammerfall 9632 because it was so cheap on craigslist. Im looking for a tiny mixer, preferably one I can easily cut speakers and not have to always lower volume to listen with phones. Not worried about lots of inputs, just want o have my headset and monitors set up again. Was going to get separate cables for out of the card, but I'd rather just have a small mixer in the meantime.

Sound card:

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/det...A2QaAlbv8P8HAQ

Speakers: Mackie HR24 Old Versions

Here is what I got so far:

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/det...y&utm_term=2x2

VS

Behringer Xenyx 502 5-Input 2-Bus Mixer [502] : AVShop.ca - Canada's Pro Audio, Video and DJ Store

Not sure which cables I should go with either.

Thank you!
Old 22nd May 2017
  #2
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Old 22nd May 2017
  #3
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GEt a monitor controller instead, perhaps the Palmer Monicon L (I have one, plus do a search for my thread on it here, on this subsection of the forum). I used to use a Behringer mini mixer once (and like you, I also have a 9632). It added lots of noise.

Also, there is a balanced breakout cable available for the 9632. It may be worthwhile getting one of those.

/Magnus
Old 22nd May 2017
  #4
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Looks good, but thats a little out of my price range for a temporary upgrade.

It came with the cables, but there's no way to turn down monitor and headphone level without using the software interface:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/con...m=Y&sku=833116


I would also need these if, but I'd rather get cables to go into a mixer
Old 22nd May 2017
  #5
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Unless you need other features of mixer (like its preamp), I'd also go with mentioned Monicon L.. It will be usable also with any next interface and with short cables it's much more transparent than typical budget mix.
Monicon L has built in headphone amp, so you'll feed it only with one pair of analog outs from 9632 and won't use its phones output jack. The one stereo signal will be shared between monitors and HP amp, each has individual volume control.

Other cheaper option is small Nanopatch by JBL or Monicon (without L), both are simple passive attenuators with mute and no HP amp, this will be between speakers and your analog outputs. Phones will be independently driven from 9632 and controlled from Total Mix.

With regards to breakout cables.. If you have unbalanced variant with RCAs, those are also usable with both volume controllers (albeit it might be more prone to ground loops with your speakers or amp).. Their full balanced breakout is nice accessory to 9632 and if you intend to use it in the future, I'd get it anyway.

Michal
Old 5th June 2017
  #6
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$250USD for the Palmer is a little pricey for a temporary upgrade, but I found this older version on ebay that comes to around $150CAN after shipping:

Which mixer and cables for old RME soundcard?MINT Palmer MONICON Passive Monitor Controller | eBay

Seems to have the basics of what I need, it's too bad on neither of these controllers there is no one quarter inch stereo input, instead I'll need separate cable for L/R. Right now I'm using this from Mackie HR24s to RME (with quarter inch jack):

http://www.guitarcenter.com/Hosa/Stereo-Y-Cable-Mini-Male-2-1-4-Mono-Males-10-ft-1274034477595.gc?cntry=us&source=4WWRWXGP&gclid=CjwKEAjwgtTJBRDRmd6ZtLrGyxwSJAA7Fy-hB3-w2qcqriPcMgn4yOjfF-O40P4T7dVzH3imC4LG5RoCQMrw_wcB&kwid=productads-adid^76729338762-device^c-plaid^151365588042-sku^1274034477595@ADL4GC-adType^PLA
Old 5th June 2017
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Valorous View Post
$250USD for the Palmer is a little pricey for a temporary upgrade, but I found this older version on ebay that comes to around $150CAN after shipping:

Which mixer and cables for old RME soundcard?MINT Palmer MONICON Passive Monitor Controller | eBay

Seems to have the basics of what I need, it's too bad on neither of these controllers there is no one quarter inch stereo input, instead I'll need separate cable for L/R. Right now I'm using this from Mackie HR24s to RME (with quarter inch jack):

http://www.guitarcenter.com/Hosa/Stereo-Y-Cable-Mini-Male-2-1-4-Mono-Males-10-ft-1274034477595.gc?cntry=us&source=4WWRWXGP&gclid=CjwKEAjwgtTJBRDRmd6ZtLrGyxwSJAA7Fy-hB3-w2qcqriPcMgn4yOjfF-O40P4T7dVzH3imC4LG5RoCQMrw_wcB&kwid=productads-adid^76729338762-device^c-plaid^151365588042-sku^1274034477595@ADL4GC-adType^PLA
That is not an older version, but a smaller version. And the asking price is about the same as for this unit new.

/Magnus
Old 7th June 2017
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnus_N View Post
That is not an older version, but a smaller version. And the asking price is about the same as for this unit new.

/Magnus
Thanks didn't notice that. Sucks theres no headphone jack for the palmer, but I can just go into the RME separately.

Also, should have mentioned my speakers are powered Mackie HR24 Old Versions
Old 11th June 2017
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Old 11th June 2017
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Valorous View Post
Can you guys please link me to the right input cables for RME to the controller. There is no Stereo Out, so I'm assuming my current 1/4 inch jack to stereo 3.5mm jack is obsolete:

https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon....68NZK_img3.jpg
It depends on which breakout cable you have.. HDSP 9632 has two options - ubalanced with RCAs and balanced with XLRs.

In case of BO variant with RCAs, you can get something like this:
https://www.amazon.com/Hosa-GPR-101-.../dp/B000068O3S
and appropriate RCA stereo cable

For balanced BO XLR variant, you'd need two XLR female to TRS cables.
https://www.amazon.com/Monoprice-104...dp/B001UJIYIK/

Michal
Old 12th June 2017
  #11
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I have this version of rme breakout cable:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/con...m=Y&sku=833116

I'm currently outputting my monitors directly from the RME's TRS connector, using a 1/4 jack. So could I just use this same cable for the monitor controller's "IN 3 STEREO" input (with jack)? Then buy 2 of these for my Mackie HR24 old versions:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/con...m=Y&sku=833116


Quote:
Originally Posted by msmucr View Post
It depends on which breakout cable you have.. HDSP 9632 has two options - ubalanced with RCAs and balanced with XLRs.

In case of BO variant with RCAs, you can get something like this:
https://www.amazon.com/Hosa-GPR-101-.../dp/B000068O3S
and appropriate RCA stereo cable

For balanced BO XLR variant, you'd need two XLR female to TRS cables.
https://www.amazon.com/Monoprice-104...dp/B001UJIYIK/

Michal
Old 12th June 2017
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Valorous View Post
I have this version of rme breakout cable:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/con...m=Y&sku=833116

I'm currently outputting my monitors directly from the RME's TRS connector, using a 1/4 jack. So could I just use this same cable for the monitor controller's "IN 3 STEREO" input (with jack)? Then buy 2 of these for my Mackie HR24 old versions:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/con...m=Y&sku=833116
That's the balanced breakout cable. You are using the headphone out at the moment. I would recommend getting two TRS to XLR cables instead of the way you suggest, although that should work as well.

I don't know why you write above that "There is no Stereo Out" on the HDSP 9632. There is. Use this instead of the headphone output.

/Magnus
Old 12th June 2017
  #13
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What's wrong with going out from headphone amp to IN 3 (Stereo) on the monitor controller? Then to out put the mackies I can also use TRS to XLR instead of both TRS like you suggest.

Is it better to eliminate my current RCA cable, and get 4 separate cables for all the in's/outs? So:

HDSP 9632 XLR to TRS (2x) ---> Controller monitor IN 1

and Controller monitor OUT 1 L/R TRS to XLR (2x) ---> Mackies
(Or TRS to TRS)

Thanks!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnus_N View Post
That's the balanced breakout cable. You are using the headphone out at the moment. I would recommend getting two TRS to XLR cables instead of the way you suggest, although that should work as well.

I don't know why you write above that "There is no Stereo Out" on the HDSP 9632. There is. Use this instead of the headphone output.

/Magnus
Old 12th June 2017
  #14
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Valorous, I already replied.. If you have balanced BO, then get two female XLR to TRS cables and connect that to ART controller, you've selected.
If you want to listen to main mix at headphones, connect it to HP output of ART, simple.. if you want to hear some totally separate mix at headphones (for example CUE mix for artist), then connect phones to HP out at BO cable directly from RME, where you can output different signal from main mix.

I don't see any reason for using HP output instead of balanced interconnects or connect to monitor controller twice

Michal
Old 12th June 2017
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Valorous View Post
What's wrong with going out from headphone amp to IN 3 (Stereo) on the monitor controller? Then to out put the mackies I can also use TRS to XLR instead of both TRS like you suggest.

Is it better to eliminate my current RCA cable, and get 4 separate cables for all the in's/outs? So:

HDSP 9632 XLR to TRS (2x) ---> Controller monitor IN 1

and Controller monitor OUT 1 L/R TRS to XLR (2x) ---> Mackies
(Or TRS to TRS)

Thanks!
BAlanced connections are preferable in general, as Michal has stated.

However, Michal, you cannot output a different signal from the HDSP 9632's headphone output, since it is identical to the Analogue 1 and 2 (i.e. the stereo analogue outs). From p. 47 of the manual:

"Channels 11/12 of the HDSP 9632 are also available via an 1/4" TRS jack (stereo output). This output is optimized for headphone operation. [...] The output delivers the same signal as the Line outputs, and its volume is adjusted in the same way via TotalMix."

/Magnus
Old 12th June 2017
  #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnus_N View Post
...
However, Michal, you cannot output a different signal from the HDSP 9632's headphone output, since it is identical to the Analogue 1 and 2 (i.e. the stereo analogue outs). From p. 47 of the manual:

"Channels 11/12 of the HDSP 9632 are also available via an 1/4" TRS jack (stereo output). This output is optimized for headphone operation. [...] The output delivers the same signal as the Line outputs, and its volume is adjusted in the same way via TotalMix."

/Magnus
You're true Magnus, I stand corrected.. I have HDSPe AIO, which has separate DAC and corresponding TM output pair for headphones. I didn't recall, 9632 was different in this area (I haven't used it for years).
Thank you for the catch!

All the best,

Michal
Old 12th June 2017
  #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by msmucr View Post
You're true Magnus, I stand corrected.. I have HDSPe AIO, which has separate DAC and corresponding TM output pair for headphones. I didn't recall, 9632 was different in this area (I haven't used it for years).
Thank you for the catch!

All the best,

Michal
Haha, Michal, it was easy for me, as I have an ancient HDSP 9632 in my computer. I didn't know that the AIO had a separate headphone output, though. That is interesting.

I've been so satisfied with my 9632 that I have been building my computers around it, finding motherboards with PCI-slots, for over ten years now. And I am about to add an AO4S-192 to it, for four more analog outs.

Best,

Magnus
Old 12th June 2017
  #18
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Those HDSP cards are keepers for sure, mainly due to excellent software and drivers. Friend has 9652 for ADAT converters and it's sill rock solid, we also picked some Skylake board, which has legacy PCI slot.
I have input board AI4S-192 at my AIO, it works very well. Never tried output board, but I don't think, there will be any problem.

Good luck with RME!

Michal
Old 13th June 2017
  #19
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Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by msmucr View Post
Valorous, I already replied.. If you have balanced BO, then get two female XLR to TRS cables and connect that to ART controller, you've selected.
If you want to listen to main mix at headphones, connect it to HP output of ART, simple.. if you want to hear some totally separate mix at headphones (for example CUE mix for artist), then connect phones to HP out at BO cable directly from RME, where you can output different signal from main mix.

I don't see any reason for using HP output instead of balanced interconnects or connect to monitor controller twice

Michal
Yes I got that, I was saying to use my RCA cable instead, from RME to ART, so I don't waste the cable. Obviously I intend to use the heaphone amp in the ART to hear the main mix.

Right now I'm using the HP output directly to my monitors because I currently only have THESE:

https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon....68NZK_img3.jpg

https://www.amazon.com/Hosa-GPR-101-.../dp/B000068O3S


Since it's not preferable, now I need FOUR cables overall. Female XLR to TRS (2), and TRS to Male XLR for my monitors.
Old 17th June 2017
  #20
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Didn't even see this. Ok, will these cables fix my speaker noise issue? I'm getting weird sounds ever since this monitor controller, annoying screeching sounds that are spontaneous.

I've had no issues going from my RME HP amp directly to my Mackie's via RCA to L/R Quarter inch. But now, I'm using the RCA cable to the ART, and these from ART outputs to Mackies:

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/det...BoCSSwQAvD_BwE

I don't see it being an outlet or grounding issue since it works from headphone amp to speakers.

Thanks!

Quote:
Originally Posted by msmucr View Post
It depends on which breakout cable you have.. HDSP 9632 has two options - ubalanced with RCAs and balanced with XLRs.

In case of BO variant with RCAs, you can get something like this:
https://www.amazon.com/Hosa-GPR-101-.../dp/B000068O3S
and appropriate RCA stereo cable

For balanced BO XLR variant, you'd need two XLR female to TRS cables.
https://www.amazon.com/Monoprice-104...dp/B001UJIYIK/

Michal
Old 17th June 2017
  #21
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Well, you insisted to stay with your unbalanced cables fed by HP out.. Generally if you have option to use balanced connections at all devices in setup, then do it.
I wrote that previous recommendation intentionally.. because insertion of another powered device, where is connected signal ground to chassis ground can cause ground loops, you're experiencing.
You don't necessarily need premium Mogami cables, that's pretty expensive.. and for instance those $10 Monoprices can work there as well.. only thing is, it needs to be balanced (eg. TRS to XLR and not TS to XLR).
I haven't really used this exact setup (ART and Mackie HR), but if it's properly made, then it should help with the loop. Otherwise, I'd test to lift the ground at inputs of Mackies, however it's next step and for another post with explanation.

Michal
Old 19th June 2017
  #22
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Cool, I'm about to order two of these, pretty good sale atm:

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/STX110F

Also, why TRS male and not TRS female?

Thanks

Quote:
Originally Posted by msmucr View Post
Well, you insisted to stay with your unbalanced cables fed by HP out.. Generally if you have option to use balanced connections at all devices in setup, then do it.
I wrote that previous recommendation intentionally.. because insertion of another powered device, where is connected signal ground to chassis ground can cause ground loops, you're experiencing.
You don't necessarily need premium Mogami cables, that's pretty expensive.. and for instance those $10 Monoprices can work there as well.. only thing is, it needs to be balanced (eg. TRS to XLR and not TS to XLR).
I haven't really used this exact setup (ART and Mackie HR), but if it's properly made, then it should help with the loop. Otherwise, I'd test to lift the ground at inputs of Mackies, however it's next step and for another post with explanation.

Michal
Old 19th June 2017
  #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Valorous View Post
Cool, I'm about to order two of these, pretty good sale atm:

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/STX110F

Also, why TRS male and not TRS female?

Thanks
Hi,

simple.. because you need to connect XLR male output (RME BO cable side) to TRS female (panel input jack at ART).
So cable there has to be XLR female -> TRS male.

For connection from ART to the monitors, you'll need TRS male -> XLR male, because input connector there is XLR female.
like these https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/STX110M

Generally it's simple with analog XLRs, output it always at male connector type.

Michal
Old 19th June 2017
  #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by msmucr View Post
Hi,

simple.. because you need to connect XLR male output (RME BO cable side) to TRS female (panel input jack at ART).
So cable there has to be XLR female -> TRS male.

For connection from ART to the monitors, you'll need TRS male -> XLR male, because input connector there is XLR female.
like these https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/STX110M

Generally it's simple with analog XLRs, output it always at male connector type.

Michal

Cool I already got those to output my speakers (the expensive versions). Going to order the Female xlr to TRS male right now. One more thing, this could also work from my ART to monitors, but it's better to just keep the XLR to TRS?

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/CSS204
Old 19th June 2017
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Valorous View Post
Cool I already got those to output my speakers (the expensive versions). Going to order the Female xlr to TRS male right now. One more thing, this could also work from my ART to monitors, but it's better to just keep the XLR to TRS?

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/CSS204
Uff expensive version (like Mogami), it maybe unnecessary luxury for the rest of your setup.
Yes, TRS-TRS would also work between the monitor controller and monitors, however I like to use non-molded version or TRS-XLR there, because if there will be some further grounding problems, you can open-up the connector at monitor side and break ground connection.

Michal
Old 19th June 2017
  #26
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Old 19th June 2017
  #27
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I already had the Mogami's for outputting monitors, I just bought these for my soundcard inputs:

https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B001UJERGS/...709270_TE_item

If this setup doesn't work, I'm going to try the Behringer in my OP. But it should work, now I'm pretty sure the issue is my L/R 1/4" to RCA cable (with 1/4" jack) outputting from the RME headphone amp.

ONly reason I'm going with the ART is for headphone knob control, I could come put of HP amp and use the software but it gets tedious. Other than that, Behringer is cheaper with more options, and I doubt the noise issue is that audible unless cranked.


Quote:
Originally Posted by msmucr View Post
Uff expensive version (like Mogami), it maybe unnecessary luxury for the rest of your setup.
Yes, TRS-TRS would also work between the monitor controller and monitors, however I like to use non-molded version or TRS-XLR there, because if there will be some further grounding problems, you can open-up the connector at monitor side and break ground connection.

Michal
Old 26th June 2017
  #28
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Thread Starter
UPDATE:

The female XLR to TRS male seemed to help a lot, but after a while I'm still getting a short in my left monitor, so I'm pretty sure it's the actual speaker now, since the short is ALWAYS left side no matter my in/out configuration. I've tried outputting my monitors with Mogami TRS to XLR, and with 1/4".

Now, I'm going XLR female directly to my studio monitors and bypassing the ART. Seems to be working again. Not sure if it's the ART or Left monitor at this point since it's random.

No idea what it could be, ready to return this thing although I love it. Could I need now TRS to TRS for ART to Monitors?

Thanks!
Old 27th June 2017
  #29
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Thread Starter
Yeah, left speaker is still cutting out randomly and sound is tilted to right side. When I wiggle the XLR attached to L monitor, nothign really happens. I have better luck when it's a 1/4, usually plugging in/out solves the issue.

No sound tilt in the ART headphone amp. Now what?
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