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SE Electronics "Space" Reflexion Filter
Old 30th May 2015
  #1
SE Electronics "Space" Reflexion Filter

Just bought the new "SE Electronics Space" and set it up today! I can't even explain how much of a difference it makes. All the "hollowness" and "harsh high end" and weird wooly sound is gone from all vocal tracks instantly! Sounds like a real booth. I cannot believe it actually works as good as advertized. I admit i was very unsure about this purchase but I just thought to myself "i'll return it if it sucks" and that was what i was planning on. No way!!! This thing is staying now!!! No way I'm getting rid of it now!!! Incredible difference!!!! Had a cheaper "Mic Shield" on before, that thing was nothing compared to this. This is the real deal. Portable vocal booth!!!!!

Before:


After:


Update New Micstand!!!!! Mic not tipping over no more with this beefy filter!!!!




Bonus: Sound clips from the mic with the filter on, raw vocals, mixed vocals and vocals over a beat. (Updated Mix, Final Version 10/29/2015)

Also Posted 3 clips of the raw recordings with and without the SE filter. 1 of my cousin before I got the se filter in my foam treated hallway where I mainly record. Then 1 with the se filter same in the same hallway. Then another with the se filter in my properly treated control room. If you listen you can hear on my cousins vocal with the old filter, the room reverb is present and it sounds hollow, there is also harshness to the vocal when you start to mix it. Comparing the SE filter in the hallway vs control room, you can hear the se filter takes the room out of the picture in a lot of ways. There's 3 mp3 version and 3 lossless wav files for everyone to check out. Thanks!

Thread updated with New (Final) Mix 10/29/15. I got this mic eq'ed pretty damn good now!!!! Really smooth sound all around I can work with these vocals.

Gear Used:
(with space filter) > > Pro Tools HD through an Avid Omni interface

Mix was:
100% "In the box" in Pro Tools 11HD
Mixed On JBL 4328p Monitors (with 4312sp Sub) / Avantone Mixubes in a Treated Room
Referenced the Mix in my Car, then made any corrections needed back in my studio.

This Review is posted on SE Electronics Website! (It's the first user review) Thank you SE Electronics!
Link: http://www.seelectronics.com/rf-space/
Attached Files

Se Space Filter (Raw Vocals).mp3 (772.5 KB, 9497 views)

Se Space Filter (Raw Vocals).wav (6.63 MB, 9940 views)

Se Space Filter (Vocals Mixed).mp3 (1.59 MB, 9594 views)

Se Space Filter (Vocals Mixed).wav (6.99 MB, 9464 views)

Se Space Filter (Vocals Over Beat).mp3 (9.15 MB, 10087 views)

Hallway With No Name Filter.mp3 (417.9 KB, 8716 views)

Hallway With No Name Filter.wav (2.69 MB, 10334 views)

Hallway With Space Filter.mp3 (296.0 KB, 8943 views)

Hallway With Space Filter.wav (1.90 MB, 8512 views)

Treated Room W Space Filter.mp3 (402.1 KB, 8635 views)

Treated Room W Space Filter.wav (2.59 MB, 10051 views)

Old 30th May 2015
  #2
Lives for gear
 
Silent Sound's Avatar
And now that you know how much better actual sound absorbing material is compared to foam, it's time to upgrade that green egg carton stuff on your wall! I'm only half kidding here.

I record out of my house a bit and can't afford/don't want to look at any permanent treatment on my walls. I built a few gobos using 703 and pull them up close to the mics when tracking. I am totally surprised at how much better my recordings sound by doing that. For instance, drums may not sound great in the room due to too much reverberation from hard surfaces, but you'd never know it listening to the raw tracks because the mics don't pick up much of that room sound. Then, come mix time, I can position those same gobos to kill the reflections in my room from my listening position. Just pull them in close enough and your effectively treating an entire wall with a single 2'x4' rectangle. One again, the room itself still sounds bad, but at least one seat sounds great!
Old 31st May 2015
  #3
Quote:
Originally Posted by Silent Sound View Post
And now that you know how much better actual sound absorbing material is compared to foam, it's time to upgrade that green egg carton stuff on your wall! I'm only half kidding here.

I record out of my house a bit and can't afford/don't want to look at any permanent treatment on my walls. I built a few gobos using 703 and pull them up close to the mics when tracking. I am totally surprised at how much better my recordings sound by doing that. For instance, drums may not sound great in the room due to too much reverberation from hard surfaces, but you'd never know it listening to the raw tracks because the mics don't pick up much of that room sound. Then, come mix time, I can position those same gobos to kill the reflections in my room from my listening position. Just pull them in close enough and your effectively treating an entire wall with a single 2'x4' rectangle. One again, the room itself still sounds bad, but at least one seat sounds great!
While the "hallway booth" I record in is foam treated. I actually properly treated my control room now with 15 bass traps. including 4 huge gik soffit bass traps. it sounds great in here! But i still prefer to record in the hallway "booth" because it is more isolated. Not enough room to record in the control room unless it's just me.

that reflexion filter is no joke. Incredible engineering!!!!!
Old 31st May 2015
  #4
Lives for gear
 
Silent Sound's Avatar
Well, they certainly wouldn't make it any worse. How much better will depend on too many things to speculate. If you're happy with what you have and it works for you, save your money. But for me, it was probably the single greatest investment I've made, gear wise.
Old 31st May 2015
  #5
Quote:
Originally Posted by Silent Sound View Post
Well, they certainly wouldn't make it any worse. How much better will depend on too many things to speculate. If you're happy with what you have and it works for you, save your money. But for me, it was probably the single greatest investment I've made, gear wise.
i agree im sure it helps a lot!Ill keep my eyes open and keep reading up on the subject. Thanks for the reply!
Old 31st May 2015
  #6
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Ol' Betsey's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by kangking View Post
i agree im sure it helps a lot!Ill keep my eyes open and keep reading up on the subject. Thanks for the reply!
If anything build a couple full-sized gobos for behind the singer (that certainly won't hurt) and then experiment with them in your room as well.

It certainly never hurts having a couple lying (or I should say standing) around.

Glad you're getting good results with the SE too.

R.
Old 2nd June 2015
  #7
Gear Maniac
 

I made my own with Owns Corning 703FRK rigid fiberglass insulation. 4" thick panels. I was shocked what a difference it made.
Old 2nd June 2015
  #8
Yes!!! Thanks for the feedback guys!!! This SE Electronics filter is so damn great!!!!! I had to order a mic stand for it since my old mic stand cannot support it. I am currently using weights to keep it from tipping over. Bought an Atlas MS 25 mic stand that should do the trick!!!

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/deta...Fc9gfgodajIARA
Old 6th June 2015
  #9
Update to this thread. Got the atlas Mic stand in yesterday! Whoo! Weighs about 40 pounds, hooked it up to my "Se Space" filter, im in business! The mic is not tipping over no more!



Also updated this thread with sound clips of the mic, me doing a test on the mic over a beat I made, mixed and dry vocal so you can hear how good it sounds now!!!!
Old 6th June 2015
  #10
Lives for gear
Wow! That foam makes the voice wobble and sound kind of robotic like a plugin. What a cool vocal effect it does. I don't get the same results from my mic with the egg cartons behind it.
Old 6th June 2015
  #11
Quote:
Originally Posted by waldie wave View Post
Wow! That foam makes the voice wobble and sound kind of robotic like a plugin. What a cool vocal effect it does. I don't get the same results from my mic with the egg cartons behind it.
Only because your music is trash
Old 7th June 2015
  #12
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by kangking View Post
Only because your music is trash
Old 7th June 2015
  #13
Quote:
Originally Posted by waldie wave View Post
Thats how we do it
Old 8th June 2015
  #14
Lives for gear
 
vincentvangogo's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheBuffaloCave View Post
I made my own with Owns Corning 703FRK rigid fiberglass insulation. 4" thick panels. I was shocked what a difference it made.
What was the rough design?
Old 18th September 2015
  #15
Just an Update: Posted 3 clips of the raw recordings with and without the SE filter. 1 of my cousin before I got the se filter using a no name brand filter in my foam treated hallway where I normally record, then 1 with the se filter in the hallway, then 1 with the se filter in my properly treated control room. If you listen you can hear on my cousins vocal with the old filter, the room reverb is present and it sounds hollow, there is also harshness to the vocal when you start to mix it. Throwing in the SE filter in the hallway vs control room to show that the se filter takes the room out of the picture in a lot of ways. There's 3 mp3 version and 3 lossless wav files for everyone to check out. Thanks!
Old 1st October 2015
  #16
Just posting to say I Updated this thread with new Sound clips from the mic with the filter on, raw vocals, mixed vocals and vocals over a beat. Also I'm glad to say this post has been featured on Se Electronics Website! sE Electronics - RF SPACE
Attached Thumbnails
SE Electronics "Space" Reflexion Filter-se-electronics-review.png  
Old 1st October 2015
  #17
270182
Guest
I don't like this type of "music". It really isn't music. It is the equivalent of scrap booking using other people's photographs and art from magazines. That said, I couldn't tell much, because there was no point of reference.

If you want to do a test, post dry vocals with no treatment, then with treatment.
Old 1st October 2015
  #18
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robert82's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by ASCMe View Post
I don't like this type of "music". It really isn't music. It is the equivalent of scrap booking using other people's photographs and art from magazines.
OOooo. Fine. You don't like this kind of music. Neither do I. But passing judgement on it is, well, just not polite, old boy.
Old 1st October 2015
  #19
270182
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by robert82 View Post
OOooo. Fine. You don't like this kind of music. Neither do I. But passing judgement on it is, well, just not polite, old boy.
I didn't pass judgement, merely stated why I don't like it. I appreciate that it takes skill and has some art to it. It IS art, and some great musicians contribute to it, but it is not music IMO. Actually, I think it is akin to preaching in the black church. It is very similar in many aspects. So, I would call it street preachin'.
Old 1st October 2015
  #20
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boombapdame's Avatar
@ASCMe don't disrespect @kangking and it's fine to express your opinion but yours reeks of ignorance.

While it's not a new phenomenon talent has never mattered in the music "industry" as the music business is more business than music as the only time music comes after business is in the dictionary. The "gangster" element in a commercial sense died in Rap a long time ago if you've ever had a cursory listen to Rap lyrics and any artist will tell you that every genre has varied levels of talent as talent and skill are mutually exclusive. The realest "gangstas" in Hip Hop have always been and continue to be White and Jewish execs who profit off the dysfunction, both real and imagined, of artists with artists conscious and unconscious consent. I'm not and never have been in defense of ignorance espoused by artists in the music/culture but I won't allow someone who sounds as if they've gotten their views on the music/culture from whitewashed mass media to **** on a culture that will remain long after what currently charts literally dies down.

Last edited by boombapdame; 2nd October 2015 at 03:21 PM..
Old 1st October 2015
  #21
270182
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by boombapdame View Post
@ASCMe don't disrespect @kangking and it's fine to express your opinion but yours reeks of ignorance.
Right. And no opinion matters but your own.

That's fine. BTW, I mix this stuff and I mix in black churches, so to me, it makes sense. I am not bashing what people have to say or the delivery of it, just that it isn't musical. Consider the harmony and the lead in time of the samples posted.

I see the level of talent (or the lack there of) coming in, and the expectations for someone living the gangster life, to come spit out some words and make it big over night, with the production waiting in the can. Uh...no. Ever get a phone call, "Hey man...toke...choke...you gots beats? You gots some beats man? I wanna come lay down a few rhymes and make record. You have Avalon? My friend says all good rap records have Avalon. Is it for real?....." All the freakin' time Pal.

Now, take church for example, the music is an extension of the pastor, and it is made in the moment, on the fly. It ebbs and flows with the mood and and words. It is one cohesive front when down well. There is a synergy between the band, or in the case of the black church the organist, and the pastor. When the pastor speaks, the music relays the thought. So much of secular rap is a distraction. It doesn't connect and reach the soul, which is the very thing that artists are striving to do with their message.

Last edited by 270182; 1st October 2015 at 03:38 PM..
Old 1st October 2015
  #22
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Oldone's Avatar
I have an SE reflection filter. I ended up never using it for singers because it ends up accenting the midrange too much. I didn't like such a close bounce around the area of the microphone. I found an absorbent area behind the singer much more useful such as a packing blanket or treated wall.
Old 1st October 2015
  #23
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ol' Betsey View Post
If anything build a couple full-sized gobos for behind the singer (that certainly won't hurt) and then experiment with them in your room as well.

It certainly never hurts having a couple lying (or I should say standing) around.

Glad you're getting good results with the SE too.

R.
Put the gobos behind the mic, not the singer. Cheers.
Old 1st October 2015
  #24
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Ol' Betsey's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Corey Milner View Post
Put the gobos behind the mic, not the singer. Cheers.
Actually in this instance, if he's using already using (and happy) with something such as this (reflextion filter et al) I suggest putting the extra gobos behind, yes behind, so you stop the room reflections from behind bouncing back into the front of the mic.

But I'm sure you know all about that already, right?

Cheers.
Old 1st October 2015
  #25
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ol' Betsey View Post
Actually in this instance, if he's using already using (and happy) with something such as this (reflextion filter et al) I suggest putting the extra gobos behind, yes behind, so you stop the room reflections from behind bouncing back into the front of the mic.

But I'm sure you know all about that already, right?

Cheers.
Right. Correct positioning to protect the mic from reflections is behind the mic, not the singer. Ergo this design dominating the market and not the opposite. You have it backwards. For sure Ethan is not the one who got it backwards. Cheers.

Old 1st October 2015
  #26
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Ol' Betsey's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Corey Milner View Post
Right. Correct positioning to protect the mic from reflections is behind the mic, not the singer. Ergo this design dominating the market and not the opposite. You have it backwards. For sure Ethan is not the one who got it backwards. Cheers.
Are you really going to argue about this? Reread what I suggested.

Was I disputing the effectiveness of using utilities such as these at cutting down room reflections? No I wasn't - though arguably some are more effective than others.

What I said is if you have some SPARE gobos (as I recall he was considering building some of his own) try putting them behind you to stop any extra room reflections from also entering the mic from the front.

Old 1st October 2015
  #27
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Funny Cat's Avatar
@Corey Milner and @Ol' Betsey...


I'm going to chime in and say you are both right to a degree. Although when I was doing location recording I found two things fairly consistent. Using a Reflexion filter only worked for styles where you need the vocal "recording" to be very dry, highly isolated and forward. Like if you were recording in a room with very poor acoustic properties or with the band in the same room. Although sometimes this can sap the life out of a recording. High end studios don't use these products for a reason. They actually want the sound of the room in the recording to a certain degree. Even on vocals.

The second thing I found was that placing treatment behind the singer yielded infinitely better results in the vocal recording. Think about it. The rejection point on a mic is on the back lobe (and sides) depending on pickup pattern. So it will reject most of what's Behind the mic. But the mic still hears reflections behind the singer because the polar pattern is facing that direction. Of course everything depends on your room's properties and whether you want that in your recordings or not.
Old 1st October 2015
  #28
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ol' Betsey View Post
Are you really going to argue about this? Reread what I suggested.

Was I disputing the effectiveness of using utilities such as these at cutting down room reflections? No I wasn't - though arguably some are more effective than others.

What I said is if you have some SPARE gobos (as I recall he was considering building some of his own) try putting them behind you to stop any extra room reflections from also entering the mic from the front.

Do not put the extra gobo behind the singer. If you have spare, place atop the two gobos you have behind your mic to prevent boxiness from ceiling-floor reflections.

In Ethan's design your body is neither reflecting sound into the mic nor allowing reflections from behind the singer to arrive at the mic.

Quote:
The rejection point on a mic is on the back lobe (and sides)
Subcardioid: 180 degrees (6 o'clock)
Cardioid: 180 degrees (6 o'clock)
Supercardioid: 120 degrees (4 o'clock or 8 o'clock)
Hypercardioid: 110 degrees (3:30 o'clock or 8:30 o'clock)

Figure of 8, 90 degrees, etc.

Definitely gobos behind the mic is industry standard for good reason.
Old 1st October 2015
  #29
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Funny Cat's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Corey Milner View Post
Do not put the extra gobo behind the singer. If you have spare, place atop the two gobos you have behind your mic to prevent boxiness from ceiling-floor reflections.

In Ethan's design your body is neither reflecting sound into the mic nor allowing reflections from behind the singer to arrive at the mic.



Subcardioid: 180 degrees (6 o'clock)
Cardioid: 180 degrees (6 o'clock)
Supercardioid: 120 degrees (4 o'clock or 8 o'clock)
Hypercardioid: 110 degrees (3:30 o'clock or 8:30 o'clock)

Figure of 8, 90 degrees, etc.

Definitely gobos behind the mic is industry standard for good reason.
Interesting how you never see Reflexion filters in pro studios. And I've personally never seen gobos behind a vocal mic (in a high end studio) unless the recording was live with the band. Most common is to put the mic out in the middle if it's a large room with nice acoustics or near a well treated area - mic facing the panels. Yes, I've worked in a few high end studios by the way.




[EDIT] FYI, 180 degree rejection point at 6 O'clock means the rejection point is exactly on the back lobe behind the mic. 90 degrees is on the sides i.e. Figure of eight (ribbon mics) which is why I specified "depending on polar pattern". You quoted me only partially and out of context.

Do me a favor and setup a mic in Cardioid then walk around it talking and see where the mic pics up sound the least. The first assistant gig I had, the AE made me setup every mic and do this to learn how each mic "hears". On a related note, It's how I learned the 421 is NOT a side adrress mic. You guys know what I'm talking about. ;0)

Last edited by Funny Cat; 1st October 2015 at 08:29 PM.. Reason: spelling
Old 1st October 2015
  #30
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Funny Cat's Avatar
Pay attention - where are the GoBos?

For anyone who has doubts, look at these iconic pics of singers in the studio and notice where the vocal mics are placed with relation to the GoBos (if they are even used). Mics are either in the middle of the room or facing treatment that is strategically placed behind the singer. Try it and see if your vocal recordings are not better afterward. And notice there are no reflexion filters in any of these pics - because they are mostly used in poor sounding rooms.
Attached Thumbnails
SE Electronics "Space" Reflexion Filter-beyonce-studio-treatment-behind-her.gif   SE Electronics "Space" Reflexion Filter-paul-mccartney-studio.jpg   SE Electronics "Space" Reflexion Filter-taylor-swift-studio.jpg   SE Electronics "Space" Reflexion Filter-stevie-wonder-studio.jpg   SE Electronics "Space" Reflexion Filter-mariah-whitney-studio.jpg  

SE Electronics "Space" Reflexion Filter-ray-charles-studio.jpg   SE Electronics "Space" Reflexion Filter-frank-sinatra-studio-behind.jpg  
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