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Best mixing and mastering monitors in 2017 !!!
Old 1st May 2017
  #1
Best mixing and mastering monitors in 2017 !!!

I am hunting for the close to " perfection " ones...

I will pair them with Antelope Zen Tour and I would like your opinion.

Budget would be round 1500-2500 Euros

I am looking for superb clarity and translation, flat and transparent sound...Will be producing on them but also will want to mix and master on them. Will work different styles but mainly EDM and Trap, or new wave Dance...

Please help me end my searching nightmare...

Thank you
Old 1st May 2017
  #2
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JP__'s Avatar
 

Nobody here is able to end your searching nightmare. Theres not that one speaker that is better than all the others, especially in that (too) low price range.
Its about taste and personal expectations; go out and search in real life. Its the only way that works...
Old 1st May 2017
  #3
Quote:
Originally Posted by JP__ View Post
Nobody here is able to end your searching nightmare. Theres not that one speaker that is better than all the others, especially in that (too) low price range.
Its about taste and personal expectations; go out and search in real life. Its the only way that works...

I know there aren't any "perfect monitors", but your opinion matters...
There has to be a selection, some monitors will be flatter and more correct then others with better translation and clear crisp frequencies, while others will be pumped, hyped, too colorful and far away from the truth...

So let me rephrase that please:

I need a list of a few monitors that you guys know and have worked on, that are correct, flat, with good translation and good frequencies that can cover the full range and are closer to reality in any type of room, that I could mix and master on my productions.

Thank you

Cheers
Old 1st May 2017
  #4
Deleted 691ca21
Guest
You're going to need to spend a lot more than that to find what you have specified.
Old 1st May 2017
  #5
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deleted 691ca21 View Post
You're going to need to spend a lot more than that to find what you have specified.
I'm sure I can find something in this price range as well...

Right? :( Or at least something close to what I have described? :(
Old 1st May 2017
  #6
Deleted 691ca21
Guest
Pounds, rupees, dollars, or yen?

You asked for "close to perfect, superb clarity and translation, flat and transparent sound, want to master on them". That doesn't come cheap. If you're talking GBP Β£, you may find some of the smaller high quality monitors second hand at that price, if you are lucky. Generally, full range mastering grade monitors are gonna be a lot more expensive. Have a look at some quality mastering places and see what they are using.
Old 1st May 2017
  #7
Euros...Sorry :P
Old 1st May 2017
  #8
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermetech Mastering View Post
Pounds, rupees, dollars, or yen?

You asked for "close to perfect, superb clarity and translation, flat and transparent sound, want to master on them". That doesn't come cheap. If you're talking GBP Β£, you may find some of the smaller high quality monitors second hand at that price, if you are lucky. Generally, full range mastering grade monitors are gonna be a lot more expensive. Have a look at some quality mastering places and see what they are using.
I wouldn't be asking the forums if I could have a look in some quality mastering studios...which are not so many by the way

Stop being sarcastic, I'm in blind spot here and a little advice would be nice....At list some brands u think are closer to what I need...I dont know...is Genelec better or Focal... etc... :|
Old 1st May 2017
  #9
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SmoothTone's Avatar
 

With that price limit, I would be looking at Tyler Acoustics.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zadkhiel View Post
closer to reality in any type of room
But there is no speaker that can beat a bad room.
Old 1st May 2017
  #10
Deleted 691ca21
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zadkhiel View Post
I wouldn't be asking the forums if I could have a look in some quality mastering studios...which are not so many by the way
Most of them have websites...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zadkhiel View Post
Stop being sarcastic, I'm in blind spot here and a little advice would be nice....At list some brands u think are closer to what I need...I dont know...is Genelec better or Focal... etc... :|
Not my intention to be sarcastic, just wanted to draw your attention to the fact that your expectations may be high for the budget you state. Have a look (online) at what some of the mastering engineers you respect are using, and look up the prices. I use ATC monitors, but that's one amongst a fair few excellent brands you should be looking to audition.

http://www.proaudioeurope.com/master...-monitors.html
Old 1st May 2017
  #11
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andredb's Avatar
 

had a friend in a similar position and with a similar budget.

i suggested him to visit a large loca hi fi store (hi end not cheap electronic store)

usually these place have a good used section too.

he visited one, listened to everything in the price range, nothing good
visited another, found a pair of canton speakers second hand and now he is a happy guy.

So go to an Hi Fi store and listen. Most mastering speaker are marketed as Hi Fi speaker for consumers (BW, ATC is also an HiFi market company, duntech)

Avoid "Studio" speakers in that range...
Old 1st May 2017
  #12
Quote:
Originally Posted by SmoothTone View Post
With that price limit, I would be looking at Tyler Acoustics.



But there is no speaker that can beat a bad room.
Price limit...let say 3000 Euros tops...

You are right about the room...
Old 1st May 2017
  #13
Lives for gear
The bottom of the line to consider for mixing would be Yamaha HS80M. But they are not good enough for mastering. For mastering, your budget is not enough.

Also for mixing, you want at least two or three different perspectives. I use HS80M's but also have a pair of Manaplaner 1.7 w/ sub, and a pair of B&W's. All a very different look at it. The Yamaha's make you fight for it, the mix benefits. Kinda like a modern version of the NS-10's
Old 1st May 2017
  #14
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermetech Mastering View Post
Most of them have websites...



Not my intention to be sarcastic, just wanted to draw your attention to the fact that your expectations may be high for the budget you state. Have a look (online) at what some of the mastering engineers you respect are using, and look up the prices. I use ATC monitors, but that's one amongst a fair few excellent brands you should be looking to audition.

Mastering Monitors - Professional Mastering Equipment - Funky Junk
A lot is markering and very few will show the masses what they really use....I remember one time when Timbaland was promoting KRK, he had them "in his studio", but what do yoh know? It was a listening room...And his actually working room had big Genelecs of 20.000 dollars a piece....So most of the times, the videos or pictures with speakers from studios will be " what they wanna show us" or what they are paied to show us...

Which model from ATC are you using?
Old 1st May 2017
  #15
Quote:
Originally Posted by andredb View Post
had a friend in a similar position and with a similar budget.

i suggested him to visit a large loca hi fi store (hi end not cheap electronic store)

usually these place have a good used section too.

he visited one, listened to everything in the price range, nothing good
visited another, found a pair of canton speakers second hand and now he is a happy guy.

So go to an Hi Fi store and listen. Most mastering speaker are marketed as Hi Fi speaker for consumers (BW, ATC is also an HiFi market company, duntech)

Avoid "Studio" speakers in that range...
This is interesting...cause one of the biggest mastering and mixing sound engineers from my country, just switched to hi-fi speakers and paid round 6000 euros on them...

Do you think, hi-fi speakers will be better then studio monitors for production/mixing and mastering?
Old 1st May 2017
  #16
Quote:
Originally Posted by elegentdrum View Post
The bottom of the line to consider for mixing would be Yamaha HS80M. But they are not good enough for mastering. For mastering, your budget is not enough.

Also for mixing, you want at least two or three different perspectives. I use HS80M's but also have a pair of Manaplaner 1.7 w/ sub, and a pair of B&W's. All a very different look at it. The Yamaha's make you fight for it, the mix benefits. Kinda like a modern version of the NS-10's
I believe Yamaha HS80M was replaced with HS8...and I could go for that, plus the Yamaha woofer?
Old 1st May 2017
  #17
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Slug1's Avatar
You're probably not going to get very far around here. Best to take your question to the So much gear forum. You'll get more opinions there.
Old 1st May 2017
  #18
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Check the Genelec 8340's with room correction. They will be the most flexible with room acoustics. You still need to try to treat for nulls and high reflections.
Old 2nd May 2017
  #19
Quote:
Originally Posted by pw2005 View Post
Check the Genelec 8340's with room correction. They will be the most flexible with room acoustics. You still need to try to treat for nulls and high reflections.
I'm thinking of buying The Barefoot footprint 01 and be done with it...
Old 2nd May 2017
  #20
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rasmus's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zadkhiel View Post
I believe Yamaha HS80M was replaced with HS8...and I could go for that, plus the Yamaha woofer?
I wouldn't even call the HS series good enough for mixing! They are entry level speakers... and i would also try to avoid subwoofers, there is just so much potential to mess up the placing of it. IMO a good full range speaker is always preferable.

I have only heard the 8" yamahas a few times but i have the small 5" ones in my living room and to me the yamaha tweeters sound really ****ty, not revealing at all. They have the potential to mask serious mix problems...

For mixing you should be fine with Adam/Genelec/Focal (i used the Solo 6 BEs for years) in your price range.

If you buy used you might get a pair of ATC SCM25a or Klein+Hummel O300. The ATC SCM25a sound very close to their bigger range and are a big step up from the mid level Adam/Genelec/Focal speakers.

In case you can't stretch your budget have a look at a used pair of Klein+Hummel o98 and get the foam surround of the speaker replaced (don't know what that part is called in english, in german it's "sicke").

Anyhow with a budget of up to 3000€ there is no "best", but there are good compromises
Old 2nd May 2017
  #21
Lives for gear
Ignore unsubstantiated opinions.
1. Look at resolution magazines speaker measurements here. Notice a pair of tannoys for 200 dollars have a better frequency and time response than many thousand dollar pmc aml2 speakers.

https://www.resolutionmag.com/wp-con...ecision-8P.pdf

https://www.resolutionmag.com/wp-con...3/PMC-AML2.pdf

You do not always get what you pay for, sometimes you do.

2. For bassy music you need flat down to 20 hz for mastering.

3. Select monitors that will get you near that. eg RCF mythos 8.

4. Its a cliche but you have to treat your room. First reflection points, basstraps very thick bare minimum. Save 500 dollars to build bass traps etc

5. buy sonarworks .

6. learn to use REW. Use their measurement mic to get a flat frequency response first with treatment then at the end use the room correction.

You can do this on your budget but you can put 1000000 dollar speakers in a room and have crap coloured response. By contrast I have +/- 4 db in my room for within your budget. You need to learn to use Rew and about acoustics and a few other things such as how to build your own basstraps. Measuring your room will tell you if you have a good response not a forum.
You may also consider HD600. If the following gentlemen had listened to all the guff audiophiles spout on here he would never have mixed and mastered a number one record on a pair. He of course had a lot of experience and nice outboard , but yes you can do it on your budget - dont let anyone tell you you cant.

How Will Putney mixed a number 1 record entirely on Sennheiser HD600 Open-Air headphones

https://en-us.sennheiser.com/news-ho...ire-headphones

Just remember mastering often uses HIFI speakers like B&W - but can such speakers take the bashing that a working studio will give them for everyday mixing duties. Mastering and mixing are different and remember one of the big advantages of using a mastering engineer - is a second pair of objective ears.

Last edited by Gusss; 2nd May 2017 at 02:52 PM..
Old 2nd May 2017
  #22
Lives for gear
 

Good points about measuring and room. At Paul Stubblebine mastering,they emphasized how much time and money was spent on the room. They brought in Bob Hodas to "shoot" the room. They cut open the ceiling and put 10 inches of fiberglass in there. 3 ft bass traps in the corners floor to ceiling. They had the Focal Utopia speakers and said half the sound is the room.

Interesting when I looked at the specs of the Genelec 8340's vs Barefoot footprint. Almost identical frequency response and the same price. The Genelec room correction system is amazing and saves a lot of headaches. You can adjust your treatment and run it again. It includes a very good D/A as well.
Old 2nd May 2017
  #23
Quote:
Originally Posted by pw2005 View Post
Good points about measuring and room. At Paul Stubblebine mastering,they emphasized how much time and money was spent on the room. They brought in Bob Hodas to "shoot" the room. They cut open the ceiling and put 10 inches of fiberglass in there. 3 ft bass traps in the corners floor to ceiling. They had the Focal Utopia speakers and said half the sound is the room.

Interesting when I looked at the specs of the Genelec 8340's vs Barefoot footprint. Almost identical frequency response and the same price. The Genelec room correction system is amazing and saves a lot of headaches. You can adjust your treatment and run it again. It includes a very good D/A as well.

I am a fan of Genelec myself... Have worked on 1032, 8050, 8040...The 8050 was best from my point of view...But they are a bit pumped and the lack clear high freq, the mids are good but I feel like on Genelecs the sound si a bit harsh...

Never listened to the barefoot though but I would sure like to know what the fuzz is about...
Old 2nd May 2017
  #24
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gusss View Post
Ignore unsubstantiated opinions.
1. Look at resolution magazines speaker measurements here. Notice a pair of tannoys for 200 dollars have a better frequency and time response than many thousand dollar pmc aml2 speakers.

https://www.resolutionmag.com/wp-con...ecision-8P.pdf

https://www.resolutionmag.com/wp-con...3/PMC-AML2.pdf

You do not always get what you pay for, sometimes you do.

2. For bassy music you need flat down to 20 hz for mastering.

3. Select monitors that will get you near that. eg RCF mythos 8.

4. Its a cliche but you have to treat your room. First reflection points, basstraps very thick bare minimum. Save 500 dollars to build bass traps etc

5. buy sonarworks .

6. learn to use REW. Use their measurement mic to get a flat frequency response first with treatment then at the end use the room correction.

You can do this on your budget but you can put 1000000 dollar speakers in a room and have crap coloured response. By contrast I have +/- 4 db in my room for within your budget. You need to learn to use Rew and about acoustics and a few other things such as how to build your own basstraps. Measuring your room will tell you if you have a good response not a forum.
You may also consider HD600. If the following gentlemen had listened to all the guff audiophiles spout on here he would never have mixed and mastered a number one record on a pair. He of course had a lot of experience and nice outboard , but yes you can do it on your budget - dont let anyone tell you you cant.

How Will Putney mixed a number 1 record entirely on Sennheiser HD600 Open-Air headphones

https://en-us.sennheiser.com/news-ho...ire-headphones

Just remember mastering often uses HIFI speakers like B&W - but can such speakers take the bashing that a working studio will give them for everyday mixing duties. Mastering and mixing are different and remember one of the big advantages of using a mastering engineer - is a second pair of objective ears.
Im also looking into Hi-fi Polk Audio S60 or S20...

How do you guys feel about that? I hear a lot of people using Hi-fi for mixing and mastering...
Old 2nd May 2017
  #25
Lives for gear
 
PdotDdot's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zadkhiel View Post
I know there aren't any "perfect monitors", but your opinion matters...
There has to be a selection, some monitors will be flatter and more correct then others with better translation and clear crisp frequencies, while others will be pumped, hyped, too colorful and far away from the truth...

So let me rephrase that please:

I need a list of a few monitors that you guys know and have worked on, that are correct, flat, with good translation and good frequencies that can cover the full range and are closer to reality in any type of room, that I could mix and master on my productions.

Thank you

Cheers
A couple of things...

First, it might be better to phrase the question as "What are some good choices" rather than "What its the best". I find these "best" questions ridiculous and tend to shy away from them.

Second, mastering should be done by people that know what they are doing and in rooms that are designed properly and well equipped. Just because manufacturers market mastering plugins and equipment does not mean that people should be doing it on their own. Personally I think anyone who thinks they can master who is not studying under someone who does this for a living is very misguided.

As to your price range, you are limited and are not likely going to find anything that is really going to up your game. That said, you can adjust to any set of monitors as long as you compare commercial material in your listening environment and get to understand what you need to do to adjust to your monitors and your room to get good mixes. This also involves listening to your mixes elsewhere and on all types of systems both good and bad to learn how they translate overall.

I am not saying investing in a good set of monitors is a bad idea - in fact it is one of the areas we all put money into along with pics, preamps and room treatment.

I do think it is wise to ask for recommendations within your price range and then go listen and if at all possible, bring monitors home and test them in your room to see what they are really going to sound like.

I do not have anything to offer as far as what monitors to try or I would offer my suggestions. I had Adam A7's and then went to Focal Twins and I love the Focals and actually cannot imagine how I lived with the Adams.

Best of luck in your quest.
Old 2nd May 2017
  #26
Quote:
Originally Posted by PdotDdot View Post
A couple of things...

First, it might be better to phrase the question as "What are some good choices" rather than "What its the best". I find these "best" questions ridiculous and tend to shy away from them.

Second, mastering should be done by people that know what they are doing and in rooms that are designed properly and well equipped. Just because manufacturers market mastering plugins and equipment does not mean that people should be doing it on their own. Personally I think anyone who thinks they can master who is not studying under someone who does this for a living is very misguided.

As to your price range, you are limited and are not likely going to find anything that is really going to up your game. That said, you can adjust to any set of monitors as long as you compare commercial material in your listening environment and get to understand what you need to do to adjust to your monitors and your room to get good mixes. This also involves listening to your mixes elsewhere and on all types of systems both good and bad to learn how they translate overall.

I am not saying investing in a good set of monitors is a bad idea - in fact it is one of the areas we all put money into along with pics, preamps and room treatment.

I do think it is wise to ask for recommendations within your price range and then go listen and if at all possible, bring monitors home and test them in your room to see what they are really going to sound like.

I do not have anything to offer as far as what monitors to try or I would offer my suggestions. I had Adam A7's and then went to Focal Twins and I love the Focals and actually cannot imagine how I lived with the Adams.

Best of luck in your quest.

Thank you for the tips mate

I know what you mean. I worked in a lot of studios since 2005...Been doing mixin and mastering as well, but, on studio monitors...

It's just, I have never had my own studio, which I am trying to build now and I dont wanna make mistakes, specially regarding the speakers....

Plus, I am a bit rusty in the " whats new " on the speaker or audio interface market...That is why, I need your opinions and I thank you for that !!!

As regarding the monitors, I am a bit confused cause my friend, that's one of the best mixing and mastering engineers in my country, switched to Hi-fi Speakers and said, he will never go back to studio monitors cause the level of details on the hi-fi system is huge compared to the traditional speakers....

He is recommending the Polk Audio S20 or S60 cause they are in my price range. He also will buy a set for himself...

So ...Hi-fi Systems vs Studio Monitors is a more accurate title
Old 2nd May 2017
  #27
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PdotDdot's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zadkhiel View Post
Thank you for the tips mate

I know what you mean. I worked in a lot of studios since 2005...Been doing mixin and mastering as well, but, on studio monitors...

It's just, I have never had my own studio, which I am trying to build now and I dont wanna make mistakes, specially regarding the speakers....

Plus, I am a bit rusty in the " whats new " on the speaker or audio interface market...That is why, I need your opinions and I thank you for that !!!

As regarding the monitors, I am a bit confused cause my friend, that's one of the best mixing and mastering engineers in my country, switched to Hi-fi Speakers and said, he will never go back to studio monitors cause the level of details on the hi-fi system is huge compared to the traditional speakers....

He is recommending the Polk Audio S20 or S60 cause they are in my price range. He also will buy a set for himself...

So ...Hi-fi Systems vs Studio Monitors is a more accurate title
My stereo of 20 years now has ProAc 2.5i speakers. I love them. They are extremely musical and every style of music sounds fantastic on the. The only thing that might be missing is the very very bottom of the frequency realm so I suppose if I listened to a lot of hip hop and dance music they might be a tad weak down there but I can listen to the Allman Brothers Live At Fillmore East and it sounds like I am back at the concert so for my ears and needs they are wonderful. The only better speakers I've ever heard are Audio Physic Virgos and they are no longer made and cannot be found. The point here is that ProAc now has gotten themselves in to the recording and mastering rooms and this reenforces what your friend is stating. I always check my mixes on the ProAcs.

I wish I could provide some suggestions in your price range to help you out but alas I do not know about the speakers in that range to offer anything but speculation and that would be of no use to you.
Old 3rd May 2017
  #28
Quote:
Originally Posted by PdotDdot View Post
My stereo of 20 years now has ProAc 2.5i speakers. I love them. They are extremely musical and every style of music sounds fantastic on the. The only thing that might be missing is the very very bottom of the frequency realm so I suppose if I listened to a lot of hip hop and dance music they might be a tad weak down there but I can listen to the Allman Brothers Live At Fillmore East and it sounds like I am back at the concert so for my ears and needs they are wonderful. The only better speakers I've ever heard are Audio Physic Virgos and they are no longer made and cannot be found. The point here is that ProAc now has gotten themselves in to the recording and mastering rooms and this reenforces what your friend is stating. I always check my mixes on the ProAcs.

I wish I could provide some suggestions in your price range to help you out but alas I do not know about the speakers in that range to offer anything but speculation and that would be of no use to you.
Thank you for sharing that. Its always good to hear different opinions. So you dont know anything about Polk Audio?

Coming from monitors, do you think I would be better with hi-fi speakers ?

Thank you
Old 3rd May 2017
  #29
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PdotDdot's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zadkhiel View Post
Thank you for sharing that. Its always good to hear different opinions. So you dont know anything about Polk Audio?

Coming from monitors, do you think I would be better with hi-fi speakers ?

Thank you
I had a friend who had a pair of Polk's and he was moving so wanted to sell them. I borrowed them but they weren't for me so I passed. Sorry, cannot recall which model they were. I do not even remember what it was that kept me from buying them. Long time ago.
Old 4th May 2017
  #30
Gear Maniac
 
M.o.T.s's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zadkhiel View Post
This is interesting...cause one of the biggest mastering and mixing sound engineers from my country, just switched to hi-fi speakers and paid round 6000 euros on them...

Do you think, hi-fi speakers will be better then studio monitors for production/mixing and mastering?
My favorite spkrs for mastering are the B&W 802D. You can find them used for 2,000/2,500.
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